Half of Americans don’t know 6m Jews were killed in Holocaust (survey)

Dohnjoe

From multiple choice, only 45% gave the correct answer. Considering the amount of data and info we have at our fingertips, it's a little surprising to say the least

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jan/22/holocaust-survey-americans-pew-research-center

Tony EH

So what?

Probably more don't know the total number of dead from WWII.

Why should they?

I wish it was a written exam. The question "What was the Holocaust" would illicit some hilarious answers I am sure.

TuringBot47

It's European history, although obviously they were heavily involved in ww2.

Would we be able to answer basic American history questions?

rock22

TuringBot47 wrote: »

It's European history, ...

That's an extremely narrow point of view. The Holocaust is surely world history.

Tony EH

rock22 wrote: »

That's an extremely narrow point of view. The Holocaust is surely world history.

Well, everything that happens on our planet is "world" history. However, certain events (or in the case of the holocaust, a series of events) can be localised to a specific region.

However, why should modern Americans be required to possess such knowledge? It would behove them better to know how many people died in their own Civil war, for example. Or have a rough estimate of how many native Americans were slaughtered in their own country.

Dohnjoe

Tony EH wrote: »

However, why should modern Americans be required to possess such knowledge? It would behove them better to know how many people died in their own Civil war, for example. Or have a rough estimate of how many native Americans were slaughtered in their own country.

It's not required. There has been a recent (global) rise in antisemitism, hate-crimes, rise of the far-right, white-supremacy. The common denominator is often ignorance, which is why education is key. This recent survey for instance shows how little Americans know about e.g. the Holocaust in general, not just the 6m figure. Highlights a possible need for better education and efforts to tackle online disinformation.

Mad_maxx

I doubt more than half the Irish population know either?

TuringBot47

rock22 wrote: »

That's an extremely narrow point of view. The Holocaust is surely world history.

It's not my point of view, I'm guessing how much emphasis they put on it in the American education system.

Tony EH

Dohnjoe wrote: »

It's not required. There has been a recent (global) rise in antisemitism, hate-crimes, rise of the far-right, white-supremacy. The common denominator is often ignorance, which is why education is key. This recent survey for instance shows how little Americans know about e.g. the Holocaust in general, not just the 6m figure. Highlights a possible need for better education and efforts to tackle online disinformation.

People "knowing" a death toll for one instance of man's inhumanity to man isn't going to do anything to tackle the issues you bring up in the paragraph above.

Combating the rise of nefarious political beliefs needs much more than cheap tertiary historical knowledge.

Dohnjoe

Tony EH wrote: »

People "knowing" a death toll for one instance of man's inhumanity to man isn't going to do anything to tackle the issues you bring up in the paragraph above.

Which is why I mentioned "This recent survey for instance shows how little Americans know about e.g. the Holocaust in general, not just the 6m figure."

Gods Gift

Jimmy kimmel does a piece on his show asking the public simple questions. Remember seeing one where they couldn’t even point out America on a world map. Americans.

Tony EH

Dohnjoe wrote: »

Which is why I mentioned "This recent survey for instance shows how little Americans know about e.g. the Holocaust in general, not just the 6m figure."

That's not going tackle it either though.

cdeb

rock22 wrote: »

That's an extremely narrow point of view. The Holocaust is surely world history.

I don't think so. If that were true, we'd surely give equal attention to contemporaneous Japanese atrocities?

How many here can say how many were killed in the "Asian Holocaust"?

Dravokivich

Dohnjoe wrote: »

Which is why I mentioned "This recent survey for instance shows how little Americans know about e.g. the Holocaust in general, not just the 6m figure."

USA is pro Isreal. I doubt they're at risk of being a hot hed of anti semitism regardless of what they know about the holocaust.

Skylinehead

[QUOTE=Tony EH;112333591

Probably more don't know the total number of dead from WWII.
[/QUOTE]

Nobody does. The uncertainty over death tolls for WW2 is the same range as the actual total deaths for WW1 (about 15m).

Dohnjoe

Dravokivich wrote: »

USA is pro Isreal. I doubt they're at risk of being a hot hed of anti semitism regardless of what they know about the holocaust.

Antisemitism and antisemitic attacks are on the rise over there. There's no magic bullet to solve it, but education (or lack of) definitely plays a part.

conorhal

Mad_maxx wrote: »

I doubt more than half the Irish population know either?

When you look at what Ruairi Quinn and Richard Bruton did to the history syllabus you're probably not wrong. Those two cleary want nobody to learn the lessons of history, preferably by not teaching them. A population that lives only in the now as consumers is a population easily controlled.

wcooba

I find this article (and survey) quite disrespectful to other victims of the Holocaust. At least 700,000 Soviets, 200,000 non-Jewish Poles, 200,000 Roma people were exterminated in nazi camps. Aren't they worth the mention?

MontgomeryClift

This is good news. It shows that Holocaust lies are fading from consciousness.

The 6 million figure is preposterous. The true number is difficult to estimate, but it's probably closer to half a million or less, and the vast majority of those were a result of disease and starvation when the supplies were cut off.

Jewish pressure groups aren't happy with this development, but that shouldn't worry us. They have used the lie of the six million to guilt trip Europeans and Germans in particular for too long as it is.

cdeb

Oh dear...

is_that_so

Not sure what this says other than the fact that people don't know the answer to a question. This is really not unusual and there are many questions many of us don't know the answer to. Had they not known what the Holocaust was you'd be more concerned. Generally a fan of the Guardian but there are times ...

MontgomeryClift

wcooba wrote: »

I find this article (and survey) quite disrespectful to other victims of the Holocaust. At least 700,000 Soviets, 200,000 non-Jewish Poles, 200,000 Roma people were exterminated in nazi camps. Aren't they worth the mention?

That's a good point. Many non-German non-Jews died in the camps, as did communists and other dissidents. In some cases the Jewish population was only about 12%.

ChikiChiki

Only 4% of Americans hold passports. Not really a shock that the be all and end all for a lot of Americans is within their own country. Quite an insular nation.

Tony EH

Skylinehead wrote: »

Nobody does. The uncertainty over death tolls for WW2 is the same range as the actual total deaths for WW1 (about 15m).

Nobody knows any death toll for certain. These things are practically impossible to quantify. That includes the holocaust.

However, my point is that this kind of mickey mouse knowledge is really meaningless. Knowledge of certain historical events is fine. But the is idea that "Half of Americans don't know 6m Jews were killed in Holocaust" is somehow a reason for concern is a bit silly.

Winning_Stroke

I'd put fifty quid on the same headline result if Irish people were asked.

cdeb

ChikiChiki wrote: »

Only 4% of Americans hold passports. Not really a shock that the be all and end all for a lot of Americans is within their own country. Quite an insular nation.

40%, not 4% - https://www.bbc.com/news/amp/world-us-canada-42586638

Still small and insular, but 4% would be remarkably improbable

SaintLeibowitz

MontgomeryClift wrote: »

This is good news. It shows that Holocaust lies are fading from consciousness.

The 6 million figure is preposterous. The true number is difficult to estimate, but it's probably closer to half a million or less, and the vast majority of those were a result of disease and starvation when the supplies were cut off.

Jewish pressure groups aren't happy with this development, but that shouldn't worry us. They have used the lie of the six million to guilt trip Europeans and Germans in particular for too long as it is.

Id recommend Timothy Synders 'bloodlands' which covers stalin and Hitler atrocities. I'd also recommend visiting treblinka, belzec and chelmno. These are extermination camp sites.


The people you are listening to, telling you of a Jewish conspiracy are lying to you and making you come across very poorly.

Dohnjoe

MontgomeryClift wrote: »

This is good news. It shows that Holocaust lies are fading from consciousness.

The 6 million figure is preposterous. The true number is difficult to estimate, but it's probably closer to half a million or less, and the vast majority of those were a result of disease and starvation when the supplies were cut off.

Jewish pressure groups aren't happy with this development, but that shouldn't worry us. They have used the lie of the six million to guilt trip Europeans and Germans in particular for too long as it is.

Here we go..

All the figures from WW2 are preposterous (e.g. Soviet POWs) or just the Jewish figure?

RobbieTheRobber

SaintLeibowitz wrote: »

Id recommend Timothy Synders 'bloodlands' which covers stalin and Hitler atrocities. I'd also recommend visiting treblinka, belzec and chelmno.


The people you are listening to, you can telling you of a Jewish conspiracy are lying to you and making you come across very poorly.

It's just straight up Holocaust denial bullshít.
There should be no doubt about the fact that the Nazis singled out the European Jewish population for extermination particularly from 1941 until the end of the war.

SaintLeibowitz

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

It's just straight up Holocaust denial bullshít.
There should be no doubt about the fact that the Nazis singled out the European Jewish population for extermination particularly from 1941 until the end of the war.

I know. Unfortunately cliff doesnt. I blame the scumbags on Youtube he's watching telling him otherwise

Nollog

SaintLeibowitz wrote: »

I know. Unfortunately cliff doesnt. I blame the scumbags on Youtube he's watching telling him otherwise

It's refreshing to see someone not attack people who watch YouTube history and instead tell them good source material.

Your Face

I wonder how many Germans know?

SaintLeibowitz

/\/ollog wrote: »

It's refreshing to see someone not attack people who watch YouTube history and instead tell them good source material.

Anyone can make a convincing video on a subject. Unfortunately there are alot of bad actors who make factually incorrect material. I've definetly watched stuff that's factually incorrect and fallen for it.

Fortunately there is wealth of peer reviewed material on the subject of the second World War.

Dohnjoe

There are plenty of informative Youtube videos on the subject, that come right away in any search, someone actually has to make more of an effort to find the denial stuff. Same goes for any source. There's no excuse.

ancapailldorcha

Why do people think pretending to be thoughtful and moderate would work here. Obvious Holocaust denialism is obvious.

Gamer Bhoy 89

It's fine that they don't know the numbers. But I've heard people not even hear of Hitler and what he did and it just astounded me. I even knew who Hitler was and what he did when I was 12. I didn't do history class on it either. I just knew, somehow...
In my eyes I regard it as common knowledge, like 9/11, the Titanic, or what the recent awful bushfires in Australia will be in years to come.

Mr.burgess

How many irish people would know how many died in the famine of the top of there head ??

MoonUnit75

What a crock, just under 70% of those who answered said 3 million or more. Ridiculous headline.

ancapailldorcha

Mr.burgess wrote: »

How many irish people would know how many died in the famine of the top of there head ??

One million. About the same number emigrated.

MontgomeryClift

MoonUnit75 wrote: »

What a crock, just under 70% of those who answered said 3 million or more. Ridiculous headline.

But don't you see, that's not good enough. They all have to say 6 million and no less in order to be doctrinally correct. A war-time tragedy has been twisted, exaggerated, and made into a religion.

Salary Negotiator

MontgomeryClift wrote: »

But don't you see, that's not good enough. They all have to say 6 million and no less in order to be doctrinally correct. A war-time tragedy has been twisted, exaggerated, and made into a religion.

I shouldn't engage, but I am curious.

If vast numbers of European Jews weren't killed in the extermination camps then where did they all go?

Mr.burgess

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

One million. About the same number emigrated.

And you had to get that of google just like myself as i forgot maybe the americans forgot as well no harm in it

2020Vision

Mr.burgess wrote: »

How many irish people would know how many died in the famine of the top of their head ??

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

One million. About the same number emigrated.

So what you're saying there is that one million Irish people would know how many died in the famine. That's about 20% of the population!

In future, why not read the question properly before posting a stupid answer.

Realt Dearg Sec

MontgomeryClift wrote: »

This is good news. It shows that Holocaust lies are fading from consciousness.

The 6 million figure is preposterous. The true number is difficult to estimate, but it's probably closer to half a million or less, and the vast majority of those were a result of disease and starvation when the supplies were cut off.

Jewish pressure groups aren't happy with this development, but that shouldn't worry us. They have used the lie of the six million to guilt trip Europeans and Germans in particular for too long as it is.

Thank you so much for this Montgomery. For the first page or so a lot of people were kind of questioning whether this survey result is all that big a deal. Then you came a long with a powerful reminder of the consequences of total ignorance of history.

Bravo.

MontgomeryClift

Salary Negotiator wrote: »

I shouldn't engage, but I am curious.

If vast numbers of European Jews weren't killed in the extermination camps then where did they all go?

The World Jewish Almanac shows a slight increase in Jewish world population between 1933 and 1948. Holocaust fans say that this is only an estimate, and that it's not correct, and maybe they're right, but they don't cite alternatives. And if these population numbers were such a reprehensible lie, why did a Jewish journal publish them?

ancapailldorcha

Mr.burgess wrote: »

And you had to get that of google just like myself as i forgot maybe the americans forgot as well no harm in it

Nope. I did google it to double check but the figure off the top of my head was correct.

Salary Negotiator

MontgomeryClift wrote: »

The World Jewish Almanac shows a slight increase in Jewish world population between 1933 and 1948. Holocaust fans say that this is only an estimate, and that it's not correct, and maybe they're right, but they don't cite alternatives. And if these population numbers were such a reprehensible lie, why did a Jewish journal publish them?

Thats what not I asked.

And I googled the World Jewish Almanac, it's just called The World Almanac or The World Almanac and Book of Facts. Have you added Jewish to the name to add credence to your point? Seems a bit dishonest.

Beasty

MontgomeryClift wrote: »

This is good news. It shows that Holocaust lies are fading from consciousness.

The 6 million figure is preposterous. The true number is difficult to estimate, but it's probably closer to half a million or less, and the vast majority of those were a result of disease and starvation when the supplies were cut off.

Jewish pressure groups aren't happy with this development, but that shouldn't worry us. They have used the lie of the six million to guilt trip Europeans and Germans in particular for too long as it is.

Do not post in this thread again

Everyone else, please ignore the poster

martingriff

Gamer Bhoy 89 wrote: »

It's fine that they don't know the numbers. But I've heard people not even hear of Hitler and what he did and it just astounded me. I even knew who Hitler was and what he did when I was 12. I didn't do history class on it either. I just knew, somehow...
In my eyes I regard it as common knowledge, like 9/11, the Titanic, or what the recent awful bushfires in Australia will be in years to come.

I agree with you knowing the numbers is not that bad as long as your informed in what has happened. That been said some deniers use number to see look not that many died and it was the hunger that took them not Nazis glossing over it was the there policies that made them starve. If someone said it was hunger and not the English that caused the Irish to die in the Famine and they are not to blame the same deniers would go mad

Mr.burgess

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Nope. I did google it to double check but the figure off the top of my head was correct.

Fair enough i thought the figure was higher than that for some reason