The real problem with Housing in Ireland

Chinasea

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=

Mr. teddywinkles wrote: »

Why come here if life is ****e here?

So exploiting the tax paying, no voice foreign low waged is ok. Cosy along.

Chinasea

Chinasea wrote: »

Wow, let's blame asylum seekers ahh?

How's about the young Spanish cleaner (in my work) with a zero hours contract, shares a room with a complete stranger in a house of 13 people. And the Romanian girl who mobs up puke and **** daily in the hospital, who is living in a house with 9 others and could not afford the fare to fly home for Christmas, no holiday pay either. How's about instead of trying to blame foreigners, we remember who is actually doing what in this country and CONTRIBUTING. Who speaks up for them.

I doubt that the Spanish cleaner is an asylum seeker. And I’m sure that the Unions look after the hospital workers.

padd b1975

Eric Cartman wrote: »

if even 10% ended up that way in my lifetime id be shocked.

All those doctors and highly qualified engineers will be fine.

Doc07

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I doubt that the Spanish cleaner is an asylum seeker. And I’m sure that the Unions look after the hospital workers.

Not as simple as that I’m afraid. Contract cleaning companies have some public body contracts out of the union reach.

NovemberWren

Patrick2010 wrote: »

They’ll go into private accommodation rented by the state, where else would they go?, everyone knows this.
The idea that there is no connection between housing asylum seekers/economic migrants and the supply of houses available to locals is ridiculous.
50 more Syrians just arrived yesterday to be housed here, are they all just going to find jobs and house themselves?
The only unsafe are in Libya is Idlib, surely they could find a safe area somewhere else in Libya

You say, 'private accommodation rented by the state'; - so really these unfortunate people are going to be used like cattle by this (money insane) Irish State (FG,FF,Lab).to pay the mortgages of the Private Investors' Profit, extra houses.
i.e. the State ensuring the buying of extra houses for their Millionaire pals.

btw at the very first post (about 21 Aungier St.);- who owns the Lease that Dublin Corporation are paying E200k per year to?

And I would bet Mehaill Martin already has his airline ticket over to Christine Lagarde to drown over more billions to here.

Eric Cartman

padd b1975 wrote: »

All those doctors and highly qualified engineers will be fine.

Impressive how theyre all so qualified when only 12% emwent to higher education before getting here

NovemberWren

padd b1975 wrote: »

All those doctors and highly qualified engineers will be fine.

frightening though,- when the, (Contract based?) foreign doctors and Consultants, take their que from the in-situ HSE F.F. consultants, when dealing with non-f.f. voters.

and how even Contract doctors even assimilate the nod from HSE (s.f.?/f.f.?/pbp?) Local, unionised cleaners.

But these contract Professionals in the HSE, may pay high rents to the Housing Investors who are the pals of the Government. And maybe they reckon they will only be in this country for c. 10 years or so.

Sweet.Science

padd b1975 wrote: »

All those doctors and highly qualified engineers will be fine.

Look at them out celebrating their recent qualifications . Good on them

https://m.facebook.com/onlyindublin/videos/1267970866725997/?refsrc=https%3A%2F%2Fm.facebook.com%2Fonlyindublin%2Fvideos%2F1267970866725997%2F&_rdr

Wanderer78

Sweet.Science wrote:

Look at them out celebrating their recent qualifications . Good on them

Tis a very competitive market out there, their aggression might help them, they're just getting practice in!

pjohnson

Chinasea wrote: »

How's about instead of trying to blame foreigners, we remember who is actually doing what in this country and CONTRIBUTING.

Hell no. This is Current Affairs. You can blame those foreigners if you even stub your toe!

Annasopra

Deleted User wrote: »

I doubt that the Spanish cleaner is an asylum seeker. And I’m sure that the Unions look after the hospital workers.

They are probably contractors without unions. Not really the point though.

Annasopra

pjohnson wrote: »

Hell no. This is Current Affairs. You can blame those foreigners if you even stub your toe!

Or for just having a toe.

TwoMonthsOff

Sweet.Science wrote: »

Look at them out celebrating their recent qualifications . Good on them

https://m.facebook.com/onlyindublin/videos/1267970866725997/?refsrc=https%3A%2F%2Fm.facebook.com%2Fonlyindublin%2Fvideos%2F1267970866725997%2F&_rdr

Nigs gonna nig

Mod

Banned.

Auguste Comte

TwoMonthsOff wrote: »

Nigs gonna nig

You stay classy.

is_that_so

Well we've made another undesirable "top" list, that of unaffordable housing. The piece is about NZ but links to the report. We're about 5th in the list.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jan/20/all-sectors-of-new-zealand-housing-market-severely-unaffordable-survey

Singapore is mentioned as a model for affordable housing and their solution is largely public and views housing differently. Given their approach that would leave our housing fully under the control of an LA set-up, not an appealing thought.


http://theconversation.com/a-century-of-public-housing-lessons-from-singapore-where-housing-is-a-social-not-financial-asset-121141

Take Singapore, for example. Singapore had its own “Brexit” in 1965 when it separated from Malaysia. In 1960 the Singapore Housing and Development Board (HDB) was formed to provide affordable and high-quality housing for residents of this tiny city-state nation. Today, more than 80% of Singapore’s 5.4m residents live in housing provided by the development board.

Wanderer78

is_that_so wrote:

Singapore is mentioned as a model for affordable housing and their solution is largely public and views housing differently. Given their approach that would leave our housing fully under the control of an LA set-up, not an appealing thought.

Yea that Singapore model is truly dreadful, the thoughts of people being able to get access to some sort of accommodation, what a terrible idea

machaseh

The problem in ireland is that private parties are too easily able to stop development of not only housing, but also public transportation and bike infrastructure.

You can plan a great metro line, but if Karen complains that the metro will make too much noise, it won't be built. You can plan a beautiful appartment block with affordable housing, but if Karen complains that it blocks the view from her single story cottage, it's not going to be built. You can plan great bike roads throughout all of dublin, but if Karen doesn't want the nice trees to be cut down it's not going to be built. Etc.

The procedures for cpos, railway orders etc. need to be legally changed so that the power of private parties can never outweigh the importance for the public as a whole.

This will not only solve Dublin's housing crisis, but also the mess that is public transportation in dublin.

Idbatterim

machaseh wrote: »

The problem in ireland is that private parties are too easily able to stop development of not only housing, but also public transportation and bike infrastructure.

You can plan a great metro line, but if Karen complains that the metro will make too much noise, it won't be built. You can plan a beautiful appartment block with affordable housing, but if Karen complains that it blocks the view from her single story cottage, it's not going to be built. You can plan great bike roads throughout all of dublin, but if Karen doesn't want the nice trees to be cut down it's not going to be built. Etc.

The procedures for cpos, railway orders etc. need to be legally changed so that the power of private parties can never outweigh the importance for the public as a whole.

This will not only solve Dublin's housing crisis, but also the mess that is public transportation in dublin.

Agree with bits of this. But the planners make the decisions, not Karen. And Karen doesn’t get to elect abp board members etc ...

Stark

It's generally death by a thousand Karens though. Especially when they start getting TDs and councillors involved and you have elected represents spouting bull**** on their Twitter feeds about how BusConnects is going to destroy all the trees etc. (case in point https://twitter.com/deirdreconroyie?lang=en . Funnily enough, they changed the designs to save the trees and suddenly it was no longer about the trees). Or the likes of Clare Daly speaking out both sides of her mouth, decrying the incumbent's record on housing provision and the homeless while at the same time being one of the most prolific objectors to planning applications for housing.

Eric Cartman

Stark wrote: »

It's generally death by a thousand Karens though. Especially when they start getting TDs and councillors involved and you have elected represents spouting bull**** on their Twitter feeds about how BusConnects is going to destroy all the trees etc. (case in point https://twitter.com/deirdreconroyie?lang=en . Funnily enough, they changed the designs to save the trees and suddenly it was no longer about the trees). Or the likes of Clare Daly speaking out both sides of her mouth, decrying the incumbent's record on housing provision and the homeless while at the same time being one of the most prolific objectors to planning applications for housing.

Its an industry, people like clare daly will keep rabbling till the 3 bed semis with a back garden show up, which protip, they wont show up so she can keep claiming to be fighting for 4eva homes when even the dogs in the street know she wont get what she claims to want

machaseh

Stark wrote: »

It's generally death by a thousand Karens though. Especially when they start getting TDs and councillors involved and you have elected represents spouting bull**** on their Twitter feeds about how BusConnects is going to destroy all the trees etc. (case in point https://twitter.com/deirdreconroyie?lang=en . Funnily enough, they changed the designs to save the trees and suddenly it was no longer about the trees). Or the likes of Clare Daly speaking out both sides of her mouth, decrying the incumbent's record on housing provision and the homeless while at the same time being one of the most prolific objectors to planning applications for housing.

This is why district-based voting systems (sadly a legacy from the Brits) are so bad. All the TDs care about is getting votes from their own constituency and they completely lose the bigger picture.

In my country the Netherlands, decisions such as public transportation are determined on a provincial level and for national networks even the national level, so we don't have nearly as many issues with Karens not wanting a train line in their backyard.

Why is Dublin even divided in various councils? There should be one council Dublin that decides everything in all of County Dublin. The reality is that the majority of council Dublin is now dublin city, not only the city center proper. I mean I suppose that the tiny villages on the very outskirts (like Rush and the like) can still remain their own council. But once a village is absorbed by Dublin it should become part of this Dublin city council.

machaseh

machaseh wrote: »

The problem in ireland is that private parties are too easily able to stop development of not only housing, but also public transportation and bike infrastructure.

You can plan a great metro line, but if Karen complains that the metro will make too much noise, it won't be built. You can plan a beautiful appartment block with affordable housing, but if Karen complains that it blocks the view from her single story cottage, it's not going to be built. You can plan great bike roads throughout all of dublin, but if Karen doesn't want the nice trees to be cut down it's not going to be built. Etc.

The procedures for cpos, railway orders etc. need to be legally changed so that the power of private parties can never outweigh the importance for the public as a whole.

This will not only solve Dublin's housing crisis, but also the mess that is public transportation in dublin.

Karen sounds like a b*tch.

Yurt2

is_that_so wrote: »

Well we've made another undesirable "top" list, that of unaffordable housing. The piece is about NZ but links to the report. We're about 5th in the list.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jan/20/all-sectors-of-new-zealand-housing-market-severely-unaffordable-survey

Singapore is mentioned as a model for affordable housing and their solution is largely public and views housing differently. Given their approach that would leave our housing fully under the control of an LA set-up, not an appealing thought.


http://theconversation.com/a-century-of-public-housing-lessons-from-singapore-where-housing-is-a-social-not-financial-asset-121141

You're misrepresenting the Singapore model big-time there. It is nothing at all like the Local Authority model in Ireland. It's probably the most successful state-led, private ownership (well, 100 year-lease) system in the world. It underpins the country's social cohesion and is the only reason that Singaporeans can afford to live in their own country comfortably. For an example of a territory that got it wrong and didn't follow Singapore's lead, Hong Kong is an absolute disaster (free market model with property baron billionaires abounding), it's part of the reason HK is in meltdown at the moment.

mikep

Deleted User wrote: »

Karen sounds like a b*tch.

Karen sounds like every TD, County Councillor or "community activist"....

is_that_so

Yurt! wrote: »

You're misrepresenting the Singapore model big-time there. It is nothing at all like the Local Authority model in Ireland. It's probably the most successful state-led, private ownership (well, 100 year-lease) system in the world. It underpins the country's social cohesion and is the only reason that Singaporeans can afford to live in their own country comfortably. For an example of a territory that got it wrong and didn't follow Singapore's lead, Hong Kong is an absolute disaster (free market model with property baron billionaires abounding), it's part of the reason HK is in meltdown at the moment.

It's in the article, which you clearly didn't bother to read. I merely presented it for discussion and some people can't help but wade in flailing! Thank you for sharing!

Markcheese

What is it that makes the cost per housing unit built so high ,?
Currently site value seems dear but not ridiculous .
the vat is a large component , water and sewerage ain't low , is part 5 still a thing ? ( Although realistically thats affects how much developer pays for the site ... )
Building regs are laxer here than lots of other European countries (well the enforcement anyway )

is_that_so

The IT has a few pieces on housing today, including an editorial. They also have this 12 point proposal. Better than any manifesto IMO. Very much a case of a little done but an awful lot more to do.
https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/homes-and-property/housing-is-ireland-s-biggest-economic-and-social-emergency-can-we-fix-it-1.4149261

skinny90

machaseh wrote: »

The problem in ireland is that private parties are too easily able to stop development of not only housing, but also public transportation and bike infrastructure.

You can plan a great metro line, but if Karen complains that the metro will make too much noise, it won't be built. You can plan a beautiful appartment block with affordable housing, but if Karen complains that it blocks the view from her single story cottage, it's not going to be built. You can plan great bike roads throughout all of dublin, but if Karen doesn't want the nice trees to be cut down it's not going to be built. Etc.

The procedures for cpos, railway orders etc. need to be legally changed so that the power of private parties can never outweigh the importance for the public as a whole.

This will not only solve Dublin's housing crisis, but also the mess that is public transportation in dublin.

Surely AirBnB has a huge part to play..
Its completely disrupted the market in terms of enabling users to advertise a room/apt or house
Think about it, if you have a second or third property in a major city in Ireland,You might a mortgage or 2nd mortgage on it what are you gonna choose?
1) lease it to the private rental market and earn an average 1200-1500, incurring rental freeze, tenants who be difficult to manage, and uncooperative on up keep and rent payments. The LL can do feck all to immediately resolve the issue
2)AirBnb it, make approx 2500-3000 a month depending on rates,charges and bookings and typically less headaches overhead costs to be worrying

The result of this is less houses on the private market, majority of which or of a questionable standard and rents at an all time high

skinny90

I say this as I am currently renting in Galway.
I have to commute from oranmore which is fine. However if the LL decides to sell which could happen im always keeping an eye open on what’s available...
Currently I pay 950 a month for a 2 bed.
If I search for places at a max of 1200 both in the city and. Surrounding areas totals to around 8 options most of which are basement/garage studios and those which are not you wouldn’t dare step a foot in never mind living in it.
Now if I check air bnb and look at the amount stock in galway and surrounding areas I have hundreds of viable options

Now I’m not ranting directly at Airbnb...it’s the failings of our government to react to dealing with this disruption. Be it a tarriff or an added tax something that would make an owner weigh things up and not make it so straightforward to just go down the air bnb route
To say that simply adding thousands of houses will solve the issue is as backwards as they come

skinny90

I say this as I am currently renting in Galway.
I have to commute from oranmore which is fine. However if the LL decides to sell which could happen im always keeping an eye open on what’s available...
Currently I pay 950 a month for a 2 bed.
If I search for places at a max of 1200 both in the city and. Surrounding areas totals to around 8 options most of which are basement/garage studios and those which are not you wouldn’t dare step a foot in never mind living in it.
Now if I check air bnb and look at the amount stock in galway and surrounding areas I have hundreds of viable options

Now I’m not ranting directly at Airbnb...it’s the failings of our government to react to dealing with this disruption. Be it a tarriff or an added tax something that would make an owner weigh things up and not make it so straightforward to just go down the air bnb route
To say that simply adding thousands of houses will solve the issue is as backwards as they come