Rent Increase in Rent Pressure Zone

SomeDude

Hi All,

Looking for some advice please. I’m renting in a rent pressure zone in Dublin and recently received a letter from the letting agency notifying me that the rent will be increasing by 12%. I was quite surprised given that there had been no increase since I started living here almost 3 years ago. I looked up the rent pressure zone calculator and in theory it appears they are allowed to increase the rent up to a maximum of 12% in this particular scenario. The property itself was managed by the property owner until they asked a letting agency to start managing the property six months ago.

Unfortunately I did not receive or request proof of how much the previous tenant(s) was paying. I believe this is a breach of regulations. Also there was no adequate fire safety in the property until a few months ago.

I’d appreciate any guidance or suggestions on my options.

Many thanks 🙏

Guidance on?

If the RTB calculator confirms that they are raising it by the permitted amount, they are acting within the regs of the RTA.

handlemaster

another crazy tenant implying somthing is amiss. I take it rent was well below market rate now rent increase is correctly applied you have an issue ! What is the issue ?

SomeDude

handlemaster wrote: »

another crazy tenant implying somthing is amiss. I take it rent was well below market rate now rent increase is correctly applied you have an issue ! What is the issue ?

Thanks for taking the time to reply. Not sure why you presume the rent was well below the market rate. The issue is that we are in rent t pressure zone and want to ensure the landlord has followed the regulations. Crazy, I know.

the_syco

SomeDude wrote: »

I’m renting in a rent pressure zone in Dublin and recently received a letter from the letting agency notifying me that the rent will be increasing by 12 ... I looked up the rent pressure zone calculator and in theory it appears they are allowed to increase the rent up to a maximum of 12% in this particular scenario.

So... agency increases rent to maximum allowed, and you are wondering... what?

SomeDude wrote: »

I believe this is a breach of regulations.

I think the regulations that you are referring to didn't come into effect until after you had moved in?

SomeDude wrote: »

Also there was no adequate fire safety in the property until a few months ago.

So there is now?

SomeDude

Dav010 wrote: »

Guidance on?

If the RTB calculator confirms that they are raising it by the permitted amount, they are acting within the regs of the RTA.

I’m not sure if the calculator operates in isolation to other regulations. I could be wrong on that though.

handlemaster

SomeDude wrote: »

Thanks for taking the time to reply. Not sure why you presume the rent was well below the market rate. The issue is that we are in rent t pressure zone and want to ensure the landlord has followed the regulations. Crazy, I know.

Because if they can legally increase by 12% it obviously was. What was your rent prior to the increase and what is the open market rate ?

SomeDude

the_syco wrote: »

So... agency increases rent to maximum allowed, and you are wondering... what?

If it’s permitted in the circumstances that I outlined...

I think the regulations that you are referring to didn't come into effect until after you had moved in?

I think the regulations came into effect in Dec 2016? This was before we moved in.

So there is now?

there is only after we questioned why there wasn’t any.

SomeDude

SomeDude wrote: »

I’m not sure if the calculator operates in isolation to other regulations. I could be wrong on that though.

The calculator gives the max that can be legally charged based on the variables of your tenancy. It does not reflect what the previous tenant was paying. You could contact the RTB for clarification but you would have to track down the last tenant to get confirmation of what he/she was paying.

The fire safety is an issue for the local planners rather than the RTB I would suspect.

The Student

SomeDude wrote: »

I’m not sure if the calculator operates in isolation to other regulations. I could be wrong on that though.

If the calculator confirms your fig will be 12% increased that that's what it will be. If regs are not been met then that's separate.I suspect your rent was below market rate otherwise why raise rent to above market rate?

SomeDude

handlemaster wrote: »

Because if they can legally increase by 12% it obviously was. What was your rent prior to the increase and what is the open market rate ?

No, it was actually slightly above similar local lettings at the time.

q85dw7osi4lebg

I recommend you find somewhere charging similar rent to what you are currently paying because 12% is a big jump alright.

SomeDude

The Student wrote: »

If the calculator confirms your fig will be 12% increased that that's what it will be. If regs are not been met then that's separate.I suspect your rent was below market rate otherwise why raise rent to above market rate?

Okay thanks. I wasn’t aware that the calculator is final.

Rent was similar or slightly below in comparable properties at the time of first renting it.

handlemaster

SomeDude wrote: »

Okay thanks. I wasn’t aware that the calculator is final.

Rent was similar or slightly below in comparable properties at the time of first renting

That was three years ago or more?

SomeDude

handlemaster wrote: »

SomeDude wrote: »

Okay thanks. I wasn’t aware that the calculator is final.

Rent was similar or slightly below in comparable properties at the time of first renting

That was three years ago or more?

Less than 3

BigVanVador

SomeDude wrote: »

Hi All,

Looking for some advice please. I’m renting in a rent pressure zone in Dublin and recently received a letter from the letting agency notifying me that the rent will be increasing by 12%. I was quite surprised given that there had been no increase since I started living here almost 3 years ago. I looked up the rent pressure zone calculator and in theory it appears they are allowed to increase the rent up to a maximum of 12% in this particular scenario. The property itself was managed by the property owner until they asked a letting agency to start managing the property six months ago.

Unfortunately I did not receive or request proof of how much the previous tenant(s) was paying. I believe this is a breach of regulations. Also there was no adequate fire safety in the property until a few months ago.

I’d appreciate any guidance or suggestions on my options.

Many thanks ðŸ™

Sounds right to me. Max of 4% increase a year for 3 years. If there was a breach of regulations you should have raised them at the time and not use it as some sort or bargaining chip.

SomeDude

BigVanVador wrote: »

Sounds right to me. Max of 4% increase a year for 3 years. If there was a breach of regulations you should have raised them at the time and not use it as some sort or bargaining chip.

Thanks for taking the time to read and reply to my post. And thanks for the advice. 12% is a steep hike in my opinion. Already looking at comparable lets for less nearby.

Irish Aris

SomeDude wrote: »

Thanks for taking the time to read and reply to my post. And thanks for the advice. 12% is a steep hike in my opinion. Already looking at comparable lets for less nearby.

I think it feels steep because the rent hasn't increased in 3 years.
I am also in a rent pressure zone, my rent increases once every 2 years by 8%.

BigVanVador

SomeDude wrote: »

Thanks for taking the time to read and reply to my post. And thanks for the advice. 12% is a steep hike in my opinion. Already looking at comparable lets for less nearby.

If the rent is been raised it also needs to be comparable to similar let's in the same area. The landlord needs to give evidence to support this and also a registered mail notification to you the tenent. The notice period depends on how long you've been there. Its on the rtb site.

SomeDude

BigVanVador wrote: »

If the rent is been raised it also needs to be comparable to similar let's in the same area. The landlord needs to give evidence to support this and also a registered mail notification to you the tenent. The notice period depends on how long you've been there. Its on the rtb site.

Thanks for the reply. I’ll check that out.

SomeDude

Irish Aris wrote: »

I think it feels steep because the rent hasn't increased in 3 years.
I am also in a rent pressure zone, my rent increases once every 2 years by 8%.

That’s true. Luckily other options nearby for less if we can’t come to a compromise.

cosybeach

BigVanVador wrote: »

If the rent is been raised it also needs to be comparable to similar let's in the same area. The landlord needs to give evidence to support this and also a registered mail notification to you the tenent. The notice period depends on how long you've been there. Its on the rtb site.

do you have a link that says it must be by registered mail.

Fol20

cosybeach wrote: »

do you have a link that says it must be by registered mail.

It doesn’t need to be registered mail. I have physically gone to my tenants before to give it to them. If you think your tenant is going to try and pull a fast one and don’t trust them. It’s safer to do it this way.

BigVanVador

cosybeach wrote: »

do you have a link that says it must be by registered mail.

No i don't have a link. You need to be able you prove you sent it though. The tenant can say they never received it and it up to the landlord to prove they sent it. Has to be express post not registered. I've just gone through the whole process recently.

Samuel T. Cogley

You can probably thank all this talk of a rent freeze for causing LLs to spring into action. That or recouping of the money used to bring the place up to spec.

Fol20

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

You can probably thank all this talk of a rent freeze for causing LLs to spring into action. That or recouping of the money used to bring the place up to spec.

I recently increased rent for all my tenants as a result of FF supporting the bill. Now they are already back peddling but i hear talks of decreasing rental increase to a max of 2pc a year so ill leave the increases go through as protection.

The Student

Fol20 wrote: »

I recently increased rent for all my tenants as a result of FF supporting the bill. Now they are already back peddling but i hear talks of decreasing rental increase to a max of 2pc a year so ill leave the increases go through as protection.

I am doing the same. I actually don't want to do it as my tenants are completely hassle free but because of the uncertainty around legislation and what the General Election might bring (no matter who gets in) rent freezing is on its way.

The Student

BigVanVador wrote: »

No i don't have a link. You need to be able you prove you sent it though. The tenant can say they never received it and it up to the landlord to prove they sent it. Has to be express post not registered. I've just gone through the whole process recently.

A certificate of posting should suffice. An Post can give you one of these when you buy a stamp in the post office and hand the letter to the post office clerk.

BigVanVador

The Student wrote: »

A certificate of posting should suffice. An Post can give you one of these when you buy a stamp in the post office and hand the letter to the post office clerk.

It should but it doesn't. Express post confirms that it was put in the letter box. If you send registered they can refuse to collect it.

The Student

BigVanVador wrote: »

It should but it doesn't. Express post confirms that it was put in the letter box. If you send registered they can refuse to collect it.

I have used a certificate of posting for legal cases I have taken and the Judge has accepted it as proof of delivery of legal papers for debt cases. But the op should do what they feel most comfortable doing.

BigVanVador

The Student wrote: »

I have used a certificate of posting for legal cases I have taken and the Judge has accepted it as proof of delivery of legal papers for debt cases. But the op should do what they feel most comfortable doing.

Yes they should definitely do whatever they feel comfortable with. The rtb recommends express post only. But they are a bit šhite.

Fian

Your landlord needs to give you notice in writing in the prescribed format of the rent increase. You are entitled to 90 days notice before the increase takes effect.

They should provide you with examples of 3 similar properties to establish that the new rent will be market rent, but that should be straightforward given that the market rent has advanced more than 12% in the last 3 years.

RTB website will give you the information you are looking for.

You don'#t appear to have any cause for complaint here, you should probably be grateful that your rent did not increase sooner. Bear in mind that because of compounding your rent could have increased more than 12% had annual rent increases been imposed.

SomeDude

Fian wrote: »

Your landlord needs to give you notice in writing in the prescribed format of the rent increase. You are entitled to 90 days notice before the increase takes effect.

They should provide you with examples of 3 similar properties to establish that the new rent will be market rent, but that should be straightforward given that the market rent has advanced more than 12% in the last 3 years.

RTB website will give you the information you are looking for.

You don'#t appear to have any cause for complaint here, you should probably be grateful that your rent did not increase sooner. Bear in mind that because of compounding your rent could have increased more than 12% had annual rent increases been imposed.

I might try the good old fashioned route of having a chat about it. We’ve been very good tenants imo. But sure you can always get more money in this market.

SomeDude

SomeDude wrote: »

I might try the good old fashioned route of having a chat about it. We’ve been very good tenants imo. But sure you can always get more money in this market.

By very good tenants, do you mean you pay rent on time and don’t wreck the place? That is just doing what is required of all tenants.

SomeDude

Dav010 wrote: »

By very good tenants, do you mean you pay rent on time and don’t wreck the place? That is just doing what is required of all tenants.

No actually, I also wouldn’t call that being very good tenants. I doubt many landlords would, so I’m surprised by your question.

SomeDude

SomeDude wrote: »

No actually, I also wouldn’t call that being very good tenants. I doubt many landlords would, so I surprised by your question.

Sorry, no offence meant. But when you say you will have a chat and that you have been very good tenants, what are “very good tenants”?

SomeDude

Dav010 wrote: »

Sorry, no offence meant. But when you say you will have a chat and that you have been very good tenants, what are “very good tenants”?

I’m not being smart, but I don’t think it would be right to go into detail on a public forum. I take it from your comments that you view tenants in very black and white manner.

SomeDude

SomeDude wrote: »

I’m not being smart, but I don’t think it would be right to go into detail on a public forum. I take it from your comments that you view tenants in very black and white manner.

I do indeed, this is a business transaction.

SomeDude

Dav010 wrote: »

I do indeed, this is a business transaction.

Interesting to view it in such a binary way when there’s a human element involved. I guess there’s a risk when you change tenants that you end up with a ‘bad one’.

BigVanVador

Dav010 wrote: »

By very good tenants, do you mean you pay rent on time and don’t wreck the place? That is just doing what is required of all tenants.

I wish i had tenants like that!

SomeDude

SomeDude wrote: »

Interesting to view it in such a binary way when there’s a human element involved. I guess there’s a risk when you change tenants that you end up with a ‘bad one’.

Binary is the way it should be, both LL and tenant should fulfil their respective responsibilities, then they are tenant and LL. When you have a chat with your LL, I don’t see why the LL should compromise on a legal rental increase because you have paid rent on time and respected the property.

SomeDude

Dav010 wrote: »

Binary is the way it should be, both LL and tenant should fulfil their respective responsibilities, then they are tenant and LL. When you have a chat with your LL, I don’t see why the LL should compromise on a legal rental increase because you have paid rent on time and respected the property.

Just because the regulations allow a LL to increase the rent to a certain level doesn’t mean they have to. If the LL doesn’t want to compromise that’s fine, they can start looking for a new tenant. And we can move elsewhere. Simple and binary 😉. Hopefully those new tenants won’t be ‘bad’ ones.

SomeDude

SomeDude wrote: »

Just because the regulations allow a LL to increase the rent to a certain level doesn’t mean they have to. If the LL doesn’t want to compromise that’s fine, they can start looking for a new tenant. And we can move elsewhere. Simple and binary 😉. Hopefully those new tenants won’t be ‘bad’ ones.

Unfortunately the regs mean that if he doesn’t increase to permitted level, the mooted rent freeze that all the political parties are now talking about will penalise your LL going forward. The joys of ill thought out interference in the rental sector.

If you are in a RPZ, there probably won’t be a problem getting a new tenant, but you might have difficulty getting a new place to rent.

SomeDude

Dav010 wrote: »

Unfortunately the regs mean that if he doesn’t increase to permitted level, the mooted rent freeze that all the political parties are now talking about will penalise your LL going forward. The joys of ill thought out interference in the rental sector.

If you are in a RPZ, there probably won’t be a problem getting a new tenant, but you might have difficulty getting a new place to rent.

I don’t think we’ll have any difficulty luckily. There are places nearby. I’ve already spoken to a letting agent I dealt with before regarding availability. The LL probably won’t have difficulty finding a new tenant, but they might be unlucky and end up with a bad tenant.

SomeDude

SomeDude wrote: »

I don’t think we’ll have any difficulty luckily. There are places nearby. I’ve already spoken to a letting agent I dealt with before regarding availability. The LL probably won’t have difficulty finding a new tenant, but they might be unlucky and end up with a bad tenant.

The odds are in his favour,.

SomeDude

Dav010 wrote: »

The odds are in his favour,.

It’s not a zero sum game Dav.

SomeDude

SomeDude wrote: »

It’s not a zero sum game Dav.

Unfortunately the regs make rental increases an essential consideration rather than a discretionary one. Missing a rental increase effects what can be charged going forward to both you and the next tenant if a freeze comes in. The LL is losing money.

SomeDude

Dav010 wrote: »

Unfortunately the regs make rental increases an essential consideration rather than a discretionary one. Missing a rental increase effects what can be charged going forward to both you and the next tenant if a freeze comes in. The LL is losing money.

But they could potentially lose more if they’re unlucky enough to get a bad tenant. They need to decide if that’s a risk worth taking. No need to ask what your decision would be!

SomeDude

SomeDude wrote: »

But they could potentially lose more if they’re unlucky enough to get a bad tenant. They need to decide if that’s a risk worth taking. No need to ask what your decision would be!

For those staying in the rental market and accepting the risk, it will be worth taking. There are considerably more good tenants than bad ones. As a business decision, it’s a no brainer.

SomeDude

Dav010 wrote: »

For those staying in the rental market and accepting the risk, it will be worth taking. There are considerably more good tenants than bad ones. As a business decision, it’s a no brainer.

By the sounds of it you’ve been lucky with your tenants. Unfortunately it’s not like that for everyone.

Rodin

12% increase after 3 years is less than 4% every year if the 4% is on the new rent (after the previous year's increase). Simple v compound increase