Bedroom locks in a shared flat

hotshot88

Hi
myself and my flatmate each have our own bedrooms but our bedrooms don't have locks on the doors, has anyone ever experienced this, is it possible to ask the landlord for locks for the bedrooms? its a two bedroom flat, non owner occupied

I'm asking as my flatmate has friends visiting often(as do I) and I would like to avoid a scenario where someone walks into a room that they shouldn't by accident or otherwise. We get on fine and I don't want to cause a scene that might cause a slightly uncomfortable living arrangement.

any info is appreciated.

Gumbo

I, as a landlord would not provide locks for bedroom doors.
I believe they are a great fire hazard should they be mistakenly locked at night.

beauf

5 mins googling is that while lots of house (especially older ones) are fitted with internal doors with keys.
It seems to be considered a bad idea to need a key to open any door if its fire escape egress route.
Which suggests even the front and back door shouldn't need a key. Ditto windows.
Its a required standard in some countries.

But then if you have a glass or similar light panel you can just break it and reach and gain access - burglary.
In a shared property you could argue your bedroom is almost like a front door.

Where you do have some internal latch instead of a key seems to be good practice to have a means of opening it from the other side in case a child or someone falls sick on the other side.

Its not like you leave a key beside it either has they can be fished, and or lost.

https://www.fireengineering.com/articles/2010/07/cc-door-locks.html#gref

Edgware

I undertand your situation and there is no restriction on people living in private homes locking bedroom doors. In a shared accommodation I can understand why people would want their bedroom locked, particularly when away from the property

Del2005

Edgware wrote: »

I undertand your situation and there is no restriction on people living in private homes locking bedroom doors. In a shared accommodation I can understand why people would want their bedroom locked, particularly when away from the property

The problem the OP has is that they are in a rented home and it's designed not to have locking internal doors. So to fit locks they'd need to drill the doors and door frames to install locks and no landlord will allow that, not to mention that since they will be on the outside someone could easily lock a person in.

thenightman

kceire wrote: »

I, as a landlord would not provide locks for bedroom doors.
I believe they are a great fire hazard should they be mistakenly locked at night.

Another of the many reasons why renting is crap in this country. 'Landlords' not being reasonable. If I'm paying out the ass in rent sharing an apartment with a stranger, I don't want him/her to have the ability to access my private room when I'm not home and go through my belongings/valuables.



Do you ban kettles, toasters and washing machines too? surely they are even more of a fire hazard.

Spanish Eyes

I am possibly an outlier here, but I would want a means to preserve my privacy. What the heck is wrong with locking your bedroom door when you are going out, or ahem "entertaining", or just using your room yourself?

I understand what people are saying about fire safety and so on, but surely a bedroom door is only plywood (mainly) and could be kicked in if necessary. The bedroom owner keeps the key on him/her at all times.

All the bedroom doors in our house (owned) have locks with a basic key, and although not used, it is very useful to be able to put personal stuff and electronics in the spare room when tradesmen are traipsing around. Not saying that these people would do anything untoward, it is more about keeping personal things private when others are working in the house. Similar to visitors in a shared house I reckon.

Del2005

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

I am possibly an outlier here, but I would want a means to preserve my privacy. What the heck is wrong with locking your bedroom door when you are going out, or ahem "entertaining", or just using your room yourself?

I understand what people are saying about fire safety and so on, but surely a bedroom door is only plywood (mainly) and could be kicked in if necessary. The bedroom owner keeps the key on him/her at all times.

All the bedroom doors in our house (owned) have locks with a basic key, and although not used, it is very useful to be able to put personal stuff and electronics in the spare room when tradesmen are traipsing around. Not saying that these people would do anything untoward, it is more about keeping personal things private when others are working in the house. Similar to visitors in a shared house I reckon.

In apartments all doors are fire rated and you won't be able to kick them in.

People have died in houses due to locked doors. A little bit of insecurity is better than burning.

I know then locks and how few different key combinations that they have. If someone working in your home wanted to open the door that lock won't stop them. So while you might think that it's safely locked up it's not.

I always locked my door at night when living in shared houses and also when going home at weekends, going away etc. no way would I live in a shared house without a lockable bedroom door.

I wouldn’t be in the least bit worried about a fire, they are so rare anyway to begin with and you can just open the door. Sure our house has a key lock on the front and back doors and we don’t keep keys near either door so I wouldn’t be getting in anyway worried about locking a bedroom door.

Gumbo

beauf wrote: »

5 mins googling is that while lots of house (especially older ones) are fitted with internal doors with keys.
It seems to be considered a bad idea to need a key to open any door if its fire escape egress route.
Which suggests even the front and back door shouldn't need a key. Ditto windows.
Its a required standard in some countries.

But then if you have a glass or similar light panel you can just break it and reach and gain access - burglary.
In a shared property you could argue your bedroom is almost like a front door.

Where you do have some internal latch instead of a key seems to be good practice to have a means of opening it from the other side in case a child or someone falls sick on the other side.

Its not like you leave a key beside it either has they can be fished, and or lost.

https://www.fireengineering.com/articles/2010/07/cc-door-locks.html#gref

Keys on windows and final exits are prohibited here in Ireland too as per our building regulations, specifically TGD Part B (Fire Safety). It’s been like that since the 2006 regs were released and possibly before that.

Gumbo

thenightman wrote: »

Another of the many reasons why renting is crap in this country. 'Landlords' not being reasonable. If I'm paying out the ass in rent sharing an apartment with a stranger, I don't want him/her to have the ability to access my private room when I'm not home and go through my belongings/valuables.



Do you ban kettles, toasters and washing machines too? surely they are even more of a fire hazard.

If you want that amount of privacy then maybe house sharing is not for you.
Machines, kettles and toasters have built in protection but should they catch fire, then the last thing I want is a tenant stumbling around his room at night looking for a key that may or may not be in the door lock and this endangering themselves and affecting the means of escape of that dwelling.

The interlinked smoke detection alarms will alert my tenants and they will be provided with early warning of fire. I’ve also placed detectors in all bedrooms. Call me anal but I believe I’m
Not being unreasonable.

Those are my rules. You don’t like them, move to a house where the LL doesn’t give a sh1t.

beauf

kceire wrote: »

Keys on windows and final exits are prohibited here in Ireland too as per our building regulations, specifically TGD Part B (Fire Safety). It’s been like that since the 2006 regs were released and possibly before that.

I don't know if this applies....

In general, Building Regulations apply to the construction
of new buildings and to extensions and material
alterations to buildings. In addition, certain parts of the
Regulations apply to existing buildings where a material
change of use takes place. Otherwise, Building
Regulations do not apply to buildings constructed prior to
1 June 1992.

Does this not apply to private homes? What if they are rented out?

boege

Some means to lock a bedroom in a houseshare is absolutely normal. Most house shares are a mixed bag and you never know them all well.

It's not about safety, its about security, both your personal security and the security of your property. I have had other people's house guests try enter my room while I was asleep. At any decent house party an open bedroom is an invitation to use (and to check out the contents). Have seen plenty of stuff go missing over the years. If I had company I wanted guaranteed privacy.

By way of an example, friend recently had a south american house share lad go a bit strange (bad drink and drugs mix) and he started trying to break down friend bedroom door. Friend was glad to have it locked.

OP ask the landlord. Alternatively, just change the lock - keep the old one and refit it when leaving. Buy one with a thumb turn cylinder on the inside, if you want to comply with health and safety.

Gumbo

beauf wrote: »

I don't know if this applies....



Does this not apply to private homes? What if they are rented out?

No, you cannot apply the regs retrospectively. I was more replying to the comment that stated it’s a requirement in other countries by confirming it’s a requirement in new builds here too.

Bandana boy

If fire regs are the issue then a thumb lock should do the trick .

I rarely had a bedroom lock and iv been through a few shared houses.

If I couldn't trust the other occupants in a small house then it was time for one of us to leave.

L1011

A standard two lever warded lock has about as much security as a Keep Out sign if you have significant security concerns

L1011

L1011 wrote: »

A standard two lever warded lock has about as much security as a Keep Out sign if you have significant security concerns

I've never seen a warded lock in a house.

L1011

BrownFinger wrote: »

I've never seen a warded lock in a house.

My terminology may not be right. The two lever non pin tumbler locks with about 40 potential positions that are the default on Irish interior doors and as replacements can be opened by anyone who has spent ten minutes we googling

Gumbo

Bandana boy wrote: »

If fire regs are the issue then a thumb lock should do the trick .

Yep, Thumb locks are fine, and are perfect for final exits etc

But the OP wants a removable key that he can lock from the outside or inside.

ChewBerecca

Back when I was in college, one of my friends lived in a few house shares. Not having a lock on her bedroom door caused her major issues (housemates friend once soiled her mattress when she went home for a weekend, she wasn't asked if they could stay in her room) and put her in physical danger in another as one of her male housemates kept coming into her room at night after a few drinks. The other housemates were his friends in this particular house so she ended up being the one who had to leave as the landlord didn't believe someone entering your room uninvited at night it was enough to evict the culprit.

She fully believes a lock on the door would have helped her in both houses as the people involved wouldn't have been intent on causing so much damage that they would break a door or pick a lock.

hotshot88

Thanks for the replies all.
The issue isn't my flatmate, I don't invade his personal space and he doesn't invade mine.

my main concern is if he has mates over and they don't have a problem invading my personal space and using my stuff without my knowledge. I've known some people like that over the years and it can lead to problems. It's just not something to cause a fuss over if it hasn't happened(yet?).

In the absence of a lock, would a personal security camera in the bedroom be a better solution?. or would this be a violation?

Xterminator

Is there already a door handle/ lock mechanism on the door, that you dont have a key to? Or are there no keyholes at all?

because its 12.99 for a new lock in woodies and if the fitting is already there, you can simple awop out, with a screwdriver, and swop back befoe you move out. No drilling etc.
https://www.woodies.ie/yale-2-lever-internal-door-lock-2-5-brass-458908

But if there isn't one, then you could ask the landlord would he object, to your fitting one. you could offer hima spare key, so he doesn't get stuck changing them again when you move out.

TheBoyConor

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

...

I understand what people are saying about fire safety and so on, but surely a bedroom door is only plywood (mainly) and could be kicked in if necessary. The bedroom owner keeps the key on him/her at all times.

I often hear this. It is dangerous thinking.

Kicking a door down is often not as easy as you'd think. Not to mind when it is in the panic situation of a house fire, possibly pitch dark, you possibly breathing in smoke. You might not be able to lay your hand on the key in the dark and panic. Thinking you'd kick in a door or smash a window with ease in a fire is the rock you'd perish on. You literally may only have seconds to do it. And someone who is very young or very old or sick or otherwise limited in their physical strength would have even less hope.


It is an extremely dangerous situation to require a key to open a door from inside. It should never be the case.
A good compromise is to use a door lock/latch that has a thumbwheel on the inside so that you can open it from inside the room without the key. The key is only used to lock/unlock the door from the outside. Much safer. It is actually a mandatory requriement for any external door. Keys to open from inside is illegal now.

riffmongous

ChewBerecca wrote: »

Back when I was in college, one of my friends lived in a few house shares. Not having a lock on her bedroom door caused her major issues (housemates friend once soiled her mattress when she went home for a weekend, she wasn't asked if they could stay in her room) and put her in physical danger in another as one of her male housemates kept coming into her room at night after a few drinks. The other housemates were his friends in this particular house so she ended up being the one who had to leave as the landlord didn't believe someone entering your room uninvited at night it was enough to evict the culprit.

She fully believes a lock on the door would have helped her in both houses as the people involved wouldn't have been intent on causing so much damage that they would break a door or pick a lock.

The physical danger can be solved with a wedge in future if there is no lock

beauf

I don't think I'd be replying on kicking your way though a door. Even those hollow doors, with cardboard in the center take a while to get though.
You'd actually go though a plasterboard wall far easier.

I'm rarely in a new build, I never noticed the lack of keys in new builds. if I upgrade my own house its something that would be useful to change in the future.

hotshot88

Xterminator wrote: »

Is there already a door handle/ lock mechanism on the door, that you dont have a key to? Or are there no keyholes at all?

because its 12.99 for a new lock in woodies and if the fitting is already there, you can simple awop out, with a screwdriver, and swop back befoe you move out. No drilling etc.
https://www.woodies.ie/yale-2-lever-internal-door-lock-2-5-brass-458908

But if there isn't one, then you could ask the landlord would he object, to your fitting one. you could offer hima spare key, so he doesn't get stuck changing them again when you move out.

Pretty sure that would violate the lease, thanks for trying though

Claw Hammer

kceire wrote: »

Yep, Thumb locks are fine, and are perfect for final exits etc

But the OP wants a removable key that he can lock from the outside or inside.

All he needs is a thumb turn on the inside and the ability to lock it from the outside when he is outside. Plenty of euro-profile locks are made that way.

Claw Hammer

hotshot88 wrote: »

Pretty sure that would violate the lease, thanks for trying though

Is it the case that there is a lock there and you have no key or, there is no lock there at all?

hotshot88

Claw Hammer wrote: »

Is it the case that there is a lock there and you have no key or, there is no lock there at all?

no lock at all

Topgear on Dave

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

I rarely had a bedroom lock and iv been through a few shared houses.

If I couldn't trust the other occupants in a small house then it was time for one of us to leave.

Many people are living with total strangers when in houseshares its totally reasonable to want to lock your door.

I can't ever recall a bedroom door without a lock be it in houseshares or family or friends houses I would call it very abnormal. Even in your own home with family there are times you want to lock the door of your bedroom.

I would see it as highly unreasonable for a LL not to have locks and the reasons given are bordering on tin foil hat stuff.

Gumbo

Raquel Raspy Sociology wrote: »

I would see it as highly unreasonable for a LL not to have locks and the reasons given are bordering on tin foil hat stuff.

I would consider it reasonable not to want a key lock from internally in a bedroom.

If a tenant doesn't like that, move on.

TheBoyConor

So not wanting a door locked and requiring a key to open while potentially in a fire is tin foil hat job? Is all fire safety a conspiracy?

There is also the problem of someone taking ill, perhaps an elderly person getting a stoke or heart attack and not being able to be reached because their door is locked, they are incapacitated and the door cannot be opened from outside either. Or a small child turning a key or thumbturn and locking themselves inside unable to be reached.

There are multiple reasons why a homeowner might want to stay clear of locks on internal doors.

You must remember that 99% of houses are intended as family homes. They are not intended as house shares with multiple people living semi-independent lives.

kceire

kceire wrote: »

I would consider it reasonable not to want a key lock from internally in a bedroom.

If a tenant doesn't like that, move on.

I would consider it unusual and very unreasonable.

TheBoyConor wrote: »

So not wanting a door locked and requiring a key to open while potentially in a fire is tin foil hat job? Is all fire safety a conspiracy?

There is also the problem of someone taking ill, perhaps an elderly person getting a stoke or heart attack and not being able to be reached because their door is locked, they are incapacitated and the door cannot be opened from outside either. Or a small child turning a key or thumbturn and locking themselves inside unable to be reached.

There are multiple reasons why a homeowner might want to stay clear of locks on internal doors.

You must remember that 99% of houses are intended as family homes. They are not intended as house shares with multiple people living semi-independent lives.

But any family house I’ve ever been in has keys on the bedroom door so that’s not a reason. There aren’t often reasons to want to lock your door even at home in a family home.

I’m shocked this is even a topic for conversation having a lockable bedroom door to be is an absolute given, I am very surprised to hear some people don’t have this and even more bizarrely people are finding fault with it.

Del2005

Claw Hammer wrote: »

All he needs is a thumb turn on the inside and the ability to lock it from the outside when he is outside. Plenty of euro-profile locks are made that way.

Bedroom doors aren't designed for Euro cylinder locks though. You can only get the locks which can be easily opened.

Raquel Raspy Sociology wrote: »

I would see it as highly unreasonable for a LL not to have locks and the reasons given are bordering on tin foil hat stuff.

If the property isn't built with internal locks, apartments and new builds, then why should the landlord alter the property. The only way to install a lock would be to remove the door and cut out a new lock profile or drill into the doors/frames.

The other thing is that the property was viewed and accepted without locks so why should the landlord change them afterwards.

TheBoyConor

Raquel Raspy Sociology wrote: »

I am very surprised to hear some people don’t have this and even more bizarrely people are finding fault with it.

I'm sure you would change your tune if someone you know or family member got severely burned or died in a house fire because they couldn't find the key of their locked bedroom door timely enough to get out or dropped it on the dark floor in the panic of the moment.

Of if a toddler locked themselves into a room and choked on something and couldn't be got to in time to save them because of a locked door.

Millenial generation strikes again with this perpetual house sharing.

Graces7

TheBoyConor wrote: »

I'm sure you would change your tune if someone you know or family member got severely burned or died in a house fire because they couldn't find the key of their locked bedroom door timely enough to get out or dropped it on the dark floor in the panic of the moment.

Of if a toddler locked themselves into a room and choked on something and couldn't be got to in time to save them because of a locked door.

Millenial generation strikes again with this perpetual house sharing.

So logically we cannot then eg lock the door when we are in a shared bathroom or toilet?

Why not also a lock on the outside eg a padlock and short chain or similar, and a simple bolt on the inside ?

When we had bedsits, it was similar and we had locks and keys and never once was there a problem like fire or injury. It was like house sharing is now in that.

Claw Hammer

Del2005 wrote: »

Bedroom doors aren't designed for Euro cylinder locks though. You can only get the locks which can be easily opened.



.

You can get casings which are the same size as the existing lock with euro profile
keyholes. It is just a matter of enlarging the keyhole.

TheBoyConor

Graces7 wrote: »

So logically we cannot then eg lock the door when we are in a shared bathroom or toilet?

Why not also a lock on the outside eg a padlock and short chain or similar, and a simple bolt on the inside ?

When we had bedsits, it was similar and we had locks and keys and never once was there a problem like fire or injury. It was like house sharing is now in that.

The issue with proper bathroom locks doesn't occur because there is a thumbturn on the inside and s slot on the outside that can be turned with a coin or any flat bladed instrument like a screwdriver or knife. It is easily openable if needed.

That is because there wasn't a fire. When there is a fire, it is an emergency situation. You don't have the luxury of time to try remember which pants the key might be in the arse pocket of, nor do you have time to warm up and stretch before kicking a door down, which is wishful thinking anyway. You shouldn't need to kick a door down.
Bedsits were usually dangerous hovels anyway, good riddance to them.

TheBoyConor

TheBoyConor wrote: »

I'm sure you would change your tune if someone you know or family member got severely burned or died in a house fire because they couldn't find the key of their locked bedroom door timely enough to get out or dropped it on the dark floor in the panic of the moment.

Of if a toddler locked themselves into a room and choked on something and couldn't be got to in time to save them because of a locked door.

Millenial generation strikes again with this perpetual house sharing.

Sure you wouldn’t leave the house for what if’s if you get so worried. You are in far far more danger crossing the road than getting in a house fire.

Also why would you take the key off the inside of the door? I’m fine with thumb locks too but especially for houseshares they need to be lockable from outside.

I’m racking my brain and I can’t really remember a house that you can’t lock the doors, either by key or thumb lock. The vast majority of houses have keys on all room doors. I was in a new build recently alright that had thumb locks on the bedrooms but it still had locks.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

kceire wrote: »

I, as a landlord would not provide locks for bedroom doors.
I believe they are a great fire hazard should they be mistakenly locked at night.

I don’t think I’ve ever mistakenly locked a door in my life. That’s seems like a statistically really unlikely thing to happen. It could happen but so could lots of things. Is accidental door-locking a scourge I’m not aware of?

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

I rarely had a bedroom lock and iv been through a few shared houses.

If I couldn't trust the other occupants in a small house then it was time for one of us to leave.

Yeah, this is a good point. If I felt I needed to lock my door in a house-share, I wouldn’t have wanted to live there any more.

Gumbo

Graces7 wrote: »

So logically we cannot then eg lock the door when we are in a shared bathroom or toilet?

Why not also a lock on the outside eg a padlock and short chain or similar, and a simple bolt on the inside ?

When we had bedsits, it was similar and we had locks and keys and never once was there a problem like fire or injury. It was like house sharing is now in that.

Bathrooms are not habitable rooms and typically people do not sleep in them.
Therefore cannot be woken in the dead of the night by a screaming fire alarm and possibly panic trying to escape safely.

Gumbo

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

I don’t think I’ve ever mistakenly locked a door in my life. That’s seems like a statistically really unlikely thing to happen. It could happen but so could lots of things. Is accidental door-locking a scourge I’m not aware of?



Yeah, this is a good point. If I felt I needed to lock my door in a house-share, I wouldn’t have wanted to live there any more.

Yes. I’ve seen teenagers go to their rooms, lock the door from the inside, pop in head phones or turn on music and not even hear the smoke alarm on the landing.

Homelander

Do you mean there's no locks, or just no keys? I've never lived in a house-share that didn't have locks, though keys were never supplied.

hotshot88

Homelander wrote: »

Do you mean there's no locks, or just no keys? I've never lived in a house-share that didn't have locks, though keys were never supplied.

The door handles have no locks built in, not even a thumblock

Homelander

Ah, right. Surely you can just change the one or two easily enough. I don't get why you would be concerned about lease/landlord. You'll get a new one in Woodies or B&Q for €20. It's not like it's involves extensive DIY, it's just a replacement job. You can put back in the original set when you're leaving.

Claw Hammer

Homelander wrote: »

Ah, right. Surely you can just change the one or two easily enough. I don't get why you would be concerned about lease/landlord. You'll get a new one in Woodies or B&Q for €20. It's not like it's involves extensive DIY, it's just a replacement job. You can put back in the original set when you're leaving.

The o/p has said there is no lock there. Just handles on spindle. The house must be ancient. Every modern house built in the last 70 years has door locks o all internal doors. Apparently it was a requirement for the building grant.

riclad

it would be easy to install a lock that can only be locked by the tenant from the outside,theres no key slot on the inside of the door.

and put a sliding door bolt on the inside.
If theres a fire the tenant will not have to lock the door , i would not live
in a shared house where there was no locks on the door,s .
What if someone steals your laptop or something else when you are gone out.
You have no security from anyone who gets inside the house.
The landlord can claim the expense of installing locks as an an
expense like buying a fridge .
Theres certainly new apartments being built where the internal door,s
have no lock,s .

a door stop stops the door being opened when you are inside the room,
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Silverline-898104-Door-Stop-Alarm/dp/B015HMKRVC/ref=pd_lpo_sbs_60_t_1/257-4021204-2677605?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=W8MJ29NQ8ZKNRDKSVKPK

and it needs no holes to be drilled anywhere .

kceire

kceire wrote: »

Bathrooms are not habitable rooms and typically people do not sleep in them.
Therefore cannot be woken in the dead of the night by a screaming fire alarm and possibly panic trying to escape safely.

If you can open a door you can unlock a door.

Honestly the numbers of people killed per year in house fires is compatible with the numbers who win the lotto.

Of course you take precautions like have a fire alarm downstairs and upstairs etc but getting all bothered about locking doors is paranoia.

Graces7

kceire wrote: »

Bathrooms are not habitable rooms and typically people do not sleep in them.
Therefore cannot be woken in the dead of the night by a screaming fire alarm and possibly panic trying to escape safely.

Living in fear is not healthy? I have in all my decades of varying rented accommodation never ever been in a fire or any situation when a locked door was a danger. More danger from leaving doors unlocked frankly . Only time a fire alarm has ever gone off was when they were put in recent years in idiotic places like above a cooker or hearth and they have been disabled now. The door is within reach

Gumbo

Graces7 wrote: »

Living in fear is not healthy?

I agree, that's why if you are living in fear of your room being entered and items removed then its time to move on and find another house. You cant live like that.

Graces7 wrote: »

I have in all my decades of varying rented accommodation never ever been in a fire or any situation when a locked door was a danger.

That's like saying I don't need to wear a seat belt as I haven't been in a car crash in my whole life. Silly statement.

Graces7 wrote: »

Only time a fire alarm has ever gone off was when they were put in recent years in idiotic places like above a cooker or hearth and they have been disabled now. The door is within reach

Again, no excuse for dodgy / cowboy builders. The detectors should be placed in the correct location and you shouldn't have a smoke detector anywhere near a kitchen, Heat detectors are required within a certain radius of the hob.