The Xbox Series X

Calhoun

Fieldog wrote: »

I am on board with the new Xbox, I skipped the One this time around so will get this at launch

I think the new Infinite game is also on PC isn't it?

I was playing Reach last night on PC and it looks spectacular, mechanics on the game haven't aged well to be fair...

Griffball is amazing but the rest you are correct. Halo 5 had decent gameplay.

Yes infinite is going to be cross platform which I don't see as an issue but a boon. Especially if they nail gamepass and can keep the current catalogue of games on it for the new system.

They really need some unique IP though PS4 has them beat hands down currently with exclusives .

Homelander

I have been playing Reach on PC and it's still a great game. The armor abilities are dated compared to modern games, I mean only being able to sprint in bursts is a pain - but it is a 10 year old game. Still holds up really well I think, great fun to play especially custom games. I thought Halo 5 wasn't very good and it sort of killed my interest in Halo, but will still play Infinite on Gamepass.

Not sure I will get this new Xbox. I had the original Xbox, the 360, the One and the One X, but I ended up playing the Ps4 Pro 90% of the time because a) the best exclusives are on it and b) most of my friends also have PS4 for same reason. Last gen we all had the 360. MS really screwed up big time with the exclusives.

Calhoun

I have been using the Xbox more for multiplatform games due to the better graphics on the one x . I have also been using gamepass to its full advantage.

Gonzo

Homelander wrote: »

Not sure I will get this new Xbox. I had the original Xbox, the 360, the One and the One X, but I ended up playing the Ps4 Pro 90% of the time because a) the best exclusives are on it and b) most of my friends also have PS4 for same reason. Last gen we all had the 360. MS really screwed up big time with the exclusives.

I too had a 360 from day 1 and most of my friends were also on same platform. I disliked the xbox one from day 1 so never bought into it. I had no interest in kinect and there were no exclusives worth playing. By the time the Xbox One X launched I was too far into buying PS4 titles, then Switch titles to even bother. Most of my friends migrated to the PS4 or Switch too.

However, I am hoping that the Xbox Series X will bring the Xbox back to the 360 glory days. I love the look of this new console and there is no kinect gimmick this time around. The Xbox Games Pass is a huge reason to convince me to get this next machine with such a vast library of relatively new games. Hopefully they will also deliver on exclusives this time around. I'll be monitoring the progress of the Series X over this year and may well end up buying one next Christmas.

Arcadeheroes

I like the look of the new system. Microsoft confirming it will continue its backwards compatibility feature among 3 generations of systems means I do not need to upgrade my pc ever again. Really looking forward to next gen

ERG89

Gonzo wrote: »

I too had a 360 from day 1 and most of my friends were also on same platform. I disliked the xbox one from day 1 so never bought into it. I had no interest in kinect and there were no exclusives worth playing. By the time the Xbox One X launched I was too far into buying PS4 titles, then Switch titles to even bother. Most of my friends migrated to the PS4 or Switch too.

Think most people abandoned the Xbox last gen. Towards the end of the 360's lifespan it kinda hit a wall with exclusive games; it was Gears, Forza & Halo in rotation. They ruined Fable by rushing 3 & then making a kinect game, an xbla game & a 4v1 multiplayer game.
Games like Project Gotham, Crackdown, Alan Wake, Lost Odyssey & Viva Pinata I enjoyed but they just became few & far between the later it went into the 360 lifestyle. This came back to bite them.
I'd love to see a new IP from them that looks as exciting as Gears was for the Xbox 360.

CiDeRmAn

I'll certainly be buying it but my XB1 has gotten the least play of all the current gen formats in my collection, certainly nothing like the mainstay the 360 was.
I'm hoping for better with this, but I think it'll depend on the exclusives

SMC92Ian

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Microsoft have said it is designed to be virtually silent which limits their design options especially considering it needs to be sub €500 retail.

My X and Pro are practically silent. Not a sound from them.

TitianGerm

SMC92Ian wrote: »

My X and Pro are practically silent. Not a sound from them.

The new consoles will have much beefier GPUs and CPUs though so cooling will need to be better for next gen.

Plenty of reports of not X and Pro being extremely loud with certain games though.

Homelander

Gpus and processors use less power with advancements, not more, particularly in the midrange, which is what console's tend to have. The new Xbox is Navi based so even say it's roughly a lower power 5700XT, even though it would be twice as fast as what's in the Xbox One X (roughly an rx580) it would use similar power. Overall with a decent cooling solution there's no reason it wouldn't be quietish.

SMC92Ian

TitianGerm wrote: »

The new consoles will have much beefier GPUs and CPUs though so cooling will need to be better for next gen.

Plenty of reports of not X and Pro being extremely loud with certain games though.

I've never once playing any game that's made my consoles loud. They are pin silent to the point I forget they're on. The Original PS4 jesus was like a Dyson.

My PS4 Pro is a jet. Launch model. Hasn't been turned on in months so it's probably worse now with dust build up.

Zero-Cool

[Deleted User] wrote: »

My PS4 Pro is a jet. Launch model. Hasn't been turned on in months so it's probably worse now with dust build up.

Same with mine, got it a great trade in deal for my original ps4 for the pro fortnite bundle. Would trade it back in a heartbeat. Multiple times my missus has come in to the room to check what's happening only to find it's the ps4 pro trying to take off and fly away. Looked it up and it's the old model they were trying to get rid of, no joy when contacted Sony.

I'll be buying a ps5 on launch just to get rid of this..... Just got next gen is quieter.

SMC92Ian

Zero-Cool wrote: »

Same with mine, got it a great trade in deal for my original ps4 for the pro fortnite bundle. Would trade it back in a heartbeat. Multiple times my missus has come in to the room to check what's happening only to find it's the ps4 pro trying to take off and fly away. Looked it up and it's the old model they were trying to get rid of, no joy when contacted Sony.

I'll be buying a ps5 on launch just to get rid of this..... Just got next gen is quieter.

That's mad. I've also a Slim for about 5 years that's also super quiet.

K.O.Kiki

Retr0gamer wrote: »

If it's too big it's impractical and in countries like Japan where living space is at a premium It can pretty much sink a system.

Just to get back to this:
You're talking utter bollocks :rolleyes:
It's a tall case with a small, square footprint.
Very easy to place near a TV stand or beside a 12" subwoofer.

Also good show on those extrapolated measurements.
If it's 157mm square it can fit a nice 140mm fan, which should allow for quiet & powerful cooling.

Shiminay

I think it looks really cool - no accounting for taste I think the PS5 had best get a facelift from that gods awful ugly dev-kit we've seen in the wild.

K.O.Kiki

Shiminay wrote: »

I think it looks really cool - no accounting for taste I think the PS5 had best get a facelift from that gods awful ugly dev-kit we've seen in the wild.

Steve from Gamers Nexus has a good hypothesis on the PS5 dev kits - they're designed that way so they can be stacked & still get airflow.

Varik

The Xbox's deigns if anything make the PS5 dev kit all the more likely. MS' vastly different deign for this quite clearly is to improve thermals. I'd say the APU,memory, & VRM are all mid way up the case and everything after that is heatpipe and fins.

Can see them ditching the V and dropping the height a bit on the PS5, both are going to be a mass of aluminium heat fins and fans on top.

Retr0gamer

So this new Xbox is actually going to be called.... Xbox.

And I thought the new Modern Warfare and God of war had confusing names.

Penn

Retr0gamer wrote: »

So this new Xbox is actually going to be called.... Xbox.

And I thought the new Modern Warfare and God of war had confusing names.

Xbox. Not to be confused with past consoles such as the Xbox One or the Xbox.

dudeeile

The not so original xbox

CatInABox

It's an Xbox. If people asked me what I played on, I'd say Xbox. Same as if someone asked me what phone I used, I wouldn't say I use a Nokia 8.1, I'd just say Nokia, or even android. Maybe it's just me, but I don't really think too hard about products names.

Stone Deaf 4evr

I cant help but feel that people are going out of their way to give off the air of apparent confusion.
Really, facing into the year 2020, at media and information overload, are we expected to believe that there are people still out there who can't tell the difference between Modern Warfare or God of War on new consoles vs one that came out Ten years previously? They're doing away with the set console name, and frankly its about time, the XB1 generation pushed it towards coming in line with phones, where people are smart enough to know that there are different models at different price points, all doing essentially the same thing with a better or worse degree of performance and price point.

I also refuse to accept that parents will be confused - any kid worth their salt will have made it plainly clear exactly what they're after, especially so with a premium version of an item.

Star Lord

Stone Deaf 4evr wrote: »

I cant help but feel that people are going out of their way to give off the air of apparent confusion.
Really, facing into the year 2020, at media and information overload, are we expected to believe that there are people still out there who can't tell the difference between Modern Warfare or God of War on new consoles vs one that came out Ten years previously? They're doing away with the set console name, and frankly its about time, the XB1 generation pushed it towards coming in line with phones, where people are smart enough to know that there are different models at different price points, all doing essentially the same thing with a better or worse degree of performance and price point.

I also refuse to accept that parents will be confused - any kid worth their salt will have made it plainly clear exactly what they're after, especially so with a premium version of an item.

The WiiU begs to differ with you, as lots seemed to just think it was yet another Wii add-on.

Retr0gamer

CatInABox wrote: »

It's an Xbox. If people asked me what I played on, I'd say Xbox. Same as if someone asked me what phone I used, I wouldn't say I use a Nokia 8.1, I'd just say Nokia

And both answers should be filled with the same amount of embarrassment :P

Stone Deaf 4evr wrote: »

I cant help but feel that people are going out of their way to give off the air of apparent confusion.
Really, facing into the year 2020, at media and information overload, are we expected to believe that there are people still out there who can't tell the difference between Modern Warfare or God of War on new consoles vs one that came out Ten years previously? They're doing away with the set console name, and frankly its about time, the XB1 generation pushed it towards coming in line with phones, where people are smart enough to know that there are different models at different price points, all doing essentially the same thing with a better or worse degree of performance and price point.

I also refuse to accept that parents will be confused - any kid worth their salt will have made it plainly clear exactly what they're after, especially so with a premium version of an item.

Don't underestimate the stupidity of the general public. The reason all this name confusion came about is because they are a generation behind the PlayStation in terms of naming convention and the Xbox 4 could be seen as less powerful than the PS5 (this is the reason the Xbox 360 was named as such to go up against the PS3)

I think they should just do a Microsoft and skip a number. Call it the Xbox 5 and be done with it.

But most importantly as someone that talks and reads about old games these reusing of old names gets very confusing!

dudeeile

Thanks for clearing all that up, I shall now adopt this new terminology going forward and expect everyone else to do the same, there shall be no confusion from this day forth.

Stone Deaf 4evr

Star Lord wrote: »

The WiiU begs to differ with you, as lots seemed to just think it was yet another Wii add-on.

I was waiting for that, but the xb1x / one S all digital (top selling console in the UK over black friday) seem to have no problem shifting units. They're bringing all their gaming in under the umbrella term of Xbox, and between cloud & console, streaming, gamepass, gamepass for PC, they're covering an awful lot of bases - Its seems very much like its being considered a service, with many ways to access it.


We'll also likely get to a point where certain games wont run on the older versions of xbox - similarly to how certain mobile games won't run on older version of the hardware - but perhaps the older consoles will be able to stream them?

Varik

Stone Deaf 4evr wrote: »

I was waiting for that, but the xb1x / one S all digital (top selling console in the UK over black friday) seem to have no problem shifting units. They're bringing all their gaming in under the umbrella term of Xbox, and between cloud & console, streaming, gamepass, gamepass for PC, they're covering an awful lot of bases - Its seems very much like its being considered a service, with many ways to access it.


We'll also likely get to a point where certain games wont run on the older versions of xbox - similarly to how certain mobile games won't run on older version of the hardware - but perhaps the older consoles will be able to stream them?

The current gen is 6 years old, there's nothing to get it confused with at this point.

Retr0gamer

Stone Deaf 4evr wrote: »

I was waiting for that, but the xb1x / one S all digital (top selling console in the UK over black friday) seem to have no problem shifting units. They're bringing all their gaming in under the umbrella term of Xbox, and between cloud & console, streaming, gamepass, gamepass for PC, they're covering an awful lot of bases - Its seems very much like its being considered a service, with many ways to access it.


We'll also likely get to a point where certain games wont run on the older versions of xbox - similarly to how certain mobile games won't run on older version of the hardware - but perhaps the older consoles will be able to stream them?

I think with the plan to stick to X86 based systems that they will be hoping to carry accounts and games to the next system, something which Sony seems to be planning as well.

goon_magee

I agree, the fuss about the name confusion is being greatly overblown IMO.

Can't speak for everyone, but I have a ton of friends and family with kids who always want the latest gadgets for birthdays and Xmas etc. and not once have I ever heard of any of them getting confused when buying tech. Kid asks for latest [insert name of product]....parent goes to store and asks for latest [insert name of product]....parent leaves store with [insert name of product].

Now apply that scenario to the Series X. If a parent goes in and asks for the latest Xbox, that parent is leaving that store with the latest Xbox unless some dim witted sales assistant decides they want to flog them an older, cheaper console and potentially make less money than they had potential to make.

The confusion around the Wii U was as a result of Nintendo's absolutely atrocious marketing and advertisement campaign. Microsoft is much better at explaining their ecosystem and where each system fits in within that ecosystem. Any info I have watched/read to date has been abundantly clear that the Series X is the latest addition to the Xbox family designed as a high end entry point to that ecosystem. And I don't believe that ability to understand is a result of me being a gamer in the know, it's a result of simple to understand marketing and press releases

I game primarily on PS4, and yes I prefer the numbered system Sony employs with their hardware and agree that it is easier to understand. But some of the feedback (referring to online in general, not specifically boards) I have seen would have you believe that people are being asked to go into their local game shop and decipher the ****ing Da Vinci Code.

Retr0gamer

goon_magee wrote: »

The confusion around the Wii U was as a result of Nintendo's absolutely atrocious marketing and advertisement campaign. Microsoft is much better at explaining their ecosystem and where each system fits in within that ecosystem.

I don't think you should give Microsoft too much credit there considering the hash they made of the One launch.

TitianGerm

Retr0gamer wrote: »

I don't think you should give Microsoft too much credit there considering the hash they made of the One launch.

The person who was in charge of the Xbox One launch project is long gone now.

Grumpypants

TitianGerm wrote: »

The person who was in charge of the Xbox One launch project is long gone now.

The idea for the One was great, the press event was terrible.

It happens when you have a marketing team that does things like says "we need to target this new market or that demographic". I can see them sitting there saying we sold 60 million Xboxes, but there are 2 billion people watching Sports lets get them to buy an Xbox to watch sports on.

This time they seem lazer focussed on getting it right into the hands of their target audience.

TitianGerm

I think the only way Microsoft could win over Retro here is if they called it the AC7 and it was in the shape of a plane

goon_magee

Retr0gamer wrote: »

I don't think you should give Microsoft too much credit there considering the hash they made of the One launch.

The Xbox One launch was shambolic admittedly, but it was also a long time ago and Don Mattrick who was largely responsible for the confused messaging behind the launch is long gone.

As of late Phil Spencer has done a great job IMO of being clear on what each console brings to the table and where they fit in.

CastorTroy

Seems all games playable on Xbox One will be playable on the new Xbox from day one

https://www.gamespot.com/articles/xbox-series-x-will-support-backwards-compatibility/1100-6472261/

So it's Backwards compatible with Xbox One games and then any OG Xbox and 360 games that were made BC on the One.

SMC92Ian

The Xbox has been confusing for parents this year. They've been asking me. Oh what's an S... what's the all digital and then... what's the X... I see another X is out next year... kids don't ask for the latest or newest. Their kids just asked Santy for an Xbox. He didn't write on the letter "Dear Santy can you bring me the latest model Xbox One X with a 2tb hard drive bundle with Jedi Fallen Order and it must be in black, also the latest pro controller with a Gears 5 Pro Skin" No, it's "Dear Santy can I've an Xbox with Minecraft" :P

TitianGerm

SMC92Ian wrote: »

The Xbox has been confusing for parents this year. They've been asking me. Oh what's an S... what's the all digital and then... what's the X... I see another X is out next year... kids don't ask for the latest or newest. Their kids just asked Santy for an Xbox. He didn't write on the letter "Dear Santy can you bring me the latest model Xbox One X with a 2tb hard drive bundle with Jedi Fallen Order and it must be in black, also the latest pro controller with a Gears 5 Pro Skin" No, it's "Dear Santy can I've an Xbox with Minecraft" :P

No 2TB version of the X as far as I'm aware? I would have thought anyone with an ounce of common sense would know what an "All Digital" console involved?

Edit: pro controller is a Nintendo controller. No wonder they were confused.

EoinHef

Still no detailed info on the hardware,which is all id really care about. Probably a bit to wait on the front.

The naming convention is a bit silly alright. Its not obvious at a glance as to where everything fits in. Why not call it the Xbox Series 2? Follows on from Xbox One then at least.

I like what MS have been doing lately,they are making their eco system much more attractive than Sonys imo.

I probably still wont be buying this unless all my mates move to Xbox and also because i can play MS exclusives on PC. Its brilliant what they are doing on PC,and frankly about time. It does discourage anyone with a good PC from buying their console imo though.

Retr0gamer

TitianGerm wrote: »

I think the only way Microsoft could win over Retro here is if they called it the AC7 and it was in the shape of a plane

Eh no need to be so dismissive of my opinion. Currently I feel the Xbox whatever needs a USP to sell it, some Mario 64/Halo level game to make it more appealing. So you are totally wrong as I've already played AC7. AC8 would be a better USP and I'd be there day 1 :pac:

Retr0gamer

CastorTroy wrote: »

Seems all games playable on Xbox One will be playable on the new Xbox from day one

https://www.gamespot.com/articles/xbox-series-x-will-support-backwards-compatibility/1100-6472261/

So it's Backwards compatible with Xbox One games and then any OG Xbox and 360 games that were made BC on the One.

So you're telling me it can play Ninja Gaiden Black and therefore as a result of that amazing game is better than anything currently on the PS4?

Greyfox

CastorTroy wrote: »

Seems all games playable on Xbox One will be playable on the new Xbox from day one

https://www.gamespot.com/articles/xbox-series-x-will-support-backwards-compatibility/1100-6472261/

So it's Backwards compatible with Xbox One games and then any OG Xbox and 360 games that were made BC on the One.

As a person who loves sony its interesting how backwards compatibility is far more important to me than whatever specs the Xbox series x will have. I still think Scarlet was simply a much better name

CastorTroy

As long as they have BC with the current gen, at least, it's a good thing. It means people with the current gen can trade in their consoles for the new one and still have games to play.
Like I know I'll get through all my PS4 games by the time the PS5 is released but if there's a good trade-in deal I can trade in and still play them while the PS5 library builds up.

SMC92Ian

TitianGerm wrote: »

No 2TB version of the X as far as I'm aware? I would have thought anyone with an ounce of common sense would know what an "All Digital" console involved?

Edit: pro controller is a Nintendo controller. No wonder they were confused.

Cop on.

Star Lord

Retr0gamer wrote: »

Eh no need to be so dismissive of my opinion. Currently I feel the Xbox whatever needs a USP to sell it, some Mario 64/Halo level game to make it more appealing. So you are totally wrong as I've already played AC7. AC8 would be a better USP and I'd be there day 1 :pac:

It's Microsoft, so they'll probably skip numbers, so it's the Xbox AC X that you'd be lusting for!

With the optional extra dog.jpg skin.

Retr0gamer

I want the Ace Combat 6 skins back



These offer a truly tactical advantage in combat.

The enemy will have a hard time pulling their trigger finger knowing that you've gone through life having never experienced the touch of a woman.

Grumpypants

The naming is smart enough. It's just the "Xbox" platform. And then they can release a bunch of variants. This is series X, they will do a diskless version, a 1080p version, a cloud version, a streaming App on pc/switch/smart tv etc. and not have to worry about splitting player bases as everyone can play on multiple places.

CatInABox

Digital Foundry have an article up on why it's shaped like it is, and echos my thoughts on this thread, it's all about the thermals.

Part of the problem is that processor fabrication technology has not increased in step with Microsoft's ambitions. Assuming it's an accurate image, the 7nm chip we saw back at E3 is roughly the same physical size as the 16nm chip seen in the X - likely a touch larger. Transistor density is unlikely to have doubled, meaning that the primary route forward for increased performance is frequency - and lots of it. Increasing clock-speeds gets more performance and therefore more value from the silicon, but the harder you push, the more power you need. And the more power you need, the more heat you produce - necessitating innovation in terms of thermal dissipation.

And that's almost certainly why the Xbox Series X is so large.

Article here.

I can't wait to see what Sony come up with for PS5.

BloodBath

That article is bull****. The writer is clueless.

Double the power consumption of the x? Not a chance. No console in history has drawn more than 200w and that is not going to change with the next gen. 1X is 175w. Series X will be under 200w.

The 12TF number being touted is FP16, not FP32. The writer seems oblivious to the difference. All previous consoles use FP16 as bigger numbers sound better. A 5700xt is around 10 teraflop FP32, 20 FP16. The 5700 is 8Tflops FP32, 16Tflops FP16.

This would put the new console gpu somewhere around 25% slower than a radeon 5700 non xt. Probably cut down and down clocked to get the power consumption down from 170w to around 100w.

An 8 core/ 16 thread Ryzen gen 3 down clocked to get it to around 50-60w. Leaving about 40-50w for the rest of the system.

Part of the problem is that processor fabrication technology has not increased in step with Microsoft's ambitions. Assuming it's an accurate image, the 7nm chip we saw back at E3 is roughly the same physical size as the 16nm chip seen in the X - likely a touch larger. Transistor density is unlikely to have doubled, meaning that the primary route forward for increased performance is frequency - and lots of it. Increasing clock-speeds gets more performance and therefore more value from the silicon, but the harder you push, the more power you need. And the more power you need, the more heat you produce - necessitating innovation in terms of thermal dissipation.

The IPC uplift from jaguar to Ryzen gen 3 is well over +75%. Combine that with a small bump in clockspeed and you get your doubling of CPU power. The guy is clueless. This is easily available information with a quick google.

I've seen several of these "tech experts" blow the specs out of proportion because they don't understand it. As it stands getting an 8/16 ryzen gen 3 and downclocked 5700 or 5600 equivalent card with a fast PCIE4 SSD for €500 is a bargain, even by next Christmas. I don't know why they keep trying to inflate the specs beyond that.

EoinHef

Nearly every console ever has had to be designed with heat dissapation in mind,not really that surprising.