Road infrastructure discussion

So with the current situation and the resultant financial hardship that the state is going to be in. Once this crisis settles down. What are the chances of work on this project being restarted or could it still be cancelled?

marno21

Deleted User wrote: »

So with the current situation and the resultant financial hardship that the state is going to be in. Once this crisis settles down. What are the chances of work on this project being restarted or could it still be cancelled?

Making several hundred people redundant and leaving a 25km half finished building site across Mayo would seem to be a worse option than finishing the project.

IMO given the current way the economy was before this sudden recession we're going to need to start more infrastructure projects to stimulate growth.

Dudda

The work has started so once things return to normal it will continue and get finished. Contracts are signed and they can be expensive to get out of. It's extensions and refurbishments to schools and other public buildings that are at design and planning stage that will get delayed or take longer to get funding approval.

I hope the two of you are wrong and this project is cancelled after the current crisis is over, I'd much rather a small part of Mayo be left with a temporary scar than a more permanent one. If the road is completed. Plus I'm sure I'm not alone when I would much rather see money go into refurbishing schools and other more useful and environmentally friendly public projects, then this Fina Gail vote buying project.

The current road is mostly okay and would be much cheaper to make small improvements on than building a new one from scratch one thing that could be done to lower accidents is install speed cameras along the road as most accidents are caused by people driving too fast.

oscarBravo

Deleted User wrote: »

The current road is mostly okay and would be much cheaper to make small improvements on than building a new one from scratch one thing that could be done to lower accidents is install speed cameras along the road as most accidents are caused by people driving too fast.

Maybe they should just close the road altogether and let people walk.

oscarBravo

oscarBravo wrote: »

Maybe they should just close the road altogether and let people walk.

Where in my post did I say that?

Of course I understand people need to drive in between the two towns and beyond, but I strongly disagree if it's worth spending €200 million on when, for a fraction of that cost, the current road could be improved and it's possible to add a better bus service between Westport and Castlebar.

oscarBravo

Deleted User wrote: »

Where in my post did I say that?

You didn't.

Of course I understand people need to drive in between the two towns and beyond, but I strongly disagree if it's worth spending €200 million on when, for a fraction of that cost, the current road could be improved and it's possible to add a better bus service between Westport and Castlebar.

Here's the thing: they're not building the road because I think a better road is needed. They won't stop building the road because you don't think a better road is needed.

Decisions about what roads do and don't get built aren't, and shouldn't be, based on the random opinions of random people. A marginally improved road and a bus service might meet your needs, but that's not exactly an objective requirements analysis.

I still believe the decision to build the road was purely a political vote buying initiative by Fina Gail, purely to shore up some support in Mayo, and I and I'm sure many others hope the next recession after the current crisis is over, puts an end to this environmentally damaging and overpriced vanity project.

Lukekul

Busiest stretch of road in mayo but alright

Lukekul

Lukekul wrote: »

Busiest stretch of road in mayo but alright

Well, it was, I doubt it's that busy these days and probably won't be with the next recession, but sure lets throw away €200 million.

Westernyelp

Deleted User wrote: »

Well, it was, I doubt it's that busy these days and probably won't be with the next recession, but sure lets throw away €200 million.

That's a poor argument in fairness.

Westernyelp

Westernyelp wrote: »

That's a poor argument in fairness.

In what way is it a poor argument?

The fact is at the moment. Thousands of people are out of their jobs and nobody is sure how long the current crisis will last and if some of the businesses that have shut down will ever reopen with the current situation, it seems we are almost guaranteed a global recession. It seems to me in that circumstance to be complete madness, throwing away €200 million or thereabouts on a road connecting two small regional towns.

And I believe what others have said earlier in the thread is wrong, no matter how much money you throw into Mayo. You are not going to change the fact that people want to live in cities or other large urban areas and that the population of rural areas is declining everywhere in the world.

yop

Deleted User wrote: »

In what way is it a poor argument?

The fact is at the moment. Thousands of people are out of their jobs and nobody is sure how long the current crisis will last and if some of the businesses that have shut down will ever reopen with the current situation, it seems we are almost guaranteed a global recession. It seems to me in that circumstance to be complete madness, throwing away €200 million or thereabouts on a road connecting two small regional towns.

And I believe what others have said earlier in the thread is wrong, no matter how much money you throw into Mayo. You are not going to change the fact that people want to live in cities or other large urban areas and that the population of rural areas is declining everywhere in the world.

Go visit the small towns these days and see 1/2 of Dublin down here in their holiday homes, working remotely and living here.
This could bring around a big change of mindset.

While I get your argument, its hard to predict that x,y.z wont return after the X number of weeks that this will go on.
Allergen won't disappear and I've posted this somewhere else but the road is business in a daily traffic count than the road between Mayo and Galway.

I live on it and I see how busy and dangerous it is, its not speed that is causing the crashes either btw.

There are a lot already employed on it and it will bring a lot of needed businesses into the hotels, restaurants etc which could be the lifelong they need after this crisis.
200m spend but in pay back from tax, vat, hotels, food, rent etc over the next 2.5 yrs will generate a massive amount of money for the region.

Vandy West

Deleted User wrote: »

I hope the two of you are wrong and this project is cancelled after the current crisis is over, I'd much rather a small part of Mayo be left with a temporary scar than a more permanent one. If the road is completed. Plus I'm sure I'm not alone when I would much rather see money go into refurbishing schools and other more useful and environmentally friendly public projects, then this Fina Gail vote buying project.

The current road is mostly okay and would be much cheaper to make small improvements on than building a new one from scratch one thing that could be done to lower accidents is install speed cameras along the road as most accidents are caused by people driving too fast.

This project is not simply about improving the road between castlebar and westport. The main benefits will be:
- reducing traffic in castlebar (dublin-claremorris and dublin-wesport traffic will be diverted around castlebar) castlebar in the evenings/morning is over-capacity.
- reducing traffic in wesport (traffic going toward newport will bypass westport town)
- Improving road between north-west mayo and dublin. Rather than going thru castlebar to newport to achill/erris, the better route will be thru new castlebar-westport road thru newport.

There are obviously alot of places around the country that need road improvements, but if the only criteria to select these projects are based solely on the amount of traffic served, there would never be any road works done in areas outside dublin/cork/galway.

Westernyelp

Deleted User wrote:

In what way is it a poor argument?

As already mentioned. The rationales for giving the go ahead to this are not just economic and will not have changed in any material way at the conclusion of the build. (2-3 years away) to warrant it being cancelled.

oscarBravo

Deleted User wrote: »

I doubt it's that busy these days...

I drove on it today (necessary business journey). With the country closing in on a lockdown, it was pretty much as busy as on any other day, and that was travelling at 10:30 one way and noon the other. Not exactly rush hour.

Your gut feelings about a road you obviously don't use very much are not, with respect, a particularly sound basis on which to make infrastructure planning decisions.

I actually do travel the road frequently on possibly one of the most dangerous forms of transportation (a motorbike), so I'm well aware of the current conditions and traffic volume of the road. However, my opinion is unchanged. That the new road is a waste of money when the current road could be upgraded in parts to meet any demand.

And despite some people keep insisting this won't make much of a difference to both the people of Mayo and tourists visiting Westport I mean, come on, how many times have you heard about tourists complaining about the state of one particular road?

If any good comes out of this crisis we are undergoing at the moment it will be the cancellation of this largely useless vote buying project.

yop

Deleted User wrote: »

I actually do travel the road frequently on possibly one of the most dangerous forms of transportation (a motorbike), so I'm well aware of the current conditions and traffic volume of the road. However, my opinion is unchanged. That the new road is a waste of money when the current road could be upgraded in parts to meet any demand.

And despite some people keep insisting this won't make much of a difference to both the people of Mayo and tourists visiting Westport I mean, come on, how many times have you heard about tourists complaining about the state of one particular road?

If any good comes out of this crisis we are undergoing at the moment it will be the cancellation of this largely useless vote buying project.

Wont be happening, so thankfully you and me and many of us using that roads inlcuding my kids who are on the school on that crazy road outside will be safer. At the end of the day peoples lives will be safer.

marno21

Every other advanced country, regardless of environmental belief, has a wide ranging functioning highway network. Because we had a rapid transformation from an economic backwater to a highly advanced economy from the late 80s to now, we missed out on 30/40 years of road building that other countries had the benefit of. We are still playing catchup, and sometimes we take for granted how bad the roads were 15-20 years ago even. It's easy to forget driving down the M6 that it's less than 15 years since Kinnegad, Moate, Ballinasloe etc were bypassed.

Because of this, there are a lot of blanks to be filled. This isn't some scheme to drive up car use, or encourage sprawl, it's to ensure the country has a properly functioning, fit for purpose, and SAFE trunk road network for traffic to get around the country. It includes all forms of long distance traffic, cars, vans, buses and trucks. Freight cannot go on buses, and buses are inefficient anyway at mass transit in low density areas such as Mayo.

Before proceeding with the Westport-Castlebar East scheme, TII (or the NRA at the time) in conjunction with Mayo County Council conducted an appriasal of all options. The N5 scheme came out as the best option, as it will be built. Free flowing, reliable journey times from Westport eastwards are incredibly beneficial and the rewards of this will be seen when the scheme opens.

Upgrades to existing routes were stopped in the 90s because they were deemed to be poor value for money and many of the previously undertaken upgrades to existing routes have since had to be replaced themselves. Castlebar being a prime example of this and the N5 east of Castlebar.

PARlance

https://www.con-telegraph.ie/2020/05/13/proposal-to-create-west-mayo-economic-growth-cluster-progresses/

More than just a road! Bit of much needed vision

Dudda

PARlance wrote: »

https://www.con-telegraph.ie/2020/05/13/proposal-to-create-west-mayo-economic-growth-cluster-progresses/

More than just a road! Bit of much needed vision

Don't get to excited. It took a year and a half to write a report and what does it tell us?
"Mayo County Council is to adopt a leadership role in developing the model over the coming years.
This will include a town plan and retail strategy process for Castlebar and Westport to be developed simutaneously (yes simultaneously is missing an 'L')."

Now how long will it take and how much do you think it's going to cost Mayo Co. Co. to create these and if they are ever created what chance will these town plans and retail strategies of getting implemented or funding?

Westernyelp

Dudda wrote: »

Don't get to excited. It took a year and a half to write a report and what does it tell us?
"Mayo County Council is to adopt a leadership role in developing the model over the coming years.
This will include a town plan and retail strategy process for Castlebar and Westport to be developed simutaneously (yes simultaneously is missing an 'L')."

Now how long will it take and how much do you think it's going to cost Mayo Co. Co. to create these and if they are ever created what chance will these town plans and retail strategies of getting implemented or funding?

I'm hoping some of this lack of detail is down to the Connaught Telegraph's complete inability to report a story

Dudda

Westernyelp wrote: »

I'm hoping some of this lack of detail is down to the Connaught Telegraph's complete inability to report a story

LOL


I tried to find a copy of the report to see what exactly it has and the article is very vague and crap on detail but I can't fine it so presuming it's not published or made public.

naughto

There back monday working on the road which will be great to see

PARlance

Dudda wrote: »

Don't get to excited. It took a year and a half to write a report and what does it tell us?
"Mayo County Council is to adopt a leadership role in developing the model over the coming years.
This will include a town plan and retail strategy process for Castlebar and Westport to be developed simutaneously (yes simultaneously is missing an 'L')."

Now how long will it take and how much do you think it's going to cost Mayo Co. Co. to create these and if they are ever created what chance will these town plans and retail strategies of getting implemented or funding?

Well that skepticism is fair enough. It must of got me on a good day!

Joking aside, it's still good to see a little bit of vision. The idea of the two towns being 1 hub is an excellent one and should be worked on from all angles. Combined together, there's an awful lot on offer between Westbar or Castleport...

RMDrive

PARlance wrote: »

Well that skepticism is fair enough. It must of got me on a good day!

Joking aside, it's still good to see a little bit of vision. The idea of the two towns being 1 hub is an excellent one and should be worked on from all angles. Combined together, there's an awful lot on offer between Westbar or Castleport...

I agree. Islandeady is the logical choice as the new capital of Mayo.

Westernyelp

RMDrive wrote:

I agree. Islandeady is the logical choice as the new capital of Mayo.

The Halfway house will rise again!

PARlance

RMDrive wrote: »

I agree. Islandeady is the logical choice as the new capital of Mayo.

There are street gangs forming and fighting for control of inner city Islandeady as we speak, now that lambing season is over.

yop

PARlance wrote: »

There are street gangs forming and fighting for control of inner city Islandeady as we speak, now that lambing season is over.

Its the lambs which are forming the gangs.

irishgeo

PARlance wrote: »

There are street gangs forming and fighting for control of inner city Islandeady as we speak, now that lambing season is over.

The half way house could become a strategic battle point.