Reversing around corner

irishgirl19

Just wondering are you allowed to adjust your left mirror before reversing around the corner.
My instructor says no but my friend's instructor says you can

Posy

Yes you can.

I personally preferred not to, because inevitably I'd forget to readjust it!

The J Stands for Jay

irishgirl19 wrote: »

Just wondering are you allowed to adjust your left mirror before reversing around the corner.
My instructor says no but my friend's instructor says you can

2 instructors told me I could, I did it in the test and passed.

irishgirl19

Thank you. I did forget today to readust it but was only practicing with a friend. I'll have to get in the habit of doing it

MascotDec85

It’s permitted on test but any tester I’ve spoken to don’t like to see it done.
As an instructor, I personally, hate to see it done. IMO dropping the mirror down means you’re reacting to where the kerb is going rather than seeing it in advance and anticipating your steering in addition to the fact you might also be able to see traffic approaching or pedestrians on the footpath etc.

zepman

My instructor didn't even talk about lowering the left mirror for reversing around the corner. He taught me to keep an eye on the back door handle in the mirror and turn the steering wheel in the appropriate direction to keep the handle parallel with the kerb at all times. This worked because, in my car, the handle is more or less above the rear wheel.

I'm glad I didn't learn to lower the left mirror. It might have been okay on the test, but outside of it, it would be time-consuming to do this every time I have to reverse, and raise it back after I'm done (if I do remember to). Even on my test, my reverse around the corner involved multiple stops since the road I was starting from was busy, and there was a vehicle parked very close to the corner of the street I was reversing into. With so much going on, if I had my left mirror lowered, there would have been things I might have missed. And being overwhelmed after completing the reverse, I would probably have forgotten to readjust the mirror.

irishgirl19

When I was out driving on pretest today instructor said maybe leave left mirror slightly more down than right one.
Hard to know what to do. I'll practice few more times with mirrors in a normal position. I did find it easier obviously having the kerb in the view of the mirror but don't want to break any rules.
I have my test in a few days and feel physically sick with nerves when I think of it.

On a side note does anyone know a handy website for refreshing on road signs?

J_R

Hi,

Adjusting the mirror downwards is no problem whatsoever, provided of course adequate observations are taken. In some situations. due to the configuration of the car windows, combined with the height of the driver using the mirrors is the only way that they can safely and competently navigate, otherwise it is pure guesswork.

Regarding returning the mirror to driving position. After completing each segment of the test and before starting a new, you should always take a moment to compose yourself, for example after reversing, say to yourself, OK, that's the reversing done, (well done me) now back to my driving mode and do the necessary checks.

Not just for reversing, providing a person performs any aspect correctly and adequately, I would be wary of changing that method just before a test. Because in the test the nerves could kick in, driver gets confused and attempt some kind of a hybrid of the new and old systems and end up using neither correctly.

I had a pupil once, after parking at the end of the test he turned to the examiner and said, " I have made one mistake, I forgot to put up the mirror after the reverse". i asked him what did the examiner say, " talk to you inside". He passed, examiner did not mention the mirrors

MascotDec85

J_R wrote: »

Hi,

Adjusting the mirror downwards is no problem whatsoever, provided of course adequate observations are taken. In some situations. due to the configuration of the car windows, combined with the height of the driver using the mirrors is the only way that they can safely and competently navigate, otherwise it is pure guesswork.

Regarding returning the mirror to driving position. After completing each segment of the test and before starting a new, you should always take a moment to compose yourself, for example after reversing, say to yourself, OK, that's the reversing done, (well done me) now back to my driving mode and do the necessary checks.

Not just for reversing, providing a person performs any aspect correctly and adequately, I would be wary of changing that method just before a test. Because in the test the nerves could kick in, driver gets confused and attempt some kind of a hybrid of the new and old systems and end up using neither correctly.

I had a pupil once, after parking at the end of the test he turned to the examiner and said, " I have made one mistake, I forgot to put up the mirror after the reverse". i asked him what did the examiner say, " talk to you inside". He passed, examiner did not mention the mirrors

The height of the pupil is essentially irrelevant if the mirror is set correctly for them (and their height) eg. In my car, the perfect mirror height is the front of the front door handle at the bottom of the mirror, it’s a reference point.
6ft 4 Paddy sets his mirror in that position the same way 5ft 0 Aoife does. That doesn’t mean the mirror hasn’t moved, it’s just set relative to the driver.
I’m sick getting into cars with pupils who haven’t been taught how to set their mirrors correctly. It’s actually frightening.

irishgirl19

MascotDec85 wrote:

The height of the pupil is essentially irrelevant if the mirror is set correctly for them (and their height) eg. In my car, the perfect mirror height is the front of the front door handle at the bottom of the mirror, it’s a reference point. 6ft 4 Paddy sets his mirror in that position the same way 5ft 0 Aoife does. That doesn’t mean the mirror hasn’t moved, it’s just set relative to the driver. I’m sick getting into cars with pupils who haven’t been taught how to set their mirrors correctly. It’s actually frightening.

I thought it was the back door handle in the bottom corner of the mirror. I could be remembering wrong. Hard to think when I'm not actually in the car doing it.

MascotDec85

irishgirl19 wrote: »

I thought it was the back door handle in the bottom corner of the mirror. I could be remembering wrong. Hard to think when I'm not actually in the car doing it.

Different reference points in different cars so you probably are right.

meathstevie

In my opinion, I'm not an instructor nor a tester, you demonstrate that you are able to use your car's features to your advantage to safely complete a manoeuvre by adjusting the mirror.

J_R

meathstevie wrote: »

In my opinion, I'm not an instructor nor a tester, you demonstrate that you are able to use your car's features to your advantage to safely complete a manoeuvre by adjusting the mirror.

+1

Could not agree more. Some instructors insist on a certain way of doing things irrespective if it is suitable for the pupil or not.

For example got a new pupil who had failed the tests a few times.

First lesson had her reverse around a corner. She was making a right mess, so stopped her, asked her why was she looking out the back window. she replied because last instructor said I must or I will fail the test. Then asked her what could she see, her reply "Clouds ?."

First thing I did was drive back to my car and got a cushion from the boot. (Kept a few from Lidl ) That helped, then taught her how to adjust, use her mirrors.

MascotDec85

meathstevie wrote: »

In my opinion, I'm not an instructor nor a tester, you demonstrate that you are able to use your car's features to your advantage to safely complete a manoeuvre by adjusting the mirror.

The word “safely” is very important here.
With a mirror adjusted downwards it could very easy to miss another oncoming hazard, like I said earlier in the thread, that hazard could be on the footpath, and in the blind spot in the rear left corner of the car.

I reckon it’s 7 years since I’ve had a pupil failing a test for the reverse around the corner. I’m happy with the method I use and my pupil’s seem to be too

irishgirl19

MascotDec85 wrote:

The word “safely†is very important here. With a mirror adjusted downwards it could very easy to miss another oncoming hazard, like I said earlier in the thread, that hazard could be on the footpath, and in the blind spot in the rear left corner of the car.

This is probably why my instructor is telling me I cant move the mirror downwards so. Safer with them up.
Think I will just leave them as they are an not turn downwards. Too risky

Always Tired

I hate how this is such a big thing in the test. The bottom row of my estate is used as a training ground by lesson givers and I'd say 50% of the time I go to cross that street there is some learner practicing this blocking my way. And it's basically the algebra of driving, you never use it in real life.

Posy

I assume the real life scenarios would be reversing into a parking space or into your drive?

Just reverse wide in the test and avoid hitting the kerb. You’ll only get a grade 2 for going wide.

Assuming the rest of your driving is good, you’ll pass. And it will be the last time you’ll ever reverse around a corner.

That’s what I did.

MascotDec85

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Just reverse wide in the test and avoid hitting the kerb. You’ll only get a grade 2 for going wide.

Assuming the rest of your driving is good, you’ll pass. And it will be the last time you’ll ever reverse around a corner.

That’s what I did.

Would you reverse wide into a parking space or driveway? It’s the same difference tbh.

I was told I should adjust my mirror for the manouver! However my old car had the mirror smashed off it so I had to adjust it by hand. If your mirror is in the right position for regular driving then you will be able to reverse around the corner grand. Just be absolutely certain to pause and do observation before you turn around the corner!!


Best of luck.

Woodsie1

When starting drive as far forward along the straight kerb as your tester will allow.
When reversing,move the wheel(SLIGHTLY),while looking in the mirror to see how he vehicle reacts to the kerb in your mirror.
Once to the turn adjust your steering to move in sync with the curve of the kerb.

Its hard to describe,I drive artics and we are trained to steer the trailer not the actual car(truck) we are driving...if you can get some time alone in a safe space just drive the car using only the mirrors...obviously in the test you need to look around too,but if you focus only driving using only mirrors(where its opposite)it will become 2nd nature to you.

Big kudos asking for advice,wish I did the same after failing my car test 1st time and truck test 1st time...passed both now,you can do the same:)

The Bishop Basher

The passenger mirror on some cars automatically drops when you place it in reverse. I’m pretty sure I dropped the mirror for my test nearly 30 years ago now. Can’t see the issue once you complete the manouver safely.

irishgirl19

Woodsie1 wrote:

Big kudos asking for advice,wish I did the same after failing my car test 1st time and truck test 1st time...passed both now,you can do the same

Thanks. Im dreading the test. Totally overthinking most of it and doubting myself even after lots of practice.
Hopefully when I'm in the car with the tester it will just be like 2nd nature to me. Fingers crossed.

irishgirl19

Practiced tonight there with mirrors in normal position and I was OK I reckon.

MascotDec85

MascotDec85 wrote: »

Would you reverse wide into a parking space or driveway? It’s the same difference tbh.

No. But for the purpose of the test, it’s best to make certain you avoid the kerb. You’ll get a grade 3 for that and wait for months for another test date.

MascotDec85

The Bishop Basher wrote: »

The passenger mirror on some cars automatically drops when you place it in reverse. I’m pretty sure I dropped the mirror for my test nearly 30 years ago now. Can’t see the issue once you complete the manouver safely.

Your instructor/car must have been really flash, the majority of cars didn’t have a left mirror 30 years ago. I passed my test 26 years ago and didn’t have one on a fairly new ADI car

MascotDec85

[Deleted User] wrote: »

No. But for the purpose of the test, it’s best to make certain you avoid the kerb. You’ll get a grade 3 for that and wait for months for another test date.

You might get a Grade 3 if you mount the kerb, simply brushing it will in most cases give a Grade 2. If you go excessively wide it could result in a Grade 3.

You should always try and keep the thing you’re trying to avoid and keep a reasonable distance from it.

I don’t think there’s anywhere in the country where a wait for the test is ‘months” most areas are around 6 weeks on average.

The Bishop Basher

MascotDec85 wrote: »

Your instructor/car must have been really flash, the majority of cars didn’t have a left mirror 30 years ago. I passed my test 26 years ago and didn’t have one on a fairly new ADI car

Not at all..

I can't remember for certain which car I did my test in but it was likely in my Dad's Nissan Sunny which was probably an 88 or 89. But then it could have been in the Mini Mayfair. Failing that it was in a 1990 civic. I have a crap memory for things like this but I do know that all 3 of those cars had a nearside mirror and I had it dropped slightly for the test.

It took another few years before I had one that automatically dropped in reverse but they all had 2 mirrors and there was nothing flash about any of those cars.

I also had the rear view mirror at an awkward angle for the test so it was obvious when I was looking at it which was done on the advice of my instructor.

I passed within a couple of months of my 17th birthday so the advice paid off.

ebbsy

I know people adjust their mirrors downwards but there is no need. Just watch until the kerb disappears from the mirror and count to 2 before turning.

I know when I first practiced it I turned the wheel to quickly. Small turns and let the car react each time.

I did it in Naas and it was busy.

irishgirl19

Failed on hitting kerb. Really annoyed at myself as I practiced for ages last night and only hit kerb once. Same in my prettest today.
Oh well

Woodsie1

irishgirl19 wrote: »

Failed on hitting kerb. Really annoyed at myself as I practiced for ages last night and only hit kerb once. Same in my prettest today.
Oh well

Awh thats a shame.
Nevermind,dust yourself down and go again,just think that youre way more prepared now for the next time you try.

Maybe someone posting has better knowledge than me,can you stop and readjust the car or does it need to be all done in one manouver.
I know in the artic trucks if you mess up you can pull forward and start again,its been a long time since I did the car test.

J_R

Deleted User wrote: »

Just reverse wide in the test and avoid hitting the kerb. You’ll only get a grade 2 for going wide.

Assuming the rest of your driving is good, you’ll pass. And it will be the last time you’ll ever reverse around a corner.

That’s what I did.

Hi,

I sometimes gave the above advice to some of my pupils but with a slight modification. Stay on your own side of the road.



Lowering the mirror is immaterial, because for rearward observation you use the mirror in conjunction with the rear and side windows and the interior and right mirror. It would only matter if you used the mirror exclusively for your observations where you would of course fail for observations - irrespective of its position. The only problem with lowering the mirror is forgetting to restore to its proper position afterwards.

dsmythy

Woodsie1 wrote: »

Awh thats a shame.
Nevermind,dust yourself down and go again,just think that youre way more prepared now for the next time you try.

Maybe someone posting has better knowledge than me,can you stop and readjust the car or does it need to be all done in one manouver.
I know in the artic trucks if you mess up you can pull forward and start again,its been a long time since I did the car test.

You can restart it if you want. Have to make sure you do the necessary observations as usual as you reposition yourself. Can be easy to forget that when you're focus is on getting the reverse done.

irishgirl19

dsmythy wrote:

You can restart it if you want. Have to make sure you do the necessary observations as usual as you reposition yourself. Can be easy to forget that when you're focus is on getting the reverse done.

Pity I didn't know that. I knew as I turned that I was going to mess it up but tried (and failed ha) to recover but kerbed it. At least I'll know next time that I can start again

irishgirl19

irishgirl19 wrote: »

Pity I didn't know that. I knew as I turned that I was going to mess it up but tried (and failed ha) to recover but kerbed it. At least I'll know next time that I can start again

Absolutely, pause, pull forwards and then continue to reverse. I did this when I knew I had turned too tightly and was going to hit the kerb. The tester told me that it was perfectly fine to do this. Just as others have said be very careful vto do full observations! That's where you'll pick up faults, being too focused on the reverse.

my3cents

:eek: You use mirrors to see where you are going when you reverse around a corner?

40 years since I did that maneuver on a test and was taught to look out the back window.

If you are looking in a mirror then there is a massive blind spot behind you

OR am I not understanding the OP's question?

irishgirl19

Deleted User wrote:

Absolutely, pause, pull forwards and then continue to reverse. I did this when I knew I had turned too tightly and was going to hit the kerb. The tester told me that it was perfectly fine to do this. Just as others have said be very careful vto do full observations! That's where you'll pick up faults, being too focused on the reverse.

Aw raging now! I will know for next time though. It was so disheartening knowing 5-10 mins into it that I had failed. Felt like asking him could we just go back to the center

Posy

Never think this and give up. What you're convinced is a grade 3, could turn out to be a grade 2*, and you've just thrown the test.

*Well, within reason! :pac:

my3cents wrote: »

:eek: You use mirrors to see where you are going when you reverse around a corner?

You use the mirror for positioning around the kerb, but still look out the back window. My instructor was always warning me not to over focus on the left mirror because then you're not looking at where you're going! Like driving forwards, it's still a combination of both.

MascotDec85

irishgirl19 wrote: »

Pity I didn't know that. I knew as I turned that I was going to mess it up but tried (and failed ha) to recover but kerbed it. At least I'll know next time that I can start again

Where are you based?

irishgirl19

irishgirl19 wrote: »

Aw raging now! I will know for next time though. It was so disheartening knowing 5-10 mins into it that I had failed. Felt like asking him could we just go back to the center

Feel for you! I passed on my third go. I know how stressful it is! I actually had 8 grade 2s on my eventual pass and three of those were me speeding through yield signs, because I was trying to not delay and get that "not progressing".

You had one grade 3. Reapply and know you can do it now!

punisher5112

my3cents wrote: »

:eek: You use mirrors to see where you are going when you reverse around a corner?

40 years since I did that maneuver on a test and was taught to look out the back window.

If you are looking in a mirror then there is a massive blind spot behind you

OR am I not understanding the OP's question?

You use your mirror and look out the window and not just the rear....

Also if it helps you don't need to wear your seat belt if reversing. Only time allowed to have it off.

mikeymouse

Should be scrapped from the test ,
along with turning in the road(3 point turn)
Instead bring in sat-nav use,
motorway driving,
parallel parking,
changing a wheel,
I could go on.

J_R

mikeymouse wrote: »

Should be scrapped from the test ,
along with turning in the road(3 point turn)
Instead bring in sat-nav use,
motorway driving,
parallel parking,
changing a wheel,
I could go on.

Hi,

The real purpose of the reverse around the corner in a test is to ascertain if the applicant can safely, competently and legally reverse into a limited opening. Unfortunately it has morphed into an exercise where the entire focus is reversing around a corner for which most people appear not to see any practical use or purpose.

I had a pupil, a lady well into middle age, she had failed the test numerous times, main problem nerves and reversing. I cleared up the reversing and in the lesson before the test she did a perfect reverse. But I was afraid that in the test she would revert back to her old system of reversing which was to reverse very very slowly and continuously turn the wheel, tiny turns and all in random directions.

So, after the reverse told her, that was fantastic, well done etc, but in the test if you start making a mess of it to stop, start over;

I pointed to a house across the road and to the right and told her to pretend you have driven into this estate and you want to call into that house and park outside. so you drive in, past this road, stop, reverse into this road and drive over and park.

After the test she came out, all smiles, saying I did what you said, i did what you said. In the test she got the exact same corner, realised she was making a mess, so she started over and "did what I said" and passed. She obviously did all the necessary obs and must have stayed "reasonably close" to her side of the road

And that is the real purpose of the reverse around the corner to simply reverse safely into a road (or driveway)

along with turning in the road(3 point turn)
This is a test to see if you can control the car in a confined space. Which you use every time in traffic

Instead bring in sat-nav use,
Already on its way

motorway driving,
I think a lesson or two on a dual carriageway is enough preparation.

parallel parking,
Agree, So all driving instructors would be forced to teach this. and also emergency braking

changing a wheel,
Not really a safety issue and would be too time consuming

meathstevie

MascotDec85 wrote: »

The word “safely” is very important here.
With a mirror adjusted downwards it could very easy to miss another oncoming hazard, like I said earlier in the thread, that hazard could be on the footpath, and in the blind spot in the rear left corner of the car.

I reckon it’s 7 years since I’ve had a pupil failing a test for the reverse around the corner. I’m happy with the method I use and my pupil’s seem to be too

To me it's very important to use all possible methods of continuously observing the environment you're moving in. I don't see any problem with using a mirror to give you that extra angle. Your back and neck are quite flexible to look over your shoulder as well.

As I said, I'm not an instructor nor tester but I am a former UK trained emergency services driver and a driver with over one million kilometre driving experience.

irishgirl19

MascotDec85 wrote:

Where are you based?

Dublin 10.

Thanks everyone I didn't want to reapply for a few weeks but I think I will just book tonight and go on normal wait list.
I have a bit of work to do re hazards too. Got 3 grade 2's for that. Tester said im taking too long to make up my mind in regards to overtaking parked trucks etc

meathstevie

J_R wrote: »

Hi,

The real purpose of the reverse around the corner in a test is to ascertain if the applicant can safely, competently and legally reverse into a limited opening. Unfortunately it has morphed into an exercise where the entire focus is reversing around a corner for which most people appear not to see any practical use or purpose.

I had a pupil, a lady well into middle age, she had failed the test numerous times, main problem nerves and reversing. I cleared up the reversing and in the lesson before the test she did a perfect reverse. But I was afraid that in the test she would revert back to her old system of reversing which was to reverse very very slowly and continuously turn the wheel, tiny turns and all in random directions.

So, after the reverse told her, that was fantastic, well done etc, but in the test if you start making a mess of it to stop, start over;

I pointed to a house across the road and to the right and told her to pretend you have driven into this estate and you want to call into that house and park outside. so you drive in, past this road, stop, reverse into this road and drive over and park.

After the test she came out, all smiles, saying I did what you said, i did what you said. In the test she got the exact same corner, realised she was making a mess, so she started over and "did what I said" and passed. She obviously did all the necessary obs and must have stayed "reasonably close" to her side of the road

And that is the real purpose of the reverse around the corner to simply reverse safely into a road (or driveway)

along with turning in the road(3 point turn)
This is a test to see if you can control the car in a confined space. Which you use every time in traffic

Instead bring in sat-nav use,
Already on its way

motorway driving,
I think a lesson or two on a dual carriageway is enough preparation.

parallel parking,
Agree, So all driving instructors would be forced to teach this. and also emergency braking

changing a wheel,
Not really a safety issue and would be too time consuming

There's a lot to be said for how a lot of continental countries do the manoeuvring components of the driving test.

In a closed environment with standardised layouts.

I remember doing my initial B category test in Belgium back in the stone age and before you go out on the road for the actual driving test you had to do a number of set manoeuvres, if memory serves me right a 10m straight reverse, reverse parking with car length plus one metre as available space, a three point turn with again car length plus one metre as available space and a reverse in and drive out car park type scenario. You were allowed one booboo, any more and you failed and didn't even get to do the public road part of the test.

All was done in a closed car park type environment adjacent to the test center and for every component you were allowed a certain amount of space on top of your car's dimensions and the boundaries were marked with moveable fences and or cones.

GrumpyMe

When I did my first test the tester put the wind up me by asking me to stop on Kinvara Avenue just short of Kinvara Park. Then he pointed to the right turn and asked me "...when you are ready, to reverse into that road on the right". I was in a rigid truck and had never practised nor dreamt of reversing into a right hand turn.
As said above

J_R wrote: »

...And that is the real purpose of the reverse around the corner to simply reverse safely into a road (or driveway)...

I remembered my instructor's words that you can't be failed if you do things safely, confidentially and competently.
So, going for broke, obs, mirrors, indicators, and moved onto wrong side of the road beyond the junction, obs, mirrors, indicators reversed around to the right, finishing on Kinvara Park close to the left footpath and waited for the next instruction.

Passed the test and in one fell swoop filled all >= four wheeled categories of my driving licence.

posy2010

I failed twice on reversing around corner. I finally passed last week. All you can do is practice - I did it constantly. Now I never have to do again thankfully!

irishgirl19

posy2010 wrote: »

I failed twice on reversing around corner. I finally passed last week. All you can do is practice - I did it constantly. Now I never have to do again thankfully!

Thanks. Its such a hard thing to fail on. I can do it OK practicing but under pressure of the tester is a different story.
Glad you passed! How many times have you had to reverse around the corner since ?

punisher5112

Parallel parking should be part of the test to be honest....

If you can grasp the idea of where to be and when to turn it's not too difficult....

Obviously practice practice practice.

my3cents

punisher5112 wrote: »

Parallel parking should be part of the test to be honest....

If you can grasp the idea of where to be and when to turn it's not too difficult....

Obviously practice practice practice.

Parking between two white lines should be part of the test looking by a lot of the parking I see.

But where do we stop? I'm not sure how you would test parallel parking unless their is going to be an area set aside for it. Its hard to parallel park between imaginary parked cars.