Trying to pull a fast one?

Jk5353

A month ago I scraped a car while getting petrol. I went and got the owner from inside the gargae, apologised and told her to contact me in the daylight and let me know if she wanted it repaired. It was dark and it didnt look bad at all. Hindsight is a great thing and I now wish I took photos etc. A full week passed before i got a message. I arranged a garage to price the repair and told her if it was too pricey I would be going through insurance.
My mechanic quoted €150.
Another large repair company quoted me €250.
The owner took another week to respond to messages, It has since materialised that they are here from the Algarve for a few months,they have no phone and borrow a friends phone, their car is also from there so I don't know the year.
Tonight I got a message from the boyfriend to say that he wasn't happy to use my mechanic with such a cheap price. That he got had a price for €800 if I go by insurance but if I want to pay cash it will be €450. And what do I want to do next.
What I want to do is tell him where to go to be honest.
Its been a month since the scratch happened, how will I proceed. There is no way I am paying him that money. I was willing to pay up to €250.
The only details I have is his mobile number he has my reg and mobile.

jmreire

Jk5353 wrote: »

A month ago I scraped a car while getting petrol. I went and got the owner from inside the gargae, apologised and told her to contact me in the daylight and let me know if she wanted it repaired. It was dark and it didnt look bad at all. Hindsight is a great thing and I now wish I took photos etc. A full week passed before i got a message. I arranged a garage to price the repair and told her if it was too pricey I would be going through insurance.
My mechanic quoted €150.
Another large repair company quoted me €250.
The owner took another week to respond to messages, It has since materialised that they are here from the Algarve for a few months,they have no phone and borrow a friends phone, their car is also from there so I don't know the year.
Tonight I got a message from the boyfriend to say that he wasn't happy to use my mechanic with such a cheap price. That he got had a price for €800 if I go by insurance but if I want to pay cash it will be €450. And what do I want to do next.
What I want to do is tell him where to go to be honest.
Its been a month since the scratch happened, how will I proceed. There is no way I am paying him that money. I was willing to pay up to €250.
The only details I have is his mobile number he has my reg and mobile.

You are not the first, and for sure will not be the last to find yourself in this position, and basically they have you, and you are completely at their mercy. The upper quote you got for €250, at the more expensive garage, indicates to me that you only scratched the car,,,and that the marks will polish out. You wont get much spray painting done for €250.But that's neither here or there...they have you. If it were me, I'd inform the insurance and tell them that you are paying for it yourself, then give them the €450, make sure that you have a witness, and get them to sign a printed form stating that the payment of €450 is in full and final settlement for the damaged caused to vehicle ( reg, nr here) on ( date and location here) and Witness signature, today's date. underneath.
Bear in mind that as they are from the Algarve,( where they do not have the same level of compo culture) you are lucky ( I know, that's not the right word) But imagine what an Irish compo aware owner could do with that incident.....small as it is. I wish you Good Luck with it.

Jk5353

Thank you, expensive lesson learned

darragh o meara

Thank your lucky stars that they didn’t claim they were in the car and wanting personal injury money, it has happened more than a few times in this country.

Berserker5

I'd be careful now if u haven't already notified your insurer

The time has elapsed since you were supposed to inform them, it may raise eyebrows or more

Jk5353

I haven't, I was too trusting initially and took them at their word that I would get it fixed for them and that would be the end of it. I have a feeling this is going to get worse before it gets better. I had hoped that his message to me could be used to call his bluff as he doesnt seem to want to involve insurance.

Jk5353

Its terrible isnt it. no wonder the premiums are sky high

mrsgiller

My son cracked a cars light at traffic lights, wanted to pay as it was minimal damage to other car and none to his, 1 months later the other driver wanted €2,500 for damage to his bumper and spoiler (which weren't damaged) he ended up getting 2,700 for damage to car and €5,000 for injury through the the insurance !! Insurance fraud at its finest, sickens me

Jk5353

Bloody hell..thats just so wrong, and no doubt your sons premium is now through the roof

jmreire

mrsgiller wrote: »

My son cracked a cars light at traffic lights, wanted to pay as it was minimal damage to other car and none to his, 1 months later the other driver wanted €2,500 for damage to his bumper and spoiler (which weren't damaged) he ended up getting 2,700 for damage to car and €5,000 for injury through the the insurance !! Insurance fraud at its finest, sickens me

Google Pat Mac's ( SuperMac's chain) He recently posted what he has paid out in claims these last few year's.....and in cases that he fought and won, it would still have been less expensive to pay up, rather than fight the case. The litigation costs were more than what the original claim were, but he believe's in fighting each and every claim. But until such time as the courts enforce penalty's for fraudulent claim's , it's a win-win situation for the fraudster's and dishonest claimant's. That tells you a lot about the dysfunctional world we are living in here in Ireland.

SEPT 23 1989

jmreire wrote: »

Google Pat Mac's ( SuperMac's chain) He recently posted what he has paid out in claims these last few year's.....and in cases that he fought and won, it would still have been less expensive to pay up, rather than fight the case. The litigation costs were more than what the original claim were, but he believe's in fighting each and every claim. But until such time as the courts enforce penalty's for fraudulent claim's , it's a win-win situation for the fraudster's and dishonest claimant's. That tells you a lot about the dysfunctional world we are living in here in Ireland.

Fair play to him

He is going to fight every case on a point of principle

If we had his money we would do the same

Eggs For Dinner

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

Fair play to him

He is going to fight every case on a point of principle

If we had his money we would do the same

It will be an interesting experiment if he fights all claims in court. Obviously, there will be some victories but the overall costs might exceed any savings. That is the conundrum facing insurance companies. I'd agree that they might take the easy option too often and in Pat Macs situation, being his own money focuses the mind

COLONELsANDERS

So you were going to pay your garage €250 and the guys is asking €450. So in your eyes you're €200 offside. If this was an Irish car your insurance company would be hung out to dry for a large claim and you'd be 1000's offside in NCB loss and premium increase. Every time you apply for insurance you'd have to click the 'I've had a claim in the last 10 years box' and the insurance company will take you to the cleaners.

Pay the money. You're the luckiest man in Ireland.

This is why it’s getting to that stage where you’d nearly be right to drive off.

Masala

So.... as Lesson Assimilation for the record.... how should he dealt with this top from day one. I be interested in learning from this in case I ever be in that situation

Thanks all...

6541

Just ignore them. Pay them nothing. There is nothing they can do about it. String them along, pretending you are going to pay, eventually they will give up. Thank me later.

emanresu

Jk5353 wrote: »

. . . The owner took another week to respond to messages, It has since materialised that they are here from the Algarve for a few months,they have no phone and borrow a friends phone, their car is also from there so I don't know the year. . . .

The year and month of first registration is on a yellow band at the right of the number plate (since 1998).


http://www.licenseplatemania.com/landenpaginas/portugal.htm


If you don't have a record of the numbers on the yellow band, you may still be able to find out the year from the two letters included in the main number.



http://comofazer.pt/series-mensais-de-matriculas-saber-o-mes-e-ano-de-determinada-matricula-automovel/
Séries mensais de matriculas entre 2010 e 2012 (tipo xx-AA-xx)

2010 Letras IQ até LE
2011 Letras LE até MO
2012 Letras MO até NL
2013 Letras NL até OG
2014 Letras OG até PJ (Excepto OO)
2015 Letras PJ até PR


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vehicle_registration_plates_of_Portugal#1992-present



"This system started in 1937 with AA-10-00, which ran out on 29 February 1992. This then went on to 00-01-AA and changed to 00-AA-01 in 2005. This last sequence is expected to be exhausted by the end of 2019, and is to be replaced by the sequence AA-01-AA.
...

Currently, at time of writing (late August 2018) the sequence has just reached initial median letter V (i.e. 00-VA-01)"

jmreire

Berserker5 wrote: »

I'd be careful now if u haven't already notified your insurer

The time has elapsed since you were supposed to inform them, it may raise eyebrows or more

Remember that he had to wait for the quote, so they will give him credit for that, but the important thing to do is to inform them, early or late..and make it clear that you are intending to pay for the repair's yourself. That way, you are covered both way's.

jmreire

mrsgiller wrote: »

My son cracked a cars light at traffic lights, wanted to pay as it was minimal damage to other car and none to his, 1 months later the other driver wanted €2,500 for damage to his bumper and spoiler (which weren't damaged) he ended up getting 2,700 for damage to car and €5,000 for injury through the the insurance !! Insurance fraud at its finest, sickens me

Yes, and all perfectly legal.....:mad:

Berserker5

jmreire wrote: »

Remember that he had to wait for the quote, so they will give him credit for that, but the important thing to do is to inform them, early or late..and make it clear that you are intending to pay for the repair's yourself. That way, you are covered both way's.

Good if that's the case

Always with the insurer, you need to decide first if you're going to call them and 2nd what to say before picking up the fone

Once they answer.and there's an incident you're being recorded immediately and you're making a statement of fact

If you’re sorting it away from insurance then I don’t know why you’d inform your insurance company. I know you’re “meant to” but it’s only a road to being out of pocket for fixing the other car and then being out of pocket again from an insurance hike.

Berserker5

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

If you’re sorting it away from insurance then I don’t know why you’d inform your insurance company. I know you’re “meant to” but it’s only a road to being out of pocket for fixing the other car and then being out of pocket again from an insurance hike.

You're gambling on there not being a claim or insurance becoming aware of the incident

If you lose your insurance may be cancelled

jmreire

Berserker5 wrote: »

Good if that's the case

Always with the insurer, you need to decide first if you're going to call them and 2nd what to say before picking up the fone

Once they answer.and there's an incident you're being recorded immediately and you're making a statement of fact

Yes, but you do realise that you must inform your insurance of any incident which may involve them having to make a payout? Because from their own business model, they must ( as in law ) put aside financial resources to meet each and every claim. Sure they will log it, and that's OK, it will protect you if it goes belly up,,Imagine that there were people in the car ( I know there were not..only positive thing to emerge from this whole caper) and they agree at the scene, "Ok, give me €500 to cover the damage, and it will be OK...so they get their money, and you don't inform the insurance, because they said it's OK. But then a week or two later, after talking to some "friends" they go see a solicitor, and discover that they now have aches and pains etc and before you know it...solicitor's letter arrives in the door, claiming thousand's of €. So you then contact your insurance, but lo and behold...they know nothing about any incident having occurred,,,,,and you could be left high and dry and without insurance cover.
But once they are informed, and will not have to make any pay out, then that should not affect your premium costs.

Whocare

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

This is why it’s getting to that stage where you’d nearly be right to drive off.

Had that happened to me petrol station garda looks at cctv and was all up to do him leaving the scene of an accident .I just say not worth the hassle to garda

Del2005

Jk5353 wrote: »

A month ago I scraped a car while getting petrol. I went and got the owner from inside the gargae, apologised and told her to contact me in the daylight and let me know if she wanted it repaired. It was dark and it didnt look bad at all. Hindsight is a great thing and I now wish I took photos etc. A full week passed before i got a message. I arranged a garage to price the repair and told her if it was too pricey I would be going through insurance.
My mechanic quoted €150.
Another large repair company quoted me €250.
The owner took another week to respond to messages, It has since materialised that they are here from the Algarve for a few months,they have no phone and borrow a friends phone, their car is also from there so I don't know the year.
Tonight I got a message from the boyfriend to say that he wasn't happy to use my mechanic with such a cheap price. That he got had a price for €800 if I go by insurance but if I want to pay cash it will be €450. And what do I want to do next.
What I want to do is tell him where to go to be honest.
Its been a month since the scratch happened, how will I proceed. There is no way I am paying him that money. I was willing to pay up to €250.
The only details I have is his mobile number he has my reg and mobile.

How can you get quotes for the repair of the other car without it being present? You've no idea what damage you did or what paint is on the car.

You can't dictate where the repairs are done all you can do is pay them for the damage you caused to their vehicle to be repair in the location of their choice, or they can choose not to repair it when they get the money, and learn not to hit things.

jmreire

Del2005 wrote: »

How can you get quotes for the repair of the other car without it being present? You've no idea what damage you did or what paint is on the car.

You can't dictate where the repairs are done all you can do is pay them for the damage you caused to their vehicle to be repair in the location of their choice, or they can choose not to repair it when they get the money, and learn not to hit things.

It was presented to two Garage's, one quoted €150 and the other one quoted , €250 neither was accepted by the car owner. They wanted €450 cash, or €800 from the insurance. And of course in a case like this.. the vehicle owner hold's all the ace card's.The morality of it though is another matter, and unfortunately it's all to prevalent here in Ireland.

Eggs For Dinner

jmreire wrote: »

It was presented to two Garage's, one quoted €150 and the other one quoted , €250 neither was accepted by the car owner. They wanted €450 cash, or €800 from the insurance. And of course in a case like this.. the vehicle owner hold's all the ace card's.The morality of it though is another matter, and unfortunately it's all to prevalent here in Ireland.

Yep, you can add in blackmarket, revenue defrauding garages in to the mix along with lazy insurers, scabby solicitors, corrupt medical professionals, incompetent judiciary and a general public waiting to cash in at the earliest opportunity.

Yet we want affordable premiums with lots of overseas insurers clambering to offer cover.Not going to happen

jmreire

Eggs For Dinner wrote: »

Yep, you can add in blackmarket, revenue defrauding garages in to the mix along with lazy insurers, scabby solicitors, corrupt medical professionals, incompetent judiciary and a general public waiting to cash in at the earliest opportunity.

Yet we want affordable premiums with lots of overseas insurers clambering to offer cover.Not going to happen

Agreed 100%, Only ray of sunshine on the horizon presently is that they are strengthening the perjury law's...only when the scammers, ( all of them, medical legal and criminal elements in society. And I consider anyone who take's a fraudulent claim to be criminally minded) face repercussions for their action's, will you see any meaningful change's in the insurance " Industry".

galwaytt

Well, we had a very light 'touch' on a family car lately, and the lightest of touches of another cars bumper. It may, or may not have been polishable -but as it's not my car but the other owners, I didn't get to pick. He wanted the bumper painted. Cost was €350. At the end of the day, my excess was more than the repair was, so I'd have had to pay it anyway, and had a claim on record.

But I did inform the insurer, and did tell them we were settling directly and that there would not be a claim by the other party, and their advice to me was to get a full written receipt confirming the amount as payment settlement-in-full.

I me the guy at (his) chosen garage, paid the garage directly and got the signed receipt from owner as advised as well as the VAT invoice from the garage for the actual work, which I then forwarded to the insurance co for their records. If anyone tries to submit a claim, I have it covered. I emailed the receipt to the insurer for their records.

And I have dashcam footage as well.

Berserker5

galwaytt wrote: »

Well, we had a very light 'touch' on a family car lately, and the lightest of touches of another cars bumper. It may, or may not have been polishable -but as it's not my car but the other owners, I didn't get to pick. He wanted the bumper painted. Cost was €350. At the end of the day, my excess was more than the repair was, so I'd have had to pay it anyway, and had a claim on record.

But I did inform the insurer, and did tell them we were settling directly and that there would not be a claim by the other party, and their advice to me was to get a full written receipt confirming the amount as payment settlement-in-full.

I me the guy at (his) chosen garage, paid the garage directly and got the signed receipt from owner as advised as well as the VAT invoice from the garage for the actual work, which I then forwarded to the insurance co for their records. If anyone tries to submit a claim, I have it covered. I emailed the receipt to the insurer for their records.

And I have dashcam footage as well.

You don't have a claim on record but you have an accident on record

Might affect your premium and you have to inform insurers going forward absolute pith in fairness here

galwaytt

Jk5353 wrote: »

A month ago I scraped a car while getting petrol. I went and got the owner from inside the gargae, apologised and told her to contact me in the daylight and let me know if she wanted it repaired. It was dark and it didnt look bad at all. Hindsight is a great thing and I now wish I took photos etc. A full week passed before i got a message. I arranged a garage to price the repair and told her if it was too pricey I would be going through insurance.
My mechanic quoted €150.
Another large repair company quoted me €250.
The owner took another week to respond to messages, It has since materialised that they are here from the Algarve for a few months,they have no phone and borrow a friends phone, their car is also from there so I don't know the year.
Tonight I got a message from the boyfriend to say that he wasn't happy to use my mechanic with such a cheap price. That he got had a price for €800 if I go by insurance but if I want to pay cash it will be €450. And what do I want to do next.
What I want to do is tell him where to go to be honest.
Its been a month since the scratch happened, how will I proceed. There is no way I am paying him that money. I was willing to pay up to €250.
The only details I have is his mobile number he has my reg and mobile.

Reading that I'd say the first thing is they're going to have to provide some bona fides: name, address, insurance company details - I'd want to see the tax book too to see who the actual owner is, and proof of i.d. - if the car isn't from here, then they can claim from MIB. The 'boyfriend' is immaterial. He wasn't there, and didn't witness or see anything. His 'opinion' or looks more like attempt to extort, is exactly that.

If you want to, go to 'his' garage : if you're paying, you're entitled to the invoice, not some random 3rd party 'boyfriend' who you don't know from a hole in the ground.

the more I think of it, the more I think it's a scam.

Oh, and, record any phone calls, keep any texts. If you meet, meet in view of CCTV and/or your dashcam

jmreire

galwaytt wrote: »

Well, we had a very light 'touch' on a family car lately, and the lightest of touches of another cars bumper. It may, or may not have been polishable -but as it's not my car but the other owners, I didn't get to pick. He wanted the bumper painted. Cost was €350. At the end of the day, my excess was more than the repair was, so I'd have had to pay it anyway, and had a claim on record.

But I did inform the insurer, and did tell them we were settling directly and that there would not be a claim by the other party, and their advice to me was to get a full written receipt confirming the amount as payment settlement-in-full.

I me the guy at (his) chosen garage, paid the garage directly and got the signed receipt from owner as advised as well as the VAT invoice from the garage for the actual work, which I then forwarded to the insurance co for their records. If anyone tries to submit a claim, I have it covered. I emailed the receipt to the insurer for their records.

And I have dashcam footage as well.

And that's the way to do it. No matter what happen's next, you are covered.

jmreire

Berserker5 wrote: »

You don't have a claim on record but you have an accident on record

Might affect your premium and you have to inform insurers going forward absolute pith in fairness here

Once the insurance are not making a payment, that's all they are interested in. BUT going forward, if they are not informed... different case entirely. You are obliged to inform your insurance of any change in circumstances, and that include's even minor tips and scrapes. But you are right, in Ireland insurance and the law, are a massive ( and expensive) black hole. And one in which our Government has no interest in fixing...leave everything to the "Market's"

Berserker5

jmreire wrote: »

And that's the way to do it. No matter what happen's next, you are covered.

They can still claim for personal injury, not saying they will but the receipt for the bumper won't preclude it

Berserker5

jmreire wrote: »

Once the insurance are not making a payment, that's all they are interested in. BUT going forward, if they are not informed... different case entirely. You are obliged to inform your insurance of any change in circumstances, and that include's even minor tips and scrapes. But you are right, in Ireland insurance and the law, are a massive ( and expensive) black hole. And one in which our Government has no interest in fixing...leave everything to the "Market's"

Yes they normally don't load a premium once u explain about minor dings not.involving a payout

jmreire

Berserker5 wrote: »

They can still claim for personal injury, not saying they will but the receipt for the bumper won't preclude it

Yes, they can ( and it would not be the first time it has happened either !!! ) but now you are covered, you have reported it to the insurance. Now it all depends on the character of the people who were in the car. Sadly, after taking " Advice" too many follow the lure of easy money,,,and as has come to light in the last few days, there are Solicitor's and Doctor's actively encouraging people to make claims...and telling them how to go about it. :mad: