Why is non alcoholic beer as expensive as regular?

Xcellor

Pubs seem to be charging the same as regular beer despite what I would imagine is less duty etc?

the beer revolu

It generally costs more to make but, yes, the lack of duty should more than offset this cost.

The real answer : because people are willing to pay that much.

Prospector1989

Fairly certain you'll be refused if you try to buy a bottle in the supermarket before 12:30 on a Sunday as well.

Always Tired

Because the legalized drug dealers, sorry, pub owners don't want it biting into their bottom line.

If you drink the NA beer, you're not going to have too many in the first place. It doesn't have that 'moreish' effect normal beer does. And they don't taste as nice. Some are better than others but even the nicer ones you can taste the difference. And when there's no buzz coming theres little reason to horse them into ya.

And they don't want to create any extra incentive for people to switch to that, on top of the above reasons. They want people to drink piss, charge a fiver a glass, turf you out the door once you've been sufficiently poisoned and they have your dosh, and they don't give a toss about you other than that. If you want to make a healthy choice for your mind and body thats fine with them as long as you still spend a ridiculous amount on whatever swill they're slinging.

I hope that alcohol free bar does well. I don't live in Dublin but I'm going to check it out next month when I go up. Surely they will have some more inspiring options, and anyway you wont feel the need to have some type of green bottle or frothy glass to not stick out.

Greed, pure and simple.

Same as why a half pint costs roughly 70-80% the price of a full pint, instead of 50%. Because they want your money, and they'll do all they can to get it.

Want to just have a glass of coke? Sorry bud, we only have them tiny glass bottles for €2.75 each (which happens to be 400% profit for me, incidentally) so a pint of that is dearer than a proper pint.

Pint of mi-wadi, you say? That'll be 3 times the price I've paid for the full bottle of undiluted stuff, my good man, thank you very much.

The VFI and publicans in general are an absolute racket in this country. It is thanks to them that it is impossible to get cans after 10pm, that bottles of wine are €2 dearer than they should be and that cans and bottles from the offos will follow suit in the next 18 months.

They'll plead the poor mouth when things aren't going their way and say that they're all in favour of measures to curb problem drinking and drink driving and all that jazz. How many pubs signed up to that designated driver campaign with the free soft drinks last Christmas? Was it fewer than 10, or something?

BeerNut

Deleted User wrote: »

The VFI and publicans in general are an absolute racket in this country.

One which the drinking public is largely fine with. We choose to drink a higher proportion of our beer in pubs (65%) than every country in Europe except Portugal.

L1011

In Portugal, there's a pub or two in every hamlet and it costs equivalent of ~2.50 a pint outside of tourist traps even in the big cities.. Licencing laws being the big difference there.

I go to an event in Portugal every year and the usual place I stay is ~5km outside a medium sized town - there's two "villages" on the way that have lost their shops to falling trade and both still have pubs; in Ireland the last pub often goes before the last shop.

Adyx

Heineken 0.0 is almost the same price as regular Heineken wholesale but of course it's all the greedy publican's fault.

That's practically brand new and has been the subject of a widespread advertising campaign in recent months. Not surprised it's similarly priced to regular Heineken in the off licence and supermarket.

What about a more established n/a beer like, say, Erdinger? Would you be surprised to find out its twice as expensive, per litre, as the alcohol version?

https://m.tesco.ie/mt/www.tesco.ie/groceries/product/search/default.aspx?searchBox=Erdinger&un_jtt_redirect

Show me a pub that sells it for half price, so.

Masala

And you can't buy it on tap... bottles only. Another ripoff!!

Xcellor

The drink driving laws are being blamed for the demise of rural pubs, pubs should be pushing non-alcoholic alternatives to encourage the 1 or 2 pint people to keep going to the pubs.

With the nice sunny weather I really enjoy a pint when I'm out and about and hate sugary ****e so a non-alcoholic beer is a great alternative (not enough choice though and requires more options) but being charged almost 10 euros to get a pint of the stuff is nonsense!!!

the beer revolu

Masala wrote: »

And you can't buy it on tap... bottles only. Another ripoff!!

That's a really dumb comment.

Publicans generally make a better margin on keg beer. If there was a big enough demand for na beer, it would be on tap.
It's not on tap because there is low demand for na beer.

Would you be happier drinking keg na beer knowing that the ripoff merchant is making a better margin???

irish_goat

the beer revolu wrote: »

That's a really dumb comment.

Publicans generally make a better margin on keg beer. If there was a big enough demand for na beer, it would be on tap.
It's not on tap because there is low demand for na beer.

Would you be happier drinking keg na beer knowing that the ripoff merchant is making a better margin???

I think his point is that, 'per ml', bottles cost a lot more than pints.

Estrella Galicia 0.0 was on tap at one stage recently (maybe at The Bank?)as the only non-alc beer on tap in Ireland, but it seemed to be a one off.

The Specialist

Serious question to those who buy NA beer - why?? What is the actual point of it?

rubadub

The Specialist wrote: »

Serious question to those who buy NA beer - why?? What is the actual point of it?

Do you get the point of people drinking coke? apple juice?

And it is typically a lot cheaper per ml than those are in a pub.

the beer revolu

irish_goat wrote: »

I think his point is that, 'per ml', bottles cost a lot more than pints..

Yes but it's not deliberately not put on tap to rip people off as I understood the comment to be suggesting.

granturismo

Non alcoholic beer costs more to produce than regular. There is the cost of any additional processes to reduce the alcohol content. I've no idea what % this adds to the production cost, compared to any duty cost forgone.

The Specialist

rubadub wrote: »

Do you get the point of people drinking coke? apple juice?

And it is typically a lot cheaper per ml than those are in a pub.

Yeah of course, if you're not drinking then coke or apple juice would be quite normal. I just don't get the point of NA - you don't drink beer for the taste do you? It would be the same as THC free weed - nobody smokes it for the taste but the effect. Maybe I'm just too set in my ways and views but it just seems like a waste of money to be drinking something meant to have an effect without that effect.

rubadub

The Specialist wrote: »

you don't drink beer for the taste do you?

I do, and know plenty who would have a single pint in a restaurant and that would be it, and not since they are driving.

Plenty don't I remember a guy in work shocked that I had a pint with food, saying he drank bud as it was the most flavourless beer he could find.

I see lads in pubs buy 2 cokes at a time and down pints of it all night, don't think I could manage that, very heavy on the wallet too.

The Specialist wrote: »

It would be the same as THC free weed - nobody smokes it for the taste but the effect.

Plenty smoke CBD weed and I presume it is for the taste (as well as medicinal effects) as you can get it in oil form and I guess it is cheaper to buy the oil.

Amirani

The Specialist wrote: »

Yeah of course, if you're not drinking then coke or apple juice would be quite normal. I just don't get the point of NA - you don't drink beer for the taste do you?

I absolutely drink beer for the taste.

OleRodrigo

Been drinking Koppaberg NA strawberry and lime cider from Tesco, its absolutely delish. 1.75 a bottle.

listermint

The Specialist wrote: »

Yeah of course, if you're not drinking then coke or apple juice would be quite normal. I just don't get the point of NA - you don't drink beer for the taste do you? It would be the same as THC free weed - nobody smokes it for the taste but the effect. Maybe I'm just too set in my ways and views but it just seems like a waste of money to be drinking something meant to have an effect without that effect.

Did you stumble into the wrong forum......

clevtrev

not a big fan of NA beer myself but if I am driving and have the option of drinking 3 cokes or 3 NA beers then it would be the beer everytime. Apart the sweetness of the coke, fanta or apple juice which I dont enjoy it also means "I fit in with the in crowd" having a beer withouth the alcohol!

OleRodrigo

Interesting thing about alcohol and taste - its actually a mild poison that the body initially rejects. Much like nicotine in cigarettes tastes awful but then grows on the smoker until they start to love the smell and taste.

But if they stop for a period of time, the taste buds reset back to their default setting.

So, to continue enjoying the taste of booze, you gotta keep on drinking :pac:.

jasper100

Deleted User wrote: »

Want to just have a glass of coke? Sorry bud, we only have them tiny glass bottles for €2.75 each (which happens to be 400% profit for me, incidentally) so a pint of that is dearer than a proper pint.

Selling at €2.75 gives about 60% profit. That does not include the barmans wages, ice, slice of lemon, clean toilets, insurance, rates, heat, maintenance etc. etc.

To suggest its 400% is just ridiculous.

Del2005

clevtrev wrote: »

not a big fan of NA beer myself but if I am driving and have the option of drinking 3 cokes or 3 NA beers then it would be the beer everytime. Apart the sweetness of the coke, fanta or apple juice which I dont enjoy it also means "I fit in with the in crowd" having a beer withouth the alcohol!

If I'm driving I'll have water and couldn't give a feck what the crowd thinks. They are usually happy for the lift regardless.

Any NA beer I've tried has been horrible. But I've tried plenty of horrible A beers so maybe I just haven't found the nice NA ones, but I just don't see the point of NA beer so won't try.

antodeco

The Specialist wrote: »

Serious question to those who buy NA beer - why?? What is the actual point of it?

Erdinger Non-Alcoholic is a really tasty drink when cold. Very malty. Nice drink to have 2 or 3 bottles with. Like a malt milkshake. Heineken 0.0 tastes very similar to normal heineken, which is gicky, so Ive avoided that. Will need to try the Estrella NA and see what its like.

The wife is going in to check out the alcohol free bar. Ive read write ups of it, and it looks really good. I hope it survives and does well. I like a good cocktail, but after 2 or 3, you are sugared out and boozed up enough to make you feel someway nauseous.

Masala

the beer revolu wrote: »

That's a really dumb comment.

Publicans generally make a better margin on keg beer. If there was a big enough demand for na beer, it would be on tap.
It's not on tap because there is low demand for na beer.

Would you be happier drinking keg na beer knowing that the ripoff merchant is making a better margin???

Whats dumb about it...... I dont want to pay €5 for a bottle of beer Alcoholic or otherwise when I get double the amount in a pint glass for the same price.

And I dont give a **** what margin the publican makes. I just care what it costs me out of my pocket.

the beer revolu

Masala wrote: »

Whats dumb about it...... I dont want to pay €5 for a bottle of beer Alcoholic or otherwise when I get double the amount in a pint glass for the same price.

And I dont give a **** what margin the publican makes. I just care what it costs me out of my pocket.

Double? Really?
Where are you paying €5 for half pint or 25cl bottles of na beer?

Here's an idea:
Don't buy it.
No one ripping you off then.

Anteayer

If only I could find a non alcoholic and gluten free beer. Basically, I'm looking for a glass of water that has some kind of vague flavour and isn't full of sugar or sweeteners.

Some of the artisan ciders are quite nice but I can't drink Bulmers, but none of those are non-alcoholic. I usually end up just drinking sparkling water if I'm out and have to drive.

spurshero

You have to laugh the way people seem to think every euro a publican takes goes into there own pocket . I guarantee most people giving out on these type of threads are in a job where they get paid weekly and are not the ones paying others . Running any kind of business now espicially pubs and resteraunts the costs are gone massive . Rates insurance tv costs food staff costs are all gone through the roof . A lot more pins closed then opened over the last 10 years and that will continue . Ok you have some pubs in Dublin cork Galway etc that are doing very well but that’s the exception rather then the rule

tayto lover

L1011 wrote: »

In Portugal, there's a pub or two in every hamlet and it costs equivalent of ~2.50 a pint outside of tourist traps even in the big cities.. Licencing laws being the big difference there.

I go to an event in Portugal every year and the usual place I stay is ~5km outside a medium sized town - there's two "villages" on the way that have lost their shops to falling trade and both still have pubs; in Ireland the last pub often goes before the last shop.

Beautiful pints of local beer (can’t remember the name of it) for 1.80 euro in Lisbon last summer.

jasper100

spurshero wrote: »

You have to laugh the way people seem to think every euro a publican takes goes into there own pocket . I guarantee most people giving out on these type of threads are in a job where they get paid weekly and are not the ones paying others . Running any kind of business now espicially pubs and resteraunts the costs are gone massive . Rates insurance tv costs food staff costs are all gone through the roof . A lot more pins closed then opened over the last 10 years and that will continue . Ok you have some pubs in Dublin cork Galway etc that are doing very well but that’s the exception rather then the rule

+1

Here is a fine pub for €110K. Nothing to stop any of these dreamers taking the plunge and making their fortune.


https://www.daft.ie/cavan/commercial-property-for-sale/restaurant-hotel-bar-for-sale/the-duckin-stool-main-street-belturbet-cavan-847193/

Wheety

The Barge charge €4 for Heineken alcohol free

JustJoe7240

jasper100 wrote: »

Selling at €2.75 gives about 60% profit. That does not include the barmans wages, ice, slice of lemon, clean toilets, insurance, rates, heat, maintenance etc. etc.

To suggest its 400% is just ridiculous.

Poster you quote was clearly talking about price to buy v price to sell. No need to be so pedantic

Pub I work In sells bottles of Heineken 0.0 at 4.20 and regulars at 6.00

n97 mini

the beer revolu wrote: »

That's a really dumb comment.

Publicans generally make a better margin on keg beer. If there was a big enough demand for na beer, it would be on tap.
It's not on tap because there is low demand for na beer.

Would you be happier drinking keg na beer knowing that the ripoff merchant is making a better margin???

Kinda contradictory. Publicans are trying to match their bottle margins with their draught margins, which makes bottles expensive in pubs. Bottles cost more to produce, hence the higher wholesale price.

n97 mini

granturismo wrote: »

Non alcoholic beer costs more to produce than regular. There is the cost of any additional processes to reduce the alcohol content. I've no idea what % this adds to the production cost, compared to any duty cost forgone.

This is not true with the latest practices. A low gravity (less malt, so cheaper) beer is brewed and is fermented with a yeast that barely ferments at all, but produces esters etc, which contribute to flavour.

Pure Brew from Guinness is produced this way (it's not the only one) and the reduced excise and production costs are reflected by the cost of a pint in the Open Gate, ie significantly cheaper.

Adyx

Deleted User wrote: »

That's practically brand new and has been the subject of a widespread advertising campaign in recent months. Not surprised it's similarly priced to regular Heineken in the off licence and supermarket.

What about a more established n/a beer like, say, Erdinger? Would you be surprised to find out its twice as expensive, per litre, as the alcohol version?

https://m.tesco.ie/mt/www.tesco.ie/groceries/product/search/default.aspx?searchBox=Erdinger&un_jtt_redirect

Show me a pub that sells it for half price, so.

That's €7 for 6 bottles vs €3.19 for 1 bottle. Litre prices are n/a 3.54/l vs regular 6.38/l.

jasper100

jasper100 wrote: »

Selling at €2.75 gives about 60% profit. That does not include the barmans wages, ice, slice of lemon, clean toilets, insurance, rates, heat, maintenance etc. etc.

To suggest its 400% is just ridiculous.

The "400%" in my post is a link to an article where I got the figure from, though I did use "profit" instead of "markup", so apologies for the mistake.

Adyx

Adyx wrote: »

That's €7 for 6 bottles vs €3.19 for 1 bottle. Litre prices are n/a 3.54/l vs regular 6.38/l.

Yes, I was using the price per litre, which is 85% of an increase.....almost double the price, no?

jasper100

Deleted User wrote: »

The "400%" in my post is a link to an article where I got the figure from, though I did use "profit" instead of "markup", so apologies for the mistake.

Big difference between 60% and 400% profit.

Do you consider 60% gross profit excessive, before all costs are taken out, heat, light, insurance, wages, security, ice, sky sports, cleaners, income tax, accountant, maintenance, advertising, musicians etc.?

What gross profit do you think the pub should make?

BrokenArrows

The Specialist wrote: »

you don't drink beer for the taste do you?

Yes, i think most people do.
On occasion Ill buy non alcoholic beer and drink a few cans because it tastes nice.
If im wandering around town i might just stop in for a single beer for the taste.

If you're only reason for drinking is to get smashed then you might need to consider what you're doing.

Id say 95% of the time I drink I don't get drunk.

jasper100

jasper100 wrote: »

Big difference between 60% and 400% profit.

Do you consider 60% gross profit excessive, before all costs are taken out, heat, light, insurance, wages, security, ice, sky sports, cleaners, income tax, accountant, maintenance, advertising, musicians etc.?

What gross profit do you think the pub should make?

Pardon my ignorance, but I'm confused........where are you pulling 60% from? How does a 400% mark-up translate to 60% profit?

jasper100

Deleted User wrote: »

Pardon my ignorance, but I'm confused........where are you pulling 60% from? How does a 400% mark-up translate to 60% profit?

Nett cost €0.55

Nett sale price €2.23

Markup €1.68

Gross Profit = €1.68/€2.75 = 61.3%

a) that's a mark-up of 300%, not 400 and
b) I think your profit calculation is flawed based on a)

https://www.omnicalculator.com/finance/markup

Entering your cost of €0.55 and a markup of 407% into that link, you get a revenue of €2.79 and a profit of €2.24 (or 80%).

80% of each and every bottle of coke sold is pure profit. And yes, I do think that is excessive, especially given the 407% mark-up is an average figure.

jasper100

Deleted User wrote: »

a) that's a mark-up of 300%, not 400 and
b) I think your profit calculation is flawed based on a)

https://www.omnicalculator.com/finance/markup

Entering your cost of €0.55 and a markup of 407% into that link, you get a revenue of €2.79 and a profit of €2.24 (or 80%).

80% of each and every bottle of coke sold is pure profit. And yes, I do think that is excessive, especially given the 407% mark-up is an average figure.

Absolute nonsense. For starters the government takes 23% vat off the top, so the pub really sells it for €2.23, not €2.75.


Then there are all the costs involved, insurance, rates, heat, light, wages, security, accountant, musicians, wages, IMRO, cleaners, maintenance, advertising, theft, rent, waste etc. etc.


Its obvious you have never run a business if you think all 407% markups and "80% pure profit"

Gavin "shels"

Article today in the Indo on the topic... obviosuly they read Boards :pac:

https://www.independent.ie/life/food-drink/sobering-thought-why-are-boozefree-drinks-so-expensive-38116266.html

jasper100

jasper100 wrote: »

Absolute nonsense. For starters the government takes 23% vat off the top, so the pub really sells it for €2.23, not €2.75.

I'm using your figures, pal, which were all net?

Nobody is denying that the Govt. take a huge slice out of the price paid for a pint. It is absolutely galling that you are defending somebody charging 4 times the price they initially paid for a product, saying they need to do so to pay the bills.

As an aside, IMRO are an absolute joke and anybody who willingly pays them anything deserves to go out of business.

jasper100

Deleted User wrote: »

I'm using your figures, pal, which were all net?

Nobody is denying that the Govt. take a huge slice out of the price paid for a pint. It is absolutely galling that you are defending somebody charging 4 times the price they initially paid for a product, saying they need to do so to pay the bills.

As an aside, IMRO are an absolute joke and anybody who willingly pays them anything deserves to go out of business.

The best thing you can do is open your own business and make your fortune.

I recommend you sell tea. You can buy the teabags for €0.01 and sell it for €1, markup 9900%!!!!

Get Real

tayto lover wrote: »

Beautiful pints of local beer (can’t remember the name of it) for 1.80 euro in Lisbon last summer.

Was it Superbock? We were in Lisbon recently and in the supermarket, 10 bottles were 8euro.

Yet in a local bar (small cafe run by a husband and wife) they were a euro a go. They were ice cold too and I imagined if living there, it's apmost as cheap to drink in your local as it is in your sitting room.

It had a real "cheers" vibe. People popping down from their apartments from upstairs, a bottle or two, read of the paper, chat about the football, and back upstairs.

It almost felt like the cafe was part of this couple's home, and you were merely contributing to the cost of some supermarket bottles in their gaf, while they sat at your table and had a coffee or beer with you.

In a capital city in Europe, that type of set up is dead.

jasper100

jasper100 wrote: »

The best thing you can do is open your own business and make your fortune.

I recommend you sell tea. You can buy the teabags for €0.01 and sell it for €1, markup 9900%!!!!

You jest, but if i had the startup cash (and a licence) a pub would be my first choice. A tea/coffee station would be number two on the list, followed by a pizza parlour.