Munster Team Talk Thread - Snymans are(n't) Forever

aloooof

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117823679#Comment_117823679

I understand that line of argument and think it’s reasonable. I don’t understand anyone arguing Munster should be doing it to help the local economy tho.

sprucemoose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117823766#Comment_117823766

i understand and in fairness youre making alot more logical arguments than others are, but i suppose on the other hand i would say that munster should try and support the economy of their supporters if possible. now, if there were no suitable venue then thats fair enough but i do think supporting the local economy of the area it represents is actually a reason to try and keep any such games in the province. in general it is the people of cork and limerick (and kerry, clare, tipp and waterford) that buy the tickets to support the team so i do think it would be best to indirectly help them in return

Lost Ormond

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117823679#Comment_117823679

Sure Munster senior teams never played in Clare, Tipp, Kerry and once in Waterford... very little to do with them.

Leinster havent played in majority of counties in the province. Leinster very little to do with all those counties.

They play in Cork as there was a tradition of splitting the games between the two. The numbers continuing to come through to the pro game, the advances of club teams to higher levels within the city and county as in many getting much stronger and doing much better than past show interest in the sport isnt at all dropping. A Munster semi final being played in Cork wont change things dramatically if interest is dropping like you suggest it is.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822851#Comment_117822851

When did Munster last win a big, big game in the Aviva? the players might be used to the venue, but they aren't used to winning there at any rate.

there are a lot of non-financial reasons to play in PuC imo. It's easy to be dismissive but a big knock out game there would be great for the casual fan in South Munster. People who post on here and on forums generally are not the fans Munster need to reach, they already have them. They need the money from the guy who may or may not go, who doesn't care about owning the latest jersey but might get one for his kids etc. Playing a game, even a one-off, in Dublin does little to build the brand with the casual fans that all clubs need.

The pandemic has probably ended any chance of a PuC game any time soon (though we don't know the respective costs associated with each venue) as right now Munster and the IRFU need every penny they can get. If the figures make sense for PuC (and as we don't know what they are, they might) we'll see games there eventually.

Cookiemunster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117823536#Comment_117823536

The same company running the bars in the Aviva and PUC is irrelevant. They are two completely separate contracts giving back different amounts to the stadium owners.

Lets do some comparisons on the money making facilities.

PUC - 18 public bars. Aviva - 30 public bars.

PUC - 9 food kiosks. Aviva - 23 food kiosks.

PUC - 2000 capacity function room. Aviva - 10,000 premium seats plus 36 corporate boxes (each with its own bar) that can house 1300 people.

The simple fact is that the IRFU will make sure that the stadium rental is better that whatever would be charged by PUC and the EPCR will make far far more money from the corporate facilities and the larger all seated capacity at the Aviva than they would at PUC. That will always win.

sprucemoose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117823822#Comment_117823822

id be more than happy if some of the games did get played in those counties though. id imagine all of the suitable venues are GAA owned however and some probably are in need of upgrade. they also do not have the populations that limerick and to an even bigger extent, cork, have, however if it were a possibility id be all for a semi in semple stadium or killarney. i do however think it would be fairly accurate to say that if were played in one of these stadia then the majority of supporters would not be local and would have to travel, whereas at least in cork/limerick a fairly decent amount of supporters do not have to travel far, certainly not as far as dublin anyway.

leinster havent played outside dublin much because dublin has by far the highest population in the province so it makes sense to be based there. if thats your argument then munster should be solely based in cork based on it having the highest population in the province

splitting the games between the two - splitting the games equally or near to equal would be fine, the current lack of games in cork simply isnt

interest in the sport isnt at all dropping - it simply is, refuse to accept it all you want but it is, participation numbers are dropping. my old club(s) have had to drop the numbers of senior teams and merge with other clubs at certain age levels, not uncommon in many clubs at the moment. lack of senior games in cork isnt the only problem, but it is a significant one

A Munster semi final being played in Cork wont change things dramatically if interest is dropping like you suggest it is - look at the increase of numbers in the womens game post rwc 2017 and think again

Cookiemunster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117823827#Comment_117823827

Munster play all their home games in either Limerick or Cork. When it comes to a Euro semi, that's not a home game. It's played at a neutral venue and they don't have a say where the game is played. I've already shown in my above post why, for financial reasons, a Euro semi is not going to be played anywhere other than the Aviva.

Clareman

If it wasn't for the history of Thomond Park Cork would be the 1 venue, it's the larger population base if nothing else, I'm sure most of the bean counters in the IRFU would prefer Munster to have a 26k stadium in Cork rather than Limerick.

Lost Ormond

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117823827#Comment_117823827

And what different would playing in a Cork venue we've never played rugby in before actually bring. The costs are very different when you are talking about a non IRFU owned stadium being used compared to the Aviva.

Cookiemunster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117823880#Comment_117823880

The drop in playing numbers and clubs dropping teams below senior is also happening to Limerick clubs. It's got nothing to do with where Munster play.

There were no games in Cork last year because of Covid. It was pointless playing there in an empty ground when the squad is based in Limerick. In the full seasons before that MP had 4 games and TP lost the game when 10 home games rather than 11. It's not financially viable to move more games to Cork and have a 50/50 split as there are more tickets sold to each match in TP that the capacity of MP (regardless of how many turn up). MP shoiuld have been increased to 18K around the same time as TP was increased, but CCC shot down the planning and then the recession struck. Remember the branch is still based in Cork, so there isn't actually a Limerick bias.

Former Former Former

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117823926#Comment_117823926

Yep, this is exactly it.

Why on earth would the IRFU give a large chunk of cash over to the GAA when they could keep it for themselves?

Lost Ormond

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117823880#Comment_117823880

A semi final in Thurles or Killarney would have same draw backs as Cork. Paying rent to another organisation which we shouldnt and wouldnt need to do.

If our fans didnt and werent known for travelling it may be more of an issue but our fans are more than used to going to Dublin for biggest games anyway be it GAA or internationals. Cork does have the biggest population but that doesnt mean you should have to be playing your biggest games there. Splitting games on a more even basis between cork and Limerick doesnt make financial sense. We developed one stadium to 25000 capacity. Moving more games from that stadium doesnt make sense.

Interest isnt dropping if you look at number of clubs participating in age grade rugby. There are some clubs merging at some age groups but across Munster as a whole numbers playing are increasing. Ive been involved as a player or coach and as an official in age grade rugby for nearly 20 years. Numbers are much higher than in the past. Some clubs are merging at some age groups because of many different factors but overall playing numbers are much higher than past.

sprucemoose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117823894#Comment_117823894

and it has been pointed out why any such decision should not be made on a purely financial basis

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117823910#Comment_117823910

true, id have no problem with the majority of the games being played in limerick though if every so often there'd be a big european game in cork

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117823926#Comment_117823926

bringing a game to local supporters who very rarely get to see their team play locally, not to be underestimated seeing as munster is very a team connected to its supporters. or its meant to be at least

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117823988#Comment_117823988

the drop in limerick numbers is partly due to an increased push by hurling to recruit players and improve their success. seems to have worked fairly well

no problem with no games in cork last year. they could play them all in the training pitches in UL for all it matters when there were no supporters. as i said previously if an even split is not financially viable then why play any games in cork at all? a half full thomond still has a higher capacity than IIP/Musgrave so sure just have all the games there if money is all that matters

part of the reason planning was refused for that capacity was due to the redevelopment of PUC then the city does not need three stadia of 15k+ capacity - which i agree, one large stadium should be more than enough in any of our cities between the main sports but due to the unique way the gaa works thats not usually viable. anyway i digress - and one of the conditions of PUC planning was that it be available for other uses if such a need arises.

sprucemoose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117824055#Comment_117824055

im not suggesting they be played there, im just saying id see no problem in the hypothetical situation that a game were to be played there

just because we're used to travelling doesnt mean PUC shouldnt be considered. up until recently it wasnt fit for purpose and so it wasnt considered, now it is and it should be an option (the primary option imo) if a 'home' semi arises.

as i have previously said, if it just about money then why play any games in cork at all so? are the branch not just throwing money away so by gracing us mere peasants with a few games against generally poor opposition every season? usually when internationals arent available either i might add

yerrahbah

https://twitter.com/Munsterrugby/status/1432347417844854790

Jenkins looks massive 😲

Cookiemunster

Not being able to edit quotes on this new site is a PITA.

@sprucemoose Before Covid ever kicked in Munster were in debt and struggling to break even each season. It's only gotten worse since then. It's a professional sport so finance is always the first priority, especially so now.

yerrahbah

Hazarding a guess at the teams for the W/E

I'm guessing anyone involved with Ireland vs the USA and Japan will be unavailable

Niall Scannell just got married so may be unavailable

Team 1:

Loughman

N. Scannell

Archer

Ahern

Jenkins

O'Donoghue

J.Daly

Okeke

N.Cronin

Crowley

L.Coombes

R. Scannell

McHenry

Nash

Haley

Team 2:

L. O'Connor

KO'B

Knox

Kleyn

Hurley

O'Sullivan

Cloete

Kendellen

Osborne

Healy

S. French

Flannery

Goggin

Gallagher

Zebo

Subs from:

J.Wycherley

J.French

Barron

Buckley

Salanoa

Donnelly

Kelly

E.O'Connor

Coughlan

Patterson

Earls

Wren

Philips

Injured:

Snyman

Hodnett

International duty:

De Allende

Lions:

Beirne

Murray

Irish internationals

Kilcoyne

Ryan

F. Wycherley

O'Mahony

G.Coombes

Casey

Carbery

Farrell

Conway

S. Daly

sprucemoose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117824167#Comment_117824167

yeah its ridiculous having to quote everything rather than specifics to be honest.

a large part of that debt is from rebuilding thomond park though as far as i remember, why should cork supporters have to miss out because of something they benefit to a much lesser extent from? and id disagree that finance has to be the priority, i might be living in dreamland but i think there needs to be much more to it than that for rugby. especially so for a team like munster.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117824173#Comment_117824173

any idea if its being streamed?

yerrahbah

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117824194#Comment_117824194

I dunno, but I would doubt it

Lost Ormond

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117824070#Comment_117824070

But finances would be reason you are taking big european games to Cork and renting a ground from GAA i cant see that being better than using Aviva for those games.

And Munster also doesnt need a bigger stadium in Cork when they have Thomond.

slingerz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822098#Comment_117822098

You’ve that the wrong way around. The MRSC stopped running buses from Limerick due to the lack of interest

the stat given for attendances when it was a stick to beat with was that over 70% of the fans attending a full house fixture were from Cork or Dublin. It’s a myth that the majority come from Limerick. Given the census data that makes sense as 26K would be 1 in 10 Limerick people attending the game.

Caranica

Any thoughts of how they'll split the teams on Saturday?

nerd69

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117824831#Comment_117824831

The way this thread has been I'd say a cork vs limerick and captains take turns picking fir the rest

sprucemoose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117824588#Comment_117824588

i literally posted that cork wouldnt need an another large capacity stadium........

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117825030#Comment_117825030

cork/dublin v limerick/SA?

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117824705#Comment_117824705

I was on many a bus from Limerick-Cork for a Friday night 7:35 Kick-off and always minimum 75% so I'd question that stat...

Also on your figures - 26K would be a full house, 13,001 would be a majority so it's closer to 1 in 20... Although 1 in 10 wouldn't be beyond the realms of possibility

Caranica

Were the buses not stopped when the sponsorship stopped and people weren't so keen to pay?

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117826585#Comment_117826585

Could have been, the only thing I can confirm for sure is they weren't stopped because of a lack of Limerick fans going down

Red Silurian

IMPORTANT - ANYBODY ATTENDING THE PRE-SEASON GAME

You need to log-in to your MRSC account and complete a survey before 5pm tomorrow or else your tickets will be invalid. More details, including the link, in the email sent this morning

thomond2006

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117826643#Comment_117826643

What email is this?

Clareman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117826585#Comment_117826585

Few reasons, chief among them being a 4 hour round trip bus journey was never fun especially on a Friday night, now that the road works have stopped there might be an option to restart it again.