Boyles acting the maggot again

RivetingRoger

Backed chief justice this morning @ 8/1
Went up to collect and they paid at 7/1 despite 8/1 on docket and on board at time. They claim their board was on a delay.......Had similar issue a few weeks back.
Yesterday they wouldn't pay out a FOBT bet as it was placed in different shop .....I refused to accept and eventually paid out to get rid of me

Mess

Marcus Rashford

That sounds like very bad form

dball

I was in a Boyles today - I place 3 bets , 2 X 2.50 E/W and 1 X 5 E/W, total €20
Your wan puts it through the till for €2 and writes €20 quid in ink beside it.

I didn't have my glasses on and couldn't see what she wrote - I was parked outside their door , got into the car and was able to read it.

I went back in and said this docket has a €2 total - she says its okay I have it written in up the ledger that its a €20 bet.

my ar5e, some serious fiddling going on in there I thought

Andrew00

There's a lad who works in Ladbrokes near me who's always doing that.

Let's say you give 30 quid for a horse he'd type in 3euro or 0.30c as your stake. When you call him out on it he'll say that he corrected the stake on the computer.

So if the horses losses he'll pocket almost 30 quid but when it wins its coming out of his pocket (or so I presume)

Always check the 'stake' part on your slip before u leave the shop

Motivator

Andrew00 wrote: »

There's a lad who works in Ladbrokes near me who's always doing that.

Let's say you give 30 quid for a horse he'd type in 3euro or 0.30c as your stake. When you call him out on it he'll say that he corrected the stake on the computer.

So if the horses losses he'll pocket almost 30 quid but when it wins its coming out of his pocket (or so I presume)

Always check the 'stake' part on your slip before u leave the shop

That doesn’t happen. There are hundreds of stake changes in shops every week due to staff error when typing in a bet, problems with the keyboard etc. If a shop has a high frequency of these then they’re checked into by security. I worked in fraud and securities for a high street firm and we regularly had to check out the records of shops. Very bad form of you to accuse a chap of theft, with the only reason for it is he makes mistakes.

NaiveMelodies

Motivator wrote: »

That doesn’t happen. There are hundreds of stake changes in shops every week due to staff error when typing in a bet, problems with the keyboard etc. If a shop has a high frequency of these then they’re checked into by security. I worked in fraud and securities for a high street firm and we regularly had to check out the records of shops. Very bad form of you to accuse a chap of theft, with the only reason for it is he makes mistakes.

The chap has a penchant for making up things.

lemush

Motivator wrote: »

That doesn’t happen. There are hundreds of stake changes in shops every week due to staff error when typing in a bet, problems with the keyboard etc. If a shop has a high frequency of these then they’re checked into by security. I worked in fraud and securities for a high street firm and we regularly had to check out the records of shops. Very bad form of you to accuse a chap of theft, with the only reason for it is he makes mistakes.

Spot on, some real idiots in this thread.

realdanbreen

This is a bugbear of mine for a long time.
I used feel that one particular cashier was leaving me slightly short on multiple bets and one time she was giving me back 71 instead of 79 and as soon as I said 'I thing you might be wrong there..' she straight away said oops my mistake . other times if I queried her she would mumble something about rule 4 and as soon as I said there was no rule 4 in that race she goes 'Oh what was I thinking of...'
If I was doing a multiple, patent, yankee etc I would always have the return totted up before presenting the docket to the cashier.

picachu

its not the staff receiving the money - boyles have been running bets off the books for the last 25 years

RivetingRoger

Can I just clarify I am not for one second accusing anyone of robbing me here, simply of being poor at their job or using flawed systems. Contrary to where some lads are taking this thread I am not inferring dishonesty on anyone's part

lemush

RivetingRoger wrote: »

Can I just clarify I am not for one second accusing anyone of robbing me here, simply of being poor at their job or using flawed systems. Contrary to where some lads are taking this thread I am not inferring dishonesty on anyone's part

A board delay is a fault that has zero to do with the employee behind the counter that you were no doubt giving out to, customer service is who you should be ringing and they should accommodate you at 8/1. The cashier cannot payout a price that’s minutes late unless they want to be disciplined.

realdanbreen

Happened again yesterday to a guy in front of me in the queue.
Clerk counted out €105 and the minute yer man said he was expecting €117 the clerk goes 'let me check that again.. your right it should be €117' .

UrbanFret

Ladbrokes Enniskillen. I put £10 on horse close to the off. the horse wins . When i go to collect the cashier informs me I was 5 seconds late and so the bet was void.I understand the latency in sat feeds etc. My gripe is if horse loses and I bin docket what happens to my stake?

Copper_pipe

UrbanFret wrote: »

Ladbrokes Enniskillen. I put £10 on horse close to the off. the horse wins . When i go to collect the cashier informs me I was 5 seconds late and so the bet was void.I understand the latency in sat feeds etc. My gripe is if horse loses and I bin docket what happens to my stake?

I think most bookies accept bets for a few seconds after the off. I know Powers do anyway. Your point is still valid though.

RivetingRoger

U get your stake back ya?

lemush

UrbanFret wrote: »

Ladbrokes Enniskillen. I put £10 on horse close to the off. the horse wins . When i go to collect the cashier informs me I was 5 seconds late and so the bet was void.I understand the latency in sat feeds etc. My gripe is if horse loses and I bin docket what happens to my stake?

No leeway with ladbrokes with regards after the off. Cashier wouldn’t know it was void until they translated it.

Mostly Harmless

I certainly do not believe in the idea that there is some grand conspiracy of betting shop staff trying to rip off the punter as some here seem to think but it is a valid point that if the bet loses they would not be calling you back to refund the stake.

realdanbreen

Mostly Harmless wrote: »

I certainly do not believe in the idea that there is some grand conspiracy of betting shop staff trying to rip off the punter as some here seem to think but it is a valid point that if the bet loses they would not be calling you back to refund the stake.

I haven't seen any post here suggesting that there is any conspiracy 'grand' or otherwise. I do know however that fiddling goes on and have seen several employees from various bookies get the road for fiddling. Like I say having been done before I now always make sure to tot up my bet beforehand if it is a multiple.

Mostly Harmless

Just seems to be an opinion that there are lots of staff out there with an agenda to screw customers, cannot say I have ever really come across staff intentionally leaving me short on payouts, in my experience the majority of incorrect payouts are due to bet details being input incorrectly.

The Rooster

Best advice is to make sure you know how much you are due.
Too many people have no clue what they're due back, and this leaves an opportunity for the unscrupulous to take advantage. And like in most walks of life there'll be those who work in betting shops.

It reminds me of late night in a crowded pub in city centre. Hand over 50 notes for 3 or 4 drinks, and just put all the change in the your pocket without knowing if it's right or not. By law of averages you're going to get screwed now and again for a few euro. Doesn't mean all, or even many, barmen are crooks. But there's a few out there.

lemush

Mostly Harmless wrote: »

Just seems to be an opinion that there are lots of staff out there with an agenda to screw customers, cannot say I have ever really come across staff intentionally leaving me short on payouts, in my experience the majority of incorrect payouts are due to bet details being input incorrectly.

What you have in this thread are the daily two bob plagues who think they own the place. The same heads that when they walk in the employee behind the desk loses another bit of whatever will they have left.

RivetingRoger

lemush wrote: »

What you have in this thread are the daily two bob plagues who think they own the place. The same heads that when they walk in the employee behind the desk loses another bit of whatever will they have left.

Funny that, cos every time you enter a thread on here everyone else says "oh christ there's that clown lemush"

Andrew00

lemush wrote: »

What you have in this thread are the daily two bob plagues who think they own the place. The same heads that when they walk in the employee behind the desk loses another bit of whatever will they have left.

Spot on

The Mig

I know of an entire shop staff sacked for pocketing money they shouldn't have been

KaneToad

Stumbled into this thread. Am not a gambler. I am intrigued however to hear so many people talking about bookie shops. Given that you all post on internet foras, you are obviously somewhat tech savvy. Why do you not do your gambling online? Is the bookies experience better in some way ?

Genuine question from someone who knows nothing about this subject!

Andrew00

KaneToad wrote: »

Stumbled into this thread. Am not a gambler. I am intrigued however to hear so many people talking about bookie shops. Given that you all post on internet foras, you are obviously somewhat tech savvy. Why do you not do your gambling online? Is the bookies experience better in some way ?

Genuine question from someone who knows nothing about this subject!

Cus some lads in here can lose the shirt on their back via online gambling. Too easily accessible but then again suppose the shops are too

eoing90

Happened to me three times in paddy power before. One bet I had on for the football , the man behind the counter told me the odds changed at 3 o clock , the bet was placed at 12 o clock. Again trying to swindle you out of a few bob. Stood my ground after the third time and eventually the manager paid out.

IAMAMORON

KaneToad wrote: »

Stumbled into this thread. Am not a gambler. I am intrigued however to hear so many people talking about bookie shops. Given that you all post on internet foras, you are obviously somewhat tech savvy. Why do you not do your gambling online? Is the bookies experience better in some way ?

Genuine question from someone who knows nothing about this subject!

It can be nice to go into a bookies and shoot the breeze with other punters, or maybe shout " pox bottle " , or " ****" really loudly at the screen whilst throwing your losing bet slip across the floor.

You just can't get that experience online tbh.

stryker mcqueen

Speaking of Boyles , I am currently waiting on an online withdrawal since last Saturday , anyone experience delayed withdrawals lately?

BoroMan32

It certainly can and does happen that staff members in some shops will be on the take in some way (two in our local boyles got the bullet for this reason supposedly) but it's not all that common I'd imagine and as others have said, there are plenty of online calculators to work out what returns you're due etc so it's always best to know......

It's actually quite frightening the amount of lads in shops you'll see asking what a 'Rule 4' even means. I understand not everyone knows the nuances of betting but you shouldn't really be betting without a grasp of the basics.

With regards to bets after the off, if you think there's a doubt as to whether a bet is on in time, it's always best to ask the cashier if it's ok when you place the bet. It is sharp practice in some (probably most) bookies to keep the bets that have been made void; though in the odd case you will see cashiers telling regulars that their bet was late and refunding their money.

WicklowBrave

Love hitting up a bookies on my walk home from work and flaking a stool across the room after doing my weeks wages on a virtual.

RivetingRoger

WicklowBrave wrote: »

Love hitting up a bookies on my walk home from work and flaking a stool across the room after doing my weeks wages on a virtual.

WAS THAT YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:mad:

realdanbreen

The next fella that reaches over my shoulder to place a e2 on trap 5 while I'm trying to get on a serious bet will be lamped!

RivetingRoger

KaneToad wrote: »

Stumbled into this thread. Am not a gambler. I am intrigued however to hear so many people talking about bookie shops. Given that you all post on internet foras, you are obviously somewhat tech savvy. Why do you not do your gambling online? Is the bookies experience better in some way ?

Genuine question from someone who knows nothing about this subject!

For me to do a bet, i have to get off my fat arse and walk to a shop
If I had phone betting I would be living under a bridge on the M7 eating insects and grass

Happy4all

RivetingRoger wrote: »

Backed chief justice this morning @ 8/1
Went up to collect and they paid at 7/1 despite 8/1 on docket and on board at time. They claim their board was on a delay.......Had similar issue a few weeks back.
Yesterday they wouldn't pay out a FOBT bet as it was placed in different shop .....I refused to accept and eventually paid out to get rid of me

Mess

Has it ever happened the other way round for anyone?

That is you were giving a higher pay out because the delay on the board didn't pick up the drifting price. I some how doubt it.

Motivator

Something that not many will know about is the “sleeper” dockets in shops. These are the dockets that haven’t been collected by customers, void bets that haven’t been cashed, bonus money on a docket that hadn’t settled up by the time the customer collected the docket etc.

I remember a shop that had sleeper dockets that amounted to a a seven figure sum. Mind boggling to think how much money goes unclaimed in shops across the country each year....

FatRat

Motivator wrote: »

Something that not many will know about is the “sleeper” dockets in shops. These are the dockets that haven’t been collected by customers, void bets that haven’t been cashed, bonus money on a docket that hadn’t settled up by the time the customer collected the docket etc.

I remember a shop that had sleeper dockets that amounted to a a seven figure sum. Mind boggling to think how much money goes unclaimed in shops across the country each year....

This would actually be a decent research topic. Money to be made there alone.. lost dockets, people forgetting small bets that end being a large sum total etc.

The online bookies really do have it best though with people keeping hundreds or even thousands in their accounts without withdrawals. Would I be write in saying that bookies only need to keep reserves of some of this money, similar to a bank? Or can it not be touched.

Interesting stuff all the same

RivetingRoger

Motivator wrote: »

Something that not many will know about is the “sleeper” dockets in shops. These are the dockets that haven’t been collected by customers, void bets that haven’t been cashed, bonus money on a docket that hadn’t settled up by the time the customer collected the docket etc.

I remember a shop that had sleeper dockets that amounted to a a seven figure sum. Mind boggling to think how much money goes unclaimed in shops across the country each year....

I bet a large share of that is people with like, one place on an ew Lucky 15 who couldnt be arsed going in to collect it!
I have been that soldier i have to admit

4068ac1elhodqr

Motivator wrote: »

Something that not many will know about is the “sleeper” dockets in shops. These are the dockets that haven’t been collected by customers, void bets that haven’t been cashed, bonus money on a docket that hadn’t settled up by the time the customer collected the docket etc.

Was about 6wks late, last year collecting a place on the GNat, the junior deskjockey there, looking at the screen said aloud "sleeper, what's that?", the bossman beside him said 'nothing, nothing, just pay it'.

Same shop the year before tried to pull out of a NRNB (that was displayed as such on screens at time of placing), until their HQ got a quick phone call.

Only today, at another much smaller indie shop, went to collect on pairofbrowneyes (NR), the fella said ah sure that didn't run, and shook his head, I said NRNB terms, was withdrawn just before the GNat, he quickly handed back the stake.

Luckily, only visit them for novelty/tv markets, and the annual GNat, when I dump a bag of coinage that the banks would otherwise refuse or charge to take.

FatRat wrote: »

The online bookies really do have it best though with people keeping hundreds or even thousands in their accounts without withdrawals. Would I be write in saying that bookies only need to keep reserves of some of this money, similar to a bank? Or can it not be touched.

They'd likely have the funds ready (as was deposited, unless they're sidelining into speculative investments).

Unlike fiat currency which is a paper money 'promise', unbacked by physical gold or silver. Some main banks may only need to hold 10% of what they loan out, entrusting they'll see the promise returned with interest, charges or repossession if needed.

Andrew00

They're conmen I've learned this down the years. And clowns like NaiveMelodies can say whatever they want about me

FatRat

Georgia Proud Sandbox wrote: »

They'd likely have the funds ready (as was deposited, unless they're sidelining into speculative investments).

Unlike fiat currency which is a paper money 'promise', unbacked by physical gold or silver. Some main banks may only need to hold 10% of what they loan out, entrusting they'll see the promise returned with interest, charges or repossession if needed.

Banks usually need 15-20% depending on reserve regulation. I would assume that bookies would need some sort of banking licence to allow them to reinvest but I would be shocked if they left that free capital sit around waiting to be withdrawn. I would assume they have teams of actuaries and investors who's sole roles are to squeeze every penny out of the idle cash.

Stheno

FatRat wrote: »

Banks usually need 15-20% depending on reserve regulation. I would assume that bookies would need some sort of banking licence to allow them to reinvest but I would be shocked if they left that free capital sit around waiting to be withdrawn. I would assume they have teams of actuaries and investors who's sole roles are to squeeze every penny out of the idle cash.

They do indeed

Pauliedragon

I think the thread title is a bit harsh. I used to work in a bookies and it's not as straight forward as it looks. Boards are constantly displaying prices that are different to the real price. This is not the fault of the customer nor the cashier behind the desk, the dopes at head offoce are either incometent or don't care about being up to date. Customers constantly trying to put late bets on when the race is half over. Writing the wrong time/meeting on the docket then coming back later asking to change a losing docket. Oh "I meant the 4.15 not the 3.45" Ya right. I'm not saying they're arent dishonest people in bookies out there but it is heavily watched. Any time I changed a bet my manger got a message and he /she double checked it so if I was putting 3 euro thru instead of 30 it would've been picked up on straight away. And don't get me started on peoples writing. My 3 year old nephew can write better then a lot of customers I dealt with. To answer the question about a late bet you should get your stake back.

slimshady007

My tuppence worth (not specific to any single bookie):
A punter should ALWAYS know how much they should get back when going to collect. Can count at least 20 times when cashiers paid out less and I had to correct them to get the correct amount. There has been the odd occasion when I've been paid extra (mainly due to the bet been settled as a full stake win rather than each way). Depending on my customer experience with the cashier I did alert them to their mistake sometimes.

If you're betting after the off ALWAYS check the bet got on in time before you leave the counter. You may miss some of the race but better than cheering home a winner only to be told the bet was void and stake refunded. Or worse, binning your docket after a loser when it was already voided to start with. I actually done all this one time in PP, horse won, went to collect and the cashier said the bet was void. She was new so I didn't go too harsh on her but it took a good half hour before the manager agreed to pay me and he ate the head of the newbie which I felt a bit bad about.

The worst cashier I ever came across was in a PP shop in South Dublin. Brutally slow at settling bets - would take the slip and tell you to come back in 5 minutes (for every single bet to collect). Constantly short changing bet returns and was constantly eating behind the desk. One time she was eating a chicken fillet roll, in the middle of placing my bet she slobbered some coleslaw on the docket, wiped it off with her snotrag, gave me the docket and said "sorry about that".

I'd really appreciate some insight from those in the know. Why are so many short changed - is this not all automated and the correct amount not displayed on the cashiers screen? Surely bookies aren't in favour of staff eating behind the counter?

lemush

slimshady007 wrote: »

My tuppence worth (not specific to any single bookie):
A punter should ALWAYS know how much they should get back when going to collect. Can count at least 20 times when cashiers paid out less and I had to correct them to get the correct amount. There has been the odd occasion when I've been paid extra (mainly due to the bet been settled as a full stake win rather than each way). Depending on my customer experience with the cashier I did alert them to their mistake sometimes.

If you're betting after the off ALWAYS check the bet got on in time before you leave the counter. You may miss some of the race but better than cheering home a winner only to be told the bet was void and stake refunded. Or worse, binning your docket after a loser when it was already voided to start with. I actually done all this one time in PP, horse won, went to collect and the cashier said the bet was void. She was new so I didn't go too harsh on her but it took a good half hour before the manager agreed to pay me and he ate the head of the newbie which I felt a bit bad about.

The worst cashier I ever came across was in a PP shop in South Dublin. Brutally slow at settling bets - would take the slip and tell you to come back in 5 minutes (for every single bet to collect). Constantly short changing bet returns and was constantly eating behind the desk. One time she was eating a chicken fillet roll, in the middle of placing my bet she slobbered some coleslaw on the docket, wiped it off with her snotrag, gave me the docket and said "sorry about that".

I'd really appreciate some insight from those in the know. Why are so many short changed - is this not all automated and the correct amount not displayed on the cashiers screen? Surely bookies aren't in favour of staff eating behind the counter?

Re eating behind the counter - When I worked in a bookies years ago you wouldn’t get a chance to go for lunch so you would have to eat behind the counter more often than not. The addicts don’t take breaks. Edit: the bookmakers couldn’t give a **** about their employees either, as long as they are taking people’s money they couldn’t care less if you have a lunch or not.

Re automated pay outs - each bet has to be translated by the cashier, if translated correctly no problem with payout but nearly 90% of dockets consist of wrong/late prices. Mistakes do also happen especially when translating thousands of dockets, many with writing that you wouldn’t see in a nursery.

handsfree2

FatRat wrote: »

Banks usually need 15-20% depending on reserve regulation. I would assume that bookies would need some sort of banking licence to allow them to reinvest but I would be shocked if they left that free capital sit around waiting to be withdrawn. I would assume they have teams of actuaries and investors who's sole roles are to squeeze every penny out of the idle cash.

It's much lower than that

Until January 2012, banks had to hold a minimum of 2% of certain liabilities, mainly customers’ deposits, at their national central bank. Since then, this ratio has been lowered to 1%. The total reserve requirements for euro area banks stand at around 113 billion euro (beginning of 2016).

https://www.ecb.europa.eu/explainers/tell-me/html/minimum_reserve_req.en.html

There are no requirements/regs for bookies so their only requirement is to ensure that they have enough working capital to pay day to day expenses.

Shemale

IAMAMORON wrote: »

It can be nice to go into a bookies and shoot the breeze with other punters, or maybe shout " pox bottle " , or " ****" really loudly at the screen whilst throwing your losing bet slip across the floor.

You just can't get that experience online tbh.

You forgot "useless jockey cost me"

realdanbreen

I had Labaik @ 33/1 when he won the supreme a couple of years ago. I duly collected €200+. I also had him backed NRNB in another Cheltenham race that he was entered in and went with my docket to collect my €5 e/w back.
Lo and behold the clerk handed me out €200+ !
I was amazed as I thought the cashier would have had to scan the docket or whatever.

Mostly Harmless

State of this thread

IAMAMORON

Shemale wrote: »

You forgot "useless jockey cost me"

I am capable of a whole spectrum of alternative colourful language when it comes to criticizing the performance of jockeys. Best not repeated, I think there is scope for an entire new thread on that one.

realdanbreen

Mostly Harmless wrote: »

State of this thread

You should have a lie down after that post, I mean William Shakespeare wouldn't be able to compose a post like that!:D