Negative vaping publicity

Guffy

I'm surprised there has been no discussion here about all of the recent negative reports on vaping. Reports coming out if the US with a lot of severe illnesses/death directly attributed to vaping.

Myself, i haven't seen anything concrete tbh. Seems like scare mongering to me but just from a cursory glance.

Has anyone else looked into this in more depth

u140acro3xs7dm

Guffy wrote: »

I'm surprised there has been no discussion here about all of the recent negative reports on vaping. Reports coming out if the US with a lot of severe illnesses/death directly attributed to vaping.

Myself, i haven't seen anything concrete tbh. Seems like scare mongering to me but just from a cursory glance.

Has anyone else looked into this in more depth

Inhaling chemicals every few minutes, every day, can't be good. I smoked for a few years, never had any side-effects, I'm sure if I kept it up for another 30 years that would be a different though. Most vapers are only vaping a couple of years. It took decades for them to figure out the cigarettes were bad.

gimli2112

I saw the Trumps now think it's bad and just assumed Big Tobacco had written them a cheque. I used smoke but had given up before vaping became a thing.

Guffy

gimli2112 wrote: »

I saw the Trumps now think it's bad and just assumed Big Tobacco had written them a cheque. I used smoke but had given up before vaping became a thing.

That was my first thought as well, it's a campaign run by big tobacco. But I assume they're all in on the vaping game at this stage anyway?

corkie

Vitamin E acetate contaminant cause of illness of people vaping cannabis products!

corkie wrote: »

Thought most of the health problems in the states was due to street bought cannabis/marijuana oils?

[nytimes] The Mysterious Vaping Illness That’s ‘Becoming an Epidemic’
A surge of severe lung ailments has baffled doctors and public health experts.

Does Vaping Really Cause Lung Damage? | MUST SEE! | IndoorSmokers

^^^ 200 cases out 10 millions of vaper's over 10 years ~~~ 0.019 %%%%??

More toxins in the pollution's in the air you breed walking down a city street than what may or not be in vaping e-liquid.

I'm not affiliated with any store or review site.

corkie wrote: »

vitamin E acetate contaminant cause of illness of people vaping cannabis products.

[boingboing.net] Vaping deaths and illnesses linked to contaminant

From paywall article: - [washingtonpost] https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2019/09/05/contaminant-found-vaping-products-linked-deadly-lung-illnesses-state-federal-labs-show/?noredirect=on

Mike Vapes
3 hours ago
Make sure to catch the Vape Team tonight on Mike Vapes channel at 10pm eastern time. We will have Matt SMM and The Vaping Legion on to alert everyone about the Rally in D.C.

Also doing the rounds in the states: -





## I'm not affiliated with any store or review sites. ##

Sleeper12

Guffy wrote:

Myself, i haven't seen anything concrete tbh. Seems like scare mongering to me but just from a cursory glance.

They have linked 5 deaths to vaping with 100 percent certainty.

We haven't seen much publicity about what's going on in the States because the EU have much tougher regulations.

colm_mcm

https://youtu.be/4SX9yYVscEo

corkie

Sleeper12 wrote: »

They have linked 5 deaths to vaping with 100 percent certainty.

We haven't seen much publicity about what's going on in the States because the EU have much tougher regulations.

See above, vaping of street bought cannabis/marijuana oils

Press and Media in the states are neglecting to share that important piece of information and just making it about vaping in general.

As you/others have pointed out the EU is more regulated with more restrictions on chemicals that can be put in ejuice.

Sleeper12

corkie wrote:

See above, vaping of street bought cannabis/marijuana oils

I saw that but there are some with the illness that haven't vaped Street bought oils. They are certain about this but I suppose their certainty is based on the people being honest about what they vaped. It is possible that they vaped street bought oils and aren't being honest about it

Nothing about the ~1400 people a day dying in the US from tobacco?

I don't think vaping is completely harmless but the difference between it and smoking is night and day.

Dr Bill V1.5

The bottom line here is without going into all the detail is that the US government are loosing out on billions of $'s paid annually from the tobacco companies. Do they care about public health...no, do they care about vaping being a gateway to smoking for the youth...no, do they care about the revenue being lost by people switching from smoking to vaping...yes.

As mentioned, thankfully on this side of the world it's a little more regulated,but that's not to say our government won't follow suit as it usually does.

No one is going to argue that the only safe thing to fill your lungs with is fresh air but for many people,vaping has been the only way for them to stop smoking. The jury is still out on the long term health effects of vaping but from what we know to date there are a lot less harmful ingredients in vaping than in cigarettes.

The recent deaths/illness related to vaping have offered them the perfect excuse to use a sledgehammer on a peanut. Cynical but unfortunately true.

Dr Bill V1.5

And for information,the US government take approximately 45% tax from each pack of 20 cigarettes,add to that a levy that every State or city can charge the tobacco companies to allow them sell their products. Philip Morris,one of the largest tobacco companies in the US still managed to make a tidy profit after tax.....35.1 Billion $.

optogirl

I'm hoping that it's Big Tobacco greed that is promoting these stories. I've been vaping almost 2 years now and haven't bought or smoked a cigarette in that time. I am still addicted to nicotine though. If anecdotal evidence is anything to go by, and it isn't, I can't see how vaping is as bad for me as smoking. I don't wake up with a tight chest and a lump of mank to hock up. I don't have chest infections anywhere near as much as I used to. I don't 'feel' my lungs when I inhale the vape.

kippy

optogirl wrote: »

I'm hoping that it's Big Tobacco greed that is promoting these stories. I've been vaping almost 2 years now and haven't bought or smoked a cigarette in that time. I am still addicted to nicotine though. If anecdotal evidence is anything to go by, and it isn't, I can't see how vaping is as bad for me as smoking. I don't wake up with a tight chest and a lump of mank to hock up. I don't have chest infections anywhere near as much as I used to. I don't 'feel' my lungs when I inhale the vape.

I suppose it all depend on "what" you are vaping but in general I wouldn't disagree with the assertion that vaping is nowhere near as bad for your health as smoking traditional cigarettes.
That doesn't make vaping "good" just not as bad.
If it helps people get off the cigarettes I am all for it but if people continue to vape after a certain time period I'd be concerned that they may suffer longer term issues that have yet to be fully determined.
I would in no way suggest that people go from vaping back to cigarettes based on the stories mentioned above so I dont think the cigarette companies have anything to gain by the publicity.

J Mysterio

colm_mcm wrote: »

https://youtu.be/4SX9yYVscEo

I actually had a search of the vaping forum yesterday to see if there was a thread on this after having watched this exact video on YouTube.

It looks like all this sh1t in the states is a deliberate misrepresentation. From what I can see, the majority of the people in difficulty have been vaping home made CBD oil, and not e-liquid produced by reputable companies.

I think most people who vape recognise that it's not entirely benign, but it's a damn sight better than smoking.

My view is that it's probably to stick to some of the less fancy flavours as the flavouring is where the risk is. About a year after I started vaping there was the diacetyl scandal and discussion about 'popcorn lung' etc. with a suggestion that butter/ cream/ cake/ custard flavours might have some risk attached.

I have mostly only vaped 'Bright Tobacco' for years, which is very bland. I do sometimes vape other stuff too, and don't worry too much about it.

I'd like to see continuing research and study. I don't trust much about the US these days though, particularly with the maniac they have in charge, so preferably independent European studies.

J Mysterio

Sleeper12 wrote: »

I saw that but there are some with the illness that haven't vaped Street bought oils. They are certain about this but I suppose their certainty is based on the people being honest about what they vaped. It is possible that they vaped street bought oils and aren't being honest about it

Who is to know what else they have been doing in their lives? Maybe they were working in a popcorn factory - who knows?

Circumstantial stuff like this is worthless. Frankly, it is all worthless until there are independent studies and research that can prove something.

kippy

J Mysterio wrote: »

Who is to know what else they have been doing in their lives? Maybe they were working in a popcorn factory - who knows?

Circumstantial stuff like this is worthless. Frankly, it is all worthless until there are independent studies and research that can prove something.

Indeed, but one cannot carry one regardless and suggest that it's totally safe to vape.
The less vaping, the better for people.

Dr Bill V1.5

optogirl wrote: »

I'm hoping that it's Big Tobacco greed that is promoting these stories. I've been vaping almost 2 years now and haven't bought or smoked a cigarette in that time. I am still addicted to nicotine though. If anecdotal evidence is anything to go by, and it isn't, I can't see how vaping is as bad for me as smoking. I don't wake up with a tight chest and a lump of mank to hock up. I don't have chest infections anywhere near as much as I used to. I don't 'feel' my lungs when I inhale the vape.

Unfortunately governments can't legislate for people's own stupidity and sadly people will always look for a new 'high' and a new way to deliver that 'high'. On this occasion vaping products were used to deliver a cannabis based liquid containing a very high level of vitamin E acetate,these products were purchased from street vendors. This has been the common link between 5 of the 6 deaths in the US. The 6th person had a long history of respiratory problems from general health issues not related to vaping but the fact that she vaped made the headlines.
10 million people in the US vape so you can imagine the effect that has on the tax intake to the government from the lack of tobacco sales considering that 45% of the cost of each pack of 20 cigarettes goes directly to them.
I won't say that vaping is better than smoking because as I said earlier the only healthy option for a person's lungs is fresh air but for anyone trying to quit smoking then vaping is a healthier option and has a much higher success rate than any other alternative.

rob316

optogirl wrote: »

I'm hoping that it's Big Tobacco greed that is promoting these stories. I've been vaping almost 2 years now and haven't bought or smoked a cigarette in that time. I am still addicted to nicotine though. If anecdotal evidence is anything to go by, and it isn't, I can't see how vaping is as bad for me as smoking. I don't wake up with a tight chest and a lump of mank to hock up. I don't have chest infections anywhere near as much as I used to. I don't 'feel' my lungs when I inhale the vape.

And with vaping there is structured way of coming off the nicotine, you can drop all the way down to 3mg and then 0mg. The only addiction you might have then is the hand movement and habit.

Either way the media and especially social media is going to kill the industry in the US and severely damage the industry here and in Europe.

corkie

The Vape Team - Trump's Flavorless Gamble

http://unitedvapersalliance.org/

It is over an hour long!

jonski

kippy wrote: »

Indeed, but one cannot carry one regardless and suggest that it's totally safe to vape.
The less vaping, the better for people.

Indeed, but you could say that about a lot of things . The less sugar the better for people, the less cars the better for people, the less caffeine the better for people, the less alcohol the better for people etc .

kippy

jonski wrote: »

Indeed, but you could say that about a lot of things . The less sugar the better for people, the less cars the better for people, the less caffeine the better for people, the less alcohol the better for people etc .

Indeed,
And that is always the response that comes back.

As an ex smoker, I've always been skeptical of vaping.
It might be healthier than smoking, but generally, in my opinions, vapers vape a whole lot more than smokers smoke.
I have a number of friends who vape, and then seem to be puffing away on it a lot more frequently than smokers light up.

I have no hidden agenda here, I think let people smoke and vape to their hearts consent, and stop trying to guilt people into stopping.
But I do feel that after a few more years, we will start to see the real results of vaping. I imagine it will be considered bad for you as well, and be linked with numerous deaths. But sure, what isn't bad for you.

As for the conspiracies around smoking, I absolutely agree that governments want people to smoke. The tax on smokers is a huge source of income for countries. If governments really cared about saving the lives of smokers, they would be doing a huge amount more.
Even the government back support groups for stopping smoking are cynically named. "QUIT" is a terrible name. It immediately provides negative connotations. The idea of quitting something makes people think they've failed. Or that they're missing out on something.
I quit a race. I quit the course I was doing. [/tangent]

kippy

Deleted User wrote: »

As an ex smoker, I've always been skeptical of vaping.
It might be healthier than smoking, but generally, in my opinions, vapers vape a whole lot more than smokers smoke.
I have a number of friends who vape, and then seem to be puffing away on it a lot more frequently than smokers light up.

I have no hidden agenda here, I think let people smoke and vape to their hearts consent, and stop trying to guilt people into stopping.
But I do feel that after a few more years, we will start to see the real results of vaping. I imagine it will be considered bad for you as well, and be linked with numerous deaths. But sure, what isn't bad for you.

As for the conspiracies around smoking, I absolutely agree that governments want people to smoke. The tax on smokers is a huge source of income for countries. If governments really cared about saving the lives of smokers, they would be doing a huge amount more.
Even the government back support groups for stopping smoking are cynically named. "QUIT" is a terrible name. It immediately provides negative connotations. The idea of quitting something makes people think they've failed. Or that they're missing out on something.
I quit a race. I quit the course I was doing. [/tangent]

Im not sure I agree with this - it would probably depend on the state/government and how healthcare was/is funded.
There are not insignificant direct and indirect costs associated with smoking:
https://health.gov.ie/healthy-ireland/tobacco/an-assessment-of-the-economic-costs-of-smoking-in-ireland/

jonski

Deleted User wrote: »

I have a number of friends who vape, and then seem to be puffing away on it a lot more frequently than smokers light up.

I wonder about this myself, as someone who vapes a lot . I definitely seem to be vaping more than I was smoking but I also wonder is it just that with a cigarette you light it and smoke it straight away other wise it burns out whereas with vaping there is no fear of it burning away so you end up tipping away at it for longer . Maybe we don't intake more we just do it for longer ........ and maybe I'm just fooling myself .

jonski

kippy wrote: »

Im not sure I agree with this - it would probably depend on the state/government and how healthcare was/is funded.
There are not insignificant direct and indirect costs associated with smoking:
https://health.gov.ie/healthy-ireland/tobacco/an-assessment-of-the-economic-costs-of-smoking-in-ireland/

I think the problem is the tax take from smoking is needed NOW , the perceived cost saving IF vaping is less harmful than smoking wouldn't be seen for a decade or two . So if loads quit smoking now and start vaping what pays for the healthcare associated with smoking for those years ?

kippy

kippy wrote: »

Im not sure I agree with this - it would probably depend on the state/government and how healthcare was/is funded.
There are not insignificant direct and indirect costs associated with smoking:
https://health.gov.ie/healthy-ireland/tobacco/an-assessment-of-the-economic-costs-of-smoking-in-ireland/

I dont want to derail this thread
I should have said, that was my opinion. I have no concrete facts to back up my opinion.
My opinion is based on the fact, that the government increase the price of a box of cigarettes practically every year, and as the majority of smokers and ex smokers know, this isn't going to stop people from smoking
While I smoked, prices increased by about 100%. I could barely afford it at the beginning, and I could barely afford it at the end. But I continued to smoke.
If the government actually wanted smokers to stop, then, IMO, they would try something different.

*Full disclosure, I used the Allen Carr method to stop smoking, and the difference in using that method, over the government backed methods for me, were night and day. I dont have official stats, just those that were quoted to me, so apologies if they are completely inaccurate.
Those who use government backed methods to become a non smoker have a 2% chance of success. The Allen Carr method has something like a 49% success rate.
Surely the government know, or have access to these stats, and if they are content with the low success rates, then I stand by my opinion that governments dont want people to stop smoking

kippy

jonski wrote: »

I think the problem is the tax take from smoking is needed NOW , the perceived cost saving IF vaping is less harmful than smoking wouldn't be seen for a decade or two . So if loads quit smoking now and start vaping what pays for the healthcare associated with smoking for those years ?

That doesn't make any sense if you think about it.
It has to be paid for from other areas - taxing cigarettes more for example - this works both ways.

kippy

Apologies, I may be taking the thread off topic.
Best wishes to all trying to get out of the habit.

bladespin

I know that when I was smoking I had the usual breathing issues, shortness of breath after exertion, morning cough etc etc. But I swapped to vaping some time back and now I can run without wheezing afterwards, no coughing in the morning and so on, not a scientific answer but for me vaping is far better.

Spanish Eyes

Vaping will be excise taxed here sooner or later. The only thing stopping it right now is the fact that according to proper Health Reports it is safer than smoking cigarettes.

So taxing it out of reach of those who are benefiting from not smoking fags might not go down well.

nthclare

Supposedly you've more chance of inhaling worse things if you're working in a kitchen...

Lot's of vapour from cooking, from oily vapour to vegetation and meat fish etc...

I vape myself and the one drawback is dehydration and sometimes I feel tired.

Although I sleep better than I did while smoking, no hanging out the window at 3am for a vape.

Just the usual 3am piss.....

bladespin

bladespin wrote: »

I know that when I was smoking I had the usual breathing issues, shortness of breath after exertion, morning cough etc etc. But I swapped to vaping some time back and now I can run without wheezing afterwards, no coughing in the morning and so on, not a scientific answer but for me vaping is far better.

Smoked for 5 years. Every morning woke up with a phlegmy throat. Vaping for 5 years now, only time I have phlegm is if Ive a cold which only happens about once a year. I can walk miles without being out of breath.

If vaping had a serious impact on my health I'm curious how it would manifest itself. Currently I feel as healthy as if I wasn't vaping and its a great stress reliever in work.

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

Smoked for 5 years. Every morning woke up with a phlegmy throat. Vaping for 5 years now, only time I have phlegm is if Ive a cold which only happens about once a year. I can walk miles without being out of breath.

If vaping had a serious impact on my health I'm curious how it would manifest itself. Currently I feel as healthy as if I wasn't vaping and its a great stress reliever in work.

I'll probably get booted out of this conversation now, but please dont think that smoking or vaping reduces stress.
Again, I am an ex smoker, but there are a huge number of studies out there that support the fact that smoking/vaping increases stress.
The way it was put to me, is look at all the people you work with, who dont smoke. Are they all more stressed than you? The answer is no. Surely if smoking/vaping reduced stress, then the non-smokers would all be under severe stress.

I'll leave now, as I have gone off topic, but I thought this is worth highlighting. We are in a "Giving Up Smoking" sub-forum by the way, and removing the belief that smoking/vaping helps you in anyway is a massive hurdle you need to get over to become a non-smoker.

To slowly go back on topic, if you feel healthier vaping than you did when you were smoking, that is great. Do what makes you feel better\happier\healthier

Best of luck everyone

kippy

kippy wrote: »

I suppose it all depend on "what" you are vaping but in general I wouldn't disagree with the assertion that vaping is nowhere near as bad for your health as smoking traditional cigarettes.
That doesn't make vaping "good" just not as bad.
If it helps people get off the cigarettes I am all for it but if people continue to vape after a certain time period I'd be concerned that they may suffer longer term issues that have yet to be fully determined.
I would in no way suggest that people go from vaping back to cigarettes based on the stories mentioned above so I dont think the cigarette companies have anything to gain by the publicity.

It's about harm reduction IMO. Anyone I know who went from smoking to vaping feels much better and you can even see it in them. Women smoking 50 years, me smoking 15 years, the difference is night and day. Yes it would be better if we quit but 100 people going to vaping is better than 10 quitting smoking IMO.
As for the cigarette companies anything they can do to stem the tide, they'll do it.

Deleted User wrote: »

As an ex smoker, I've always been skeptical of vaping.
It might be healthier than smoking, but generally, in my opinions, vapers vape a whole lot more than smokers smoke.
I have a number of friends who vape, and then seem to be puffing away on it a lot more frequently than smokers light up.

I have no hidden agenda here, I think let people smoke and vape to their hearts consent, and stop trying to guilt people into stopping.
But I do feel that after a few more years, we will start to see the real results of vaping. I imagine it will be considered bad for you as well, and be linked with numerous deaths. But sure, what isn't bad for you.

As for the conspiracies around smoking, I absolutely agree that governments want people to smoke. The tax on smokers is a huge source of income for countries. If governments really cared about saving the lives of smokers, they would be doing a huge amount more.
Even the government back support groups for stopping smoking are cynically named. "QUIT" is a terrible name. It immediately provides negative connotations. The idea of quitting something makes people think they've failed. Or that they're missing out on something.
I quit a race. I quit the course I was doing. [/tangent]

Ex smokers and current smokers who've never made a proper attempt to quit are generally the most skeptical about vaping. :pac:
I'll put it like this, a guy I worked with went from smoking to vaping and in under 2 years was running 10ks and lost about 8 stone. There is 0 chance he could have if still smoking.
I personally have been losing weight, can walk for hours without hacking and coughing, can do a bit of exercise and I'm not afraid to get out of breath because I can get it back. Never could while smoking. FFS a few times a year I'd "rupture" something from coughing and hack up a bit of blood for a few days. I don't miss it. :P
It's not perfect, but it's a huge improvement.

But for all the vested interests the research that should be coming out now would be fascinating. Take people who have vaped for the last 10 years and compared their health to people who continued smoking in that time.

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

I'll probably get booted out of this conversation now, but please dont think that smoking or vaping reduces stress.
Again, I am an ex smoker, but there are a huge number of studies out there that support the fact that smoking/vaping increases stress.
The way it was put to me, is look at all the people you work with, who dont smoke. Are they all more stressed than you? The answer is no. Surely if smoking/vaping reduced stress, then the non-smokers would all be under severe stress.

I'll leave now, as I have gone off topic, but I thought this is worth highlighting. We are in a "Giving Up Smoking" sub-forum by the way, and removing the belief that smoking/vaping helps you in anyway is a massive hurdle you need to get over to become a non-smoker.

To slowly go back on topic, if you feel healthier vaping than you did when you were smoking, that is great. Do what makes you feel better\happier\healthier

Best of luck everyone

Not looking to start a big row but again for most people it's about improving things. I doubt there's many on here who'd prefer to not feel like they need to vape but that's where they are.
I don't smoke, drink or do drugs, rarely get takeaway, eat ok, don't have a gambling, trying to lose weight. If my one vice is vaping then I'm fine with that.
I do know where you're coming from with the proper quitting POV but most of us are aware of it and happy to stay at the half-way (more like 95%-way :P ) point.

Being discussed on Liveline now, so expect well informed debate.

rob316

It will be taxed and have a minimum pricing eventually. The main reason they brought in the max bottle size for liquid with nicotine was so there would be a universal unit size they could tax accordingly.

The TPD was only the start of the regulation of ecigarettes but it's been unable to progress as there is still no independent evidence that vaping legal products is harmful and it's irrefutably less harmful than smoking. I agree it's early days to see the long term effects but you can't argue what we are seen right now regarding the positive effects.

You have the NHS allowing vape shops in hospitals now, actively promoting it as a smoking replacement. The optics look terrible for any state looking to ban or serverely curtail the accessibility to them.

Dr Bill V1.5

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Being discussed on Liveline now, so expect well informed debate.

Think there'd be more reasonable, sensible debate here tbh

rob316

rob316 wrote: »

It will be taxed and have a minimum pricing eventually. The main reason they brought in the max bottle size for liquid with nicotine was so there would be a universal unit size they could tax accordingly.

The TPD was only the start of the regulation of ecigarettes but it's been unable to progress as there is still no independent evidence that vaping legal products is harmful and it's irrefutably less harmful than smoking. I agree it's early days to see the long term effects but you can't argue what we are seen right now regarding the positive effects.

You have the NHS allowing vape shops in hospitals now, actively promoting it as a smoking replacement. The optics look terrible for any state looking to ban or serverely curtail the accessibility to them.

Hate to admit it but the Brits seem to be the only ones not with their heads up their arses. :P

It'll be interesting if/when they try to tax it. Contraband for it will be great craic.

Dr Bill V1.5

Dr Bill V1.5 wrote: »

Think there'd be more reasonable, sensible debate here tbh

That comment was tongue in cheek.

bladespin

rob316 wrote: »

It will be taxed and have a minimum pricing eventually. The main reason they brought in the max bottle size for liquid with nicotine was so there would be a universal unit size they could tax accordingly.

This will be very difficult, I've noticed a trend in some EU countries towards 0nic juice (you add your own nicotine if you want), now I can see how they could target nicotene but cannot see how it could be controllable as a taxed product etc.

I've been on the 0% stuff a long time and it works fine for me.

rob316

bladespin wrote: »

This will be very difficult, I've noticed a trend in some EU countries towards 0nic juice (you add your own nicotine if you want), now I can see how they could target nicotene but cannot see how it could be controllable as a taxed product etc.

I've been on the 0% stuff a long time and it works fine for me.

They'll close that loophole eventually, the availability and range of product has exploded through shortfills.

bladespin

rob316 wrote: »

They'll close that loophole eventually, the availability and range of product has exploded through shortfills.

What loophole? Not being smart but don't see what they could do, essentially after the nic it's just glycerin and flavors.

Captcha

Ronald Unimportant Lever wrote: »

Inhaling chemicals every few minutes, every day, can't be good. I smoked for a few years, never had any side-effects, I'm sure if I kept it up for another 30 years that would be a different though. Most vapers are only vaping a couple of years. It took decades for them to figure out the cigarettes were bad.

All matter, including us, is made of chemicals. Chemistry is the study of the composition, structure, properties and reactions of matter. Everything is made of chemicals. This includes the whole Earth – all matter in it and on it is made of chemicals.

Captcha

J Mysterio wrote: »

I actually had a search of the vaping forum yesterday to see if there was a thread on this after having watched this exact video on YouTube.

It looks like all this sh1t in the states is a deliberate misrepresentation. From what I can see, the majority of the people in difficulty have been vaping home made CBD oil, and not e-liquid produced by reputable companies.

I think most people who vape recognise that it's not entirely benign, but it's a damn sight better than smoking.

My view is that it's probably to stick to some of the less fancy flavours as the flavouring is where the risk is. About a year after I started vaping there was the diacetyl scandal and discussion about 'popcorn lung' etc. with a suggestion that butter/ cream/ cake/ custard flavours might have some risk attached.

I have mostly only vaped 'Bright Tobacco' for years, which is very bland. I do sometimes vape other stuff too, and don't worry too much about it.

I'd like to see continuing research and study. I don't trust much about the US these days though, particularly with the maniac they have in charge, so preferably independent European studies.

A big thing I see from vapers after quitting smoking is wanting the cheapest possible vape liquids, making their own etc, buying online from random cheapest places.... It's your lungs ffs, people need to either really fully qualify those "good deals" or simply buy from a reputable brand such as Juul - bad rep and good rep I know but at least they are big enough to actively make their liquids safer.

J Mysterio

The discussion on Liveline was not the worst ever. The host was receptive to points in favour of vaping and criticized some obviously stupid anti-vaping points.

The owner of vapura (think it was) rang in to give balance and did an ok job, if a little preachy/ holier than thou.

There was some scientist from DCU who had the rug pulled from under him on some obviously wrong points he made. Once the owner of Vapura clarified his sh1te, your man basically thanked him and finished up :pac:

corkie

^^^ Anyone missed can listen here: - https://www.rte.ie/radio/radioplayer/html5/#/radio1/21619224


Edit: - The caller on the show could be in the very small percent of people who are allergic to vape oils liquid pg/vg.

According to E-CigReviews(dot)org(dot)uk, allergic reactions to propylene glycol or vegetable glycerin, two ingredients that make up e-liquids, are possible although often rare. Symptoms of a propylene glycol allergy include dry throat, sore throat, swollen gums, skin problems and rashes, and sinus problems.

....


Only about 1 out of every 1000 people has a VG sensitivity. Around 10% of people have a slight sensitivity to PG, however, this usually only exhibits itself in the form of dryness in the throat.

Dr Bill V1.5

I'll still take these guys at their word and the good old US can go take a jump.

https://publichealthmatters.blog.gov.uk/2019/02/27/e-cigarette-evidence-update-patterns-and-use-in-adults-and-young-people/

There are certainly a lot of mixed messages coming out about vaping at the current time.

The deaths and serious hospitalisations seem to have a lot to do with cannabis-related products (but also some to do with "normal" nicotine-based products) but it's not fully clear.

The whole Trump thing seems to me like he wants he wife to have a "cause" that she can put her own stamp on to get behind - not entirely rational but such are the times we live in.

For sure (as an ex-vaper) it's healthier not to vape compared to vaping (I can tell the difference in aerobic performance) but it's also healthier to vape rather than to smoke but that equally doesn't mean that you have to vape forever.

It is also a bit annoying obviously that people who see the headlines and jump on the whole "vaping will kill you" thing or those who are completely uninformed.

there is also the conflict with the concept of helping smokers stop smoking with the idea of young people coming in and getting addicted to nicotine.

corkie

Wisconsin man ran a drug ring that filled up to 5,000 bootleg vaping cartridges per day, police say

Not mentioned but JUUL removed some flavor pods from the US market, which also generated a rise in bootleg flavor pods there. What heck was put in them pods.

Also as THC Oils is illegal in some states, people may have been reluctant to report/admit to using it.





A Thickener Used in Pot Vaping Is a Hugely Popular Black-Market Scam
Vitamin E acetate is used to thicken THC oil, but sellers are running scared as investigators close in.