Energy infrastructure

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118235723#Comment_118235723

They'll be vandalised in days

That's what they said about the bike share schemes

Sam Russell

Why would they be vandalised - anymore that the lamps themselves?

If they work and are found to be useful, they will be OK except in some areas where they will not be installed. Anywhere they are vandalised, they would not be replaced.

Those who do not respect nice things will do without nice things. That is the way things work - there are nice places to live where there are nice things, and areas that are not so nice. That is the way life is I'm afraid.

Birdnuts

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118235505#Comment_118235505

The fact that you had to pick the windiest of the year so far smacks of desperation on your part to justify the serious short comings of wind dependent grids across Europe this year

bob mcbob

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118237996#Comment_118237996

When the figures for H2 2021 come out I will be more than happy to post them. See you then 😀

Capt'n Midnight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118236922#Comment_118236922

Oxygen is liberated when you generate green hydrogen from water, it could perhaps be stored in salt domes like under Dublin Bay or Islandmagee. And as you say we should be increasing the production capacity anyway besides BOC has undertaken in excess of 30 system upgrades and we are in the process of working on a number of others.

As for NOx emissions, most are water soluble. Or you can use ammonia or urea (adblue) at source, both made from hydrogen and you end up with more fertilizer. Since there's virtually no sulphur dioxide or other nasties filter design should be a lot easier. And separating carbon dioxide from water vapour should be a doodle when there's no nitrogen to sap compression energy.

BTW ammonia is a great way to store small amounts of hydrogen (as long as you aren't worried about efficiency) as it's water soluble and just ~0.3 volts will split it into hydrogen and nitrogen. Yes it's corrosive and toxic but it used to be sold as a household cleaner as "0.88" (35.6% ammonia in water has a specific density of 0.88)

If NOx really is an issue hydrogen can be used in fuel cells but higher capital costs for grid scale and similar efficiency. It's a option.

BTW sealing from air is how we've always stored and transported gases it's always been a prerequisite.

The diesel emissions disaster is from unburnt carbon particles. Burning natural gas or hydrogen on an industrial scale is a world away from particulates from cold badly maintained engines (catalytic converters only work when heated up by the exhaust) new regs on particulates will likely include tyre dust so even EV's will be restricted.

cnocbui

Russian methane leakages from gas pipelines is of a greater scale than the entire pollution output of Paris, so no, it's not a a world away from pollution from ICE engines.

josip

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118240214#Comment_118240214

When you say "Russian methane", do you mean just the pipelines in Russia or does it include the pipelines in Europe and transit countries?

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118240589#Comment_118240589

I mean the leakages in Russia before the gas is funneled into their end of the pipelines to Europe.

"Gazprom says it released enough methane to trap the same amount of heat as 25.5 million tons of CO₂ last year. But that only takes into account the warming impact over a century. Methane is much more dangerous in its first two decades in the atmosphere, during which Gazprom’s 2020 emissions would exceed the annual carbon footprint of the entire city of Paris or the Chinese industrial hub of Tianjin."

https://www.bloomberg.com/features/russia-europe-gas-pipeline-climate-impact-2021/

Apogee

IT front page

Source: https://www.broadsheet.ie/2021/11/29/tuesdays-papers-113/

Minister for the Environment Eamon Ryan will bring a memo on the security of Ireland’s energy supply, which will lay out a policy to build an extra two gigawatts of power generation from gas in the next decade to supplement the transition to renewables as the mainstay of Ireland’s energy.

The two gigawatts stipulated are likely to be provided by four to seven new gas-fired plants, sources say, depending on their size. It will be in addition to about 15 gigawatts of renewable energy expected to be added to the grid in the coming decade, mostly made up of offshore and onshore wind farms, and solar energy.https://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/new-gas-fired-power-plants-to-bridge-gap-to-renewables-1.4742283

Capt'n Midnight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118243381#Comment_118243381

With the closure of coal-fired Moneypoint and other fossil-fuel plants, the overall volume of gas being used will remain almost at current levels as it replaces those sources.

So no increase in emissions from gas and 100% reduction in the fossil fuels it replaces. Gas is expensive to run it's not as capital intensive as other power sources so there's no need to keep it as alternatives come on line later.

cnocbui

Genius - talk about walking into a trap with your eyes wide shut. Putin must be rubbing his hands together in glee. His takeover of the EU is nearly complete.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118245294#Comment_118245294

I, for one, welcome our Russian overlords

Capt'n Midnight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118245294#Comment_118245294

Our gas imports come from Scotland so mostly North Sea and Norway. Look at pipeline maps.

England gets a small fraction of it's gas from the continent and only some of that is Russian.

cnocbui

That is comforting, I had thought it was all interconnected.

gjim

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118245132#Comment_118245132

Just switching to natural gas will reduce the CO2 per kWh to less than half that for coal (or even worse oil in Tarbert). And gas is far more useful (responsive) than coal for demand following although in the slightly longer-term the role for NG will be more for seasonal supply/demand mismatches as I expect li-ion batteries to take over for the intra-day balancing given the prices trajectories.

I still believe that the construction of an LNG terminal should be allowed, given the flexibility it would provide as electricity demand fluctuates seasonally - and it would provide access to cheaper sources of NG particular from Qatar. I argued this for a long time earlier in this thread.

timmyntc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118245779#Comment_118245779

It is all interconnected - and if Russia put the squeeze on Europe it will be much harder for us or UK to get any excess from Norway, Netherlands, etc.

If Germany/Poland etc are tight for gas, they will get more from their european neighbours and that will in turn put the squeeze on UK and Ireland. Definitely a better situation than those who are far more dependent on Gazprom, but we're not out of the woods yet.

cnocbui

Li-ion battery price trajetories are probably not what you think they are.

specialbyte

There's nothing quite like posting a graph without a source or clear unit on the Y axis for a Lithium Carbonate, which isn't a primary component of Lithium Ion batteries and is actually an impurity that battery designers try to avoid.

Here's a more useful graph:

In April 2020 there was 21MW of batteries on the grid in Ireland. By April 2021 that was up to 156MW, and that has grown more since. This is because many private companies are investing in putting batteries on the grid because it is a worthwhile investment. Source: https://www.energystorageireland.com/2021/04/over-150-mw-of-bess-now-operational-in-ireland-northern-ireland/

Edit: The growth is dramatic, in September this year: "There are more than 350 MW of operational battery storage projects on the island of Ireland and many more projects in construction with a growing pipeline of projects with planning permission." Source: https://www.energystorageireland.com/2021/09/government-must-choose-zero-carbon-storage-over-fossil-fuels-to-back-up-power-supplies/

cnocbui

You consider speculation done in April more useful than current pricing of a basic commodity that the tech relies on? Suit yourself.

"lithium carbonate is typically “the first chemical in the lithium production chain,” with compounds like lithium hydroxide being produced with subsequent steps if needed. For that reason, lithium production numbers are often broken down in terms of lithium carbonate equivalent."

If Iron ore prices are rising in commodity markets, you can be fairly sure the price of steel isn't falling.

Here is the source, but it doesn't change anything.: https://tradingeconomics.com/commodity/lithium

Since your stale chart is from Bloomberg, this is from an article in Bloomberg today:

"Higher raw material costs could push the average price of a lithium-ion battery pack to $135 per kilowatt-hour in 2022, a 2.3% gain from this year’s level, according to BloombergNEF’s 2021 Battery Price Survey.

...

Battery producers in China, the top electric-vehicle market, have been raising concern for months over tight supply and rising costs of some raw materials. China-based SVolt Energy Technology Co., which has an agreement to supply Jeep-maker Stellantis NV, flagged issues with materials including copper foil, while Gotion High-tech Co., a partner of Volkswagen AG, told customers in mid-October it needed to raise battery prices, citing pressure from surging commodities. "

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-11-30/even-the-battery-boom-can-t-escape-world-s-supply-chain-woes?srnd=premium-europe

Would you like more evidence?

"Pilbara Minerals (ASX:PLS) has sold an 8,000t SC5.5 spodumene cargo for an extraordinary $US2,240/t via its Battery Material Exchange (BMX) digital auction platform.

The ‘icing on the cake’ for PLS is that this product – 5.5% lithium – is the low grade stuff.

The equivalent headline price achieved for industry standard 6% product would be USD$2,500/t.

This essentially doubles the $US1,250/tonne received via the inaugural auction held late July.

It is also represents a ~550% year-on-year price increase, with spod prices last year hitting lows of ~$US380/t.

Even the experts are dumbstruck.

...

It also indicated that lithium shortages, which were supposed to start kicking in around 2023-2024, are happening right now."

https://stockhead.com.au/resources/pilbara-minerals-just-sold-its-lithium-at-auction-for-us2240-t-thats-a-550pc-yoy-increase/

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118247351#Comment_118247351

Prices of commodities fluctuate all the time, regardless of industry so nothing new here.

cnocbui

Glad to see you agree that battery prices have stopped declining and look likely to increase on account of movement in the commodity markets.

specialbyte

No company makes long-term capital investment decisions based on the current state of the commodities market that changes hourly. Yes there's inflation right now. There's global supply chain shortages in every industry because of the pandemic.

"2.3% gain from this year’s level, according to BloombergNEF’s 2021 Battery Price Survey" A 2.3% increase in cost is obviously not desirable but it's not going to break the economics of the battery projects that are in the later stages of development in Ireland. You're making it seem like the entire battery market is about to collapse when it isn't.

You consider speculation done on the commodity markets really informs a conversation on energy infrastructure? Suit yourself.

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2021/1130/1264000-futurenergy-ireland-launched/

Another 1GW of wind planned

RandomViewer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118248168#Comment_118248168

Doesn't say where, I know Coillte has done a huge amount of harvesting the last year up here but the pathetic response by the state and the developers to the landslide outside Ballybofey will see objections to all projects,

ESB isn't liked and Coillte shortchanged a lot of landowners in the 90s,add to that Ryan is a complete gobs####, all these plans will be tied up in courts for years,

CatInABox

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118248249#Comment_118248249

Honestly, with the state of our legal and planning system, every project is going to be held up for years. That's why they're planning on pushing through reforms to the process, which will reduce the amount of objections possible. This will, of course, face it's own legal objections, so we'll see what happens once it all goes through.

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118249411#Comment_118249411

The planning system, particularly allowing those turkeys An Taisce to stick their unelected and unaccountable oar in on everything. Should be done away with and re-done from scratch. When you have to keep sticking band-aids on your own legislation because it gets in the way of what you believe are absolute necessities, you should stop messing around and throw it out and re-write it.

Look how the government had to fight the councils over solar panels and wind turbines and remove their ability to say no, which they were doing in spades.

Complaints about the planning process are similar to those about delays going through the courts.

Easily resolved by proper resourcing.

It was the same with the felling licences for forestry, nearly ground to a halt but was sorted once they staffed appropriately.

At the end of the day, as per Aarhaus, anyone has a right to lodge an objection to anything. While I often disagree with many objections, the government will find themselves on shaky ground, legally, if they aim to restrict those rights

josip

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118250737#Comment_118250737

I think everyone should have the right to 1 or 2 free objections or within a certain range of where they live or own property in their lifetime.

But I don't agree with serial strawman objections anywhere in the country.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118250777#Comment_118250777

Anyone within the country can object to anything within the country. Trying to put an arbitrary distance limit on it is 100% against Aarhaus and will be struck down.

Aarhaus is very simple to follow for national govts and very hard to get around. There are 3 main elements:

As for strawman objections, Sweetman is one lad everyone loves to hate. Personally I disagree with a lot of his objections e.g. against greenways, however he only ever objects on a point of law. That he has a very high success rate indicates there are fundamental issues with the design and submission processes rather than the fact that he is allowed to object.

Objectors force applicants to follow the rules to the full extent of the law. It protects society and the environment from vested interests skipping requirements as they see fit.

WRT making it more difficult to object, be very careful what you wish for as it could have horrendous consequences

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118250737#Comment_118250737

Could expound on what you mean by "Easily" and "proper resourcing"?

Let me see if I can guess - employ more tax funded public sector workers?

"The majority of the new Climate Action Plan's costs will fall to individuals, households and the private sector, not the State, the coalition leaders have confirmed.

The €125 billion plan..."

Have you heard of a popular Australian children's book called 'The Magic Pudding'? Surely you have, as you and the government endlessly dismiss all inconvenient issues of cost and affordability by referencing the magic pudding that apparently every tax payer has which is always available to dispense limittless amounts of money as required by the government and greenies wanting their grandiose dreams and wishes satisfied.