Adblue is generating crazy volumes of plastic waste

IrishHomer

My work state owned vehicle is relatively new a 2.2 litre diesel Ford Ranger.

It uses an additive called adblue and this is purchased at all filling stations and comes in 1.5 litre heavy duty plastic bottles or in large plastic 10 litre drums.

I think mine is using one 1.5 litre bottle with every 2nd fill of diesel.

I was just thinking is is generating an unthinkable volume of plastic waste associated with all modern diesel vehicles.

How the hell is this allowed. I even noticed the bins in garages are full of the plastic bottles mixed with regular waste no means of recycling.

I'm going to make a complaint to Circle K

alias no.9

If you're having to top it up every second tank of diesel, I expect there is a bigger problem with your car.

pablo128

You may complain to the European body responsible for introducing this stuff. What have Circle K got to do with it?

Sure there's car makers now refusing to supply diesel engines into Europe because of the legislation and you want to blame your local filling station?

.red.

IrishHomer wrote: »

I'm going to make a complaint to Circle K

What's it got to do with CircleK?
Your car burns a hell of a lot more adblue than it should, but instead of going to Ford, or the work mechanics to get it fixed you wanna complain to a petrol station?
Makes sense!

Damien360

alias no.9 wrote: »

If you're having to top it up every second tank of diesel, I expect there is a bigger problem with your car.

My Superb uses about a litre per thousand kilometers which is about a litre adblue per 65 litres of fuel. A couple of collegues use the as the same rate. So OP's use is probably not out of line with normal use. From reading the blurb, it's use varies with driving style, i.e. motorway or town use. More town use and the adblue gets added more.

I bought a 20L container in a motor factors. Anything bigger would just be too difficult to handle when filling adblue to the car.

ted1

.red. wrote: »

What's it got to do with CircleK?
Your car burns a hell of a lot more adblue than it should, but instead of going to Ford, or the work mechanics to get it fixed you wanna complain to a petrol station?
Makes sense!

The way they sell it. The could dispense it with a pump on a pet pay litre. They could sell it in glass bottles. They could use reuse the bottle

alias no.9

Damien360 wrote: »

My Superb uses about a litre per thousand kilometers which is about a litre adblue per 65 litres of fuel. A couple of collegues use the as the same rate. So OP's use is probably not out of line with normal use. From reading the blurb, it's use varies with driving style, i.e. motorway or town use. More town use and the adblue gets added more.

I bought a 20L container in a motor factors. Anything bigger would just be too difficult to handle when filling adblue to the car.

When this stuff was being introduced as a solution to exhaust particulate, it was supposed to be a very infrequent top up. Looks like another case of being oversold and under delivering.

IrishHomer

pablo128 wrote: »

You may complain to the European body responsible for introducing this stuff. What have Circle K got to do with it?

Sure there's car makers now refusing to supply diesel engines into Europe because of the legislation and you want to blame your local filling station?

Circle K have no recycling bin!

IrishHomer

.red. wrote: »

What's it got to do with CircleK?
Your car burns a hell of a lot more adblue than it should, but instead of going to Ford, or the work mechanics to get it fixed you wanna complain to a petrol station?
Makes sense!

All fuel stations should have recycle bins for all the plastic

pablo128

IrishHomer wrote: »

Circle K have no recycling bin!

Bring the container home and put it in your green recycling bin!

kerry37

There are a lot of places that do it by the pump now. One I use regularly is the Maxol garage on the M3 into Dublin at Mulhuddart. Might be worth checking your local area to see if there is a pump available

Guy:Incognito

ted1 wrote: »

. They could use reuse the bottle

Or ,and I know this is an alien concept to a lot of people, the ones buying it could recycle the bottles instead of dumping them in the bin.


If you buy a drink in the shop and wall off down the street, do you just lob the bottle on the ground if theres no bin and blame the shop?

dubbrin

I've seen 1000L IBC's of the stuff, but might be too much hassle for ordinary Sam though

Worth kicking up over all the same, it's happening away under the radar

Kimbot

IrishHomer wrote: »

All fuel stations should have recycle bins for all the plastic

Sure my local has no bin at all, never mind a recycling one

stefanovich

It'd be much less environmentally unfriendly if the adblue containers were reused by the adblue manufacturers rather than melted down by a recycling company.

Dial Hard

stefanovich wrote:

It'd be much less environmentally unfriendly if the adblue containers were reused by the adblue manufacturers rather than melted down by a recycling company.

You can say that about pretty much every plastic and glass bottle in use.

1874

Is this product similar to dipetane? Is it really even necessary if correct regular maintenance is carried out? Why put it in even if not coming up to a test? On a continual basis Is it any benefit?

IrishHomer

1874 wrote: »

Is this product similar to dipetane? Is it really even necessary if correct regular maintenance is carried out? Why put it in even if not coming up to a test? On a continual basis Is it any benefit?

If I let mine run low I get a warning message and light on the dash.

My ford ranger is a big heavy jeep it does approximately 700km to a tank and every two fills it uses a full bottle of adblue.

Adblue is supposed to reduce harmful emissions and is on most new diesels I believe.

BorneTobyWilde

Best form of recycling plastic is to burn it on the site it's generated. Plastic is but oil, should be incinerated on site efficiently and used to generate hot water and heating for the building.

Most plastics now go for burning in Ireland, waste to energy. Very little value in it now, best to burn it. Why is can't be done on site though is beyond me.

killanena

Its you whose throwing the plastic into general waste bin. Either bring it home or ask at the counter if they can dispose of it for you.

What's the point of a shop having both bin types? Some people are going to ignore the signs on bins and contaminate the recycling bins anyways, leaving the shop having to pay a fine if noticed by their contacted refuse collection company.

Edit: I have also heard of places having a pump much like a normal diesel or petrol pump that dispense ad blue. Although I haven't seen one personally in my part of the country.

colm_mcm

IrishHomer wrote: »

My work state owned vehicle is relatively new a 2.2 litre diesel Ford Ranger.

It uses an additive called adblue and this is purchased at all filling stations and comes in 1.5 litre heavy duty plastic bottles or in large plastic 10 litre drums.

I think mine is using one 1.5 litre bottle with every 2nd fill of diesel.

I was just thinking is is generating an unthinkable volume of plastic waste associated with all modern diesel vehicles.

How the hell is this allowed. I even noticed the bins in garages are full of the plastic bottles mixed with regular waste no means of recycling.

I'm going to make a complaint to Circle K

Could you not buy the 10l drum and pour 1.5l into the smaller bottle?

OldMrBrennan83

1874 wrote: »

Is this product similar to dipetane? Is it really even necessary if correct regular maintenance is carried out? Why put it in even if not coming up to a test? On a continual basis Is it any benefit?

It's not a diesel additive, it's used in modern diesel engines to reduce emissions and has a separate tank.

ct5amr2ig1nfhp

I've a 1.5D auto 5008 just shy of 10k kms and I've not had to refill the adblue yet. I will just fill out at a station when I need to top up.

IrishHomer

OmegaGene wrote: »

My local circle k sell adblu at the pump where the lorries fill up, it’s 90 cent a litre this way and no mess or plastic waste
It costs me about €5 every 6 months so op I suggest you get the car looked at and find a garage with a pump if your that concerned about the plastic waste

I have to use Cirkle K I have a fuel card for them

IrishHomer

I will call my local Ford dealer in the morning and query the high adblue consumption

killanena

Bottles sold at stations are only Kent a an emergency top up to keep in the boot anyways. Cars will refused to start if it completely runs out.

Twenty Grand

IrishHomer wrote: »

My work state owned vehicle is relatively new a 2.2 litre diesel Ford Ranger.

It uses an additive called adblue and this is purchased at all filling stations and comes in 1.5 litre heavy duty plastic bottles or in large plastic 10 litre drums.

I think mine is using one 1.5 litre bottle with every 2nd fill of diesel.

I was just thinking is is generating an unthinkable volume of plastic waste associated with all modern diesel vehicles.

How the hell is this allowed. I even noticed the bins in garages are full of the plastic bottles mixed with regular waste no means of recycling.

I'm going to make a complaint to Circle K

I think the problem is your own. Why not buy larger drums of it? Surely it's cheaper?

Looking online, a 4l bottle is a tenner and 10l it 15.

Surely it's better to buy in bulk?

punisher5112

Op how much are you putting in and how much miles you are doing is going to be the answer to having to add it in.

It's basically pigs pee.

Be very careful not to get in contact with it or body parts.

antoinolachtnai

The impact of manufacturing a plastic bottle is tiny (250g CO2 maybe) compared to burning 100 litres of diesel (in the order of 250kg of CO2).

They certainly look untidy and take up a lot of space but in the grand scheme of automotive emissions the impact is a very small amount.

punisher5112

Get a little pump to fit onto the container and away you go.

1874

OldMrBrennan83 wrote: »

It's not a diesel additive, it's used in modern diesel engines to reduce emissions and has a separate tank.

I was going to ask is there a separate reservoir for it, if it's on most/all modern diesels then there has to be something to be said for it not coming in small quantities regarding plastic waste, of all else I've heard this must herald the beginning of the end for diesels at least in private use, if they require additives to keep emissions down. Ithought I'd heard of something else that assisted in cleaning out egrs other than driving them hard, I'll drive my own on, thankfully there's none of this stuff in it.

colm_mcm

antoinolachtnai wrote: »

The impact of manufacturing a plastic bottle is tiny (250g CO2 maybe) compared to burning 100 litres of diesel (in the order of 250kg of CO2).

They certainly look untidy and take up a lot of space but in the grand scheme of automotive emissions the impact is a very small amount.

Adblue reduces emissions of nox, which is actually harmful. Co2 is focussed on for some reason.

eagle eye

Some places have it on a pump. All places should have that.

punisher5112

Some cars such as Citroen have it in bags and needs changing by garage.

antoinolachtnai

colm_mcm wrote: »

antoinolachtnai wrote: »

The impact of manufacturing a plastic bottle is tiny (250g CO2 maybe) compared to burning 100 litres of diesel (in the order of 250kg of CO2).

They certainly look untidy and take up a lot of space but in the grand scheme of automotive emissions the impact is a very small amount.

Adblue reduces emissions of nox, which is actually harmful. Co2 is focussed on for some reason.

That is a controversial statement certainly. Still if your priority is to reduce NOx emissions then the impact of the plastic bottle is even tinier and even less relevant.

colm_mcm

punisher5112 wrote: »

Some cars such as Citroen have it in bags and needs changing by garage.

Isn’t that just Eolys fluid rather than adblue? Eolys goes into the fuel and is a lot less friendly than adblue. It’s a toxic liquid AFAIK.

colm_mcm

antoinolachtnai wrote: »

That is a controversial statement certainly. Still if your priority is to reduce NOx emissions then the impact of the plastic bottle is even tinier and even less relevant.

My comment is in reply to one that I read as saying adblue does not really make that much difference to emissions.

On rereading it I see that the comment is that the impact of the bottle is insignificant compared to car usage.

SeanW

What happens if you run a vehicle like that without AdBlue? Does it damage the engine? Does the vehicle stop operating when it runs out?

OldMrBrennan83

SeanW wrote: »

What happens if you run a vehicle like that without AdBlue? Does it damage the engine? Does the vehicle stop operating when it runs out?

Not sure about all models but there's a good few won't start at all once you run low.

punisher5112

SeanW wrote: »

What happens if you run a vehicle like that without AdBlue? Does it damage the engine? Does the vehicle stop operating when it runs out?

It won't damage but the reason for it is on health grounds.

This is why it will warn you and then state you have so much kilometers before the car won't start.

colm_mcm

SeanW wrote: »

What happens if you run a vehicle like that without AdBlue? Does it damage the engine? Does the vehicle stop operating when it runs out?

Adblue is added to the exhaust gases so it’s not vital that the engine gets it. The vehicle will refuse to start as far as I know, and if it did run, obviously the exhaust gasses would be more harmful than before.

stefanovich

Dial Hard wrote: »

You can say that about pretty much every plastic and glass bottle in use.

Doesn't make it less true.

1874

OmegaGene wrote: »

the engine will not be damaged when you run out of AdBlue. ... No, the engine will not shut down, but some engines automatically limit engine performance when AdBlue supplies are depleted. If your engine is equipped with SCR technology, your vehicle will lose power, and reduce its emission according to legal standards.
Btw is not pigs urine either, don’t beleive everything that’s online

Sounds like it could be bypassed, not that I would, Id just prefer have a car that doesnt have that feature.
I was thinking of getting a newer replacement diesel, by importing from the UK, how do you know which cars have it? any central location or just look up "specific car AND adblue" in google?
Im guessing VAGs might not have it? as they softwared their way around the problem, when did it start coming into use?

heroics

OP why are you just putting in 1.5 litres every 2nd fill. According to this https://www.euro6diesel.com/app/vehicles/ford/ranger_wildtrak the ford ranger has a 20 litre tank for Adblue. Why not just fill it with 20 Litres every 20 fills and either buy it in 20litre drum or go to a garage with an adblue pump?

1874

OmegaGene wrote: »

https://www.whatcar.com/news/what-is-adblue-and-does-your-diesel-car-need-it/n16545

Hang on a sec, I just got a few paragraphs down, how much is this stuff??
It says its urea and deionised water, I can make this stuff at home! :):pac:

Guess it looks obvious though, they have a seperate filler neck at/near the fuel filler cap, I thought it would be a reservoir in the engine bay.

GreeBo

1874 wrote: »

Hang on a sec, I just got a few paragraphs down, how much is this stuff??
It says its urea and deionised water, I can make this stuff at home! :):pac:

Are you taking the piss......home and making AdBlue out of it?:pac:

1874

GreeBo wrote: »

Are you taking the piss......home and making AdBlue out of it?:pac:

Im sure someone will or already has come up with the proportions, quick check of youtube has people producing urea for gardening, half joking half wondering :eek:

green123

[/quote]I think the problem is your own. Why not buy larger drums of it? Surely it's cheaper?

Looking online, a 4l bottle is a tenner and 10l it 15.

Surely it's better to buy in bulk?
[/quote]

[/quote]

IrishHomer wrote: »

My work state owned vehicle is relatively new a 2.2 litre diesel Ford Ranger.

No problem for him.
He is not paying for it.
We are.

Typical of the public service wasting our money.

323

SeanW wrote: »

What happens if you run a vehicle like that without AdBlue? Does it damage the engine? Does the vehicle stop operating when it runs out?

If AdBlue tank goes empty, most vehicles will stop. So would need an expensive recovery collection to have the vehicle taken to a dealership for them to reset.

Friend was in London last year with a company vehicle, couldnt find AdBlue, topped it up with water rather than get stranded in the city. Worked fine.

bucketybuck

punisher5112 wrote: »

It won't damage but the reason for it is on health grounds.

This is why it will warn you and then state you have so much kilometers before the car won't start.

Its not health grounds, its legislative grounds. It is an EU requirement that any vehicle emitting nox gases treats those gases with urea at the source. Because it is a requirement then the vehicles are programmed not to work without it. Mechanically the vehicle doesn't need adblue, but if the SCR isn't working then the vehicle is not conforming to EU law and so the ECU informs the driver and limits the vehicle.

1874 wrote: »

Sounds like it could be bypassed

It has been bypassed on many, many vehicles. Basically you can get a widget that sends a false signal to the ACM telling it that everything is fine and that adblue is being dispensed as normal, while in fact everything has been disconnected.

Unfortunately now Test centres are checking the SCR and anything untoward is a test fail, a lot of people with the adblue switched off are facing huge bills to put the vehicles back to spec again.

323 wrote: »

If AdBlue tank goes empty, most vehicles will stop. So would need an expensive recovery collection to have the vehicle taken to a dealership for them to reset.

Most vehicles won't stop, they are just limited in speed and can limp back to a garage perfectly well, no recovery needed.

punisher5112

Of course it's to do with health as nox is extremely harmful to us.