Irish beef to lose out as UK open floodgates to Brazil

Dakota Dan

Not looking good.

I says

Let fcuking bord bia and whatever other shower of penpushers start picking up the slack on British beef that won’t be exported to the eu whatever the tonnage it’s a start.
Too long relying on the British market lazy marketing ah sure we always have the British market to bale us out

TooOldBoots

Larry will be ok though, he's got those Board Bia feedlots in Brazil so all will be ok. And as a bonus the UK supermarket can still get the Irish flag on the meat being sold

wrangler

TooOldBoots wrote: »

Larry will be ok though, he's got those Board Bia feedlots in Brazil so all will be ok. And as a bonus the UK supermarket can still get the Irish flag on the meat being sold

I often wondered why English farmers didn't throw our beef into the Irish SEA the way we were undercutting their product to get in, they won't be sorry to see us gone at least

greenfield21

Seem like no one's talking about it but What potential does the UK have to increase its own supply. Look at dairy here the last few years. Is it the restrictions from the environmentalists that would stop it?

kk.man

greenfield21 wrote: »

Seem like no one's talking about it but What potential does the UK have to increase its own supply. Look at dairy here the last few years. Is it the restrictions from the environmentalists that would stop it?

They are way off the mark in terms of self sufficiency.

Goodman and Co have plants in the UK so no worries for them. I forecast you will see the British customer becoming even more nationalistic after Brexit in support of their farmers.

gozunda

wrangler wrote: »

I often wondered why English farmers didn't throw our beef into the Irish SEA the way we were undercutting their product to get in, they won't be sorry to see us gone at least

The UK have aggressively pushed a cheap food policy for the masses since WW2. Farmers in the UK have been largely sidelined in favour of imports of agricultural produce from all over the world. In this the UK also benefited from Irish agricultural produce being easily sourced but also of a high quality.

I would like to see UK agriculture being given proper support by the powers that be - however to feed the approx 70 million people - they will still need to import the bulk of their agricultural produce. Looks like even cheaper markets with less than rigorous standards will be the flavour of the day once they crash out of the EU and tariffs increase

_Brian

kk.man wrote: »

They are way off the mark in terms of self sufficiency.

Goodman and Co have plants in the UK so no worries for them. I forecast you will see the British customer becoming even more nationalistic after Brexit in support of their farmers.

There will also be a huge resentment of anything Irish, they consider were being unreasonable over the backstop and really just dragging the **** out of this because we’re being stubborn ignorant micks.

alps

I says wrote: »

Let fcuking bord bia and whatever other shower of penpushers start picking up the slack on British beef that won’t be exported to the eu whatever the tonnage it’s a start.
Too long relying on the British market lazy marketing ah sure we always have the British market to bale us out

How can you possibly be too long relying on a market if 70 million people only 3 hours away by boat? A market that cannot meet its demand from its own resources, it would have rediculous to have been bypassing it.

UK is not leaving the EU without a deal.

Supermarkets in the UK are anal about quality and traceability. They are just the hint of a horse meat scandal away from irreparable damage to their good name and their client base. They will take no risks on quality.

Whatever posturing is left to play for over the next 6 weeks, and any extension of time thereafter, a deal will be done and Ireland will remain the significant food production site for UK food supplies.

kk.man

alps wrote: »

How can you possibly be too long relying on a market if 70 million people only 3 hours away by boat? A market that cannot meet its demand from its own resources, it would have rediculous to have been bypassing it.

UK is not leaving the EU without a deal.

Supermarkets in the UK are anal about quality and traceability. They are just the hint of a horse meat scandal away from irreparable damage to their good name and their client base. They will take no risks on quality.

Whatever posturing is left to play for over the next 6 weeks, and any extension of time thereafter, a deal will be done and Ireland will remain the significant food production site for UK food supplies.

We can't do side line deals with a "third country" as per EU rules. Only the EU can make the deal and why should they do that?...make it easy for the next country to break ranks.Ireland will be exporting to the UK under world trade rules.

Me thinks It's intervention time for Irish beef. I'd love to own a cold store right now.

older by the day

I know the time is slipping on. And the British politics system is going in to a right ****. But i still cant see that the be its will chance a no deal. Business wise it would cripple them. They might get cheaper beef from Brazil, but they need Europe to buy their expensive goods and services

Cavanjack

Dakota Dan wrote: »

Not looking good.

The store trade will probably strengthen on this news

EdgeCase

It won't be anything to do with politically inspired backlashes or consumer choice. The UK will be desperate for trade deals and has far less leverage then it imagines.

In trade negotiations with the US, for example, agriculture will be a huge thing.

UK farming isn't that strong a political lobby domestically, so unfortunately, they'll be thrown under the bus and you'll see US and Brazilian etc etc products replace British.

From a UK point of view, they need urgent access for things like financial services, food exports are way way down the list of priorities. They're a major net importer of food.

It was a lot easier for British farmers within the EU. It's a huge bloc with very serious leverage in trade negotiations and the agricultural policies were driven by more farmer / producer focused countries like France, not by the Tories who like nothing more than hardcore market economics.

older by the day

Don't worry about it, do the best you can on your own farm, and educate the next generation to get a trade or a job. That way, if things get stuff they have options. We have a "end is near" neighbour here and every time you speak to him he would tell you "farming is finished". Shear we are all still tapping away. Fads come and go. There is a lot of backing for "fake food" at the moment

theguzman

The loss of the British export market will severely hurt Irish agriculture, particularly the beef and sheep sector. However we must look at things from another perspective in that we are producing far far too much food here and it is being produced at a massive loss, only for CAP and Protectionism most farms would go. I myself favour leaving the EU and subsidising production for Irish consumption only.

We cannot compete with Brazil, I have been there just forget it, and Brazilian beef is every bit as good as Irish beef, we take a holier than thou approach to farming here. some of the he best land in the world is in Brazil, they have amazing weather and Ireland is just too high-cost and wet especially in the west to make a go of farming.

Irish farmers are injecting their sheep and cattle with tonnes of anti-biotics and chemicals, my father keeps wether lambs totally chemical free and they graze on heather in the hills and grass in the spring, totally different taste and flavour after the butcher kills one each year.

Brexit now should see the Government roll-out huge supports for afforestation for confiers and especially native hardwood species as post hard-brexit thousands of Western farmers will be finished but they still deserve the opportunity to earn money from their land. No-one gives a damn about Irish farmers and the Government and IFA are only concerned that the Goodman Monopoly can continue to strengthen its control across the various sectors.

Mad_maxx

Did that much heralded Chinese deal several years ago amount to anything?

road_high

What tons of antibiotics and chemicals are farmers injecting their cattle with it, exactly?

wrangler

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Did that much heralded Chinese deal several years ago amount to anything?

Cormac healy of the Mii said the beef is €2/kg in brazil, we've no hope of competing with that, is Brazil nearer to china than we are

drunkmonkey

wrangler wrote: »

Cormac healy of the Mii said the beef is €2/kg in brazil, we've no hope of competing with that, is Brazil nearer to china than we are

Were way closer and we also have road links if not going by boat.

Mad_maxx

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Were way closer and we also have road links if not going by boat.

I'd have thought it's about the same distance to China from both, don't the Chinese want higher quality than Brazilian beef?

jimmycrackcorm

For exports I wonder why farmers don't concentrate more on premium beef.

Won't be able to compete on raw price but branding, marketing on quality should be the focus.

drunkmonkey

Yea sorry my bad took it off track....I'm far from vegan.

What happened with the Brits and Dev didn't read the paper just noticed the headline...

Danzy

theguzman wrote: »

The loss of the British export market will severely hurt Irish agriculture, particularly the beef and sheep sector. However we must look at things from another perspective in that we are producing far far too much food here and it is being produced at a massive loss, only for CAP and Protectionism most farms would go. I myself favour leaving the EU and subsidising production for Irish consumption only.

We cannot compete with Brazil, I have been there just forget it, and Brazilian beef is every bit as good as Irish beef, we take a holier than thou approach to farming here. some of the he best land in the world is in Brazil, they have amazing weather and Ireland is just too high-cost and wet especially in the west to make a go of farming.

Irish farmers are injecting their sheep and cattle with tonnes of anti-biotics and chemicals, my father keeps wether lambs totally chemical free and they graze on heather in the hills and grass in the spring, totally different taste and flavour after the butcher kills one each year.

Brexit now should see the Government roll-out huge supports for afforestation for confiers and especially native hardwood species as post hard-brexit thousands of Western farmers will be finished but they still deserve the opportunity to earn money from their land. No-one gives a damn about Irish farmers and the Government and IFA are only concerned that the Goodman Monopoly can continue to strengthen its control across the various sectors.

Jesus H Christ lad.

The use and abuse of antibiotics in Brazil is a major issue for them.

The idea of withdrawal periods for medicines before human consumption is completely ignored.

Growth hormones are abused like it was a Californian gym.

As for the environment, regulations or an eye to long term sustainability, all ignored.

It is already catching up with them but scale is there.

Your idea of closing a sector that directly/indirectly is responsible for 1 in 7 jobs here is a non runner.

Gawddawggonnit

Be grand...


https://www.independent.ie/business/farming/beef/coveney-eu-will-bail-us-out-of-beef-trade-war-with-uk-37839162.html

theguzman

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

Be grand...


https://www.independent.ie/business/farming/beef/coveney-eu-will-bail-us-out-of-beef-trade-war-with-uk-37839162.html

Until the EU throw us under the bus like they always do.

Tigerandahalf

The British people will be in for a price shock if they think Brazilian beef will solve their problems. Transport is a huge cost and that beef would have to be in refridgerated transport. Given that countries are making commitments to CO2 targets, sourcing your beef from Brazil is just not going to happen - all frozen beef, presumably defrosted for the shelf. The quality chain there will be terrible.

What sort of tariffs would be on live transport with the kill being done in Britain?

Dakota Dan

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

Be grand...


https://www.independent.ie/business/farming/beef/coveney-eu-will-bail-us-out-of-beef-trade-war-with-uk-37839162.html

Coveney, fcuked up in every position he ever had, God help up if we have to depend on him.

greysides

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Yea sorry my bad took it off track....I'm far from vegan.

...

Mod:
Okay, I've split off the Off-topic posts to their own thread although it would have been easier to leave them and move the on-topic ones.....

screamer

I think if the uk flood their market with lets face it, low quality meat, then their own produce is just going to become unsellable outside of the UK.
I can’t see them crashing out though, but we’re going to have to give concessions on the backstop or be out of the EU ourselves

farawaygrass

Ah we’ll never be out of the eu but likely the backstop will be removed. Will be very embarrassing for the government if it does come to pass, and more then likely stir up trouble again

_Brian

We’re only a stones throw from the border here and I spent my whole life crossing it both legitimately and on less legitimate forays.

I simply cannot fathom how the border will remain open between the six counties and ourselves.
The old divisions are very real and very close to the surface, if a hard border is forced between NI amd U.K. the unionist will not tolerate that, isolating them from what they see as the mainland.
Similarly nationalists will not tolerate ansix counties with a hard border to the republic.

I fear trouble isn’t far off.

If the U.K. access Brazilian beef will it be allowed into NI ? If it is I guarantee it will flow into the south in vast quantities polluting our food chain, hard border or not it would be a profitable run indeed.

Keep Sluicing

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

Be grand...


https://www.independent.ie/business/farming/beef/coveney-eu-will-bail-us-out-of-beef-trade-war-with-uk-37839162.html

Great. Hopefully it'll put more money in my pocket for doing less farming.

freedominacup

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

The British people will be in for a price shock if they think Brazilian beef will solve their problems. Transport is a huge cost and that beef would have to be in refridgerated transport. Given that countries are making commitments to CO2 targets, sourcing your beef from Brazil is just not going to happen - all frozen beef, presumably defrosted for the shelf. The quality chain there will be terrible.

What sort of tariffs would be on live transport with the kill being done in Britain?

About €2000 atm to ship a refrigerated container to China from Europe.

Markcheese

Not trying to be negative here, but why the assumption that Brazilian beef is low quality? It's not... There may be practices over there we don't like but their export plants can provide paperwork as good as ours, and any grade of beef the UK want,

PixelTrawler

This is ill informed scare mongering by whoever wrote that article . Unless the UK does a trade deal with Brazil, and in that deal, the UK agree to completely eliminate meat tariffs (destroying its own agriculture base in the process and these deals take many years), the UK will operating under WTO rules. It must treat all countries equally. Which means its tariffs for all or tariffs for none.

The UK will still need to buy beef. And Irish beef has a quality reputation.

The UK as it stands cannot just open its market to brazilian or Irish or any one countries meat products.

_Brian

PixelTrawler wrote: »

This is ill informed scare mongering by whoever wrote that article . Unless the UK does a trade deal with Brazil, and in that deal, the UK agree to completely eliminate meat tariffs (destroying its own agriculture base in the process and these deals take many years), the UK will operating under WTO rules. It must treat all countries equally. Which means its tariffs for all or tariffs for none.

The UK will still need to buy beef. And Irish beef has a quality reputation.

The UK as it stands cannot just open its market to brazilian or Irish or any one countries meat products.

Your looking at an all or nothing approach to tariffs, they could of course be set at any level in between including a level that brings Brazilian beef in on a par with British beef. That way it complements their indigenous supply without destroying the industry.

Buford T. Justice XIX

Markcheese wrote: »

Not trying to be negative here, but why the assumption that Brazilian beef is low quality? It's not... There may be practices over there we don't like but their export plants can provide paperwork as good as ours, and any grade of beef the UK want,

There's oodles of evidence that Brazilian authorities don't enforce the agreed protocols as regards withdrawl times for medicines, usages of prohibited medicines etc, and that's before their flouting of agreed protocols for vaccination for F&M and restirctions on slaughtering of animals from F&M areas.


On F&M alone, they shouldn't be left within 3000 miles of Europe and that's even too close.


Think back on the restrictions and mayhem when F&M was imported in sheep from the UK. Any market we have access to atm would automatically shut until the F&M is eradicated.


Anybody can produce paperwork but few enough can back up what's on the paperwork with independent auditing. Brazil can't even get the paperwork right...

Willfarman

_Brian wrote: »

We’re only a stones throw from the border here and I spent my whole life crossing it both legitimately and on less legitimate forays.

I simply cannot fathom how the border will remain open between the six counties and ourselves.
The old divisions are very real and very close to the surface, if a hard border is forced between NI amd U.K. the unionist will not tolerate that, isolating them from what they see as the mainland.
Similarly nationalists will not tolerate ansix counties with a hard border to the republic.

I fear trouble isn’t far off.

If the U.K. access Brazilian beef will it be allowed into NI ? If it is I guarantee it will flow into the south in vast quantities polluting our food chain, hard border or not it would be a profitable run indeed.

A hard border made of soft water is cheaper than one made of hard walls and fences. I don’t think the unionists particularly want a hard border from the south. The republican movement would be the main beneficiarie from criminality as a hard border with lots of holes would be a return to a good old days for these hoors. I agree Brazilian beef would definitely wind up in the catering trade here.

_Brian

Willfarman wrote: »

A hard border made of soft water is cheaper than one made of hard walls and fences. I don’t think the unionists particularly want a hard border from the south. The republican movement would be the main beneficiarie from criminality as a hard border with lots of holes would be a return to a good old days for these hoors. I agree Brazilian beef would definitely wind up in the catering trade here.

It’s a big risk.
Any meat that’s allowed in the six counties will end up here.

Mad_maxx

_Brian wrote: »

We’re only a stones throw from the border here and I spent my whole life crossing it both legitimately and on less legitimate forays.

I simply cannot fathom how the border will remain open between the six counties and ourselves.
The old divisions are very real and very close to the surface, if a hard border is forced between NI amd U.K. the unionist will not tolerate that, isolating them from what they see as the mainland.
Similarly nationalists will not tolerate ansix counties with a hard border to the republic.

I fear trouble isn’t far off.

If the U.K. access Brazilian beef will it be allowed into NI ? If it is I guarantee it will flow into the south in vast quantities polluting our food chain, hard border or not it would be a profitable run indeed.

The DUP wants a hard border, they are a single issue party, the economy is far down the list, any barriers between North and south is good in their narrow minds

alps

freedominacup wrote: »

About €2000 atm to ship a refrigerated container to China from Europe.

Just over 8c/kg.....

It puts into perspective the years of brainwashing we endured, that we are an Island Nation and at a massive disadvantage due to the cost of transport.

Willfarman

Mad_maxx wrote: »

The DUP wants a hard border, they are a single issue party, the economy is far down the list, any barriers between North and south is good in their narrow minds

Is it just a ploy? Legitimate Unionist business people surely have nothing to gain? They do a good impression of lunacy no doubt but is it genuine.

Mad_maxx

Willfarman wrote: »

Is it just a ploy? Legitimate Unionist business people surely have nothing to gain? They do a good impression of lunacy no doubt but is it genuine.

In their defense, unionists are a people with plenty of stoic old fashioned character but they are also a people who want very little, they want to be British and that's it, the DUP would live on bread and water if it was the price for remaining aligned with the mainland UK

Bass Reeves

This is tge final bluff by the British. Did you ever watch Texas hold em on TV. When someone has very few chips they would go all in when in a deal they got an Ace King or Queen as.one of there two cards. Then they would stand up and watch the final cards being placed on the table to see if they won.
The British are in the same position now. They have gone all in. They know that they cannot leave the EU without a deal or else we will have a repeat of Factories like Honda and Nissan closing except right across the economy. Its immaterial if as to where they get there beef after leaving without a deal. They will not be able to afford to eat meat or buy impossible burgers. While we might take a hit in the shortterm they will be f@@ked for twenty years.

What going on at the moment is a faceing saving excerise by the hard Brexiteers who in the end will vote For May's deal as there is no other choice

Willfarman

Mad_maxx wrote: »

In their defense, unionists are a people with plenty of stoic old fashioned character but they are also a people who want very little, they want to be British and that's it, the DUP would live on bread and water if it was the price for remaining aligned with the mainland UK

They’d take a 50€ note readier than a 20 pound note with Lizzie’s head just the same!

Mad_maxx

Willfarman wrote: »

They’d take a 50€ note readier than a 20 pound note with Lizzie’s head just the same!

I don't think so, they are nothing if not patriotic

st1979

Willfarman wrote:

Is it just a ploy? Legitimate Unionist business people surely have nothing to gain? They do a good impression of lunacy no doubt but is it genuine.

Don't think you have spent much time in the north. A unionist feels more British than any on mainland uk. A lot don't travel south to have gone to Dublin is a big deal.

jim o doom

The only people who are going to lose out are the public in the UK.

Rather than high quality grass fed Irish beef, they'll be gobbling up industrial farmed beef that has been pumped full of every steroid and drug under the sun. Yuck.

Gawddawggonnit

alps wrote: »

Just over 8c/kg.....

It puts into perspective the years of brainwashing we endured, that we are an Island Nation and at a massive disadvantage due to the cost of transport.

+1.

An Claidheamh

wrangler wrote: »

I often wondered why English farmers didn't throw our beef into the Irish SEA the way we were undercutting their product to get in, they won't be sorry to see us gone at least

Undercutting them?

They'd starve without our food and their own beef was bloody infected for years.

Ungrateful is what they are.

Now, they're happy to be under cut by Brazilian beef?

At least they have more than enough gammon to eat......

Willfarman

No I wouldn’t have spent a lot of time up there and I don’t doubt they won’t ever want to join the republic but I can’t comprehend why they’d want a return to a hard border that would act like “a go fund me” for republican criminality.