Candyman (2021)

piplip87

Absolute pure and utter shite. I'm convinced at this stage Jordan Peale could remake Sharknado, make it about race and still get 5 star reviews.

I get that Cinema is a brilliant medium to dabble into politics and I am all for it but thus movie tries to dabble but hits the wrong note on so many levels. The Guardian and other critics who review movies based on identity politics alone will love this.

For a horror it's not scary, the storyline is all over the place and in parts it's blame white people for all the problems in society.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117813372#Comment_117813372

it's actually a joke how so many of the press bend over to be seen to be "on side" with his movies / projects when it's obvious that it's trying to polish a turd in this case. (rebooter and writer here if not director but the script pretty much defined it)

at least you came down on one side in your judgement

horror movies by definition are supposed to create feelings of terror. this is about as scary as a baby rabbit.

as if showing things happening in a mirror or off-camera is original

Also as someone else said these movies don't empower anyone, especially with the "brick to the face" Peele style.

the original movie showed the way with the use of artistic subtext to deal with social issues

so the irony is that it's a rich coloured guy making movies supposedly to give a voice to the disenfranchised

the rappers with gold chains and Bentleys in their music videos are far more authentic than this guy

It was marketed explicitly with "lines drawn" - using the terms "racism" and "provocative"

as I said before, just hope that he doesn't butcher any more IP's

Tony EH

Why did you go and see something that you knew you'd hate?

Fysh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117813372#Comment_117813372

Setting aside your issues with Jordan Peele, who did not direct this film, how recently have you seen the original film, and what did you think of it?

The original is very much about race, albeit presented from the perspective of a white middle class woman. The new film may have a different tone, but the themes around race and suffering it builds on are very much present in the original film.

pixelburp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117814221#Comment_117814221

If Jordan Peele, Greta Thunberg and Phoebe Waller-Bridge ever made a movie together, the collective meltdown from those with resting bias would be rather entertaining to watch.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117814221#Comment_117814221

Ya, I'm looking forward to watching it. The original is a social issues horror, black communities being destroyed by gentrification. And gentrification is becoming more of an issue rather than less.

pjohnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117813812#Comment_117813812

I tried to warn him.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117814260#Comment_117814260

you're correct in saying that gentrification was an element in the original

however it's also correct to say that it was very much a subtext in the 1992 film and executed through nuance and subtlety. it actually gave a decent template of how to effectively do this "message".

in the 2021 version the gentrification themes feel very forced and are done with absolutely no subtlety or nuance whatsoever, making it feel shallow and very preachy relative to the original film. 

it's about as nuanced as a hook up the rear-end

people trying to argue otherwise are at best being at best duplicitous

you'd wonder where Peele can go next with jumping into the multitude of classic IP's out there - what about tackling the perceived racism issues in Star Wars (Lucas's supposed misuse of Caribbean, east Asian and Jewish ethnic stereotypes in the prequels) for example?

"Star Wars - Return of the awoken" anyone?

The world is his oyster here truly.

Secondly the original film was an actual horror film with great intensity but this film does not. It's simply not a horror film anymore as no fear is elicited from the audience.

Oh it has some decent direction shots from DaCosta here and there, and hand-puppets - WOW! - but it's supposed to be a horror film. That is the heritage of the IP.

I thought that the idea of IP's was to be faithful to the key elements.

The third act is a real mess where it really loses the viewer and verges into the boring and "just get this over with" territory.

It's really bizarre how this elicits the need to be rationalised with faux effusiveness as a good film and why people need to do that - quite weird.

johnny_ultimate

Mod note: glasso, you've received two warnings now for the overt trolling so the next one will be an automatic siteban. Please read the forum charter and stop trolling / accusing other posters who liked this of being "duplicitous".

We get it - you don't like the film, you decided that months before anyone - let alone yourself - actually saw it (not sure if you've even seen it yourself yet, frankly). Some people will like it, some people won't. Fine. Please don't go around insulting anyone who disagrees with the opinion you pre-formed about it. Lay off the tedious soapboxing.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117814540#Comment_117814540

I do think that it's a fair question to ask your good self why you saw the need to provide a link to the Vulture article which pretty much eviscerates the piece when you claimed yourself to find it "worthy" as you put it.

I can't actually figure that as I've never seen that before so I'd like to get an insight into your thinking there.

johnny_ultimate

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117814618#Comment_117814618

Very simple: because I found it to be an excellent, persuasively argued piece of film criticism, from a perspective (a Black American woman) that I can't possibly pretend to emulate.

Criticism to me isn't about blindly agreeing with what's said, but allowing a different perspective to challenge or complicate my own reading of the film. I put a lot more value on the aesthetic and atmospheric success of the film than that review does. I also feel the film's morality / point-of-view is murky and ambiguous in a way I found intriguing and unsettling, particularly its final minute or two. But that Vulture review is an uncommonly sharp piece of writing about a film that I definitely felt worth sharing, even if some of its viewpoints and conclusions depart from my own.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117814648#Comment_117814648

Ok well it is interesting that it's in the case of this film in particular that made you do so.

I'd be surprised if this franchise sees another entry notwithstanding how that is allowed for with the ending of this outing as the IP identity is now very muddled.

santana75

Saw this earlier and there was a good film in there somewhere but it got lost in the Black lives matter agenda and in general ticking of the woke boxes. White cops are the bad guys and candyman is in fact an avenging hero of black people. Could've been so much better had they just made a straight up horror movie.

gmisk

I liked it....the lead was top notch as was Teyonah Parris (I wasn't totally sold on her in wandavision). The social commentary etc was in the original zero issue with it...I didn't find it scary tbh, some decent body horror and some really strong individual scenes. The "high school" storyline seemed a tad tacked on and unnecessary.

7/10

Space Dog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117814743#Comment_117814743

Cost $25 million, made $22 during its opening weekends in the US, so it'll probably be a minor success at the end of its run. The thing about horror movies is that they often easily recoup their money since they usually don't need massive budgets. They're a safe bet, so I wouldn't be surprised to see another outing. I haven't seen the film yet so I can't comment on how the ending may have "muddled" the "IP identity", but since the Halloween franchise is basically a multiverse with different timelines and iterations at this stage, we'll probably seen another outing in one way or another. In Hollywood there's always room for a sequel that ignores previous entries or maybe a soft reboot or whatever writers come up with 😊

"“Candyman” cost $25 million to produce — MGM financed and produced the film, while Universal handled marketing and distribution — and appears on track to become one of the rare pandemic-era releases to become profitable during its theatrical run."

https://variety.com/2021/film/box-office/box-office-candyman-opening-weekend-1235051270/

silverharp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822143#Comment_117822143

its not a genre I watch but the economics are great, make some kind of a profit at the start, and years of residuals coming in from television etc. for the next 10 years.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822143#Comment_117822143

Yes a fairly low budget achieved by getting in not big-name actors and director (so in relative terms "cheap"), pretty inexpensive production (some of the GGI used is not great and off-camera stuff and extensive shadow puppets is a cost-saving measure also of course) and using an existing IP and then marketing it on the basis of "racism" and "provocative" (which is Peele's brand in film so far) was going to get a return leveraging on the George Floyd situation etc in the current climate. My only shock was not hearing the NWA classic "F**k tha police" as background music during the finale - must have pulled the purse-strings tight on that one :)

Fortuitous or planned I don't know but the release window timeframe is good as there is nothing big competing with it on opening.

Still don't see another one happening given the in-your-face exaggerated treatment and the other afore mentioned reasons.

https://youtu.be/Q3p-b5Yf-YA?t=9

gmisk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822422#Comment_117822422

Related to this blumhouse tend to be the masters at it, rare they lose any money.

pixelburp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117823290#Comment_117823290

Indeed, though $25 million for a Blumhouse feature is an extravagance 🤣 The Invisible Man only cost them ~$7 million, made them ~$145 million.

conorhal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117814221#Comment_117814221

Well I think the original is in my top 10 best horror movies of all time.

Yes, the original film addresses the topics of racism and gentrification, but it does so in the context of the plot. Remember when themes in movies used to be subtly woven into the interplay between the characters and the plot?

Helen and Anne-Marie live in identical apartments with the same layout (which leads Helen to a revelation), but one building was put up on the 'right side' of the socio-economic gulf that exists between Helen's home and that of Ann-Marie's and was thus converted into yuppy flats. Helen can even look out her window across that invisible socio-economic divide and see Cabrini Green in the distance. They both effectively live in the same building, but one is a bastion of aspiration while the other is one of desperation.

Now Candyman 1992 is not exactly subtle in its commentary, but it does at least trust it's audience to do the very simple maths it presents to add 1 plus 1 and get to 2. What it doesn't do is come to a dead stop for a soap box rant about gentrification by bougie black people in a manner that makes you ask, 'wait, are we supposed to agree with these idiots or laugh at their hypocrisy?

Homelander

I thought this was reasonably good though the final act seemed completely unnecessarily - and very disappointingly - rushed and muddled given the already scant run-time.

I have no problem at all with a short, succinct movie if it achieves what it sets out to achieve in an organic way, but here it feels like it actually suffered badly. What was a pretty impressive slow burn with moments of sudden action suddenly accelerated to 90 in very haphazard fashion.

Still decent and a nice companion to the original, which I also watched recently and enjoyed, but I'd say another 10-15 minutes and a more gradual build to the end-game that feel more earned, and in-tune with the rest of the movie, would have served it immensely.

Still worth a 6.5/10 I'd say. Great performances and while definitely a flawed journey in the final act, it's not bad in principle. Considering I paid €10 in the IMC for a ticket, popcorn and a drink, it was money very well spent.

Fysh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117826592#Comment_117826592

It would have definitely added to the film if the script had been able to accommodate the tensions between existing residents of Cabrini Green (or any area that is being gentrified) and those who move there. Does it make a difference if the aspirational middle-class gentrifiers pricing people out of their homes are a racial minority? If so, what is it and how does it manifest?

I can see it being tricky to tackle that effectively without either muddying the film's throughline or making the runtime and pacing a lot baggier than they otherwise are. It will be interesting to see if there are any deleted or extended scenes whenever the home release comes around.

In terms of "are we supposed to agree with these idiots or laugh at them", I felt that the way the art world is sent up (in a fairly arch way) is intended to indicate that while these characters are the protagonists, they may also simultaneously be victims of systemic racial violence and contributors to the perpetuation of systemic socioeconomic issues in areas like Cabrini Green.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117830571#Comment_117830571

It would have definitely added to the film if the script had been able to accommodate the tensions between existing residents of Cabrini Green (or any area that is being gentrified) and those who move there. Does it make a difference if the aspirational middle-class gentrifiers pricing people out of their homes are a racial minority? If so, what is it and how does it manifest?

If you're genuinely interested in such issues wouldn't you be better served looking for a gentrification documentary than a supposed horror movie?

And this "piece" was never going to muddy the hammer-fist thematic line with a black-on-black conflict when everything was so unequivocally and literally black and white.