Donald Trump Presidency discussion Thread VII (threadbanned users listed in OP)

Gbear

Another one of Trump's swampdwellers appears to be getting drained, with former advisor George Nader pleading guilty to child pornography and child sex trafficking.

He really does sound like an absolute monster, to the extent where it's better not to read about the details of his crimes because they're seriously grim.

Fair enough about having fellow travellers in the con-artistry game, like Manafort, Cohen and whatnot, but how they have people like Nader involved in a campaign when he had multiple prior incidences of child sex crimes (**** knows why he wasn't locked up already) really is difficult to wrap your head around.

everlast75

https://twitter.com/ScottMStedman/status/1216867486471278593?s=19

Of course they did. Anyone care to wager how many Republicans will do anything about it?

Do ye remember when Republicans used to say there was no collusion with the Russians, presumably because it was a bad thing to say in public? Now the levels of acceptance seemed to have moved.

Trump enablers need to take a step back and realise that there is *nothing* he will not do.

He keeps pushing and pushing. His behaviour is only going to get worse. That's what happens when there is no check on him.

StringerBell

Yep, no surprise at all. Like there will be no surprise when you hear the talking heads and others say that there is no evidence linking Trump to this alleged hack and follow it up with the old and surely if Biden has nothing to fear the Russians, or whoever cause obviously you can't just flat out accept it was the Russians won't have found anything.

Christy42

Barr is now saying the "imminent" threat has nothing to do with why they carried out the assassination. Now they are shifting to it was for deterrence.

If anyone believes that they need help.

StringerBell

Christy42 wrote: »

Barr is now saying the "imminent" threat has nothing to do with why they carried out the assassination. Now they are shifting to it was for deterrence.

If anyone believes that they need help.

And again, what will be the consequences of the repeated lies and changing stories? What basically amounts to an act of terrorism, of murder on the territory of a sovereign nation?

As I said, too far gone at this point to even realise how far from their idea of what they are they really are.

Timberrrrrrrr

everlast75 wrote: »

This was retweeted by Trump today.

JFC

https://twitter.com/D0wn_Under/status/1216667026191605760?s=20

Republicans/Trump hitting new low every day

Dems should do a quick photoshop job themselves and depict Trump with a Hitler moustache and SS uniform. The Twitter meltdown would be epic.

duploelabs

Christy42 wrote: »

Barr is now saying the "imminent" threat has nothing to do with why they carried out the assassination. Now they are shifting to it was for deterrence.

If anyone believes that they need help.

The red flag for this was the other week when Pompei refused to define what imminent meant when questioned

check_six

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Republicans/Trump hitting new low every day

Dems should do a quick photoshop job themselves and depict Trump with a Hitler moustache and SS uniform. The Twitter meltdown would be epic.

I don't think the reaction would be what you'd expect. I think it would surprise and horrify you. I'm thinking back to the video clip from the Kingsman movie with trump's face superimposed on a mind-controlled secret agent who is in the process of gruesomely butchering a church full of fundamentalist maniacs (possibly also mind controlled) who had a variety of Democratic Party notable faces superimposed on them. Yer man re-tweeted that one himself, and he's not exactly repulsed by the idea of a totalitarian hard man leader either.

check_six

Also, along those lines, I would have thought that Solemani would have been the exact model of a go-getting sociopathic monster that gets things done that trump and his supporters so worships and admires. You start to believe that someone like that could do well in a US election at this point.

Christy42

Trump breaking off the deal with Iran is having the desired effect (presumably). Iran is now actively working towards having nuclear weapons saying that European companies are not helping enough to mitigate US sanctions. Especially as they hit European countries as well.

Why Trump wants Iran to have nuclear weapons is beyond me but it is the only logical motive I can give to his actions (that may be my issue going for logical).

Timberrrrrrrr

Christy42 wrote: »

Trump breaking off the deal with Iran is having the desired effect (presumably). Iran is now actively working towards having nuclear weapons saying that European companies are not helping enough to mitigate US sanctions. Especially as they hit European countries as well.

Why Trump wants Iran to have nuclear weapons is beyond me but it is the only logical motive I can give to his actions (that may be my issue going for logical).

He needs a "valid" reason to go to war, Like Bush and his W.M.D claims.

robinph

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

He needs a "valid" reason to go to war, Like Bush and his W.M.D claims.

Iran need to hurry up with getting something that Trump can claim is a viable weapon. Trump needs the war to start in the next 6 months to win the US election by default.

StringerBell

Not really no, he and his ilk have always run on fear, scaremongering scapegoating and exploiting others.

All he needs is an other, an enemy and Iran working toward getting a nuclear weapon plays well into that. It's all theatre with him and those like him, all that matters is the story you tell and knowing what the audience wants. His reality TV career helps him big time as a candidate which when you consider it is the highest office on the land is a very sad indictment of where society has sunk to these days.

drunkmonkey

robinph wrote: »

Iran need to hurry up with getting something that Trump can claim is a viable weapon. Trump needs the war to start in the next 6 months to win the US election by default.

Lol, no he doesn't need a war to win. When did he ever need a war to win.
He had a great reception from the fans in New Orleans last night, all chanting 4 more years and USA, USA.

What did the Democrats and the left want to do, cancel Vince Vaughn. All Trump has to do is not be a bigger clown than the fossets circus to his left.

StringerBell

I'd argue that in fact what he has to do, what he has always had to do and what he will continue to do is BE the biggest clown in the race. Cause that's his thing, that gets the ratings.

aloyisious

Apparently, for now anyway, Boris Johnson is saying that Don Trump's version of the Iran deal should be accepted. One thing is whom is that message aimed at: Iran or the EU? I cant see it being Iran so it's probably for the EU, I see Boris using it to cause splits in the EU position on the deal it and the US had with Iran [pre trump] as he is now allied with Don on creating an alternative international business partnership and wants to destroy the EU as an international business pact. Boris's public position is likely intended to be used by Don to promote his "stable" POTUS image to voters.

Outlaw Pete

aloyisious wrote: »

@Outlaw Pete.

In so far as the assassination of General Soleimani created the tensed-up military alert situation in Iran, then yes, the Trump Administration bears a strong degree of responsibility for the downing of the Ukrainian Civil airliner.

Utter nonsense. Many military attacks by the Obama administration resulted in tense situations in the middle east and you can be damn sure had an affected "Government" accidently brought down an airliner in the midst of such situations, you would not have been on here suggesting that the Obama Administration was culpable.

duploelabs

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

Utter nonsense. Many military attacks by the Obama administration resulted in tense situations in the middle east and you can be damn sure had an affected "Government" accidently brought down an airliner in the midst of such situations, you would not have been on here suggesting that the Obama Administration was culpable.

When did the Obama administration assassinate such a high level government official? Can you refresh me?

drunkmonkey

It's worrying what the people so upset Trump was elected in the first place will do after Trump is reelected.

This is incitement to terrorism, won't look great for Sanders.

https://twitter.com/bennyjohnson/status/1217111200720400389?s=20

aloyisious

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

Utter nonsense. Many military attacks by the Obama administration resulted in tense situations in the middle east and you can be damn sure had an affected "Government" accidently brought down an airliner in the midst of such situations, you would not have been on here suggesting that the Obama Administration was culpable.

Good to see you think the regional tensions caused by the assassination of the general had nothing to do with the shooting-down of the Ukrainian aircraft. What you say about me not being on here suggesting that the Obama Administration would have been culpable in similar situations is correct. It would be a total misnomer on this thread given that Don Trump now heads the administration.

drunkmonkey

drunkmonkey wrote: »

It's worrying what the people so upset Trump was elected in the first place will do after Trump is reelected.

This is incitement to terrorism, won't look great for Sanders.

https://twitter.com/bennyjohnson/status/1217111200720400389?s=20

There is seemingly no end of actual criminals that work/worked for Trump and you are upset that a communist works on Sanders campaign?
Edit: or what about all the right wing gun nuts who who were threatening civil war if trump was removed?

drunkmonkey

Deleted User wrote: »

There is seemingly no end of actual criminals that work/worked for Trump and you are upset that a communist works on Sanders campaign?

I'm not upset, I'm just worried people are going to have a hard time dealing with the future, I'm worried for the presidents safety. The absolute hate from the Dems and the left is scary, they don't want a democracy anymore, you said it, they'd take communism over Trump.

Fonny122

Not a fan of that violence nor am I a fan of Project Veritas who have been caught manufacturing lies so often that it its best to not give them any credence whatsoever.

That said, Trump has also incited politically motivated violence and intimidation (otherwise known a the definition of terrorism) at his rallies, going so far as to tell people to hit others and he will cover the legal fees. It's kinnd of hard to claim a moral high ground or make a complaint if that is the stuff you're supporting, as it comes across less as being against violence, and more so being against violence against one side only.

Billy Mays

Deleted User wrote: »

There is seemingly no end of actual criminals that work/worked for Trump and you are upset that a communist works on Sanders campaign?
Edit: or what about all the right wing gun nuts who who were threatening civil war if trump was removed?

Sure only yesterday a former Trump advisor pled guilty to child sex trafficing and possession of child porn

Outlaw Pete

gizmo wrote: »

There's only one problem. The links I shared from the various agencies do not show the protests from the perspective you claim.

"Various agencies" don't cut it. I am speaking about the MSM and the liberal left at large and they absolutely have been trying to suggest that Sulimani was a war hero and that the people of Iran loved him.

Like I said, I used the word "amplify" for a reason given that MSNBC/CNN had showed Sulimani's funeral on a loop for days, interviewing "mourners" who declared that America would pay a high price, and of course comparing the response to his death to that of Elvis or Princess Diana ... alongside coverage that Trump had illegally killed him, which of course, was all done in a concerted effort to make it appear as if Trump had just killed an esteemed member of the Iranian Government.

The agenda was clear, the motives obvious.

The MSM are starting to respond to the suggestion that they were helping push the narrative of terrorists though, as NBC included the following image on an article and a few hours later removed it:

Which is why I said at the end of my post yesterday that the left will soon have no choice but to admit that the Iranian people did not see Sulimani how they had reported it for over a week. They did their damndest (along with certain democrats in congress of course) to try and push the narrative that Trump had ordered an illegal assassination and it didn't work. The reaction to Trump last night at the game shows that he's not seen (by all Americans at least) how these people wish he was. Your hatred for Donald Trump has to very far to do what they did and it will be remembered for a long time. Especially in November.

I now see the democrats just blocked a resolution to show support to the protestors. Well colour me surprised.


https://twitter.com/GOPLeader/status/1217160400443191297

aloyisious

drunkmonkey wrote: »

I'm not upset, I'm just worried people are going to have a hard time dealing with the future, I'm worried for the presidents safety. The absolute hate from the Dems and the left is scary, they don't want a democracy anymore, you said it, they'd take communism over Trump.

Peculiarly enough, some Trump supporters had a message "I'd rather be Russian than Democrat" on their t-shirts during his 2015 rallies in reference to whom they would vote for. Not exactly MAGA or good for the US to prefer living under Russian government, given that government's, and also its president's, historical roots in communism.

Toeuptony

drunkmonkey wrote: »

I'm not upset, I'm just worried people are going to have a hard time dealing with the future, I'm worried for the presidents safety. The absolute hate from the Dems and the left is scary, they don't want a democracy anymore, you said it, they'd take communism over Trump.

To paraphrase South Park, "The Trump supporters already did it!"

drunkmonkey

aloyisious wrote: »

Peculiarly enough, some Trump supporters had a message "better Russian than Democrat" on their t-shirts during his 2015 rallies in reference to whom they would vote for. Not exactly MAGA or good for the US to prefer living under Russian government, given that government's, and also its president's, historical roots in communism.

I'd vote for Putin before any of the top Dem canidates, there absolute nut jobs from what I've seen of them. Back in the last election the Russians helped the Democrats and they still lost. Leo and Trump could only dream of Putin's approval rating, well Trump might just get there yet.

Toeuptony

Toeuptony wrote: »

To paraphrase South Park, "The Trump supporters already did it!"

30 + years ago they would have been wearing shirts that said beware of reds under the bed.

aloyisious

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Back in the last election the Russians helped the Democrats and they still lost.

Really? Yet neither Don nor the GOP have been using that as an electoral slogan in the current campaign slamming the Dems for having Vlad as a supporter in the last campaign. Was it himself or the Democrat candidate that Don wanted the Russian Govt to help with his call for that Govt to free up Hillary's Emails or did that public request made by Don via the international media just miss your attention?

Itssoeasy

The Donald trump presidency is the political equivalent of the Cleveland browns the last twenty years.

drunkmonkey

They don't need to it's old news. They have Uncle Joe snookered, Bernie and the Apache are tearing themselves apart and Nacy is going to shaft the pair of them with the Impeachment to help Joe. All Trump needs to do is sit back and watch. I'd love to see someone give him good run but the left has become such a dumping ground for what's wrong with the modern world they'll never find a candidate they all can agree on.

Fonny122

DubInMeath wrote: »

30 + years ago they would have been wearing shirts that said beware of reds under the bed.

I would love to know what their fathers who likely fought in WW2 (and then came home to undertake some of the biggest social projects in US history) would think of that photo.

One example is FDRs New Deal, one of the most successful policies in US history, and which was catigsted as socialist. His response was to say that the New Deal was about “the adjustment of burdens, the help of the needy, the protection of the weak, the liberation of the exploited and the genuine protection of the people’s property.” As a result, he said, “we have earned the hatred of entrenched greed…. ut now … they seek the restoration of their selfish power.”

And indeed, perhaps the loudest critic trying to paint it in a bad light (Al Smith) had said this only a few years earlier: “The cry of socialism has been patented by the powerful interests that desire to put a damper on progressive legislation. Is that cry of socialism anything new? Not to a man of my experience. I have heard it raised by reactionary elements and the Republican party … for over a quarter century.”

Those two quotes are from 1936 and 1928, respectively.

Gbear

Fonny122 wrote: »

Not a fan of that violence nor am I a fan of Project Veritas who have been caught manufacturing lies so often that it its best to not give them any credence whatsoever.

That said, Trump has also incited politically motivated violence and intimidation (otherwise known a the definition of terrorism) at his rallies, going so far as to tell people to hit others and he will cover the legal fees. It's kinnd of hard to claim a moral high ground or make a complaint if that is the stuff you're supporting, as it comes across less as being against violence, and more so being against violence against one side only.

This is the nature of fascism.

Someone else mentioned that Trump fans should've been a fan of Soleimani, and that's true, they should've been, except that their positions are not based on principle, but on identity.

Conservatism in general is an ideology that is based on being part of a particular in group, and maintaining the status quo for that group, and in the Republican party we see a radicalised version of that seldom seen outside of third world countries, or Fascist regimes from the middle of the last century.

That is why the "what about if Obama did that" arguments have no effect on these people. They don't care about arguments. Their position isn't based on them. It's based on identity.

It's why far right theocrats are largely in agreement with the kinds of policies outlined in Shariah law, but still use it as a boogeyman to fearmonger against Muslims.

They can make up any old ****e about the Democrats coming from your babies' blood, lying about the awful things that Trump or those in his adminstration have done and pretending like they haven't, or trying to spin what they've done as a positive, because they follow the hierarchy first, and then construct arguments to buttress it afterwards.

The entire approach of the far right is to lie, project, and obfusticate the truth and they've been using the same approach, often using the exact same arguments, at least since we've been able to recognise such a political cohort.
The ultimate goal is to bypass cognitive dissonance by changing the perception between a set of ideas to be about two warring tribes.

Fonny122

Itssoeasy wrote: »

The Donald trump presidency is the political equivalent of the Cleveland browns the last twenty years.

Only if they actively sought out Vontaze Burfict and Rae Carruth personality types during the combine interview process on their way to all those double digit losing seasons.

duploelabs

https://www.speaker.gov/newsroom/11420

“The American people deserve the truth, and the Constitution demands a trial. The House will now proceed with a vote on transmitting the articles of impeachment and naming impeachment managers on Wednesday, January 15.

“The President and the Senators will be held accountable.”

drunkmonkey

They won't get anywhere near the Truth, Trump won't even turn up he's in Switzerland for the start. He wanted it dismissed, he'll have to accept it goes on a little longer but he'll get his Not Guilty.

Puts Joe & Co in a bit of a position if it plays out that way. We can hear all about the Truth then.

drunkmonkey

drunkmonkey wrote: »

I'm not upset, I'm just worried people are going to have a hard time dealing with the future, I'm worried for the presidents safety. The absolute hate from the Dems and the left is scary, they don't want a democracy anymore, you said it, they'd take communism over Trump.

Absolute rubbish. Trump and the Republicans are actually taking apart the usa's democracy as we speak. The widespread corruption, gerrymandering etc. Its appalling to watch. If I was American I'd be far more worried about violence from the right wingers and white supremacists than the likes of antifa.

Leroy42

drunkmonkey wrote: »

I'm not upset, I'm just worried people are going to have a hard time dealing with the future, I'm worried for the presidents safety. The absolute hate from the Dems and the left is scary, they don't want a democracy anymore, you said it, they'd take communism over Trump.

Where is this fear coming from? The majority of domestic terrorism has been undertaken by the far right, yet you are scared of the left?

Talking about letting fear of the unknown override your fear of the known. You know you face a threat from the far right, hell there are militias whose stated position is to attack the government if they don't like it, yet you are more worried about some made up problem?

Itssoeasy

The House of Representatives have released some of the information that they got from Lev Parnas and his lawyer and boy does it look like lev kept the receipts. It seems the former Ukrainian ambassador was having her movements tracked an and there is one photo of a napkin with notes written on it about Biden and the investigation.

drunkmonkey

Leroy42 wrote: »

Where is this fear coming from? The majority of domestic terrorism has been undertaken by the far right, yet you are scared of the left?

Not all Terrorists use guns, it's more the damage they can do to society, I'd be fairly easygoing live and let live but I just can't get on board with some of the woke agenda and that's 100% coming from the left.

drunkmonkey

Itssoeasy wrote: »

The House of Representatives have released some of the information that they got from Lev Parnas and his lawyer and boy does it look like lev kept the receipts. It seems the former Ukrainian ambassador was having her movements tracked an and there is one photo of a napkin with notes written on it about Biden and the investigation.

So if there was corruption by some of the Democrats and Trump was trying to verify it, how does that make him the bad guy especially if there was one of these deeply corrupt individuals running for president.
Is there enough evidence for a criminal case against Biden when Trump is found not guilty.
It's not like it's fake news, some Democrats have a case to answer about Ukraine.

hotmail.com

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Not all Terrorists use guns, it's more the damage they can do to society, I'd be fairly easygoing live and let live but I just can't get on board with some of the woke agenda and that's 100% coming from the left.

It's just cringey when people use the term woke. And when people talk about the Left in America. There is no mainstream Left there.

Itssoeasy

drunkmonkey wrote: »

So if there was corruption by some of the Democrats and Trump was trying to verify it, how does that make him the bad guy especially if there was one of these deeply corrupt individuals running for president.
Is there enough evidence for a criminal case against Biden when Trump is found not guilty.
It's not like it's fake news, some Democrats have a case to answer about Ukraine.

So not addressing my post then. Okay.

droidus

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Not all Terrorists use guns, it's more the damage they can do to society, I'd be fairly easygoing live and let live but I just can't get on board with some of the woke agenda and that's 100% coming from the left.

50 people killed in extremist terror in the US in 2018 and "All of the extremist killings in the US in 2018 had links to right-wing extremism" whilst the Trump administration has so far done little to meet the domestic pressure to combat the far-right and defunded programs intended to stop the radicalization of young white people.

gizmo

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

"Various agencies" don't cut it. I am speaking about the MSM and the liberal left at large and they absolutely have been trying to suggest that Sulimani was a war hero and that the people of Iran loved him.

The various agencies, the ones I listed, are the news outlets most widely recognised as the leading left-leaning MSM outlets, especially in the context of political and world affairs. To pretend otherwise is either further disingenuity or grossly intellectually dishonest.

Furthermore you're again changing your accusation, you did not claim, in either your original post or your follow up, that they were trying to suggest that Soleimani was a war hero. You made various claims regarding both the existence and then nature of their coverage of the protests, both of which could be easily disproved by simply opening the links I provided.

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

Like I said, I used the word "amplify" for a reason given that MSNBC/CNN had showed Sulimani's funeral on a loop for days, interviewing "mourners" who declared that America would pay a high price, and of course comparing the response to his death to that of Elvis or Princess Diana ... alongside coverage that Trump had illegally killed him, which of course, was all done in a concerted effort to make it appear as if Trump had just killed an esteemed member of the Iranian Government.

Yes, they covered the events as they occurred. They covered the funeral, then they covered the anti-government protests over the weekend, then the large scale deployment of anti-riot police in Tehran yesterday and now, in the case of CNN, their headline analysis piece, "Is this Iran's 'Chernobyl moment'?", again focuses the blame squarely on the government and examines whether the protests could be the tipping point for revolution against the regime.

As for the legality of the matter, until the US provides evidence of the actively developing or imminent attacks they originally claimed, the strike against Soleimani remains in a position of dubious legality under Article 51 of the UN Charter. The problem with maintaining this rather low standard of justification is evident when the same Article is subsequently misused by your adversary, as Iran proved when they applied it in order to justify the launching of their own missile strike days later.

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

The MSM are starting to respond to the suggestion that they were helping push the narrative of terrorists though, as NBC included the following image on an article and a few hours later removed it

Evidently they've responded by using a photo which looks like it was taken at Soleimani's funeral. The tweet, with the offending image, linking to the article can be found here.

drunkmonkey

hotmail.com wrote: »

It's just cringey when people use the term woke. And when people talk about the Left in America. There is no mainstream Left there.

Hopefully it stays that way for another 4 more years. They are living in a somewhat free society, were unfortunately not and it's only going to get worse here until we have our Trump moment.

hotmail.com

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Hopefully it stays that way for another 4 more years. They are living in a somewhat free society, were unfortunately not and it's only going to get worse here until we have our Trump moment.

Americans being free must be the greatest US propaganda nonsense they believe in.

aloyisious

drunkmonkey wrote: »

So if there was corruption by some of the Democrats and Trump was trying to verify it, how does that make him the bad guy especially if there was one of these deeply corrupt individuals running for president.
Is there enough evidence for a criminal case against Biden when Trump is found not guilty.
It's not like it's fake news, some Democrats have a case to answer about Ukraine.

As stated before, if you're president, you get your AG to make a presentable legal case and hand it to your Sec State to provide to the Ukraine President and Govt so it can launch a formal corruption investigation into the Biden's and Burisma. You act in a way which is fully compliant with your lawful obligations under US law.

One thing you don't do is send your personal lawyer on a personal non-governmental mission to Ukraine to investigate the Biden's, to supplant the official US ambassador to Ukraine with your EU ambassador for the same purpose and let your personal lawyer character-assassinate the official US representative, the US ambassador, to Ukraine by lying to Ukraine's president, AG and Govt.

If you think I'm mistaken about the way Don, as US President, should have handled the matter of getting a corruption case into activities in Ukraine of US citizens handled by the proper people there the so be it. Remember while considering this, that the new Ukraine President was elected out of the blue, same as Don, on the promise of cleaning up corruption in his country.

Edit: please forgive me if you think I'm haranguing you. It's just that once I started following Don Trump's road to the White House, I was surprised by the way a large proportion of the GOP and the US seems to have swallowed everything he said as gospel. He's a man who path is as crooked as possible.

drunkmonkey

You do realise the Ukrainians had already the evidence and were a couple of years into this case before it blew up on Trump.
The Ukrainians couldn't get the Trump administration to listen, that doesn't surprise me as they were looking for their money back.
There is enough for a case against Biden and more Democrats but it's explosive. It required a tactical approach especially as there were Democrats involved.