40% of students have severe anxiety

Balanadan

My arse they do.

dennyire

in before berties horse

Lollipops23

I'm not a student anymore, but I've suffered anxiety since secondary school.

I've tried everything; therapy, CBT, meditation, yoga, diet.

Finally got on medication after being reluctant to do so for 15 years. Best decision I ever made. It's o magic wand, but it makes me that bit more able to cope.

I don't want to stay on them forever, but for now I'm in the best shape mentally that I've been for many, many years.

Please don't disregard how tough and common it is.

you'd worry that young people are maybe not learning some essential life skills that appear to have been ingrained in previous generations.

something about resilience, independence, a bit of "get on with it"

strange really, things were so horrible in the 80s and the 90s and the 00s but its almost as if people just coped better.

0lddog

Nothing new here

40+ years ago a lot of my fellow first yearers had what now seems to be called "Severe Anxiety"

To right they did !

They were totally out of their depth and should never have been let into the course.

And of course they never had any money and there was no affordable accom etc etc

They always seemed to have money for drink

I never managed to figure that one out

padd b1975

I would say about 90% experience regret when they eventually hit the real world and realise their degree is worth SFA.

SureYWouldntYa

Did ya ever think that maybe doubting those who say they have mental health issues is actually adding to the real numbers with mental health

Next thing you'll be telling guys to "man up" about their issues

quokula

As a counter to all the anti-millenial / anti-Gen-Z nonsense that this thread will generate.

They're heading into a world where they know things previous generations took for granted like permanent jobs and home ownership are more and more of a pipe dream. And they also know that the world's ecosystems will be on their knees in their lifetime, but the older generation can't be arsed to do anything about it.

odyssey06

One wonders how many of them weren't anxious until they were constantly being asked if they were by people sent to help and told how stressful things could be...

quokula

quokula wrote: »

As a counter to all the anti-millenial / anti-Gen-Z nonsense that this thread will generate.

They're heading into a world where they know things previous generations took for granted like permanent jobs and home ownership are more and more of a pipe dream. And they also know that the world's ecosystems will be on their knees in their lifetime, but the older generation can't be arsed to do anything about it.

they certainly are bombarded with these messages, yes

if they decide to accept them uncritically as true and certain then ive no doubt their mental health could be affected.

one would wonder if that was their only option.

something something locus of control something

eviltwin

Nothing new, what is new is the coping mechanism.

In my day we drank a lot, at least now people are talking about it and seeking appropriate help

odyssey06

quokula wrote: »

As a counter to all the anti-millenial / anti-Gen-Z nonsense that this thread will generate.
They're heading into a world where they know things previous generations took for granted like permanent jobs and home ownership are more and more of a pipe dream. And they also know that the world's ecosystems will be on their knees in their lifetime, but the older generation can't be arsed to do anything about it.

In the 1980s we had dreadful economic circumstances in Ireland and at a global level talk of acid rain, famine in Ethiopia and the threat of nuclear armageddon as the Cold War reached its highest tension such the Cuban Missile Crisis.
I don't think we had 40% anxiety rates in students...

Something is different today and I don't think the concerns you raise are sufficient in themselves to explain it.

quokula

quokula wrote: »

As a counter to all the anti-millenial / anti-Gen-Z nonsense that this thread will generate.

They're heading into a world where they know things previous generations took for granted like permanent jobs and home ownership are more and more of a pipe dream.

They’re at least a generation too late for that to be a relevant argument.

quokula wrote: »

And they also know that the world's ecosystems will be on their knees in their lifetime, but the older generation can't be arsed to do anything about it.

All bollox.

It’s not up to the older generation. We’re generally speaking far more capable of buying, maintaining and mending what we’d purchase. Spend more on quality and demand that it’s durable and repairable, with most of the exceptions being due to reduction of available alternatives.

Come back and try that one again when young folk aren’t dressing in oil derived synthetics, wearing borderline disposable fashion footwear, travelling the world on gap years, eating fast food and ordering crap from Aliexpress or Amazon which they simply don’t need and which won’t last.

odyssey06

odyssey06 wrote: »

In the 1980s we had dreadful economic circumstances in Ireland and at a global level talk of acid rain, famine in Ethiopia and the threat of nuclear armageddon as the Cold War reached its highest tension such the Cuban Missile Crisis.
I don't think we had 40% anxiety rates in students...

Something is different today and I don't think the concerns you raise are sufficient in themselves to explain it.

the idea that students "nowadays" are the first to experience a lack of certainty about jobs, housing and the environment gives you some indication of how special these ones think they are.

there's little as toxic to giving things a constructive go as buying into a narrative that the cards are stacked against you specifically

its a quitter's narrative imo

ireland isnt emptying of jobs, property or opportunity this year nor next- thats a lot more than anyone graduating in 2008 had as a certainty

odyssey06

Deleted User wrote: »

the idea that students "nowadays" are the first to experience a lack of certainty about jobs, housing and the environment gives you some indication of how special these ones think they are.
there's little as toxic to giving things a constructive go as buying into a narrative that the cards are stacked against you specifically
its a quitter's narrative imo
ireland isnt emptying of jobs, property or opportunity this year nor next- thats a lot more than anyone graduating in 2008 had as a certainty

I would put a slight shift in emphasis, I think there's a whole industry building up around telling them they are facing unprecedented issues so that that industry is there to 'help' them. I don't want to make this a generational thing.
Past students had things just as tough or tougher, but they didn't have these emotional vampires coming along feeding off the negative energy they are fuelling.

xckjoo

We're in a world now that has a constant bombardment of noise; internet, social media, TV, news, etc. People get overloaded and don't even realise it. There's such a constant flow of information that everything seems equally important. It's no wonder anxiety levels are rising across the board.


What hasn't changed though is the old fogies waffling about how things were harder in their day and kids these days are soft

Edgware

eviltwin wrote: »

Nothing new, what is new is the coping mechanism.

In my day we drank a lot, at least now people are talking about it and seeking appropriate help

You mean hitting the boozer and have a lash of pints with the lads isn't " appropriate help"

I get the sense (and I could easily be wrong) that previous generations didn't worry about their future in the same way as under 25's do now. Perhaps the constant flow of information and news and awareness of all the ills in the world is just too much to sit comfortably with young people in uncertain times. There were uncertain times in the past but much less in-your-face information about it.

xckjoo

xckjoo wrote: »

What hasn't changed though is the old fogies waffling about how things were harder in their day and kids these days are soft

They are. There are always things in life that challenge us as individuals and communities. Both the individual and the community have changed and it's resulting in an inability to cope with problems of types that generations before us took in their strides.

It starts with the kids, and the often questionable ability of my own generation to parent their children in a way that will prepare them to deal with the challenges life will present.

AustinLostin

quokula wrote: »

As a counter to all the anti-millenial / anti-Gen-Z nonsense that this thread will generate.

They're heading into a world where they know things previous generations took for granted like permanent jobs and home ownership are more and more of a pipe dream. And they also know that the world's ecosystems will be on their knees in their lifetime, but the older generation can't be arsed to do anything about it.

Yup, if you want proof, you can just look at the replies on this thread :P

JohnnyFlash

Spending too long staring into phones looking at Instagram and snapchat. That shït is neurotic central.

freshpopcorn

I think people always suffered from anxiety but in the past they were called a worrier or fretter.
People are also much more likely to admit it now than in the past.

Il Fascista

xckjoo wrote: »

We're in a world now that has a constant bombardment of noise; internet, social media, TV, news, etc. People get overloaded and don't even realise it. There's such a constant flow of information that everything seems equally important. It's no wonder anxiety levels are rising across the board.


What hasn't changed though is the old fogies waffling about how things were harder in their day and kids these days are soft

Ted Kaczynski, aka the Unabomber, actually has a great essay about this topic in manifesto. It goes without saying that he's a murderous scumbag, but he actually had something interesting ideas. It's very odd to read though as he doesn't seem like the type who's stupid enough to think that terrorism would bring about the world that he wanted.

Upstream

Is this related?
Are students nowadays prescribed more antibiotics?
Antibiotic exposure and the risk for depression, anxiety, or psychosis: a nested case-control study.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26580313
From their results

Similar association was observed for anxiety and was most prominent with exposures to penicillins and sulfonamides, with an AOR of 1.17 (95% CI, 1.01-1.36) for a single course of penicillin and 1.44 (95% CI, 1.18-1.75) for > 5 courses.

CONCLUSION: Recurrent antibiotic exposure is associated with increased risk for depression and anxiety but not for psychosis.

Upstream

Upstream wrote: »

Is this related?
Are students nowadays prescribed more antibiotics?
Antibiotic exposure and the risk for depression, anxiety, or psychosis: a nested case-control study.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26580313
From their results

It's probably lifetime exposure. Antibiotics devastate the gut microbiome which affects things like perhiperal seratonin production, so it's not surprising.

There's also good evidence that certain probiotics can be beneficial to people with anxiety. Look after your gut, people.

xckjoo

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

Spending too long staring into phones looking at Instagram and snapchat. That shït is neurotic central.

I actually think adults are worse for phone staring than kids. They won't admit it to themselves though. Definitely not setting a good example anyway.

is_that_so

Edgware wrote: »

You mean hitting the boozer and have a lash of pints with the lads isn't " appropriate help"

It may not be but it seems like it is!

_Brian

Probably a good thing, it gets them ready for the real world and being a functioning adult in Ireland

Portsalon

quokula wrote: »

And they also know that the world's ecosystems will be on their knees in their lifetime, but the older generation can't be arsed to do anything about it.

So what would you like us to do? I'll gladly hit someone over the head with my zimmerframe if that will make you feel better.

is_that_so

Candie wrote: »

It's probably lifetime exposure. Antibiotics devastate the gut microbiome, which includes things like perhiperal seratonin, so it's not surprising.

There's good evidence that certain probiotics can be beneficial to people with anxiety. Look after your gut, people.

May not fix the issue. Learning coping mechanisms is a far better long-term approach. I'm with Phillip Larkin on this! A lot of parents don't allow their kids to build resilience in the face of challenges by overprotecting them. That and the excessive pressure they put on them to perform academically!

Ursus Horribilis

What exactly does severe anxiety entail?

Portsalon

Ursus Horribilis wrote: »

What exactly does severe anxiety entail?

Mainly saying "yes" when an opinion pollster asks you do you worry much about stuff.

is_that_so

quokula wrote: »

As a counter to all the anti-millenial / anti-Gen-Z nonsense that this thread will generate.

They're heading into a world where they know things previous generations took for granted like permanent jobs and home ownership are more and more of a pipe dream. And they also know that the world's ecosystems will be on their knees in their lifetime, but the older generation can't be arsed to do anything about it.

Think this argument was used in the 60s,70s,80s and 90s and will be used again and again. But it's good to get it out there anyway!

Upstream

Candie wrote: »

It's probably lifetime exposure. Antibiotics devastate the gut microbiome, which includes things like perhiperal seratonin, so it's not surprising.

There's good evidence that certain probiotics can be beneficial to people with anxiety. Look after your gut, people.

Probably some benefit from avoiding ultraprocessed foods and eating a healthy and varied diet instead.

So for variety students should have some toast and beans instead of beans and toast every now and then

is_that_so

Ursus Horribilis wrote: »

What exactly does severe anxiety entail?

Here's what the hexperts say.

https://www.stpatricks.ie/mental-health/anxiety

is_that_so

is_that_so wrote: »

Think this argument was used in the 60s,70s,80s and 90s and will be used again and again. But it's good to get it out there anyway!

they think they invented sex an all!

BDI

I told my mother once I felt a lot of pressure about my exams. She said pressure? What pressure are you under? You gob****e.

Never suffered from anxiety again

is_that_so

Deleted User wrote: »

they think they invented sex an all!

That was Gay Byrne apparently!

bmc58

Balanadan wrote: »

My arse they do.

The snowflake generation.Time they grew up and became part of the real world we live in.

is_that_so

is_that_so wrote: »

May not fix the issue. Learning coping mechanisms is a far better long-term approach. I'm with Phillip Larkin on this! A lot of parents don't allow their kids to build resilience in the face of challenges by overprotecting them. That and the excessive pressure they put on them to perform academically!

Well, there's good evidence for it. While it may not be a complete fix alone, looking after your diet and being healthy has been proven to affect mental health positively. So both approaches would be ideal, parents to foster resilience and limit exposure to things that engender unnecessary anxiety, and for people to lead healthy lives with proven benefits.

The whole person approach would usually be better than a selective fix.

freshpopcorn

BDI wrote: »

I told my mother once I felt a lot of pressure about my exams. She said pressure? What pressure are you under? You gob****e.

Never suffered from anxiety again

Ye both sound like delights!

joe40

Maybe there was always high levels of anxiety among students and young people but it wasn't talked about.
Things like anxiety and mental health are not as hidden as in previous generations.
I do remember been anxious at times as a teenager (1980s) but you just got on with it. Not necessarily the best approach either.
If a young person is feeling anxious they are more likely to say so now.

Upstream

Upstream wrote: »

Probably some benefit from avoiding ultraprocessed foods and eating a healthy and varied diet instead.

So for variety students should have some toast and beans instead of beans and toast every now and then

Don't forget noodles, the staple of many a student diet.

BDI

freshpopcorn wrote: »

Ye both sound like delights!

There’s a difference Between feeling anxious and suffering from anxiety and the pill pushers want us all to believe any little fright needs a dose of pills.

I’m not saying some people don’t need pills but 40 per cent of people needing pills means society needs to change not peoples chemical balance.

Potential-Monke

I believe a lot of the issue is down to what people are being told these days. I was guilty of this myself until I copped myself on.

Every child for the last 10-15 years has been told they can be whatever they want if they just work hard enough to achieve it. This is an extremely damaging line imo. Yes, some people may get lucky and get what they want. For the vast majority of people, they won't. But reinforcing that they can with hard work/dedication is making them believe that it's possible for anyone. We've filled their heads with nonsense and when it's not going the way they want, they get told that it's a mental condition.

We need to start teaching the youth how to accept rejection and move on. We need to teach them how to cope with not getting what they want, and that most people usually settle for what they have. Like, what are the chances of an Irish person becoming an Astronaut? A quick Google is leading me to believe there has never been one (I don't count 'links' to Irish ancestry).

Now, I don't want to take away from genuine anxiety, I have it myself but have learned how to cope with it (most of the time). But I think some people, especially professionals, are quick to label anything negative and the feelings that ensue as anxiety. I thought for a good while I had it, but it wasn't until my first proper anxiety attack that I was thinking wrong all along, labelling rejection as anxiety.

freshpopcorn

BDI wrote: »

There’s a difference Between feeling anxious and suffering from anxiety and the pill pushers want us all to believe any little fright needs a dose of pills.

I’m not saying some people don’t need pills but 40 per cent of people needing pills means society needs to change not peoples chemical balance.

Well you should have being clearer in your OP!

Fian

This is a perfect example of "lies, damn lies and statistics".

It is easy to generate a survey that will give you headline grabbing results, by framing the questions in a way that prompts those results.

It is easy to sell a press release to newspapers or news organisations who are competing with an ever growing range of competition and who need cheap (or in this case essentially free) content to grab some clicks & increase their revenue.

Unfortunately it is also easy to convince large swathes of the public to take this news at face value, especially when it is reported by "reputable" news sources like the Irish times etc.


So I don't think this generation are snowflakes, it is just that the USI or whoever decided to generate some media using this survey, in order to encourage more funding for students and for student mental health, at the start of a new college year which also coincides with the run in to the budget.

Nor do I think that college students have it especially tough. Whatever about the stresses faced by this new generation or the relative resilience of Generation Z, college students are in a privileged place versus the others in their generation and have it especially easy. Fair enough, I had my turn, now it is their opportunity to enjoy themselves studying a topic they chose and with little or no responsibilities or oversight.

Life is undeniably far harder for people starting off in the workplace or for people dealing with the responsibilities of career, children, mortgages/rent, bills etc. than most (not all) college students who are either living at home or being funded by their parents.

I lived away from home when I studied in UCD, I lived in grotty places, I had a part time job to help fund myself and I loved every minute of it. Great times, fun times, no responsibilities and certainly far less stress than later on when I was worrying about providing for my children.

the other big change, career wise, is that back not too long ago college was an opportunity to get a good grounding in a specialised field but whether you got college or went in a trade or whatever you had no illusions that your first few years in the job were to keep your mouth shut, your head down, get the tea made and keep your ears open.

probably due to the tiger but at some stage that changed and people were leaving school and college and thinking 40k and a corner office was a fair starting position for them

comes along the crash and everyone took a look at starting back on 20k and at the bottom and emigrated

now its back to good times again but i think that graduates and school leavers are starting at low paid, low level jobs and they seem to think that this is (a) forever and (b) the horriblest thing ever.

sorry kids. things went a bit mental there but normal service has been restored. knuckle down and you'll be fine but we're going to need to see a few years of you first.

BDI

Fian wrote: »

This is a perfect example of "lies, damn lies and statistics".

It is easy to generate a survey that will give you headline grabbing results, by framing the questions in a way that prompts those results.

It is easy to sell a press release to newspapers or news organisations who are competing with an ever growing range of competition and who need cheap (or in this case essentially free) content to grab some clicks & increase their revenue.

Unfortunately it is also easy to convince large swathes of the public to take this news at face value, especially when it is reported by "reputable" news sources like the Irish times etc.


So I don't think this generation are snowflakes, it is just that the USI or whoever decided to generate some media using this survey, in order to encourage more funding for students and for student mental health, at the start of a new college year which also coincides with the run in to the budget.

Nor do I think that college students have it especially tough. Whatever about the stresses faced by this new generation or the relative resilience of Generation Z, college students are in a privileged place versus the others in their generation and have it especially easy. Fair enough, I had my turn, now it is their opportunity to enjoy themselves studying a topic they chose and with little or no responsibilities or oversight.

Life is undeniably far harder for people starting off in the workplace or for people dealing with the responsibilities of career, children, mortgages/rent, bills etc. than most (not all) college students who are either living at home or being funded by their parents.

Right across the board, public sector.

Pressure to do well in school is a massive one. Previous generations could do poorly in leaving cert/not do it at all and still end up in a solid job.

A level 8 degree is now what the leaving cert used to be.

It's at the stage where a level 8 degree is often not even enough as the employer wants a couple of centuries work experience on top.

One eyed Jack

Balanadan wrote: »

My arse they do.

Considering how they’re actually presenting the information, who is presenting the information, and why they’re presenting the information, it doesn’t surprise me in the least that the Union of Students Ireland would claim that their own report suggests that almost a third of students in Ireland are depressed, and they need more funding to address the issues :rolleyes:

Almost a third of students in Ireland are depressed.
A new report on Student Mental Health in Third Level Education has found that college-goers have ‘extremely severe levels of anxiety’.

They’ve also had a formal diagnosis of a mental health difficulty at some point in their lives. USI Vice President for the Dublin region Craig McHugh says the report's findings are concerning: "What it really tells us is that students are under a lot of pressure," he said.

"We've the second highest fees in Europe at €3000.
"Students in Dublin are paying the highest rent in the EU27. "These are massive, massive pressures that are being put on to students. "Just last week we found that students were skipping lectures to work and fund their way through college. "This can't be good for people's mental health."


EXTREME ANXIETY A PROBLEM WITH 40% OF STUDENTS


It’s basically a headline grabbing effort for the kinds of pressures which are experienced by students in third level education. Throwing more money at USI won’t address these issues. Understanding and developing coping mechanisms and methods has to come from the students themselves.