Ulster Team Talk Thread IV... Go On My Henderson...

bilston

Bazzo wrote: »

I have it on good authority that Leinster are taking the Coetzee money so they can buy more of Connacht's best players that came from Munster.

Question...what is Scott Penny's contract situation. Would I be right in saying he is 4th choice Leinater O/S now? Just asking for a friend?:D

Wegians89

Would any Ulster supporter do you a position by position depth chart? Havnt seen too much of ulster this season

Locke_Lamora

bilston wrote: »

Question...what is Scott Penny's contract situation. Would I be right in saying he is 4th choice Leinater O/S now? Just asking for a friend?:D

James Ryan has been out of form...perhaps a change of scenery can help him rediscover it?

launish116

Wegians89 wrote: »

Would any Ulster supporter do you a position by position depth chart? Havnt seen too much of ulster this season

In pecking order for first name on sheet, age in brackets. hopefully haven't missed anyone.

LH Prop
Eric O’Sullivan (24)
Jack McGrath (30)
Kyle McCall (28)
Andrew Warwick (30)
Callum Reid (21) Academy

TH Prop
Marty Moore (29)
Tom O’Toole (21)
Gareth Milasinovich (27)
Ross Kane (25)

Hooker
Rob Herring (30)
John Andrew (27)
Adam McBurney (23)
Bradley Roberts - AIL
Tom Stewart (19) – Academy Year 1
James McCormick (18) – Academy Year 1

Lock
Iain Henderson (28)
Sam Carter (30)
Alan O’Connor (27)
Kieran Treadwell (24)
David O’Connor (25)
Cormac Izuchukwu (20) – Academy Year 1

Backrow
Marcell Coetzee (29)
Sean Reidy (31)
Jordy Murphy (29)
Matty Rea (27)
Nick Timoney (25)
Greg Jones (24)
Marcus Rea (22)
David McCann (20) – Academy Year 2
Azur Allison (21) – Academy Year 2
Reuben Crothers (18) – Academy Year 1

Scrumhalf
John Cooney (30)
Alby Matthewson (34)
Dave Shanahan (25)
Lewis Finlay (20) – Academy Year 1
Nathan Doak (18) - Academy Year 1

Outhalf
Billy Burns (26)
Ian Madigan (31)
Bill Johnston (23)
Michael Lowry (22)
Bruce Houston (21) – Academy Year 3

Centre
Stuart McCloskey (28)
Luke Marshall (29)
James Hume (21)
Stewart Moore (21)
Angus Curtis (22)
Hayden Hyde (20) – Academy Year 1
Ben Carson (18) – Academy Year 1

Back Three
Jacob Stockdale (24)
Robert Baloucoune (23)
Will Addison (28)
Matt Faddes (28)
Craig Gilroy (29)
Rob Lyttle (23)
Louis Ludik (33)
Ethan McIlroy (20) – Academy Year 1
Aaron Sexton (20) – Academy Year 2
Conor Rankin (19) – Academy Year 2

Wegians89

launish116 wrote: »

In pecking order for first name on sheet, age in brackets. hopefully haven't missed anyone.

LH Prop
Eric O’Sullivan (24)
Jack McGrath (30)
Kyle McCall (28)
Andrew Warwick (30)
Callum Reid (21) Academy

TH Prop
Marty Moore (29)
Tom O’Toole (21)
Gareth Milasinovich (27)
Ross Kane (25)

Hooker
Rob Herring (30)
John Andrew (27)
Adam McBurney (23)
Bradley Roberts - AIL
Tom Stewart (19) – Academy Year 1
James McCormick (18) – Academy Year 1

Lock
Iain Henderson (28)
Sam Carter (30)
Alan O’Connor (27)
Kieran Treadwell (24)
David O’Connor (25)
Cormac Izuchukwu (20) – Academy Year 1

Backrow
Marcell Coetzee (29)
Sean Reidy (31)
Jordy Murphy (29)
Matty Rea (27)
Nick Timoney (25)
Greg Jones (24)
Marcus Rea (22)
David McCann (20) – Academy Year 2
Azur Allison (21) – Academy Year 2
Reuben Crothers (18) – Academy Year 1

Scrumhalf
John Cooney (30)
Alby Matthewson (34)
Dave Shanahan (25)
Lewis Finlay (20) – Academy Year 1
Nathan Doak (18) - Academy Year 1

Outhalf
Billy Burns (26)
Ian Madigan (31)
Bill Johnston (23)
Michael Lowry (22)
Bruce Houston (21) – Academy Year 3

Centre
Stuart McCloskey (28)
Luke Marshall (29)
James Hume (21)
Stewart Moore (21)
Angus Curtis (22)
Hayden Hyde (20) – Academy Year 1
Ben Carson (18) – Academy Year 1

Back Three
Jacob Stockdale (24)
Robert Baloucoune (23)
Will Addison (28)
Matt Faddes (28)
Craig Gilroy (29)
Rob Lyttle (23)
Louis Ludik (33)
Ethan McIlroy (20) – Academy Year 1
Aaron Sexton (20) – Academy Year 2
Conor Rankin (19) – Academy Year 2

Thanks, think there will be plenty of inter-provincial movement at the end of the season with the contract situation

launish116

Wegians89 wrote: »

Thanks, think there will be plenty of inter-provincial movement at the end of the season with the contract situation

Definitely see a bigger emphasis coming from IRFU, its already begun this season, to the dismay of Leinster. Well justified dismay!

We've definitely benefited from it in past, only concern now is the pillaging of our academy/squad going forward. To fair its a give take relationship and Ulster will need to start giving back. We can joke that Leinster have so many players to pick from with a conveyor belt.

If I was the IRFU I'd been focusing on the academies and exile program going forward, maximising return from our resources. Slowly reduce the NIQ quota.

Must have wee nosey at other provinces and see who's potentially in line for a province switch.

Hands Like Flippers

launish116 wrote: »

In pecking order for first name on sheet, age in brackets. hopefully haven't missed anyone.

LH Prop
Eric O’Sullivan (24)
Jack McGrath (30)
Kyle McCall (28)
Andrew Warwick (30)
Callum Reid (21) Academy

TH Prop
Marty Moore (29)
Tom O’Toole (21)
Gareth Milasinovich (27)
Ross Kane (25)

Hooker
Rob Herring (30)
John Andrew (27)
Adam McBurney (23)
Bradley Roberts - AIL
Tom Stewart (19) – Academy Year 1
James McCormick (18) – Academy Year 1

Lock
Iain Henderson (28)
Sam Carter (30)
Alan O’Connor (27)
Kieran Treadwell (24)
David O’Connor (25)
Cormac Izuchukwu (20) – Academy Year 1

Backrow
Marcell Coetzee (29)
Sean Reidy (31)
Jordy Murphy (29)
Matty Rea (27)
Nick Timoney (25)
Greg Jones (24)
Marcus Rea (22)
David McCann (20) – Academy Year 2
Azur Allison (21) – Academy Year 2
Reuben Crothers (18) – Academy Year 1

Scrumhalf
John Cooney (30)
Alby Matthewson (34)
Dave Shanahan (25)
Lewis Finlay (20) – Academy Year 1
Nathan Doak (18) - Academy Year 1

Outhalf
Billy Burns (26)
Ian Madigan (31)
Bill Johnston (23)
Michael Lowry (22)
Bruce Houston (21) – Academy Year 3

Centre
Stuart McCloskey (28)
Luke Marshall (29)
James Hume (21)
Stewart Moore (21)
Angus Curtis (22)
Hayden Hyde (20) – Academy Year 1
Ben Carson (18) – Academy Year 1

Back Three
Jacob Stockdale (24)
Robert Baloucoune (23)
Will Addison (28)
Matt Faddes (28)
Craig Gilroy (29)
Rob Lyttle (23)
Louis Ludik (33)
Ethan McIlroy (20) – Academy Year 1
Aaron Sexton (20) – Academy Year 2
Conor Rankin (19) – Academy Year 2

Think HH ant Tom S are y2 academy

Paul Smeenus

launish116 wrote: »

In pecking order for first name on sheet, age in brackets. hopefully haven't missed anyone.

LH Prop
Eric O’Sullivan (24)
Jack McGrath (30)
Kyle McCall (28)
Andrew Warwick (30)
Callum Reid (21) Academy

TH Prop
Marty Moore (29)
Tom O’Toole (21)
Gareth Milasinovich (27)
Ross Kane (25)

Hooker
Rob Herring (30)
John Andrew (27)
Adam McBurney (23)
Bradley Roberts - AIL
Tom Stewart (19) – Academy Year 1
James McCormick (18) – Academy Year 1

Lock
Iain Henderson (28)
Sam Carter (30)
Alan O’Connor (27)
Kieran Treadwell (24)
David O’Connor (25)
Cormac Izuchukwu (20) – Academy Year 1

Backrow
Marcell Coetzee (29)
Sean Reidy (31)
Jordy Murphy (29)
Matty Rea (27)
Nick Timoney (25)
Greg Jones (24)
Marcus Rea (22)
David McCann (20) – Academy Year 2
Azur Allison (21) – Academy Year 2
Reuben Crothers (18) – Academy Year 1

Scrumhalf
John Cooney (30)
Alby Matthewson (34)
Dave Shanahan (25)
Lewis Finlay (20) – Academy Year 1
Nathan Doak (18) - Academy Year 1

Outhalf
Billy Burns (26)
Ian Madigan (31)
Bill Johnston (23)
Michael Lowry (22)
Bruce Houston (21) – Academy Year 3

Centre
Stuart McCloskey (28)
Luke Marshall (29)
James Hume (21)
Stewart Moore (21)
Angus Curtis (22)
Hayden Hyde (20) – Academy Year 1
Ben Carson (18) – Academy Year 1

Back Three
Jacob Stockdale (24)
Robert Baloucoune (23)
Will Addison (28)
Matt Faddes (28)
Craig Gilroy (29)
Rob Lyttle (23)
Louis Ludik (33)
Ethan McIlroy (20) – Academy Year 1
Aaron Sexton (20) – Academy Year 2
Conor Rankin (19) – Academy Year 2

Think that's everyone, Launish; good work. I'd say Lyttle is ahead of Gilroy now, and Warwick is probably preferred to McCall against good scrummagers. Also a bit of a disservice to Lowry - he's a lot more than fourth choice ten.

thomond2006

If it's a choice between a five year deal for Coetzee or closing down Connacht, well there's only one choice to make.

Dubinusa

I would expect Leinster will lose one #8. I think Deegan may move. But, it may be to Connacht? I think Doris and Conan will be preferred.
One 7 may leave also. I don't know which one. I'd hazard a guess and say Penny.
Leinster will probably cut Adam Byrne too.
Fardy will be available and maybe Toner. Ulster should pick up one of them.

Paul Smeenus

Dubinusa wrote: »

I would expect Leinster will lose one #8. I think Deegan may move. But, it may be to Connacht? I think Doris and Conan will be preferred.
One 7 may leave also. I don't know which one. I'd hazard a guess and say Penny.
Leinster will probably cut Adam Byrne too.
Fardy will be available and maybe Toner. Ulster should pick up one of them.

Zero point in taking on Toner. We need young talent who can come in and kick on.

launish116

Dubinusa wrote: »

I would expect Leinster will lose one #8. I think Deegan may move. But, it may be to Connacht? I think Doris and Conan will be preferred.
One 7 may leave also. I don't know which one. I'd hazard a guess and say Penny.
Leinster will probably cut Adam Byrne too.
Fardy will be available and maybe Toner. Ulster should pick up one of them.

Deegan offered as an olive branch for us letting Coetzee being bought out? more like. We have the pedigree to manage serious knee injuries I guess.

Can't see Connacht picking him up, Abrahan Papali'i is a serious ball carrying no8. just very rough presently, but with some good coaching and fitness he will be a serious player for them. Almost the sort of player we could do with as a back up. Really like how Connacht identified him, they rolled the dice and in a season think it will pay off.

Wegians89

launish116 wrote: »

Deegan offered as an olive branch for us letting Coetzee being bought out? more like. We have the pedigree to manage serious knee injuries I guess.

Can't see Connacht picking him up, Abrahan Papali'i is a serious ball carrying no8. just very rough presently, but with some good coaching and fitness he will be a serious player for them. Almost the sort of player we could do with as a back up. Really like how Connacht identified him, they rolled the dice and in a season think it will pay off.

Could see deegan to ulster, I’d say vdf could possibly be the 7 to lose out in Leinster. Could see the likes of cloete and Tommy o donnell be g moved around too. Not the biggest fan of cloete and he wouldn’t be the biggest lose to Irish rugby but could see himself and deegan moving up north to replace Coetzee

bilston

launish116 wrote: »

Can’t really see Dan submitting and focusing on the Pro 14.

Though are hand could be forced, Coetzee & Carter may have HIA return to play protocols.

Gloucester could lose today as well I guess.

I didn't know this, but teams 5-8 in the final pool standings progress to the Challenge Cup, so still plenty to play for.

Dog Botherer

Cloete is IQ now which makes him a handy pickup. he’s not great but he’s good at Pro14 level.

thomond2006

Dog Botherer wrote: »

Cloete is IQ now which makes him a handy pickup. he’s not great but he’s good at Pro14 level.

He's under contract for another year at Munster and with TOD most likely on the way out and Hodnett out term I imagine Munster will want Cloete to see out next season.

bilston

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

Zero point in taking on Toner. We need young talent who can come in and kick on.

Genuinely think we should look at Penny, tough wee nut, a better version of Marcus Rea.

But hes behind Leavy, Van Der Flier and Connors which is why I could see offers coming in for him, although I don't know his contract status at the end of the season.

bilston

launish116 wrote: »

Deegan offered as an olive branch for us letting Coetzee being bought out? more like. We have the pedigree to manage serious knee injuries I guess.

Can't see Connacht picking him up, Abrahan Papali'i is a serious ball carrying no8. just very rough presently, but with some good coaching and fitness he will be a serious player for them. Almost the sort of player we could do with as a back up. Really like how Connacht identified him, they rolled the dice and in a season think it will pay off.

Deegan strikes me as a good ball carrier, but perhaps is less interested in the nuts and bolts side of things? Leinster fans can inform on that. He is nowhere near Coetzee's league, but I don't think anyone is in the Pro 14...Doris will get there, Felatau was there once, but other than that Coetzee is in a league of his own...we will never replace him.

launish116

Wegians89 wrote: »

Could see deegan to ulster, I’d say vdf could possibly be the 7 to lose out in Leinster. Could see the likes of cloete and Tommy o donnell be g moved around too. Not the biggest fan of cloete and he wouldn’t be the biggest lose to Irish rugby but could see himself and deegan moving up north to replace Coetzee

Greatest respect to O’Donnel & Cloete I’d rather stick with the academy if that was our options. Be more value in giving McCann, Rea or Allison exposure.

Deegan & VDF would be unreal pillages if another province managed to persuade them to move.

Could see Vardy (36) or Toner (34) being offered Connacht.

awec

bilston wrote: »

Deegan strikes me as a good ball carrier, but perhaps is less interested in the nuts and bolts side of things? Leinster fans can inform on that. He is nowhere near Coetzee's league, but I don't think anyone is in the Pro 14...Doris will get there, Felatau was there once, but other than that Coetzee is in a league of his own...we will never replace him.

Deegan is all flash, doesn’t get involved enough in the grunt work.

We can’t really afford a player like that.

Paul Smeenus

Dog Botherer wrote: »

Cloete is IQ now which makes him a handy pickup. he’s not great but he’s good at Pro14 level.

That's not the level we need. We're not in any difficulties in the Pro14.

Dog Botherer

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

That's not the level we need. We're not in any difficulties in the Pro14.

what, you don’t need a groundhog who either gets 4 turnovers or 3 penalties against him per game, and has more yellow cards on his disciplinary record than an Ireland vs England match thread?

launish116

Ulster-A highlights

https://youtu.be/zNWLdoBHLrY

Sexton is rapid

McMenamin & Izuchukwu look pretty big.

molloyjh

awec wrote: »

Deegan is all flash, doesn’t get involved enough in the grunt work.

We can’t really afford a player like that.

I wouldn't have said that about him tbh. At 8 he is used more in open play than in tight, but he's still well able to do whats asked of him. He's a decent defender, pretty good at ruck time etc. He's started HEC games as well as being capped for Ireland. You don't get that by being incapable of doing the grunt work.

Deegan is a good 8. He isn't a great 8. He's behind Conan and Doris. But with more game time he could kick on a bit.

launish116

molloyjh wrote: »

Deegan is a good 8. He isn't a great 8. He's behind Conan and Doris. But with more game time he could kick on a bit.

Thought his mobility and skill/offloading would suit our open play quite well. Would definitely benefit with some game continuity in one position. Hopefully his injury doesn’t affect his game.

awec

molloyjh wrote: »

I wouldn't have said that about him tbh. At 8 he is used more in open play than in tight, but he's still well able to do whats asked of him. He's a decent defender, pretty good at ruck time etc. He's started HEC games as well as being capped for Ireland. You don't get that by being incapable of doing the grunt work.

Deegan is a good 8. He isn't a great 8. He's behind Conan and Doris. But with more game time he could kick on a bit.

The reason he's behind Conan and Doris, and is just a "good" 8, is because he doesn't bring enough grunt.

He's a highlights reel player.

launish116

awec wrote: »

The reason he's behind Conan and Doris, and is just a "good" 8, is because he doesn't bring enough grunt.

He's a highlights reel player.

Agree with Molloyjh little harsh on Deegan, he has 65 Leinster caps and they don’t come cheap with their squad.

Head & shoulders above anything we currently have at 6 or 8 and still only 24. Good can be coached to be great, plus he could add some more timber.

Think we’d be lucky to wrangle him if Coetzee was bought out. Mighten tick every box but beggars can’t be choosers.

awec

launish116 wrote: »

Agree with Molloyjh little harsh on Deegan, he has 65 Leinster caps and they don’t come cheap with their squad.

Head & shoulders above anything we currently have at 6 or 8 and still only 24. Good can be coached to be great, plus he could add some more timber.

Think we’d be lucky to wrangle him if Coetzee was bought out. Mighten tick every box but beggars can’t be choosers.

Is he?

I think some of our young lads would look great if they got to play in this Leinster team.

launish116

awec wrote: »

Is he?

I think some of our young lads would look great if they got to play in this Leinster team.

Some being?

McCann by far looking like our most talented player, hasn’t even got 80 mins senior rugby in total this season. He’s more a 6/7.

Rea Jnr has several caps at open side and would be below Penny in the pecking order.

Allison has one senior cap from last seasons kamikaze trip to Leinster.

Jones & Timoney were released by Leinster if i remember

Appreciate its apple & oranges, but Deegan would definitely add to our team in the absence of Coetzee. Nothing would please me more than a McCann, Rea Jnr & Allison back row going forward but we ain’t seen any of it.

awec

launish116 wrote: »

Some being?

McCann by far looking like our most talented player, hasn’t even got 80 mins senior rugby in total this season. He’s more a 6/7.

Rea Jnr has several caps at open side and would be below Penny in the pecking order.

Allison has one senior cap from last seasons kamikaze trip to Leinster.

Jones & Timoney were released by Leinster if i remember

Appreciate its apple & oranges, but Deegan would definitely add to our team in the absence of Coetzee. Nothing would please me more than a McCann, Rea Jnr & Allison back row going forward but we ain’t seen any of it.

You can't put stock in how little game time guys have had for Ulster. We don't have the luxury of being able to carry players through games. Leinster could field Dave Shanahan at number 8 and they'd still win the match, we wouldn't (though in fairness, this is probably not true this year in the league).

I think Rea is very good. I only saw a tiny bit of McCann, but he looked decent. I don't think Deegan is head and shoulders above either, he just benefits from a lot more hype because of the whole Leinster school thing.