Where is Hitler's soul now? What a Rabbi Says.

ILoveYourVibes

In Judaism there is no hell.

The soul evolves or leaves behind what no longer serves it ..if there is nothing to salvage ..the soul becomes just energy ...like a cloud.

What does your spirituality or conscience tell you about what happens to evil ?

I think it's a really compassionate answer.

riffmongous

I saw another Rabbi say recently that Hitler was the most correct person there ever was, only he was on the wrong side.. so I'll take the word of these and any other religious authorities with a large pinch of salt

ILoveYourVibes

riffmongous wrote: »

I saw another Rabbi say recently that Hitler was the most correct person there ever was, only he was on the wrong side.. so I'll take the word of these and any other religious authorities with a large pinch of salt

Did you listen to the video? Its very wise and profound.

Canis Lupus

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Did you listen to the video? Its very wise and profound.

No such thing as a soul so I don't really care what he has to say on the subject.

ILoveYourVibes

Canis Lupus wrote: »

No such thing as a soul so I don't really care what he has to say on the subject.

I just thought it was a very noble idea rather than the idea of punishment and aggressive spirituality etc.

Even if you don't believe ..the sentiment i think you can admire.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

riffmongous

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Did you listen to the video? Its very wise and profound.

I did.. but to me it's just all waffley stuff about energy and eternity

paw patrol

I often read on the internet that hitler is now the president of the USA.
Literally.
I guess his soul resides in that guys body , feasting on mcDs in the white house.

Fr_Dougal

I saw a video for Toyota once and it said that Toyota were the best built cars in the world.


But what does it ALL MEAN?

Canis Lupus

Canis Lupus wrote: »

No such thing as a soul so I don't really care what he has to say on the subject.

I was going to say 'no offence' but there's no inoffensive way of saying: I think that's just lazy. Sorry.

You don't have to believe in a soul as a supernatural blue light that goes up to heaven when we die. I like Soren Kierkegaard's notion of the soul as the synthesis between the psyche and the body. It isn't a physical object, just as a thought is not, or free will. But it's a useful concept, even just as a tool for making sense our existence, whether or not it can be said to exist.

The term has been hijacked by religion, but belief in a soul is by no means a religious pursuit.

Wibbs

Judaism was unusual enough among religions in that the idea of an afterlife wasn't present in the early days and is often discounted, or ignored anyway even today. IIRC there is the sense of an afterlife with the coming of the Messiah where people are resurrected in the end of days, but AFAIR that means actual resurrection into a human body. Christianity and Islam took this idea to different degrees. Again AFAIR in Islam the dead are dead, no afterlife until the resurrection, except for Jesus, or Isa as he is called within Islam(from the Greek of his name), he's alive as he was brought straight to heaven and never died. In Christianity the afterlife took on a more solid notion, probably from Greek and Roman thoughts on the matter. Even the idea of a soul has had many meanings within Judaism, mostly as the divine spirt that is within the body, but I'm not sure it can exist beyond it in that theology?

ILoveYourVibes

riffmongous wrote: »

I did.. but to me it's just all waffley stuff about energy and eternity

I understand . Thank you for listening to it though

Ferajacka

Sure Hitler probably never did anything wrong he got other people Todo his dirty work.That being said if Hitler is not in hell the rest of us should be sound.

ILoveYourVibes

Wibbs wrote: »

Judaism was unusual enough among religions in that the idea of an afterlife wasn't present in the early days and is often discounted, or ignored anyway even today. IIRC there is the sense of an afterlife with the coming of the Messiah where people are resurrected in the end of days, but AFAIR that means actual resurrection into a human body. Christianity and Islam took this idea to different degrees. Again AFAIR in Islam the dead are dead, no afterlife until the resurrection, except for Jesus, or Isa as he is called within Islam(from the Greek of his name), he's alive as he was brought straight to heaven and never died. In Christianity the afterlife took on a more solid notion, probably from Greek and Roman thoughts on the matter. Even the idea of a soul has had many meanings within Judaism, mostly as the divine spirt that is within the body, but I'm not sure it can exist beyond it in that theology?

The hebrew word for soul is Neshama.
Not sure where you get this from. I am Jewish BTW we dont have this idea that we all have to believe the same thing like in Christianity etc.

Some ancient jews believed in re incarnation some still do.

But in general the quality of your soul is based on what you do not what you believe. So its fine for jews to BELIEVE lots of diff things.

ILoveYourVibes

Ferajacka wrote: »

Sure Hitler probably never did anything wrong he got other people Todo his dirty work.That being said if Hitler is not in hell the rest of us should be sound.

I don't think you have anything to worry about. If you can forgive god for allowing all those wars to happen i think you're sound

Pero_Bueno

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Did you listen to the video? Its very wise and profound.

It is nice, and I'm sure he's a really good person, but has he anything to back up these claims ?
or he says them cos he likes the sound of them ? it makes him feel secure?

Pero_Bueno

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

I just thought it was a very noble idea rather than the idea of punishment and aggressive spirituality etc.

Even if you don't believe ..the sentiment i think you can admire.

Absolutely

ILoveYourVibes

Pero_Bueno wrote: »

It is nice, and I'm sure he's a really good person, but has he anything to back up these claims ?
or he says them cos he likes the sound of them ? it makes him feel secure?

That's what i like best of all. His goodness. His wish that not even Hitler would be damned. Its not based on anything other than the kindness and nobility of his character and the culture and environment he comes from.

NOW THAT IS A SPIRITUAL TEACHER I WANT.

Pero_Bueno

paw patrol wrote: »

I often read on the internet that hitler is now the president of the USA.
Literally.
I guess his soul resides in that guys body , feasting on mcDs in the white house.

2 Big Macs
2 Mc Chicken Fillets
and a large chocolate shake

Every day apparently - he must have a deal with the devil to be alive at 72 with that crap diet.

ILoveYourVibes

All the souls in all the universe added together in harmony and all the good deeds ever done together in harmony.. is god.

1874

I once saw a clip with a Rabbi describing what love is and is not, that was interesting, this is complete hogwash, I dont know what I am, an atheist or an agnostic or something inbetween or something else, when you die, you die, thats it, ashes to ashes, dust to dust, the end.

Ferajacka

Now I didn't listen to the whole thing, but how does he really know what happens to the soul?
I think he's a bit of chancer.

ILoveYourVibes

Ferajacka wrote: »

Now I didn't listen to the whole thing, but how does he really know what happens to the soul?
I think he's a bit of chancer.

He is just saying ...no one should be damned.

Wibbs

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

The hebrew word for soul is Neshama.
Not sure where you get this from. I am Jewish BTW we dont have this idea that we all have to believe the same thing like in Christianity etc.

Some ancient jews believed in re incarnation some still do.

Oh no I agree, that's why I said "Even the idea of a soul has had many meanings within Judaism". It's a religion that isn't pickled in just one way or theology and always has been especially in the last couple of thousand years. It's a theology of constant re-examination.

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

That's what i like best of all. His goodness. His wish that not even Hitler would be damned. Its not based on anything other than the kindness and nobility of his character and the culture and environment he comes from.

I got a different vibe myself IL. Not so much that he didn't want Hitler to be damned, more that eternal damnation was itself pointless because most souls would have some goodness or room to improve, whereas Hitler's soul was so utterly bereft of any goodness so nothing would be left to save so dissolution was the only other option. If anything dissolution is a worse fate.

Then one has to consider if Hitler had any goodness and the nature of evil itself and how moralities can be remarkably fluid, as can the notion of goodness, as can the human need for absolutes or evil or good(the former being easier to find throughout history and depending on viewpoints, cultural and persona). If we go down that rabbit hole things can get messy and not a little uncomfortable. If we consider the old saw of you die twice, first when the breath leaves your body and second when the last person speaks your name, then as a shared human memory Hitler as a name and idea will "live" longer than the vast billions that have ever lived on this Earth. That's not a nice thought on a few levels.

Ipso

At least we know where the holocaust victims are.
https://religionnews.com/2017/12/21/mormons-perform-baptisms-on-holocaust-victims/

Atoms for Peace

Canis Lupus wrote: »

No such thing as a soul so I don't really care what he has to say on the subject.

Would you sell your soul?

I like your vibes, Iloveyourvibes..

Capt'n Midnight

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

I saw a video for Toyota once and it said that Toyota were the best built cars in the world.


But what does it ALL MEAN?

They are the best built cars in the world

Apart from the defective airbags , brakes that don't work, speakers that catch fire, power windows that catch fire, fuel leaks that could catch fire, loss of power steering, seatbelt anchors that don't.


But back to Hitler and his car or rather it's steering wheel and the left turn signal from Charles Manson's Volkswagen
As you yourself pointed out :

DOUGAL: Can I stay up tonight to watch the scary film?
TED: Ah, no no no. The last time you stayed up to watch a scary film, you ended up having to sleep in my bed. I wouldn't mind, but it wasn't even a scary film.
DOUGAL: Come on, Ted. A Volkswagen with a mind of its own. Driving all over the place and going mad. If that isn't scary, I don't know what is.

ILoveYourVibes

Wibbs wrote: »

Oh no I agree, that's why I said "Even the idea of a soul has had many meanings within Judaism". It's a religion that isn't pickled in just one way or theology and always has been especially in the last couple of thousand years. It's a theology of constant re-examination.

I got a different vibe myself IL. Not so much that he didn't want Hitler to be damned, more that eternal damnation was itself pointless because most souls would have some goodness or room to improve, whereas Hitler's soul was so utterly bereft of any goodness so nothing would be left to save so dissolution was the only other option. If anything dissolution is a worse fate.

Then one has to consider if Hitler had any goodness and the nature of evil itself and how moralities can be remarkably fluid, as can the notion of goodness, as can the human need for absolutes or evil or good(the former being easier to find throughout history and depending on viewpoints, cultural and persona). If we go down that rabbit hole things can get messy and not a little uncomfortable. If we consider the old saw of you die twice, first when the breath leaves your body and second when the last person speaks your name, then as a shared human memory Hitler as a name and idea will "live" longer than the vast billions that have ever lived on this Earth. That's not a nice thought on a few levels.

I really love that Wibbs

Except his name being remembered. I understand where you are coming from.

There is another evil doer Haman we remember to forget his name on Purim.

Wibbs

Deleted User wrote: »

I like your vibes, Iloveyourvibes..

In fairness it's hard to dislike a user name like Iloveyourvibes

ILoveYourVibes

Wibbs wrote: »

In fairness it's hard to dislike a user name like Iloveyourvibes

I just thought of something that would make people feel good when they saw it
:pac:

Like the universe is telling them ...hey ..you're cool!:P

hgfj

Atoms for Peace wrote: »

Would you sell your soul?

I'd sell my imaginary soul.

ILoveYourVibes

Deleted User wrote: »

I like your vibes, Iloveyourvibes..

Thanks!
I like yours!

mad muffin

Evil never dies. It multiplies.

ILoveYourVibes

mad muffin wrote: »

Evil never dies. It multiplies.

Make it wear a Johnny! :pac:

Junkyard Tom

Dogs loved Hitler.



How come dogs are such bad judges of character?

ILoveYourVibes

^^^

Would never happen with cats.

True though....dogs don't make the best choices in life.

But we love them none the less.

Wibbs

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

There is another evil doer Haman we remember to forget his name on Purim.

Jaysus IL, that's so about one of the most Jewish, even rabbinical sentences I've ever read. We remember to forget his name*. Bloody brilliant.





*but we remember his name anyway, but shush on that day ya muppets.

ILoveYourVibes

Wibbs wrote: »

Jaysus IL, that's so about one of the most Jewish, even rabbinical sentences I've ever read. We remember to forget his name*. Bloody brilliant.





*but we remember his name anyway, but shush on that day ya muppets.

You also have to get drunk!

Wibbs

hgfj wrote: »

I'd sell my imaginary soul.

I offered, but the devil was all ah... no, yer grand and suggested the Hari Krishnas may be interested. I'm so old I remember them bouncing about in airports and train stations.

kowloon

Pero_Bueno wrote: »

2 Big Macs
2 Mc Chicken Fillets
and a large chocolate shake

Every day apparently - he must have a deal with the devil to be alive at 72 with that crap diet.

Maybe he's making up for being a vegetarian before.

TheValeyard

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

Dogs loved Hitler.



How come dogs are such bad judges of character?

And Germans

ILoveYourVibes

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

And Germans

ouch ....:pac:

I didn't say it yall!

Wibbs

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

You also have to get drunk!

Oh I know. Apparently it's a religious instruction for that holiday. Id say there's some theological debate around the instruction. But not much.

There's a similar thing in Spain and Italy on some saint's day or other(or maybe it's Easter?), where a few of the community have to get wasted and parade through the streets displaying same. How that, or Purim didn't get picked up here as a festival I'll never understand.

Then again we always tended towards the more grey religious stuff. I reckon its the weather. Christian festivals in the Latin countries = Wahay!!! let's party and get off our heads. Christian festivals in the more northerly climes = drizzle soaked procession, or Calvinist self reflection, indoors, sober.

Well this has turned into a lovely thread to read of a weeknight.

Group hug before everyone gets back to tearing one another new arseholes.

Wibbs

kowloon wrote: »

Maybe he's making up for being a vegetarian before.

He wasn't a vegetarian. Nor a teetotaller. Though funny enough was into animal rights and was the first government to ban vivisection and other animal testing. Which when one considers what transpired is seriously twisted and unbelievable. He was also anti tobacco and again was the first government to bring in anti smoking legislation.

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

And Germans

and Austrians(who were true converts) and many others throughout Europe and beyond. Was considered groundbreaking and largely a force for good in the US too.

That's the truly scary thing about "evil". There's the obvious one of the banality of evil, but there's also the massive contradictions and confusion within it. Someone like Stalin was More Evil™ in many ways and killed just as many if not more by some counts and very clear about it too. A lot less contradiction and confusion.

For me anyway I think Hitler and the nazis were and remain such a focus is because they weren't always so clear and they came from a country and culture of such, well.. culture and art and science and philosophy and engineering and... etc. "Evil" is somehow easier to stomach when it's coming from somewhere else, from peoples and cultures that let's face it at a primal level many feel not quite "us". It's much harder to stomach when it's one of "ours" next door. It shines a harsh light on us and reminds us that we're not so different. That's one reason at least why Hitler is the embodiment of evil to the European mind. If we hear Pol Pot liked cats and they liked him, we barely even register it, to hear that Hitler liked dogs and they liked him...

TheValeyard

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Well this has turned into a lovely thread to read of a weeknight.

Group hug before everyone gets back to tearing one another new arseholes.

*kicks in the balls*