Landlord demands to collect rent in cash

machaseh

I have a really really really evil landlord (many other issues, already called about them with threshold ).

Now one of the issues is that my landlord wants to collect the rent in cash each month. Presumably to avoid taxes, but why this is so is not really my concern.

My concern is:
- safety. What if some thugs steal my month's rent on the way from the bank? What if the deposit is stolen from my home overnight? What if my roommate f*cks me over and steals it? What if my landlord steals it and claims that I didn't pay the rent?
- Landlord has to come to my home to collect it. I honestly want to see him as little as possible.
- Difficulty in arranging a meet up time.


He refused to accept bank transfer. I asked him if I could write out a cheque instead (in my country this is a super old fashioned method and never used anymore, but here in Ireland it's slightly more common). But your man said that it would take too long to clear.

Is a landlord legally able to demand the rent in cash each month (as well as bills)?

jimmycrackcorm

Yes. Cash is legal tender.
Is the tenancy registered with the RTB? As that's an indicator of the tax situation.

limitedIQ

Get a Rent Book for him to sign before handing over the rent.

https://www.easons.com/rent-book-assured-tenancy-2090105?gclid=Cj0KCQiAmsrxBRDaARIsANyiD1rP0kgi2uEcnoCqpyG72MWd1FtbqYs6fi5akAlz-XZwARm3zpCggsUaAlWGEALw_wcB

I would say everything on your list is a non-issue. You are just paranoid. Plenty of people would regularly carry 4 figure sums of cash without giving it a second thought.

Mitzy

He can request the rent to be paid in whatever manner he prefers.
I know it is painful for you to have to get cash and would be much easier to deal by EFT but just because this is his preferred payment method you can't assume he is avoiding tax.

Also he is perfectly entitled to visit the property to carry out regular inspections to ensure it is being kept to a certain standard. This might be his way of killing two birds with the one stone!

Samuel T. Cogley

Oaklynn Rancid Womanhood wrote: »

I would say everything on your list is a non-issue. You are just paranoid. Plenty of people would regularly carry 4 figure sums of cash without giving it a second thought.

Completely disagree. All perfectly well founded fears imho especially if the OP is in a dodgy living situation which it sounds like he is.

My suggestion is to move if possible. Otherwise you're just going to have to comply I dont think there is any legislation on modes of payment. What does your lease say, assuming you have one.

cruizer101

Is this a change to how you have been paying or have you always been paying in cash and now want to change?

MacDanger

limitedIQ wrote: »

Get a Rent Book for him to sign before handing over the rent.

https://www.easons.com/rent-book-assured-tenancy-2090105?gclid=Cj0KCQiAmsrxBRDaARIsANyiD1rP0kgi2uEcnoCqpyG72MWd1FtbqYs6fi5akAlz-XZwARm3zpCggsUaAlWGEALw_wcB

Definitely do this (although it's the landlord's responsibility to provide the rent book rather than yours. Don't hand over any cash without getting a signed receipt first

Ray Palmer

Up to him how he wishes to collect the rent. What makes him evil?

dashoonage

Ray Palmer wrote: »

Up to him how he wishes to collect the rent. What makes him evil?

He's a landlord.

Salary Negotiator

What’s in your lease?

Old diesel

Oaklynn Rancid Womanhood wrote: »

I would say everything on your list is a non-issue. You are just paranoid. Plenty of people would regularly carry 4 figure sums of cash without giving it a second thought.

4 figures is in excess of 1,000.

While there are reasons people carry that sort of money around.

Most people would certainly give carrying that cash more then a second thought.

1) how best to withdraw.

2) how best to carry it - ie dont put it all in one section of clothing if possible.

3) minimising the amount of time you need to have 1000 euros or more on you. So if you are meeting the landlord at 4.30 pm on a Friday you'd try to do the withdrawal as close to that 4.30 pm as possible.

What's annoying is that there are perfectly acceptable ways of paying sums of money without needing to get cash.

We aren't talking about a once off transaction here - this is monthly.

I realise that as OP is renting a room it's less then 1 k..

But still a pain.

Ray Palmer

dashoonage wrote: »

He's a landlord.

I suspect that is the case but 3 *really suggests more😊

machaseh

machaseh wrote: »

My concern is:
What if the deposit is stolen from my home overnight?

Eh? Why do you have the deposit?

machaseh

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Eh? Why do you have the deposit?

Sorry I mean rent

machaseh

Old diesel wrote: »

I realise that as OP is renting a room it's less then 1 k..

But still a pain.

This is definitely a 4 digit figure. We are talking dublin here and a small apartment.

machaseh

Mitzy wrote: »

He can request the rent to be paid in whatever manner he prefers.
I know it is painful for you to have to get cash and would be much easier to deal by EFT but just because this is his preferred payment method you can't assume he is avoiding tax.

Also he is perfectly entitled to visit the property to carry out regular inspections to ensure it is being kept to a certain standard. This might be his way of killing two birds with the one stone!

Regular inspections is fine, but monthly is too much in my opinion.

Having been in this situation, the biggest annoyance is arranging a time for him to collect it. I'd regularly get a text saying, "I'm near the house now, can I come round", and I'd be in tesco, or in the pub, or in the middle of sexy time with herself.

He couldn't commit to the same day/time every month so it was a monthly annoyance.

spaceHopper

Make Him commit to a set time and day to collect it. If he texts or phones to change it say no doesn't suit or I'm not there / going out, don't have it one me. Please stick to the arrangement, or send me you account and I'll transfer it. Do as he asks but don't make it easy for him

Ray Palmer

spaceHopper wrote: »

Make Him commit to a set time and day to collect it. If he texts or phones to change it say no doesn't suit or I'm not there / going out, don't have it one me. Please stick to the arrangement, or send me you account and I'll transfer it. Do as he asks but don't make it easy for him

You can ask but you can't make him do anything

cruizer101

Ray Palmer wrote: »

You can ask but you can't make him do anything

Could he issue eviction notice though if you said you were available to pay rent at a specific time and he refused it, and if you also offered to pay electronically?

You've made reasonable effort to pay.

Ray Palmer

cruizer101 wrote: »

Could he issue eviction notice though if you said you were available to pay rent at a specific time and he refused it, and if you also offered to pay electronically?

You've made reasonable effort to pay.

You need to make reasonable attempts to meet with him. If neither can agree a time neither are being reasonable

Ray Palmer

Ray Palmer wrote: »

You need to make reasonable attempts to meet with him. If neither can agree a time neither are being reasonable

Well that works both ways.

Offer a list of times or dates that you will be home, but making them awkward times. It's not the OPs problem they dont suit the landlord.

Mrs OBumble

Tell him to meet you yo collect it at the bank, rather than your home.

Wayyyy to risky to carry a months rent in cash.

beauf

Mitzy wrote: »

He can request the rent to be paid in whatever manner he prefers.
I know it is painful for you to have to get cash and would be much easier to deal by EFT but just because this is his preferred payment method you can't assume he is avoiding tax.

Also he is perfectly entitled to visit the property to carry out regular inspections to ensure it is being kept to a certain standard. This might be his way of killing two birds with the one stone!

Cash is legal tender no argument.

But its a ridiculous way of dealing with rent.

People are completely paranoid about cash, I couldn’t be dealing with people like that.

I honestly wouldn’t think anymore about carrying 1k in cash as I would about 5 euro. Maybe I’m just used to it so I’m desensitised.

macplaxton

Oaklynn Rancid Womanhood wrote: »

Plenty of people would regularly carry 4 figure sums of cash without giving it a second thought.

Plenty?
4-figure sums?

You must move in some circles. I can't think of anyone I've known that go around with those sorts of sums on their person on a regular basis.

A few hundred maybe and those would be few enough to count on one hand

macplaxton

macplaxton wrote: »

Plenty?
4-figure sums?

You must move in some circles. I can't think of anyone I've known that go around with those sorts of sums on their person on a regular basis.

A few hundred maybe and those would be few enough to count on one hand

Anyone who pays rent in cash, anyone who buys and sells cars, the vast majority of tradesmen will take in plenty of cash, people paying tradesmen in cash, people who take out a wad of cash from the machine or bank to do them for the month etc etc.

Also lots of people keep cash at home for different reasons.

awec

Only idiots carry large sums of cash on their person. OP, unfortunately your landlord is an idiot.

You can be sure that tradesmen, after taking large cash payments, are getting to the bank to deposit said cash as soon as they can.

Even these days I doubt there are too many oul grannies daft enough to walk about with large cash sums on them.

beauf

That doesn't mean its a good idea to use cash if there is an easy way to avoid it.

In this case its not simply about the cash.
Its about having arrange a meeting every time the rent is due.

awec

awec wrote: »

Only idiots carry large sums of cash on their person. OP, unfortunately your landlord is an idiot.

Why is he an idiot, I’ve never ever been robbed be in mugged, my car or my house? Why would I be worried?

awec wrote: »

You can be sure that tradesmen, after taking large cash payments, are getting to the bank to deposit said cash as soon as they can.

I don’t think you get the purpose of taking cash if you think they lodge it in the bank, that is the last place they go with it.

beauf wrote: »

Its about having arrange a meeting every time the rent is due.

A very wise move by the LL many would say, gives him the chance to inspect the house every month. I paid cash in 2/3 places I rented and never found it in the least bit inconvenient. If I wasn’t there the LL just let himself in to get it.

awec

Oaklynn Rancid Womanhood wrote: »

Why is he an idiot, I’ve never ever been robbed be in mugged, my car or my house? Why would I be worried?



I don’t think you get the purpose of taking cash if you think they lodge it in the bank, that is the last place they go with it.

:pac:

I think if any of these things had happened to you and you still carried cash then "idiot" would be an overly kind descriptor.

"It's never happened to me" is of course, rock solid reasoning.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

Oaklynn Rancid Womanhood wrote: »

Why is he an idiot, I’ve never ever been robbed be in mugged, my car or my house? Why would I be worried?

It only has to happen once.

Musefan

One of the first questions asked by my bank when applying for a mortgage was "do you pay your rent in cash or out of your bank account". I was told to make sure it comes out of my account if I wanted rent to be factored into ability to repay each month.

Daz_

dashoonage wrote: »

He's a landlord.

Yeah , how dare someone own another property and then provide you with a place to live .

JustAThought

It gets around the problem of banks and the rent date eg 1st being a Sunday - if like many people you don’t do online banking you are left trotting to the bank to check if the payment is in, maybe having to return a few days later -Q, etc - its a major pain in the neck. Not all bank accounts CAN have atm cards for them but give a higher rate of interest but it means you can’t just check balances at the wall but have to go in and waste time q’ing to see if money is lodged. So I see why the landlord would do it.Assuming you can pay it all in one go ( another heartache ) why not set aside a regular time and place and day to give him/her the rent in cash.You could chose one of those atm’s that are inside the bank but that you can access after the bank is closed at 3 or 4 or whatever time banks close at. Might be a win all round. Agree re rent book or receipts.

saabsaab

I had a landlord like this but that was in the nineteen eighties. Cash only every Friday. Came in person, Id say to check up on what I was up to for a year or so. Then asked me to lodge to account and had no bother afterwards.

Sounds like he doesn't trust you yet or he wants you to go?

AndrewJRenko

cruizer101 wrote: »

Is this a change to how you have been paying or have you always been paying in cash and now want to change?

This is the key question OP.

You're probably going to be exceeding daily/weekly ATM limits to pay a month's rent in Dublin in cash. So you're going to have to spread your withdrawals, and hold maybe half the rent in cash in your place for a week or two.

With reduced bank opening hours and moves to outsource the ATM business, this could turn into a very complex operation.

If you're forced into it, the first step would be to report to Revenue.

antimatterx

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

This is the key question OP.

You're probably going to be exceeding daily/weekly ATM limits to pay a month's rent in Dublin in cash. So you're going to have to spread your withdrawals, and hold maybe half the rent in cash in your place for a week or two.

With reduced bank opening hours and moves to outsource the ATM business, this could turn into a very complex operation.

If you're forced into it, the first step would be to report to Revenue.

Report to revenue? Is cash not legal tender for services?

Browney7

Is your tenancy registered with the RTB OP?

I'd suggest making up some yarn that you're going to be out of the country for 6 weeks with work and holidays and won't be able to physically hand over cash so can you provide details for an electronic payment.

That or if you can't pay you go into arrears and you've 2 weeks to rectify - you could do this every month if you liked and he could get sick of writing arrears letters (which I doubt he'll actually do). If he gets annoyed you missed rent day just reply in writing that you can pay immediately if he provides bank details.

If you like where you live it's probably not the wisest move to piss him off as he may mysteriously find a family member to move in or remove you at the four year point.

He has reasons for cash, most of them potentially dubious (hiding money from bank (he might owe a load and is just creaming off cash before repossession in an extreme case), taxman, wife etc) or else he's just old school and uses it to get out of the house and to check up on ye (which is a pain and quite infantilising but that's people for you).

machaseh

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

This is the key question OP.

You're probably going to be exceeding daily/weekly ATM limits to pay a month's rent in Dublin in cash. So you're going to have to spread your withdrawals, and hold maybe half the rent in cash in your place for a week or two.

With reduced bank opening hours and moves to outsource the ATM business, this could turn into a very complex operation.

If you're forced into it, the first step would be to report to Revenue.

I used to pay the rent for my room only to my previous roommate by bank transfer. How he handled it with the landlord I don't know. He moved out and now I have to deal with the landlord.

What the landlord told me is that he did pay it by bank transfer but always paid late. I have no more contact with that previous roommate.

Basically the evil landlord is punishing me for the wrongdoings of my previous roommate (not only paying late but he was also a pig and didn't clean etc.)

Now this lease will only run for a couple more months. I am strongly considering not renewing it. The issue is then I have to rent somewhere else with possibly an equally evil landlord. I'd prefer to just move out of dublin really but it's not really feasible with my job and all.

AndrewJRenko

antimatterx wrote: »

Report to revenue? Is cash not legal tender for services?

Yep, it is absolutely legal tender.

Tax evasion is not legal, and is the most likely reason for looking for a cash payment.

Gumbo

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

This is the key question OP.

You're probably going to be exceeding daily/weekly ATM limits to pay a month's rent in Dublin in cash. So you're going to have to spread your withdrawals, and hold maybe half the rent in cash in your place for a week or two.

With reduced bank opening hours and moves to outsource the ATM business, this could turn into a very complex operation.

If you're forced into it, the first step would be to report to Revenue.

You make one single withdrawal in the bank on the due day.

You can’t report to revenue for cash payments either.
I pay my plumber cash, he gives me RGI certs. Do you report every taxi driver you meet that takes cash from you!

The Student

machaseh wrote: »

I have a really really really evil landlord (many other issues, already called about them with threshold ).

Now one of the issues is that my landlord wants to collect the rent in cash each month. Presumably to avoid taxes, but why this is so is not really my concern.

My concern is:
- safety. What if some thugs steal my month's rent on the way from the bank? What if the deposit is stolen from my home overnight? What if my roommate f*cks me over and steals it? What if my landlord steals it and claims that I didn't pay the rent?
- Landlord has to come to my home to collect it. I honestly want to see him as little as possible.
- Difficulty in arranging a meet up time.

He refused to accept bank transfer. I asked him if I could write out a cheque instead (in my country this is a super old fashioned method and never used anymore, but here in Ireland it's slightly more common). But your man said that it would take too long to clear.

Is a landlord legally able to demand the rent in cash each month (as well as bills)?

My advice is to thread with caution the advice you are receiving on this forum in relation to your post.

Cash is legal tender, if you were always paying in cash then there is no reason why the landlord should not continue to receive payment in cash. Agree a location to make payment to him even if it means for you going to where he lives etc.

It seems strange to me if the landlord was previously accepting payment into a bank account and now wants cash. if it was going in to a bank account then there was a trace of it so Revenue would see it.

if you are not happy with the situation then live with it for the short term while looking for another place.

The Student

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Yep, it is absolutely legal tender.

Tax evasion is not legal, and is the most likely reason for looking for a cash payment.

And what happens if he reports the landlord to Revenue?

Possible outcomes landlord is not tax compliant blames tenant for reporting him tenant is made homeless.

Landlord is tax compliant and decides tenant is a troublemaker tenant is made homeless.

Landlord is tax compliant and decides tenant is a troublemaker any hope of improving tenant landlord relationship is destroyed. Tenant suffers.

Great advice!

thomas 123

Daz_ wrote: »

Yeah , how dare someone own another property and then provide you with a place to live .

How dare they purchase them with lax mortgages and now force our generation to slave to pay their mortgages without a chance of owning our own home before 35/40.

In most cases that is.

El_Duderino 09

Mitzy wrote: »

Also he is perfectly entitled to visit the property to carry out regular inspections to ensure it is being kept to a certain standard. This might be his way of killing two birds with the one stone!

They're perfectly entitled to.carry out inspections IF they give notice of an inspection. The OP could meet them at the door and give them the money and not allow them into the house.


It would also be responsible to have to cancel the meeting at short notice because things come up which would interfere with the transaction e.g. Have to work late or need to go somewhere. The landlord has chosen a very inconvenient method of payment so they must expect to be inconvenienced too.

AndrewJRenko

kceire wrote: »

You make one single withdrawal in the bank on the due day.

So you have to get there in bank opening hours, which are restricted. And many bank branches are non-cash branches now, which is a further restriction.

This could get fairly messy fairly quickly.

kceire wrote: »

You can’t report to revenue for cash payments either.
I pay my plumber cash, he gives me RGI certs. Do you report every taxi driver you meet that takes cash from you!

You can report anyone you like to Revenue for anything. The question is what Revenue will do with your report.

I'd guess that if there is evidence of >€10k changing hands in cash over the course of a year, they'll be fairly interested.

Browney7

The Student wrote: »

And what happens if he reports the landlord to Revenue?

Possible outcomes landlord is not tax compliant blames tenant for reporting him tenant is made homeless.

Landlord is tax compliant and decides tenant is a troublemaker tenant is made homeless.

Landlord is tax compliant and decides tenant is a troublemaker any hope of improving tenant landlord relationship is destroyed. Tenant suffers.

Great advice!

I thought the narrative on this forum was that being a LL was a hiding to nothing and tenants are there to screw you and the RTB back them up.

Seems easy enough to remove tenants from your post?

AndrewJRenko

The Student wrote: »

And what happens if he reports the landlord to Revenue?

Possible outcomes landlord is not tax compliant blames tenant for reporting him tenant is made homeless.

Landlord is tax compliant and decides tenant is a troublemaker tenant is made homeless.

Landlord is tax compliant and decides tenant is a troublemaker any hope of improving tenant landlord relationship is destroyed. Tenant suffers.

Great advice!

The landlord won't know who reported him to Revenue.

AndrewJRenko

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

This is the key question OP.

You're probably going to be exceeding daily/weekly ATM limits to pay a month's rent in Dublin in cash. So you're going to have to spread your withdrawals, and hold maybe half the rent in cash in your place for a week or two.

With reduced bank opening hours and moves to outsource the ATM business, this could turn into a very complex operation.

If you're forced into it, the first step would be to report to Revenue.

Hold money for two weeks? How much do you think the op is paying. Atm limits are around 700 euro per day, so two days at most is all that would be needed to withdraw to pay for the cost of one room in a two bed (most people have more than one current account so you can have the withdrawal limit per account).

As for report to revenue, it’s not your business to look after the LL tax affairs. It’s ridiculous how fast some suggest this, reporting someone to revenue is real bottom of the barrel stuff that only the lowest of the low would consider.