CUMH mother and baby incident

pwurple

Just saw that poor baby in CUMH died...

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/baby-of-woman-found-dead-in-cumh-in-critical-condition-913501.html

So sad. And really brings back those memories of being alone in the CUMH rooms after giving birth with the baby, heavily bleeding, with no assistance for hours.

MarkR

That is NOT a feel good story. We have two children, born ten years apart (both in Limerick). Massive difference in the level of support you got with our first. You'd need to be coding for anyone to come into you second time around.

lawred2

I was stopped in my tracks this morning taking the young fella to creche when I heard that story.

Just so awful for that family. I believe that she had two other children and I presume a partner. The grief and pain that some people have to endure is just simply not fair.

lawred2

MarkR wrote: »

That is NOT a feel good story. We have two children, born ten years apart (both in Limerick). Massive difference in the level of support you got with our first. You'd need to be coding for anyone to come into you second time around.

That is something my wife and I can't say about the Rotunda. Three children spread across 5 years. Top notch care each and every time and they weren't all straightforward.

First required forceps and cutting
Second resulted in young fella in ICU for three weeks
Third was a c-section

Neyite

It's such a sad story.



I know single rooms give much more dignity and privacy to the patient but the wards give visibility to others if you suddenly need help such as falling or having a medical episode - someone can hit the call button for you.

Digs

Some stories just gut punch you and this is one of them. I recently had my third baby, like she did, I can’t stop thinking about her and her poor baby.

It’s just the saddest story.

SusieBlue

I understand the baby has since also passed away, due to the extensive physical and brain injuries incurred.
Its one of the saddest, most tragic stories I've ever heard.
It beggars belief how it even happened.

Thoughts are with her poor family, this should have been one of the happiest times of their lives and its ended like this.
Just tragic.

TheBoyConor

The hospital has described the incident, which took place this morning, as “a tragic occurrence”.

What are we to infer from this? Is it case of died in "tragic circumstances"?

mitresize5

no - she fell getting out of bed, unfortunately on top of the new born

theres nothing to read between the lines

SusieBlue

TheBoyConor wrote: »

The hospital has described the incident, which took place this morning, as “a tragic occurrence”.

What are we to infer from this? Is it case of died in "tragic circumstances"?

They believe she either had a fit or some sort of collapsing episode and fell out of the bed with the baby in her arms, and landed on top of the child.

She was in a private room, therefore no one was around to raise the alarm until she was checked on an hour later by staff. I believe they were checking on an hourly basis, and it happened in between checks.

It was a perfect storm. I live locally and heard the staff who found her were in bits. Its just so sad, its awful for them too.

Milly33

So horrible, heard it also on the radio this morning that the little one passed away. Really very sad, I hope that this was a horrible accident and not something like negligence..

Very hard really feel for the family

whiskeyman

One of the papers online speculated a possible medical seizure of sorts, but all were corrected to a tragic incident after / while breastfeeding.

That poor family and partner especially.
From the elation of the best news and sending texts to family and friends of your new addition to this.
Heartbreaking

Thiught with the staff members and other mother's on the ward.

TheBoyConor

It could have been an aneurysm or stroke or something.

seamus

TheBoyConor wrote: »

The hospital has described the incident, which took place this morning, as “a tragic occurrence”.

What are we to infer from this? Is it case of died in "tragic circumstances"?

No, I don't think that's it.

I think the implication is that it was a random but serious and unforseeable incident not caused by complications of childbirth. It doesn't necessarily have to have been a stroke or a seizure. Even a simple slip getting out of bed could have been fatal, especially as her instinct would have tried to protect the baby rather than break her own fall.
Of course, one would expect the hospital to avoid saying anything which could suggest fault. So...

I can't imagine getting this news, it's desperately sad.

It may not necessarily have been an issue in this case, but I certainly think hospitals - maternity ones in particular - should make a big deal of encouraging patients to use the call bell for any and all assistance, no matter how frivolous. Patients feel like they're bothering the nursing staff and would rather try sort it themselves first, but you can end up in serious bother.

shesty

Mod Note

Please refrain from conjecture as to the possible reasons behind this incident.

pwurple

Neyite wrote: »

It's such a sad story.



I know single rooms give much more dignity and privacy to the patient but the wards give visibility to others if you suddenly need help such as falling or having a medical episode - someone can hit the call button for you.

There are no wards in CUMH by deisgn, it's single, double or 4 bed rooms. I was in a double room for both of my births there, on my own for a lot of the time.

They do Rooming in there. I wonder will this result in a review of that process.

pwurple

lawred2 wrote: »

That is something my wife and I can't say about the Rotunda. Three children spread across 5 years. Top notch care each and every time and they weren't all straightforward.

First required forceps and cutting
Second resulted in young fella in ICU for three weeks
Third was a c-section

I don't think is about the birth though, I couldn't fault my care either.

It's more about women and babies being left alone in beds afterwards, and the risk there.

LouD2016

I had my son in a midlands hospital almost two years and I remember not getting to close my eyes for ten minutes without a doctor or a nurse coming into the room and checking something. At the time it felt annoying but hearing this story im glad for it now.

So so sad for the family.

shesty

Have also had three in the Rotunda, and they are constantly checking you.

Such a sad, sad story.As someone else said, it really hit me in the gut when I saw it.

lazygal

Couldn't stop thinking about this. I was the same as as her having my third, got a private room following a c section. I was checked regularly but there was certainly an hour between checks where it was me and baby alone, even though my husband and mother were regular visitors. I don't know what should happen going forward. Rooming in was my preferred option for breastfeeding. I hated being on larger wards, my recovery was much easier once I got my own room and I needed the privacy. The poor children who've lost a brother and mother, it is just an awful situation.

The HorsesMouth

Really felt the need to post

I had my 2nd baby last year in a midlands hospital. I had a c section and I have to say the care I received was poor at times. My first night there the nurses were so busy they could not help feed/change baby. So I had to make sure I had everything within arms reach. I rang the bell but they would just take baby out and hand them to me and go again..and they kept saying how busy they were etc and making me feel like i would be bothering them if I asked for help. Bare in mind i still could not move my legs from the c section. I'm not saying that thats what happened this poor woman and her baby in Cork but I think there is definitely a conversation to be had about the dropping standards on maternity wards..through no fault of the nurses themselves, they are just so under pressure.

lawred2

pwurple wrote: »

I don't think is about the birth though, I couldn't fault my care either.

It's more about women and babies being left alone in beds afterwards, and the risk there.

I'm speaking exactly of the frequency of checks... it was constant

LouD2016

The HorsesMouth wrote: »

Really felt the need to post

I had my 2nd baby last year in a midlands hospital. I had a c section and I have to say the care I received was poor at times. My first night there the nurses were so busy they could not help feed/change baby. So I had to make sure I had everything within arms reach. I rang the bell but they would just take baby out and hand them to me and go again..and they kept saying how busy they were etc and making me feel like i would be bothering them if I asked for help. Bare in mind i still could not move my legs from the c section. I'm not saying that thats what happened this poor woman and her baby in Cork but I think there is definitely a conversation to be had about the dropping standards on maternity wards..through no fault of the nurses themselves, they are just so under pressure.

We were talking about this today and a colleague of mine said the exact same. She had no help in the ward after her section and had to sleep with the baby on the bed with her as she was unable to lift the baby into the crib beside the bed.
You can see how accidents can happen

lazygal

The HorsesMouth wrote: »

Really felt the need to post

I had my 2nd baby last year in a midlands hospital. I had a c section and I have to say the care I received was poor at times. My first night there the nurses were so busy they could not help feed/change baby. So I had to make sure I had everything within arms reach. I rang the bell but they would just take baby out and hand them to me and go again..and they kept saying how busy they were etc and making me feel like i would be bothering them if I asked for help. Bare in mind i still could not move my legs from the c section. I'm not saying that thats what happened this poor woman and her baby in Cork but I think there is definitely a conversation to be had about the dropping standards on maternity wards..through no fault of the nurses themselves, they are just so under pressure.

I had the worst care after having my second baby. I had a wristband stating I was allergic to a common painkiller and on the semi private ward every single nurse who brought me pain relief failed to note my allergy. I had to remind them, I dread to think what could have happened if I wasn't able to communicate well. That wasn't nursing staff being overstretched, that was carelessness. I learned that you have to be the squeaky wheel, pain in the arse patient to get attention too. The care improved dramatically once I got onto a private ward with my own room.

tretorn

I visited a young relative in a Holles Street public ward and it was just horrible. Beds packed in together and the new mums had to push the baby to another room to change them, I dont think there was even a sink in this eight bedded room, it was just beds lined up along two walls with horrible plastic curtains between them.

SusieBlue

The HorsesMouth wrote: »

Really felt the need to post

I had my 2nd baby last year in a midlands hospital. I had a c section and I have to say the care I received was poor at times. My first night there the nurses were so busy they could not help feed/change baby. So I had to make sure I had everything within arms reach. I rang the bell but they would just take baby out and hand them to me and go again..and they kept saying how busy they were etc and making me feel like i would be bothering them if I asked for help. Bare in mind i still could not move my legs from the c section. I'm not saying that thats what happened this poor woman and her baby in Cork but I think there is definitely a conversation to be had about the dropping standards on maternity wards..through no fault of the nurses themselves, they are just so under pressure.

My cousin had a very traumatic birth in CUMH last year, it was her first baby, 30 hour labor, failed forceps followed by an emergency section.
Baby was eventually born at around 1am in the morning, and her partner was only allowed stay until just after 2am, when he was made leave.

They were both first time parents in their early 20's, she had a long painful labor and a traumatic birth.
She was absolutely exhausted, she had no idea what to do with a baby and she was immobile from the waist down.
She was basically abandoned and left to her own devices. She kept buzzing for help but was made feel a nuisance of because they were so busy.

Eventually when her mum came to visit the next day (at which point she'd still had no sleep since going into labor) and saw how upset and distressed her daughter was, she ripped the midwife in a charge a new one. Her care after that improved but it was too little too late.

The aftercare was absolutely shocking.

margo321

such a sad case. so sad for family.

shesty

Some of these stories are shocking.As with another poster I have had three in the Rotunda in the last four years.The first time the staff were totally overstretched, it was absolute chaos (semi-p).By the time my third arrived last year it was unbelievable the change that had taken place.Staff are certainly busy and stretched, but they came to help when needed, carried out observations regularly, pharmacist came every morning and introduced themselves and asked about any drug allergies (every morning...), the whole thing felt a lot more seamless, although I could see they were still understaffed.

That thing Holles St have of making mothers wheel the baby down the hall to change them -I just do not get that.Even C-section mothers.What is that for??Sorry, I rarely criticise individual hospitals because you have good and bad in both, but I cannot make sense of that.

There is no doubt but maternity services in this country need a major overhaul to a point where they are all brought in line, instead of practices varying so much between hospitals.

I know this is totally off the point of the thread, but it angers me so much.And if I were some of you I would stand up and go back and complain.Childbirth is a natural thing, so we don't view it in the same light as an operation or an injury, but it doesn't mean we should lie down and take whatever is dished out to us in the circumstances either.The thing is that BECAUSE it is a process ending in a predictable result,it should be easier to standardise the care for it across the hospitals. Things won't improve unless we shout about it.

pwurple

You know you're right shesty, we kind of accept it once we're out the far side with a healthy baby. I did write a letter after my first baby about that, and got a response about how "rooming in" was policy for breastfeeding, and visiting hours were there for women to get rest. They don't see that those two things conflict.


I simply don't get how it can be best practice to leave a woman alone in a room to look after a newborn after giving birth. Visitors were banned from my stays as well. My mum, friends or husband would gladly have stayed with me, to give me a hand, but were kicked out.

It is the riskiest time in a woman's life. You can heamorrhage, fall, anything. We should be minded, looked after in those days after birth. Not put in a room, immobile, with the sole responsibility for a newborn. And I don't mean wards of other women who are also in labour or who have just given birth. I mean have family, or a doula or nurse or porter or someone there to help out.

lazygal

I noticed a significant difference between having my third in September 2018 and my other two five and six years ago, all in Holles Street. The care and many other things were significantly better. I didn't bother wheeling baby to change, I changed him on a towel on the bed. No one insisted we leave the room to change baby.

Neyite

pwurple wrote: »

There are no wards in CUMH by deisgn, it's single, double or 4 bed rooms. I was in a double room for both of my births there, on my own for a lot of the time.

They do Rooming in there. I wonder will this result in a review of that process.

They do it here too. I'd say they'll look at everything but probably until the cause of death is determined they won't know where exactly to focus the investigation.