Thinking if giving up VHI

Former Observer

Thinking of giving up VHI. My parents have twenty years put into into it and I've another nine or ten. I don't see the point. Seems like a scam and philosophically I'm against private health insurance. Am I wrong? For the wage I'm on it's a big expense.

Stheno

Former Observer wrote: »

Thinking of giving up VHI. My parents have twenty years put into into it and I've another nine or ten. I don't see the point. Seems like a scam and philosophically I'm against private health insurance. Am I wrong? For the wage I'm on it's a big expense.

What age are you?

Former Observer

Stheno wrote: »

What age are you?

Early thirties.

TheValeyard

Former Observer wrote: »

Early thirties.

Probably heading into the age where you will start to actually need it.

Abba987

Gave it up years ago . Couldn't justify the cost. If I really need to be seen I'll camp out there until I am.

corner of hells

Former Observer wrote: »

Thinking of giving up VHI. My parents have twenty years put into into it and I've another nine or ten. I don't see the point. Seems like a scam and philosophically I'm against private health insurance. Am I wrong? For the wage I'm on it's a big expense.

Stick with it , you'll get pregnant eventually.

Its helped me to no end with my dyslexia.

meeeeh

Did you ever switch between providers or plans?

Personally I would not want to be without it. It's complete waste of money when you don't need it but essential whe you would be otherwise stuck on some waiting list for years.

BoroMan32

Just be thankful you're not getting full value for money from it.

kneemos

The day after you give it up you get hit by a truck.

Always the way.

Former Observer

meeeeh wrote: »

Did you ever switch between providers or plans?

Personally I would not want to be without it. It's complete waste of money when you don't need it but essential to avoid waiting times.

No I feel at the very least I need to shop around. I'm paying a fortune. As I say though, I kind of hate these cynical parasites blackmailing poor people and I'm not sure I want a part of it.

Still waters

corner of hells wrote: »

Stick with it , you'll get pregnant eventually.

Its helped me to no end with my dyslexia.

You now have full blown aids

ThreadedJarLid

TheValeyard wrote: »

Probably heading into the age where you will start to actually need it.

I normally lurk, registered just to post this. I was fit and healthy until diagnosed with a heart condition. Health insurance covered everything and I was seen very promptly. Definitely worth it from my perspective. Important to review every regularly though, just like gas, electricity, broadband, etc.

corner of hells

Still waters wrote: »

You now have full blown aids

Pardon, no my hearing is fine.

Former Observer

ThreadedJarLid wrote: »

I normally lurk, registered just to post this. I was fit and healthy until diagnosed with a heart condition. Health insurance covered everything and I was seen very promptly. Definitely worth it from my perspective. Important to review every regularly though, just like gas, electricity, broadband, etc.

Thanks for your contribution. I gather access to specialist was streamlined? Quality of medical practice is the same.

nullObjects

Former Observer wrote: »

I kind of hate these cynical parasites blackmailing poor people and I'm not sure I want a part of it.

What would you propose instead of the current system?

mvl

I'd only advise giving up on VHI once you get an employer that pays for another private health insurer, so you won't have to pay but are still insured.

Fr_Dougal

If you give it up and get sick, then decide to take it up again you’ll be looking at a 5 year waiting period of pre-existing conditions.

Former Observer

nullObjects wrote: »

What would you propose instead of the current system?

Umm... Universal healthcare based on taxation ?

It's hardly controversial to believe that wealthy people shouldn't have access to better healthcare than poorer people, I would have thought. Everybody should have to contribute to the same system. I feel the same about schooling.

meeeeh

Former Observer wrote: »

No I feel at the very least I need to shop around. I'm paying a fortune. As I say though, I kind of hate these cynical parasites blackmailing poor people and I'm not sure I want a part of it.

You have to change every two years or so. If you are on the same plan 8-10 years you are overpaying for what you are getting. I bet it's VHI plan B (or whatever it is called now) and your parents are on it for ever and you just continued on the same plan.

Lia_lia

I only have it because it’s paid by work (and me through BIK but anyway). Used it a few times for small things. But if I was paying the full whack myself it still would have been cheaper to just pay for the small things privately. I’m currently pregnant but going public as you still have to pay 3K odd even with insurance!

My close family have never had health insurance and always got on fine through the public system. And paid for private appointments here and there. It’s a tough call though as you never know really. The waiting times for some tests/procedures are crazy.

kneemos

Former Observer wrote: »

Umm... Universal healthcare based on taxation ?

It's hardly controversial to believe that wealthy people shouldn't have access to better healthcare than poorer people, I would have thought. Everybody should have to contribute to the same system. I feel the same about schooling.

Don't we already have universal health care based on taxation?
That's why so many are choosing private.

Gimme A Pound

Cancer or MS could hit anyone at any age - no amount of "that'd never happen to me" will change that. The young people who have been hit by same thought that way too.

So I'll keep paying it.

Abba987 wrote: »

Gave it up years ago . Couldn't justify the cost. If I really need to be seen I'll camp out there until I am.

Bless.

meeeeh

Former Observer wrote: »

Umm... Universal healthcare based on taxation ?

It's hardly controversial to believe that wealthy people shouldn't have access to better healthcare than poorer people, I would have thought. Everybody should have to contribute to the same system. I feel the same about schooling.

Not everyone agrees. European consumer Healthcare Index claims that health systems supported by different insurers tend to perform better.

Sephiroth_dude

Mod

Gonna move this to Banking and Insurance as I think its better suited there, please read charter before posting.

Nigel Fairservice

Former Observer wrote: »

Early thirties.

I had health insurance for most of my 20s. My general health was good. I was young and didn't foresee anything bad happening to me in the near to medium future. I thought I was spending too much money on health insurance so one year in my late 20s I didn't bother renewing it. I was diagnosed with MS not long after turning 30. It was a bolt out of the blue and I felt a right fool for not keeping my insurance. A year or two after my diagnosis I took out health insurance again but now I have a pre-existing condition and my MS will not be covered for 5 years (I have just over half of this time period covered now). Also, when I was without insurance cover I needed minor surgery. Insurance would have covered it straight away but I had to wait for a while for the surgery on the public system. It wasn't a pleasant wait on the public system. My mother needed the same surgery as I did but she got it straight away on her insurance. After being caught twice in quick succession I was very sorry I didn't keep up my insurance. My advice is to keep your health insurance.

dudara

The public system will take care of you if you have a true emergency.

But if you have a complaint that’s less serious, you could be waiting a long time. Or else you’ll have to shell out for private from your own pocket.

Insurance can help massively, and will help you feel better sooner, recover faster, have a better standard of care. I recently had to go to A&E. My doctor said to go private as my insurance covered it. I ended up needing a semi-cast which is made from some modern fibreglass, self-curing epoxy which is really light. Doc said that this is not available in the public sector as it costs more, so I would have ended up with a heavy, plaster of Paris cast.

lawred2

Those entry level plans that the insurers are selling on the back of government legislation to penalise those in their mid thirties are a scam. They cover nothing but take a handy premium so that you don't get any future policy levied.

Private in a public. That's meaningless. By the time I'm a public inpatient my healthcare is paid by the state anyway. So what is it that the insurer is covering when they say 2500 participating consultants?

Government and insurers hand in hand as per usual.

lawred2

Mr.S wrote: »

It's hardly a scam - you're paying for access to "private" healthcare benefits, it's a good thing you've never had to claim!

If you are young, a base plan should be sufficient enough and then upgrade as you get older or have a higher income.

If you need an outpatients referral, on the public system you could be waiting over a year for certain procedures. Private, you generally are seen within the week.



Private in a public hospital is a common plan, you basically get a smaller room on a ward (rather then say, a room with 10 people) and access to consultants (see above example) - a base plan is a base plan, it's not going to give you everything.

Once you're in the public system you get the same consultants as an inpatient.

And more often than not, private beds aren't available so you end up on a ward anyway.

gerard2210

Hi O.P
What plan are you on and how much are you paying?
Thankfully we have insurance, I never had to use it myself but the wife has made use of it on several occasions for surgery on her back and knees.
Her family suffer from arthritis, my wife was able to get her knees done very quickly, her sister needs her hips replaced, she might be waiting 4 or 5 years on the public system.
If you can afford it you should keep it.

mvl

dudara wrote: »

The public system will take care of you if you have a true emergency.
But if you have a complaint that’s less serious, you could be waiting a long time. Or else you’ll have to shell out for private from your own pocket.

I am not suggesting this is your meaning, but emergency only is not enough, serious cases can be found late - and we're not in some 3rd world country that has no healthcare services at all ...
Of course I have a personal discontentment - as I am on a 18/24 months waiting list for a specialist investigation for a genetic matter - and I am really confused how whoever analyzed "my case" is allowed to classify it as non urgent without even seeing me, when that genetic matter if confirmed would need special handling for life.
- Extremely frustrating, I couldn't rely only on public system here. Actually, while I have private insurance, in this case I decided to go abroad to investigate sooner.

ted1

corner of hells wrote: »

Stick with it , you'll get pregnant eventually.

Its helped me to no end with my dyslexia.

The mid wife domino scheme is better than going private and it’s free

Sleeper12

Former Observer wrote:

Early thirties.

You can give it up for a few years & rejoin without any loading. Very important though is to keep proof of the years that you had VHI.

It's a waste of money if you are young and healthy but as you hit middle age & beyond you start to need it more and more.

listermint

I have a top level policy via work.

But frankly it was crap for when I wanted some tests done. And I do mean crap.

Yes I got seen faster. But I ended up paying through the nose for the tests. Vhi gave me the run around in terms of covering the costs and were cynically trying to play down their percentage cover.

They are not helpful. Their job is to get the most money out of people and give you the run around should they make mistakes in your policy.

Subsequently they made another large error by not adding someone to the policy when they had emailed to say they did.

Overall pretty dam rubbish experience with them frankly.

lawred2

listermint wrote: »

I have a top level policy via work.

But frankly it was crap for when I wanted some tests done. And I do mean crap.

Yes I got seen faster. But I ended up paying through the nose for the tests. Vhi gave me the run around in terms of covering the costs and were cynically trying to play down their percentage cover.

They are not helpful. Their job is to get the most money out of people and give you the run around should they make mistakes in your policy.

Subsequently they made another large error by not adding someone to the policy when they had emailed to say they did.

Overall pretty dam rubbish experience with them frankly.

My wife had to get some tests done for cancer recently... She had the list of procedures and where she was scheduled to get them done. Rang VHI to ask what it is that they cover.. didn't get a straight answer. Surely it's a black or white matter.

lawred2

She's clear by the way..

But you should have seen their 'cancer commitment' in the brochure.

Our private health system is a stain on Irish governments.

listermint

lawred2 wrote: »

My wife had to get some tests done for cancer recently... She had the list of procedures and where she was scheduled to get them done. Rang VHI to ask what it is that they cover.. didn't get a straight answer. Surely it's a black or white matter.

Evasive bunch. I'm in no doubt it's mandated to confuse the cover as much as they can.

I phoned before going into see one of their own consultants and was told to pay up front

Then went to claim and was told I shouldn't have paid and that I had to claim back off consultant and then they reimburse them.


Nuts...

Abba987

Victor Incalculable Grapefruit wrote: »

Bless.

??

Abba987

As said domino is way better than any other plan when pregnant.

Also found that with vhi, always had trouble getting a straight answer on what was covered. Nothing it seemed in terms of outpatient tests.

You may have to fight your corner in the public system. I've made calls and sent in complaints if I felt I wasn't getting a good service. But overall I am well looked after

If you can afford it I guess why not. But i just can't justify it as an outgoing on the income I have now

As said do change provider and plans to get the best deal

Lia_lia

Domino is great but not suitable for everyone. Only offered in some hospitals and you have to be living within a certain distance of the hospital. I was on it but was kicked off due to having gestional diabetes. Saying that I’m still glad I went public. Getting loads of extra scans etc for nothing!

meeeeh

For me private maternity isn't essential at all. Nobody will put you on waiting list when having a baby but if you are on the waiting list for hip replacement, knee surgery or colonoscopy you might be very happy if you have private insurance. I didn't overly need to avail of private insurance except getting private room but OH could skip a few ques for procedures and consultant appointments.

Gimme A Pound

Abba987 wrote: »

??

The naivety of saying you'd camp outside until you're seen. You'd expect them to skip you past people? You'd be able for camping out that long even if seriously ill?

Health insurance here costs way less than in other first world countries.

ste

I have private health ins. I'd recommend anyone who can should get insurance. Without going into personal experience some things good private health gets is

- quicker access to many diagnostic tests
- quicker access to outpatient consultants - which ties into point 1
- more comfortable accommodation if inpatient in one of the more modern private facilities, eg. Private room
- quicker access for elective surgeries /procedures

If you get seriously ill or acute issue public care will be on par, but it's all about not getting to that stage. Outcome will almost always be better with quicker intervention.

Private health for me in Ireland means quicker earlier access to consultants, diagnostics and surgery/intervention if required.

My 2c

Still waters

Money talks and the poor can go and fcuk themselves is the medical view in Ireland

Gimme A Pound

Still waters wrote: »

Money talks and the poor can go and fcuk themselves is the medical view in Ireland

The poor have medical cards. Where is the money supposed to come from that meets the costs paid for by insurance?

BarryD2

Former Observer wrote: »

Thinking of giving up VHI. My parents have twenty years put into into it and I've another nine or ten. I don't see the point. Seems like a scam and philosophically I'm against private health insurance. Am I wrong? For the wage I'm on it's a big expense.

Problem with VHI and health insurance generally is that it's marketed like a pension scheme - put yer money in now and benefit when you're older, that's the mantra.

But and it's a big but, it's actually sold like car or house insurance on an annual basis. Once they get their claws into you and you've paid several years contributions, it becomes harder and harder to justify pulling out. Because once you do, you lose whatever status you've accrued and have to start again if you wish to re enter. So in that sense, it is a 'scam'. You're only ever as good as your last annual contribution, regardless of what you've paid over the decades.

If it really like a pension scheme, I'd have no problem - put some money in this year, can't afford it next - then take a break, carry on the following and so on.

Wheety

BarryD2 wrote: »

Problem with VHI and health insurance generally is that it's marketed like a pension scheme - put yer money in now and benefit when you're older, that's the mantra.

But and it's a big but, it's actually sold like car or house insurance on an annual basis. Once they get their claws into you and you've paid several years contributions, it becomes harder and harder to justify pulling out. Because once you do, you lose whatever status you've accrued and have to start again if you wish to re enter. So in that sense, it is a 'scam'. You're only ever as good as your last annual contribution, regardless of what you've paid over the decades.

If it really like a pension scheme, I'd have no problem - put some money in this year, can't afford it next - then take a break, carry on the following and so on.

But you could need it tomorrow.

Sheep Shagger

It's like all insurance - you are buying protection should you need it, it might seem like a waste but....

If your decision is cost driven then review your policy and just get a basic one (look at other companies). Ring VHI and ask them for a comparative policy from their corporate range (they have to offer this even of you are not a corporate customer).

The regulator website is also a good starting point (the hia dot ie.)

.......

lawred2 wrote: »

Once you're in the public system you get the same consultants as an inpatient.

This used to be true but my last 2 orthopediac consultants have given up their public jobs and only do private now.

I dont know if its the same in other areas.

I used to go public for orthopediacs in Tallaght throughout my 20s and every single appointment I had to re-explain the situation to some guy Id never met who didnt speak english well and they would fob me off til the next appointment.

Eventually I just stopped going and when the situation suddenly drastically dis-improved I went private and was on the operating table 3 weeks later.

.......

lawred2 wrote: »

My wife had to get some tests done for cancer recently... She had the list of procedures and where she was scheduled to get them done. Rang VHI to ask what it is that they cover.. didn't get a straight answer. Surely it's a black or white matter.

I had murder with them over the exact same thing.

A constant non answering of a straightforward question.

PHG

lawred2 wrote: »

She's clear by the way..

But you should have seen their 'cancer commitment' in the brochure.

Our private health system is a stain on Irish governments.

This... Not everything is the government's fault and I am not aligned to a party. Maybe you should have asked for the operators manager to clear it up what was covered.

My mother has stage 4 cancer and vhi has been great. I have had 12 procedures on my spine, no issues claiming and usually seen and operated on within 3 weeks. Have been seen within a week twice. Do I have to pay for consultants, yes but I couldn't give a crap. I am delighted for the 2 tier health service here as it means I am fast tracked. Is it unfair, yes, do I care that I skip the queue, never! Been insured in UK too and the private ones only pay to bring you back to a standard way of living.

I have other issues that kept me in hospital for 5 weeks and had a semi private room within 2 days. The auld lad had a quad heart bypass in 4 working days after his private check up showed issues.

In my view it is worth it and easing back on a night out a month.

lawred2

PHG wrote: »

This... Not everything is the government's fault and I am not aligned to a party. Maybe you should have asked for the operators manager to clear it up what was covered.

My mother has stage 4 cancer and vhi has been great. I have had 12 procedures on my spine, no issues claiming and usually seen and operated on within 3 weeks. Have been seen within a week twice. Do I have to pay for consultants, yes but I couldn't give a crap. I am delighted for the 2 tier health service here as it means I am fast tracked. Is it unfair, yes, do I care that I skip the queue, never! Been insured in UK too and the private ones only pay to bring you back to a standard way of living.

I have other issues that kept me in hospital for 5 weeks and had a semi private room within 2 days. The auld lad had a quad heart bypass in 4 working days after his private check up showed issues.

In my view it is worth it and easing back on a night out a month.

Two tier health system where the public system is one of the worst rated in Europe is 100% the fault of Irish governments..

Who else is at fault?