Do you trust Meltzer any more?

savemejebus

Just after seeing that someone is reporting that Dave Meltzer has said that “one of the very few people in WWE who hasn’t inquired to AEW.”

Personally I find that the concept that there are 'very few people' who haven't enquired hard to believe, whether due to liking their job security, knowing they wouldn't fit in, not wanting to lose the exposure they have etc.

If it is true that he said this then it's not the first shill-like comment that i've heard attributed to him when it comes to AEW (more demand than any wrestlemania springs to mind) so I think i'd take everything he says with an extra pinch of salt from now on. I'm wondering am I the only one though?

What do ye think? Do ye trust what he says these days?

Bounty Hunter

Meltzer is just a person. He speaks in hyperbole and he makes mistakes. I think he has a lot of contacts, knowledge and experience however and is still the person that a lot of "Wrestling journalism" is based around, with a lot of people just regurgitating what he says. He might be friendly with the people behind AEW and that might mean that we should take his opinion on them with a grain of salt but tbh you should take anyone's opinion that way as it is opinion not fact / news.

jaykhunter

Nopes

I'd take Meltzer's reporting to be factual (eg "here's the gate for this PPV") and his facts/figures to be as accurate as you can get in the wrestling business; but his opinions I more or less disregard, since he has a massive chubby for Japanese wrestling. Stuff like Omega & Jericho brawling at a press conference was like Rock / Hogan; that kind of wild hyperbole bigging up Japanese wrestling, it's pretty much a running gag.

ERG89

savemejebus wrote: »

Personally I find that the concept that there are 'very few people' who haven't enquired hard to believe, whether due to liking their job security, knowing they wouldn't fit in, not wanting to lose the exposure they have etc.

Would you not be a complete f**king idiot to not say to WWE you have options in contract negotiations now???
Even if you're bluffing you should at least put out feelers, when a company is giving 5 year deals to turkeys like Mojo Rawley they'd offer stupid money if one could confirm offers. I'm sure others would inquire for no other reason other than the schedule.

As far as Japan goes the standard of stuff like the New Japan Cup, Best of the Super Juniors and the G1 are so high it is praiseworthy. Much like on twitter those who say 'that's a 5* in the Tokyo Dome' must not actually watch Wrestle Kingdom shows to be using them as a punchline to a lazy joke.

savemejebus

Atari Jaguar

ERG89 wrote: »

Would you not be a complete f**king idiot to not say to WWE you have options in contract negotiations now???
Even if you're bluffing you should at least put out feelers, when a company is giving 5 year deals to turkeys like Mojo Rawley they'd offer stupid money if one could confirm offers. I'm sure others would inquire for no other reason other than the schedule.

Nobody questions the logic of getting more leverage in contract negotiations. However, I'd guess that the number of talent in wwe coming up to contract negotiation time does not tally with what Meltzer is supposed to have said about there only being 'very few' who haven't enquired.

I haven't had an issue with him giving false praise to matches too often, I would however be fairly cynical when dealing with unprovable comments about his friends business.

Agent Coulson

Using Meltzer has worked well for the midcard talent that are getting a nice bump in pay on 5 year deals offered to them by the WWE that will set most of them up for life.


Then there are those that are happy to use it to negotiate with other companies.


So whatever you want to say about Meltzer his writing is working for the benefit of talent in the long term.


I'd take his paid view over the paid view of Brother Love, Conrad and all the podcast gangs that make money out of fans for their opinions and insider knowledge that they sell themselves for having.

B.A._Baracus

Atari Jaguar

Al Snow said it best regarding Meltzer and that he is the greatest worker of all time and he has never taken a bump at the same time (it wasn't a compliement either)

Meltzer takes crap. He doesn't know what he is talking about. By that I mean he was never working for some promotion for years as a booker or anything. He is no different than a fan who reads some insider terms. Granted, credit is due the man has earned a great living from wrestling by taking no bumps. But it's all horse crap. People buying into this opinions as gospel.

5 star matches ... you can wipe your ass with his 5 star matches :pac:
We all have different opinions. I might vanilla ice cream and you might like chocolate ice cream. Who cares what people think. All that matters is did it sell... (from wwe's own perspective) the rest is all BS.

Like what Meltzer views as a good match is completely different to what vince and other key management in WWE think.

Jerichoholic

Nopes

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Al Snow said it best regarding Meltzer and that he is the greatest worker of all time and he has never taken a bump at the same time (it wasn't a compliement either)

Meltzer takes crap. He doesn't know what he is talking about. By that I mean he was never working for some promotion for years as a booker or anything. He is no different than a fan who reads some insider terms. Granted, credit is due the man has earned a great living from wrestling by taking no bumps. But it's all horse crap. People buying into this opinions as gospel.

5 star matches ... you can wipe your ass with his 5 star matches :pac:
We all have different opinions. I might vanilla ice cream and you might like chocolate ice cream. Who cares what people think. All that matters is did it sell... (from wwe's own perspective) the rest is all BS.

Like what Meltzer views as a good match is completely different to what vince and other key management in WWE think.

Absolute nonsense.

B.A._Baracus

Atari Jaguar

Jerichoholic wrote: »

Absolute nonsense.

How?
He's no different from you starting your own wrestling news website. How does his knowledge differ from yours? I? some random fan watching years?

Jerichoholic

Nopes

90% of actual wrestlers have subscribed to his newsletter for 40 years. He teaches Sports Business in a University. Vince has offered him deals to work with WWE at least 3 times. He's not a random fan. He's friends with some pretty impressive names. Rock, Flair, Bret etc. He was best friends with Brian Pillman.

A geek on wreddit is not that way.

Also you don't need to take an armdrag to tell if a match was good or not or to be allowed to criticize it. It's a performance art. Do you need to be an actor to be able to tell if Spice World is a good movie or not.

sky88

Atari Jaguar

Jerichoholic wrote: »

90% of actual wrestlers have subscribed to his newsletter for 40 years. He teaches Sports Business in a University. Vince has offered him deals to work with WWE at least 3 times. He's not a random fan. He's friends with some pretty impressive names. Rock, Flair, Bret etc. He was best friends with Brian Pillman.

A geek on wreddit is not that way.

Also you don't need to take an armdrag to tell if a match was good or not or to be allowed to criticize it. It's a performance art. Do you need to be an actor to be able to tell if Spice World is a good movie or not.

why does being friends with any of the wrestlers come into support of his work when its generally good for the wrestler as he wont criticize his friends eg flair

Jerichoholic

Nopes

His work is always good, but you would have to read it to know that.

B.A._Baracus

Atari Jaguar

Jerichoholic wrote: »

90% of actual wrestlers have subscribed to his newsletter for 40 years. He teaches Sports Business in a University. Vince has offered him deals to work with WWE at least 3 times. He's not a random fan. He's friends with some pretty impressive names. Rock, Flair, Bret etc. He was best friends with Brian Pillman.

A geek on wreddit is not that way.

Also you don't need to take an armdrag to tell if a match was good or not or to be allowed to criticize it. It's a performance art. Do you need to be an actor to be able to tell if Spice World is a good movie or not.

Its all balls dude.
If a wrestler is renegotiating his or her deal it doesn't come down to "oh how many stars did meltzer give?" - comes down to brass tax. They sold X amount of merch now worth X amount more etc.

It's just his opnion. As said above fair play to the chap for making as much as he did. But he just sells his opinion. I don't need to read about how much a match was good to enjoy it myself.

Jerichoholic

Nopes

He reports on business aspects very well and has trusted sources for news. 99% of the twitter scooperstars get all their news the Observer. You would also have to be blind not to be able to see that New Japan matches are of a higher quality than anywhere else.

If you don't read his stuff that's fine, but you shouldn't be condemning something you don't read or know anything about.

B.A._Baracus

Atari Jaguar

Jerichoholic wrote: »

He reports on business aspects very well and has trusted sources for news. 99% of the twitter scooperstars get all their news the Observer. You would also have to be blind not to be able to see that New Japan matches are of a higher quality than anywhere else.

If you don't read his stuff that's fine, but you shouldn't be condemning something you don't read or know anything about.

second time you tried to play the one-up card saying i dont read him :pac:
nice try. I do read him.

what card will jericholic play next... stay tuned. lol.

Jerichoholic

Nopes

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

second time you tried to play the one-up card saying i dont read him :pac:
nice try. I do read him.

what card will jericholic play next... stay tuned. lol.

I don't need to read about how much a match was good to enjoy it myself.

Where do you read his stuff?

Saying you don't trust him and all of his stuff is bollocks and he hasn't a clue, then you say you read him.

I'm calling bull**** on that.

B.A._Baracus

Atari Jaguar

Jerichoholic wrote: »

Where do you read his stuff?

Saying you don't trust him and all of his stuff is bollocks and he hasn't a clue, then you say you read him.

I'm calling bull**** on that.

you're like a deck of cards.

well seeing as you bloody love the man and feel the absolute need to defend him... i now pronouce your mrs jericho-holic-meltzer :pac:

but to be serious. i dont give two flying fu*ks what you think. I got my opinion. You got yours. You quoted me first. Take it... leave it... try to go on about how wrong I am? whatever you want dude.

Jerichoholic

Nopes

Who's better than Dave then, may I ask?

B.A._Baracus

Atari Jaguar

Jerichoholic wrote: »

Who's better than Dave then, may I ask?

your ma :pac:

Loughc

Atari Jaguar

Jerichoholic wrote: »

Who's better than Dave then, may I ask?

Canyon.

Jerichoholic

Nopes

What a great thread

B.A._Baracus

Atari Jaguar

Loughc wrote: »

Canyon.

Crap. Would have been a better joke :pac:

The White Wolf

Jerichoholic wrote: »

Who's better than Dave then, may I ask?

I do think Meltzer has been unfairly disparaged ever since social media has given a platform to countless rent-a-mouths desperate to discredit someone who has simply been peerless for decades. That's my two cents anyway on the subject.

Him and Alvarez are still the first opinions I seek out when something has happened.

jaykhunter

Nopes

Jerichoholic wrote: »

90% of actual wrestlers have subscribed to his newsletter for 40 years. He teaches Sports Business in a University. Vince has offered him deals to work with WWE at least 3 times. He's not a random fan.

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Its all balls dude.

The height of coherent rebuttals there BA. Well done.

I suscribe to the Fcuk Dave Meltzer club....

Thats cause the first ever podcast i listened to Something to wrestle

Agent Coulson

Brother Love Dave's biggest source back in the day.

B.A._Baracus

Atari Jaguar

jaykhunter wrote: »

The height of coherent rebuttals there BA. Well done.

Whats the alternative? I have my opinion & others have theirs. So we get back and fourth, back and fourth arguing our point and whats the end result? i still have my opinion he still has his.

So yes it's all balls :pac:

leggo

It’s not a simple issue.

Does he have sources and report a lot of accurate info? Yeah, clearly.

Does he also report absolute bollocks? Yes. I’ve known enough about stories I’ve seen him report on to be able to gauge how much he actually understands and doesn’t and it’s just right there that he reports whatever is said to him without double-sourcing or further research. These are core principles in any field of journalism and he’ll ignore them to get a good yarn out when necessary. That’s low standards.

Is he objective in his opinion, the backbone of any credible reviewer in any medium? No, clearly not, he favours NJPW, finds it painful to rate WWE when they deserve it and his reporting on AEW has shown he prioritises looking after his mates and protecting his sources over reporting the truth or asking the tough questions.

Do I trust the word of other wrestling journalists more? I do, the likes of David Bixenspan clearly take more pride in what they’re saying being truthful. But do they have his contacts? No.

So he’s likely the best we’ve got, but what that speaks for is a damning indictment of the standard of reporting in wrestling rather than him being a great journalist in his own right. Ariel Helwani, for example, runs rings around him for standards in a similar environment.

Jerichoholic

Nopes

Sirsok wrote: »

I suscribe to the Fcuk Dave Meltzer club....

Thats cause the first ever podcast i listened to Something to wrestle

Listening to a con man is not a good start.

Vince135792003

Nopes

When it comes to reviewing matches, it's just Meltzer's opinion. Sometimes I'd agree. Sometimes I'd disagree. I sometimes do feel he could be more open to others opinion. I was a print subscriber of the Observer for about 7 years before he went online. The amount of factual information and the sheer volume of it and analysis is incredible. You would regularly get 2 Observers a week and I could not keep up! His obituaries and historical pieces about wrestlers, incidents and wrestling territories are where Dave Meltzer shines. The Observer is overambitious (history, news, business analysis, obituaries, match reviews and gossip, especially when it first began). All done by 1 man for 30 years week after week (it may be slightly more or it may be less) is incredible and deserves respect. It's not a perfect publication but wrestling is far better off for its presence. I have listened to him for nearly 20 years at this stage and I've enjoyed it immensely. His enthusiasm, intelligence and thoroughness is undiminished. I do think he can be slow to admit an error and can come across overly confident/flippant on social media. When all is said and done though, his passion and knowledge of wrestling is infectious and helped turn a childhood interest for me into an adult 1. I think he's done that for many.
His influence as a commentator/reporter of wrestling may be overstated in 2019. Life moves on. However, he will be remembered as a pioneer. A pioneer wrestling needed.

sky88

Atari Jaguar

Jerichoholic wrote: »

Listening to a con man is not a good start.

But the con man is/was friends with impressive names like flair,piper, Austin, rock

Mr.Nice Guy

Atari Jaguar

I think he's become too close to his pals in the business. I don't trust him to give an unbiased take on the industry. Also, he's made a mockery of the star rating system.

thebostoncrab

Nopes

I look at it in two ways: there is the matches he reviews, and then there is the journalism.

For matches, I’ll be honest I tend to agree with Meltzer but that’s just because the style of wrestling he enjoys has always been the style that I’ve enjoyed. I grew up on a good diet of old AJPW and NJPW tapes as well as WWF, so if Dave rates a match highly I seek it out. But, that’s also subjective and I think not something you should base your view on his credibility on.

When it comes to news and reporting on wrestling, I honestly think he is a victim of two things; doing it for so long and working in a very over-saturated market. It’s much easier now for Johnny and Joey Boot and Tights to start a podcast or a news website, and a ton of these websites get their detail from Dave, which they won’t credit, and thus it can make people not see the amount of work Meltzer has put into this gig, from his connections to his decades of insight to the business.

He does get things wrong yes, however wrestling plans do change at the drop of a hat, and there isn’t a single journalist in any market that gets it right 100% of the time. If we talk baseball, Meltzers batting average for news is going to be untouchable.

J. Marston

Atari Jaguar

Whatever about his contacts in the industry but the religious reverence paid to his arbitrary match rating system has always confused and more recently fúcking annoyed me.

Reddit in particular is mental with it. Mention not liking, or liking, a wrestler and there will be a handful of his zealots on hand with a database of all that wrestler's 4.25/1.5 star matches which are definitive, unquestionable proof of that wrestlers merit.

Go away and shíte.

ERG89

thebostoncrab wrote: »

He does get things wrong yes, however wrestling plans do change at the drop of a hat, and there isn’t a single journalist in any market that gets it right 100% of the time. If we talk baseball, Meltzers batting average for news is going to be untouchable.

In fairness WWE's booking has been so haphazard the last few years its caught up on them when you look at the lame card for SummerSlam which in the past they would have been building towards since the Spring, another lazy nostalgia show next week on Raw with all your favourite old, old catchphrases & the fact they had to dig up Eric Bischoff from his 20 year old sarcophagus to get buzz in 2019.

He did say Lesnar vs Reigns was the WM 34 main event a long time before that show which some people thought WWE would not be dumb enough to do, which went as well as many expected.

Necro

Atari Jaguar

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

I think he's become too close to his pals in the business. I don't trust him to give an unbiased take on the industry. Also, he's made a mockery of the star rating system.

Yep, this is exactly the crux of my issue with Meltzer tbh. His fawning over specific promotions and styles has reached parody levels at this point.

showpony1

leggo wrote: »

I’ve known enough about stories I’ve seen him report on to be able to gauge how much he actually understands and doesn’t

what stories are these - related to Irish wrestling?

The White Wolf

Gas that some nobody would try and pull the mark card on Meltzer. Watching too many Kevin Nash and Al Snow shoots.

leggo

showpony1 wrote: »

what stories are these - related to Irish wrestling?

I'll give one example I've spoken about here before: remember he reported that JBL 'caused' Mauro Ranallo's bipolar? I grew up with someone close to me who was bipolar so know a LOT about the condition. If you've even a rudimentary understanding of it, you'll know that the only thing that 'causes' it is a chemical imbalance in the brain, that's literally what it is. The entire point of bipolar is that your mood is often cripplingly affected by your brain just switching from elated to depressed apropos of nothing (sometimes it can be seasonal, sometimes it can switch daily, sometimes completely random) and it's so devastating because nothing can control it. Nothing 'causes' the switch and even medication and constant treatment can be ineffective sometimes. It's just how people are wired and it can ruin lives, it's an awful condition. Meltzer may as well have reported, "JBL bullied Mauro Ranallo and it gave him AIDS." That's how ignorant the story was.

So what can we deduce from this about his standards? Well we know he didn't get that news from the source, i.e. Mauro, because nobody with bipolar would say this. We also know he didn't check it with Mauro before reporting on his suffering of a serious medical condition. We also can deduce that someone who is ignorant of bipolar and had an axe to grind fed him this info and he reported it without even a cursory Google of bipolar, so he can easily be used by lads who feed him absolute waffle to suit an agenda. So not only will he report sensitive info on people within wrestling, he'll report on it wrongly.

Then look at the affect: because Meltzer said it, you had his fanboys who believe every word that comes out of his mouth, and were also equally ignorant of bipolar, accept this narrative unquestioned. This created a mob demanding JBL's head. JBL was a commentator on TV at the time and the backlash was so severe, despite it being complete BS, that he was quietly taken off TV. So even though his info is bad, he has enough of a following who rely on his word that his bad info was able to affect someone's livelihood.

By any reasonable standard, that is gutter journalism on every level.

Itssoeasy

Atari Jaguar

Meltzer like anyone reporting on wrestling is only as good as the info he's getting from his sources within the wrestling companies.

leggo

But if you take the example I gave, a Google search or even basic knowledge of the words he typed would’ve completely changed how he reported the story and the affect that story had. So no, I don’t accept that. It’s making excuses for poor, reckless work and low standards.

Also it’s a choice to report on someone’s medical ailments, he could’ve used discretion and not pointed the eyes of the world at someone suffering with depression. There’s a whole debate in the ‘real’ media about what’s in the public interest and what’s not (the Hulk Hogan story was largely centred on this) and should journalists get away with posting personal info about celebrities for profit or is it scummy? Dave has no qualms about doing this and he’s gotta be held accountable, as do we if we feed that and make it a profitable thing for him to do.

Itssoeasy

Atari Jaguar

Sorry leggo I wasn't referring to your post in my post. I literally just answered the question without looking at your post. Yeah, while JBL is far from a saint I could never understand how they could blame one person on the thing meltzer was saying.

nannerby

Atari Jaguar

Havnt listened to him in at least 5 years and thought then he was full of it,dont know if anything has changed since apart from him being matey with the aew crew but id still have no interest in listening to him.

The White Wolf

nannerby wrote: »

Havnt listened to him in at least 5 years and thought then he was full of it,dont know if anything has changed since apart from him being matey with the aew crew but id still have no interest in listening to him.

Meltzer and Alvarez have not been afraid to be critical of AEW when they've done questionable things so the bias accusation is a non runner.

nannerby

Atari Jaguar

The White Wolf wrote: »

Meltzer and Alvarez have not been afraid to be critical of AEW when they've done questionable things so the bias accusation is a non runner.

I never mentioned any bias at all I gave up listening to him because I thought he was rubbish long before aew came along.

The White Wolf

nannerby wrote: »

I never mentioned any bias at all I gave up listening to him because I thought he was rubbish long before aew came along.

The fact you mentioned AEW as something to hold against him means you are biased.

leggo

These days people just see what they want to see and apply facts that enforce the view they want to have while ignoring ones that disprove it. You get that a lot with Meltzer diehards.

It’s absolute insanity, even here you’ve got a couple of people who are like “Show me one thing he’s ever gotten wrong!” He was completely wrong just this week like: he reported Chris Charlton had been reduced to just translating on NJPW coverage, after this was debunked by the people involved if anything he’s been more of a focal point on commentary since that story. But they just won’t see this stuff and, when confronted, will rant about how he works in a college or something equally random and nothing to do with the point.

nannerby

Atari Jaguar

The White Wolf wrote: »

The fact you mentioned AEW as something to hold against him means you are biased.

Everyone who mentions Melzer nowadays mentions aew ive no bias against aew im delighted they are on the scene.

thebostoncrab

Nopes

leggo wrote: »

I'll give one example I've spoken about here before: remember he reported that JBL 'caused' Mauro Ranallo's bipolar? I grew up with someone close to me who was bipolar so know a LOT about the condition. If you've even a rudimentary understanding of it, you'll know that the only thing that 'causes' it is a chemical imbalance in the brain, that's literally what it is. The entire point of bipolar is that your mood is often cripplingly affected by your brain just switching from elated to depressed apropos of nothing (sometimes it can be seasonal, sometimes it can switch daily, sometimes completely random) and it's so devastating because nothing can control it. Nothing 'causes' the switch and even medication and constant treatment can be ineffective sometimes. It's just how people are wired and it can ruin lives, it's an awful condition. Meltzer may as well have reported, "JBL bullied Mauro Ranallo and it gave him AIDS." That's how ignorant the story was.

So what can we deduce from this about his standards? Well we know he didn't get that news from the source, i.e. Mauro, because nobody with bipolar would say this. We also know he didn't check it with Mauro before reporting on his suffering of a serious medical condition. We also can deduce that someone who is ignorant of bipolar and had an axe to grind fed him this info and he reported it without even a cursory Google of bipolar, so he can easily be used by lads who feed him absolute waffle to suit an agenda. So not only will he report sensitive info on people within wrestling, he'll report on it wrongly.

Then look at the affect: because Meltzer said it, you had his fanboys who believe every word that comes out of his mouth, and were also equally ignorant of bipolar, accept this narrative unquestioned. This created a mob demanding JBL's head. JBL was a commentator on TV at the time and the backlash was so severe, despite it being complete BS, that he was quietly taken off TV. So even though his info is bad, he has enough of a following who rely on his word that his bad info was able to affect someone's livelihood.

By any reasonable standard, that is gutter journalism on every level.

I’ll say before I continue that I am someone with bipolar disorder and have lived with it officially for 12 years, so I’ll admit I may be biased in this discussion, although I’ll do my best to double check my own biases.

Can I ask where Meltzer ever said that JBL “caused” Mauro’s bipolar disorder? I’m not asking for a long explanation or anything here, just where he said specifically that JBL “caused” the condition?

Because that story hit home very hard for me, for one reason being stupidly obvious, but also because of what was actually reported, that JBL added Mauro to a long list of guys he bullied (or “hazed” and I ****ing hate that word in stories like this) and part of his target was his struggles with bipolar. A bi-product if bipolar is paranoia and self doubt, so while JBL didn’t cause the disorder, bullying can worsen the feelings it brings due to the paranoia and self doubt. It can validate your own thoughts and lead you down a very dangerous path. But I’m close to moving away from the point.

What I’m asking for is where did Dave report that JBL caused Mauro’s bipolar? Because all the reports I read from the man never claim this. I also just spent the last few minutes doing a sanity check on reports from that time period and again, nothing from Dave about JBL causing his bipolar.

leggo

Now come on man...are you seriously asking me to backcheck every report, daily report and tweet he made from a specific period several years ago for a specific quote when we can all remember it?

Here's my recollection of it: I'd have no particular axe to grind with the man, and especially wouldn't around then, he'd have given projects I'd have worked on coverage over the years when we'd send it off etc so if anything I'd have appreciated that and defended him more often than not. Then I saw his reporting on that story and, to be honest, that was a turning point because bipolar is something quite close to my heart too and to see it reported in such black and white terms in an effort to whip up a mob against JBL* was a turning point for me. It's such a complex illness, one that shouldn't be revealed publicly without SERIOUS consideration** because of ignorance around it (that I'm sure you have experienced yourself), and if you bothered to understand what you were saying or gave a **** you wouldn't report it in the manner he did. You just wouldn't. And he threw it out there casually like a sensational tabloid story where "This man = good, this man = bad."

Besides, we can all vividly remember it. You remember Meltzer reporting it right? And that it was one of these stories that, like with Roman Reigns right now, he constantly had to go back-and-forth with people on because he took a lot of flack? And do you remember JBL being painted as the bad guy and a pile-on ensuing, to the point he started blocking people en masse? Do you remember Mauro coming out with a video and pretty much saying, "Thanks guys, I appreciate the support, but that's actually not the case"? And that being how Mauro ended up on NXT, while JBL's commentary role was downsized before being taken off TV quietly after it died down?

That alone validates what I'm saying. I get if you like Meltzer and/or don't like JBL you're going to want to see things the way that reflects that, but come on...you know that that outcome alone doesn't reflect the true nature of your condition (and I'm sorry you go through that, I didn't know that, having seen its affects I can only imagine the struggles you've dealt with) or particularly help with dealing with it. And Meltzer is the one who just dropped that bomb and let it all happen, then walked away from it first chance he got. Do you honestly, in your heart of hearts, think that's the 'responsible' way of handling it all? From a lad who's now making a person's suffering with leukaemia about himself and threatening people who criticise that by giving away their personal info, that he would've gotten through subscriptions, publicly?

*I'd have no particular affinity for JBL either. If anything, his historical behaviour does sound problematic and he likely wasn't built for WWE in this era. But that doesn't excuse false accusations being thrown his way and everyone being okay with it because they just don't like him either. That kind of behaviour and attitude is bullying in itself.

**For example, if it was me, even if the person suffering told me "Tell everyone, I don't care," I'd still be reluctant to reveal it. You don't know the state of mind they're going through at that point and what consequences that could have. I wouldn't want to be the person responsible if they later regretted making that public. But we do know now and we know because of Meltzer, not Mauro, in a story that Mauro himself came out and publicly distanced himself from. That's just the facts of the matter.

thebostoncrab

Nopes

I bring up asking for where you read this simply because it was the case you pointed towards Meltzer leaning more towards a tabloid style, and all I’ve asked is “Where did he actually say that?” because there is a huge difference between reporting “JBL caused Mauro’s bipolar” vs “JBL bullied Mauro in the lead up to his breakdown”. It was a massive story when it broke and it didn’t take more than two minutes to find Meltzer’s original comments on the story, which didn’t focus on his bipolar but more on JBl’s treatment towards the man.

I’ve no issue with someone saying “I don’t rate Meltzer”, no one should “have” to enjoy the writings of the man, but if you are going to invite conversation on why his level of journalism is poor then of course if I’m on the other side of the fence in a conversation I’ll ask “Cool, can you show me where he said what you are claiming, because everything I have here is saying different”. No offense but I won’t change my mind just because you (or anyone, not singling you out) says “I heard him say this” without evidence, for any good debate, not just on the merits of a wrestling journalist.

I’ll happily admit that yes, lately Dave has let his personal biases come into his reporting from time to time, and I’m not a fan of that since I only want to hear that in his podcast, not his news reporting. But that doesn’t take away from taking his new items in higher regard towards being reality vs other journalists, since his sources are far reaching and his batting average surpasses so many others.