Smoke signals versus rural broadband - better bang for buck?

KikiLaRue

is_that_so wrote: »

I don't think there is much disagreement about the need for it but what is under question is how the process was run and whether it will actually be the most efficient use of funds.

Ah I totally get that, but there are a few on here saying it’s not worth pursuing at all
“So a few boggers can get Netflix and pornhub”

Atoms for Peace

Pkiernan wrote: »

Here we go. The far left telling us we all need to cram ourselves into dirty, polluted, crime ridden cities.

No thanks.

There is a compromise solution. How about we first supply fibre broadband to villages and small towns while incentive people to move to rural villages rather than a one off house.

Gary kk

Atoms for Peace wrote: »

There is a compromise solution. How about we first supply fibre broadband to villages and small towns while incentive people to move to rural villages rather than a one off house.

A hey get real.How about we get people in Dublin to move cork to easy the housing crisis in Dublin. It's so easy I can't believe no one else though of it

KikiLaRue

Gary kk wrote: »

A hey get real.How about we get people in Dublin to move cork to easy the housing crisis in Dublin. It's so easy I can't believe no one else though of it

Is this a joke?

The housing crisis is almost as bad in Dublin as it is in Cork?

whisky_galore

KikiLaRue wrote: »

Is this a joke?

The housing crisis is almost as bad in Dublin as it is in Cork?

Just someone talking out of their hoop, as is so often the case.

Gary kk

whisky_galore wrote: »

Just someone talking out of their hoop, as is so often the case.

It's a joke

Atoms for Peace

Atoms for Peace wrote: »

There is a compromise solution. How about we first supply fibre broadband to villages and small towns while incentive people to move to rural villages rather than a one off house.

Because lots of people don’t want to live in towns or estates they want their own private house which isn’t tiny and has lots of private outside space not stuck to a neighbor. Lots of people also build rurally as they own the land and want to live next to family trying to force these to live where they don’t want to live us ninsess.

It’s a disgrace that fiber BB hasn’t already been rolled out to all areas, farms need it to begin with and serving farms means you will pass by pretty much every other house also so you might as well connect them.

If they just paid eir to do it rather than this nonsense scheme then a lot of the county would be covered. Eir’s idiotic roll out was a disgrace they run the fiber to a few houses and stop and move into the next road, it would have been so quick for them to cover all the houses in the areas they just connected up a few houses. They stopped the fiber 200 meters from my house leaving half the houses without BB and the half with it on the road, it would have taken them a few hours to finish it in the road and they have done the same on all the roads off the main road the the area. The thing is there would have been a higher uptake from the houses they didn’t connect compared to the ones they did so it was stupid by them also.

Anyone giving out about this is a Dub where all the investment and money goes to in this county so their opinion isn’t worth even considering.

whisky_galore

Gary kk wrote: »

It's a joke

Remind us when to laugh.

snotboogie

Nobody knows what “rural Ireland” is, so politicians are making hay off our terrible knowledge of our own demographics. Supplying every town in the country with broadband is absolutely no issue, supplying every McMansion in the state with fiberoptic is madness. “Rural Ireland” if you mean outside Dublin, Cork, Limerick, Galway and Waterford, will be saved by people moving back to the towns which are being deserted in favor of one off houses.

snotboogie

Hallie Noisy Geology wrote: »

Because lots of people don’t want to live in towns or estates they want their own private house which isn’t tiny and has lots of private outside space not stuck to a neighbor. Lots of people also build rurally as they own the land and want to live next to family trying to force these to live where they don’t want to live us ninsess.

If you want a massive McMansion and are so anti community that you “don’t want to be stuck next to a neighbor” you shouldn’t expect the state to bankrupt itself to provide your one off house with urban services

Pkiernan

snotboogie wrote: »

If you want a massive McMansion and are so anti community that you “don’t want to be stuck next to a neighbor” you shouldn’t expect the state to bankrupt itself to provide your one off house with urban services

We also shouldn't expect the State to bankroll a 20 billion euro per year Welfare bill, but a lot of lefties have no issue with that.

M5

M5 wrote: »

5g will not be faster or better than fiber optic. That article is from 2013,in tech terms that's jurassic!

And yet, and yet... People are claiming with apparent certainty that the proposed broadband infrastructure will be future-proofed for 35 years.

By the time the last National Broadband Scheme was up and running, it was already obsolete.

This isn't an argument against doing anything, in case it becomes obsolete. It's just that people (particularly Government ministers currently in the middle of an election campaign) are claiming all kinds of certainties about it, when senior civil service servants are essentially telling them it doesn't make sense.

If we must invest all of these billions in such a dubious project, can we not at least own it? Can we not at least see what GMC are putting into it? The whole thing seems like a Tribunal in its embryo stage.

The high horse brigade

We got 30 years of tech advancement on the copper network from 56k to a hundred megabits per second and it will be the same for fibre. Fibre is in its infancy. To get faster speeds you just change the optics either end.

Gary kk

whisky_galore wrote: »

Remind us when to laugh.

About now

snotboogie

snotboogie wrote: »

If you want a massive McMansion and are so anti community that you “don’t want to be stuck next to a neighbor” you shouldn’t expect the state to bankrupt itself to provide your one off house with urban services

Anyone using the term “McMansion” cannot be taken seriously.

3 billion spread over many years is pocket change, about 500 million of which is going straight back in vat so it’s really only 2.5 billion to begin with for a vital infracture that every house hold should have. People who want to live rurally are as entitled to fiber BB as anyone in a city.

snotboogie

Hallie Noisy Geology wrote: »

Anyone using the term “McMansion” cannot be taken seriously.

3 billion spread over many years is pocket change, about 500 million of which is going straight back in vat so it’s really only 2.5 billion to begin with for a vital infracture that every house hold should have. People who want to live rurally are as entitled to fiber BB as anyone in a city.

You do understand that the cost per house is higher the lower the density? “City” is a red herring, there are hundreds of towns all over the country that should have fiber broadband, that doesn’t mean that every McMansion is entitled to it, especially at a subsidy of up to 20k per house. 3 billion is pocket change? That’s your excuse?

The high horse brigade

Hallie Noisy Geology wrote: »

Anyone using the term “McMansion” cannot be taken seriously.

3 billion spread over many years is pocket change, about 500 million of which is going straight back in vat so it’s really only 2.5 billion to begin with for a vital infracture that every house hold should have. People who want to live rurally are as entitled to fiber BB as anyone in a city.

It's also 550M of contingency funding for a disaster like a hurricane taking out lots of the network. So in reality is only 2Billion.

I agree with you, money will spent. I'm sick and tired of this I'm alright Jack attitude filling these threads on here. Broadband is as essential as running water, electricity and flushing toilets.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

Hallie Noisy Geology wrote: »

Anyone using the term “McMansion” cannot be taken seriously.

3 billion spread over many years is pocket change, about 500 million of which is going straight back in vat so it’s really only 2.5 billion to begin with for a vital infracture that every house hold should have. People who want to live rurally are as entitled to fiber BB as anyone in a city.

The term ‘McMansion’ doesn’t mean just any big house. Some large houses and mansions are elegantly designed. McMansions are large houses or mansions that are external eyesores. Small houses can be eyesores too of course but because they’re small, they don’t stick out so much. McMansions have all kinds of ugly appendages and/or rooflines because what the occupier wants internally can’t be reconciled with a pleasing exterior.

whisky_galore

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

The term ‘McMansion’ doesn’t mean just any big house. Some large houses and mansions are elegantly designed. McMansions are large houses or mansions that are external eyesores. Small houses can be eyesores too of course but because they’re small, they don’t stick out so much. McMansions have all kinds of ugly appendages and/or rooflines because what the occupier wants internally can’t be reconciled with a pleasing exterior.

A large modern ugly home the size of a small hotel with a handful of humans residing within. Like the Anglo Irish mansions of old but without any class or other redeeming features.

Gary kk

A lot of hate there guys did some rural person run over a pet when you where small

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

whisky_galore wrote: »

A large modern ugly home the size of a small hotel with a handful of humans residing within. Like the Anglo Irish mansions of old but without any class or other redeeming features.

That’s it. At least some of those old Anglo-Irish mansions were aesthetically pleasing. And indeed, I’ve seen the odd nice modern one. But so many of the one-off large houses built these days are arse-ugly.

John_Rambo

Hallie Noisy Geology wrote: »

Anyone giving out about this is a Dub where all the investment and money goes to in this county so their opinion isn’t worth even considering.

Any investment in Dublin comes from the city of Dublin. And indeed more investment is needed in the capital. Don't forget about 10 billion a year is diverted out of the city to subsidise rural areas that would struggle without. And rightly so, this isn't a problem. It's the same all over the world. Cities are the cultural and economic hubs of all modern countries.

The high horse brigade wrote: »

We got 30 years of tech advancement on the copper network from 56k to a hundred megabits per second and it will be the same for fibre. Fibre is in its infancy. To get faster speeds you just change the optics either end.

Excellent & valid point. This is a brave and bold move from the government. Naughton has to be admired, it's basically the deal he brokered with little or no changes with an extended release date to garner rural votes for FG.
There's amusing veiled threats of it not happening if FG aren't leading the country in the future, so interesting times ahead regarding this project.

Gary kk

John_Rambo wrote: »

Any investment in Dublin comes from the city of Dublin. And indeed more investment is needed in the capital. Don't forget about 10 billion a year is diverted out of the city to subsidise rural areas that would struggle without. And rightly so, this isn't a problem. It's the same all over the world. Cities are the cultural and economic hubs of all modern countries.



Excellent & valid point. This is a brave and bold move from the government. Naughton has to be admired, it's basically the deal he brokered with little or no changes with an extended release date to garner rural votes for FG.
There's amusing veiled threats of it not happening if FG aren't leading the country in the future, so interesting times ahead regarding this project.

I am not sure where the 10 billion figure is coming from I tried to find this out on government sites but I can't if you could share the link that would be great. Thanks

Anteayer

Equivalent money was spent in the 80s bringing modern phone services to remote areas.

I agree though that we have way too much unsustainable development.

At the end of the day the decision to subsidize it is a democratic one. The Irish dream seems to be living in an isolated house down a boreen with no facilities or neighbours.

I'd love to know how these post 1960s one off housing dwellers cope in old age when driving becomes an issue. We've an awful lot of rural isolation for no particular reason other than ppl not thinking beyond their 60s.

That being said, we've done a fine job of making the towns and cities far less attractive than they should be due to the equally bad urban planning.

Discodog

OneEightSeven wrote: »

Eircom rolled out fibre to 350k one-off houses and the take-up rate is only 20%. There are many vacant and holiday homes in remote parts of the West, so the take-up rate for the NBP will mos likely be lower than 20%. €3 billion for <100,000‬ homes just so boggers can watch Netflix and porn is just ridiculous.

The take up rate may be low because it's Eircom. They have huge numbers of complaints & for example, insist on direct debit. I am with Vodafone fibre to the exchange. I could have fibre to my home but only with Eircom. I'll stick with Vodafone.

Wanderer78

So we re handing a finance company 3 billion to build a fibre network, and we mightn't own it in the end, sure what could go wrong!

Anteayer

Discodog: It's OpenEir. You can buy services from Eir, Vodafone, Digiweb, Airwire and a whole load of other providers and they're all delivered over the OpenEir FTTH access network. You'd have no contact with Eir retail at all, unless you actually subscribe to them.

You can use Vodafone's services over it. There absolutely nothing forcing you to use Eir retail.

Personally, I'd go with one of the smaller ISPs like Digiweb. They've way way better customer care than either Eir or Vodafone and the Fritz!Box router they provide is far better than the own brand junk the big two give out.

Ask around the broadband forum for advice.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

The term ‘McMansion’ doesn’t mean just any big house. Some large houses and mansions are elegantly designed. McMansions are large houses or mansions that are external eyesores. Small houses can be eyesores too of course but because they’re small, they don’t stick out so much. McMansions have all kinds of ugly appendages and/or rooflines because what the occupier wants internally can’t be reconciled with a pleasing exterior.

IMO is a painful term used to describe any house that’s of a half decent size in the country by people who choose to live in small houses in estates (and are most likely jealous).

I personally see almost no “eyesores” or ugly houses. The vast majority of one off houses are at worst grand to look at and there are a lot of very nice houses also. I’m paying particular attention also as I’m in the process of having my own house designed so I am going out of my way to look at houses both online and in person to build up ideas and suggestions for our own house. Building a small house is a total waste of time imo. If you are building build big better to have too much space than not enough and end up having to extend etc in future.

whisky_galore

Hallie Noisy Geology wrote: »

IMO is a painful term used to describe any house that’s of a half decent size in the country by people who choose to live in small houses in estates (and are most likely jealous).

I personally see almost no “eyesores” or ugly houses. The vast majority of one off houses are at worst grand to look at and there are a lot of very nice houses also. I’m paying particular attention also as I’m in the process of having my own house designed so I am going out of my way to look at houses both online and in person to build up ideas and suggestions for our own house. Building a small house is a total waste of time imo. If you are building build big better to have too much space than not enough and end up having to extend etc in future.

Fine if you're planning to procreate a small army.

whisky_galore

Gary kk wrote: »

A lot of hate there guys did some rural person run over a pet when you where small

I am from rural Ireland.
My 'one off' house is c.150 years old.

Getting back ot, there are places in rural SE Asia with better broadband than supposedly 1st world rural Ireland.