Enforcing boundaries

igotissues

In an emotionally abusive relationship. Am working on picking my self esteem partly due to trauma in this relationship off the floor- and to stop seeking validation externally and build my strength.

I am setting boundaries but I'm having trouble enforcing them. In any things I've read/ watched it says that you don't engage with them, leave the conversation, or walk away.

The issue is this- the person involved would LOVE this. They love nothing more than for me to just **** off and leave them alone. They despise talking about anything other than superficial stuff (house, kids, what's for dinner) unless it's on their terms.
Furthermore, when they are ignoring me (one tactic used), they want me to ignore them back/ eff off. To enforce my boundary I would need to do this- walk away literaly/metaphorically- and that is fine.... but it becomes hugely problematic when I actually need to speak to them about collecting the kids, making plans etc and they repeatedly ignore my calls, messages, walk away when I'm speaking to them.
Can anyone explain in a KISS manner how I am meant to enforce a boundary of " do not ignore me when I am communicating with you" when they act like this?
Thanks
Fwiw- I have taken a lot of advice on from last thread but it's baby steps. Wish I could just pack bags and go, but life ain't like that sometimes :-)

shesty

Hmm..
Could you take the "We need to talk about picking up the kids/what is happening on Saturday etc. Let me know when you're ready to talk about it or it won't get sorted?" approach??? Although I do see the downfalls in that too admittedly.

Mr. Incognito

In an emotionally abusive relationship.

Leave

woodchuck

igotissues wrote: »

Fwiw- I have taken a lot of advice on from last thread but it's baby steps. Wish I could just pack bags and go, but life ain't like that sometimes :-)

OP you've been given a lot of advice previously. You could pack your bags and leave (or better, kick him out), but you're choosing to stay.

You're in an emotionally abusive relationship with an alcoholic who treats you like sh1t. You need to GET OUT!

wiggle16

igotissues wrote: »

In an emotionally abusive relationship. Am working on picking my self esteem partly due to trauma in this relationship off the floor- and to stop seeking validation externally and build my strength.

NONE of this is going to happen until you walk out the door. Absolutely none of it. No one is pretending this is going to be easy but you know already what you need to do and you won't do it. If you do nothing, nothing will change.

woodchuck wrote: »

OP you've been given a lot of advice previously. You could pack your bags and leave (or better, kick him out), but you're choosing to stay.
You're in an emotionally abusive relationship with an alcoholic who treats you like sh1t. You need to GET OUT!

This sums it up. There is no relationship. You are simply choosing to adapt to the situation. You need to stop thinking about it and get out.

Why won't you leave?

igotissues

Guys, I get where you are coming from- and I am genuinely not throwing my toys out of the pram- but I need advice on this aspect. Even when we do split, I will still have to be in touch with him over the kids, maintenance etc. - and I imagine he will be every bit as bad if not worse... so I do need some tools in this regard.
I can't emphasise how messed my head is- I have been with him for 20 years and we have kids together. At this stage, I am finding it very difficult to ascertain what is "normal" in a relationship as I have not experienced it since I was in my teens.
I have been to see a counsellor, a solicitor, an estate agent. I am doing stuff but I can't just walk away from the house/ situation inside of weeks- in fact that is what he wants me to do- keeps saying if I don't like it get lost and live with my sister!

When I say he won't discuss anything, I'll give you an example of a generic type of conversation:
IGI: So as you say John, it isn't working, so will I book mediation?
John: (silence)
IGI: John, we need to sort this out and make some decisions. I can't live with this constant anger.
John: (silence)
IGI: Will I make an appointment then?
JOhn: (silence)
IGI: What days are you free?
John: What is the point in mediation- it won't work unless you agree to sell this place
IGI: Ok, if that is what it takes. Maybe we can discuss that at mediation
John: (Walks away)

Then I might leave the issue and one of a few things happen:
1. He ignores me for a few hours/ days and then starts talking to me again as if the above conversation never happened
2. I book mediation and coming up to it he says he doesn't want to go- and as he thinks we should try again. Because he is being nice, I get all "misty eyes" thinking it can maybe work (fool) and get drawn back in
3. He is nasty for a few days and then relents and I am so "grateful" I don't bring it up again.

Here is another example of a recent conversation - where it would be useful to know how to enforce a boundary:
John and I are having a conversation with our son regarding his grades. Son is getting B's but has slipped from A's. John is cross with son and says that he missed 20% in his last test, he is better than this, he should be leading the pack. Broadly, I agree, son is capable of more but I think saying that he is "good but can do better" is a nicer way to put it. Also, I don't want son to think he has to be BEST at everything, just best HE can be (which TBF is better than his current tests but anyway) as perfectionism never ends well.
Later in the evening, I ask John can he help at his daughter's birthday party- as I need to leave early and could he do the party bags and goodbyes. John fundamentally disagrees with birthday parties and is quite introverted so he really wouldn't like this.

He gets angry with me and says nasty things because:
I undermined him with our son by not approaching it in the same way he did and I am mollygoddling son
I have "western angst" and need to have these parties, but he will do it, seeing as how I have put him in that position

Later the conversation goes like this:
I say we have the same goal for son but I think carrot is better than stick. John reluctantly agrees. He then starts getting mean saying I do nothing with the kids- don't bring them to any activities. I say I signed them up to GAA and soccer, and he scoffs saying they are bullsh1t. He says that he wants to bring them to martial arts (he has mentioned this for weeks and I have been saying it is a good idea and to go ahead)- and I ask what has he done in this regard? Why is it my responsibility? He ignores this.
Then I say I can change the party as I understand it isn't his thing. He says it's ok (in a petulant way i.e. Sigh, I'll do it, it's fine), but I know it was probably unfair to ask given his thoughts on parties, even though the times suit best.
The conversation progresses to me asking why he gets nasty when uncomfortable emotions come up- and he basically ignores me, interrupts me by talking about links he is clicking on his laptop, just leaving long silences or leaving the room. I say that I am unhappy with him going nuclear when we are trying to discuss topics we may not approach in same way (e.g. how we speak to kids, parties)
He hasn't erupted in anger so I think the conversation, one sided as it was, has gone well.
He then ignores me the entire next 2 days- and will not respond to queries regarding kids on text or answer the phone (I am at work). At home he is monosyllabic until he leaves the house for work.
I end up changing the party - so basically he has "won" and he has managed to avoid speaking about anything.
HOw does one handle something like that? What could I have done differently?
As I say, I have ZERO experience of a normal, functional romantic relationship. My own parent was widowed at a young age.

These are conversations regarding every day events that will have to happen even when we are apart- and I don't know how to approach them to ensure that I keep my strength and resilience - and don't keep being brought to his level.
We have a session booked for Monday- and with a 3rd party he always comes across as a functional human- and I start feeling maybe I am making a mountain out of a molehill.... but outside of any session, he will not engage with me on an emotive topic in a rational way (he will ignore, scream, stonewall).... how do you get someone who will not engage with you on any functional level to make decisions that affect you both? How do you enforce those boundaries?

Ursus Horribilis

Kick him out

woodchuck

As I say, I have ZERO experience of a normal, functional romantic relationship.

OP I think part of the problem is that you're trying to turn this dysfunctional toxic relationship into a normal functional romantic relationship. While that's possible in some cases, both partners need to want the same thing and work very hard towards it together. You absolutely cannot drag your husband kicking and screaming into a functional relationship.

Honestly, I wouldn't even bother consulting him on these decisions. Stop trying to engage with a brick wall. You need to take control and make these decisions on your own. Behave as if you're a single parent - because essentially, you are. It sounds like he's there in body only.

And when you make a decision, stick to it. Don't give in based on what you think he wants. That's just playing into his hands.

I understand that separating doesn't happen overnight, but I really hope you continue down this path. It sounds like your heart is still investigated in the relationship though. I think you need to accept that the relationship is dead before you can move on. As an aside, kids are very intuitive. You son is probably feeling the tension at home and this could be affecting his performance at school. All the more reason to get out - if not for your sake, then for your sons.

igotissues

Ursus Horribilis wrote: »

Kick him out

Solicitor says it will be very difficult - albeit not impossible- to buy him out due to the level of equity in the house. The bank will lend me just under what I need. This will put me pin to the collar debt wise which I don't want. We will havr to sell, traumatic as that will be for me (he knows this. It was my parents house).

If I try to get a barring order, he has a lot of sway in that area, plus as I say he makes me look like I'm deluded when we are in front of others - he has a very clever way of putting things. It's frightening to watch. Sure, he makes ME feel like I imagined it/ blew it out of proportion.

For example, at the moment I am wondering DID I undermine him in front of our son? Mad stuff. It's like living in the Twilight Zone.

Thanks Shesty.
Thanks Woodchuck. You're right. I will have it all written down (what is happening) for Mondays appt so he can't confuse me. And a list of what I want to happen.

woodchuck

OP I don't know much about family law, but I thought where there is a child involved, often the mother and child are entitled to stay in the family home. Have you discussed this with your solicitor?

he makes me look like I'm deluded when we are in front of others - he has a very clever way of putting things. It's frightening to watch. Sure, he makes ME feel like I imagined it/ blew it out of proportion.

For example, at the moment I am wondering DID I undermine him in front of our son? Mad stuff. It's like living in the Twilight Zone.

Google gaslighting...

I will have it all written down (what is happening) for Mondays appt so he can't confuse me. And a list of what I want to happen.

When you say "a list of what you want to happen", what do you mean? Do you mean what you want from your husband? Again, you're going to be talking to a brick wall. If you genuinely wanted out of the relationship you would tell him that and put the wheels in motion. Not give him a list of what you want to happen... because you're not going to get anything from him. He's proven that time and time again.

wiggle16

igotissues wrote: »

If I try to get a barring order, he has a lot of sway in that area

You'll have to excuse my ignorance because I don't have any experience of barring/restraining orders (thankfully) - but I still don't understand what you mean by this? What do you mean he has a lot of sway in terms of a barring order?

Your last two posts scream "appeasement". You involve him in every decision; you're seeking permission for things; everything is negotiated with him - and everything always ends up going his way. He's a bully and a dirtbag. I am not trying to be mean or put you down, but you need to realise he is bullying you and controlling everything because you are trying to engage with him. He is an extremely manipulative person but you are both adults - you come across as a clearly intelligent, articulate woman and you are a match for him, which you clearly don't realise.

There is no point in further mediation. You've been doing this all along and it hasn't worked. He doesn't care. Why do you think that you can do the same thing over and over again and expect a different result?

Woodchuck is right. Google gaslighting. This is what is happening here.

As I said to you in a previous thread, you need to prioritise your kids. The house was your parents' house, but that is no longer important. And as I said to you previously, the moment you get away from him you will begin to feel a lot better in yourself. I don't know how else to advise you at this point. As I've said also, any attempt to enforce some form of boundary is just an attempt to adapt to the situation. It's pointless. There is no way to make this situation more tolerable. You need to sit down with your solicitor and work out your options - ALL of your options.

igotissues

She said that we could argue it alright, but she also said that it can be easier to sell it as down the line it feels more like "your" house and he is less likely to feel he still has authority there.
there is some work needs doing on the house and I don't want to be so in debt paying him off that I won't be able to afford it, but we'll see. It seems that much of it is grey area and it's basically who has the better neogtiating skills/ lawyer!
And that is why I need to write it down.
When I get talking I get all flustered, he makes me all in knots (at home because he insists I don't "misquote" him, or use the wrong language - for e.g. I said "John, encouragement is better, there is no point in slamming our son" And he got angry as he said slamming was too extreme for what he was doing talking to son about grades) *BTW, this was NOT in front of our son, this was privately.

When we are in front of someone, he makes it seem like he has everyone's best interests at heart- for example, his idea is that he wants to stay in the house for 3.5 or 4 more years til he switches career and that this is best financially and for the kids. When I disagree in front of the mediator I look like some sort of harridan, who is trying to wreck the family home coz shure, isn't what he is proposing reasonable?
Also his head in the sand / ignoring isn't confined to our conversations. He refuses to get the documents together for the mediator (pension statements etc)- in fact he procrastinates in all areas of life, to his own detriment, but I digress.

So if I write down that John does this and this and this at home so he can't confuse me and I forget, and then that I want the following to happen rather than his plan- and say that to the mediator and hopefully we compromise there instead of it just being his plan and everyone going along with it.

re Gaslighting: I have read about it, and some of the examples are so extreme that I can't see it, but I expect it must be so, given that I feel very confused a lot of the time. I always thought it was just me.

Ursus Horribilis

Doesn't sound like much of a mediator ye have

woodchuck

She said that we could argue it alright, but she also said that it can be easier to sell it as down the line it feels more like "your" house and he is less likely to feel he still has authority there.

So you DO have other choices. I know if it was me, I'd fight.

there is some work needs doing on the house and I don't want to be so in debt paying him off that I won't be able to afford it, but we'll see.

You sound like you've lost the battle before you've even begun. I assume you're talking about being in debt due to buying him out of the house? I would not go down that route until you've fully explored your other options.

It seems that much of it is grey area and it's basically who has the better neogtiating skills/ lawyer!

Get yourself a very good solicitor so who will fight for you.

I know I sound like a broken record, but you need to stop trying to communicate with him at this point. Do everything through solicitors - good ones!!

I'm sorry for everything you've been through OP and I know the battle is really just beginning. Are you currently attending a counsellor? I think there are a lot of issues you need to work through. For yourself, not for the relationship.

igotissues

Ursus Horribilis wrote: »

Doesn't sound like much of a mediator ye have

Yeah, I found her quite passive. I had rather she had some suggestions for us. John was meant to fill out his outgoings but he wouldn't and nothing was said. Ditto pensions

More like: So IGI, you want the whole house, that isn't realistic, what about...

So John, you want to stay living in the house, that isn't realistic, what about....

@woodchuck: I do go, but I find myself going around in circles a little. I get a little insight and then I get stuck again for a bit before moving on another little step. I find myself, much like here, talking about john, rather than me- and what he should/ would/could do rather than what I need to do for ME. You hit the nail on the head with appeasing. I have spent 15 years trying to mollify him and worrying about what JOhn would say/ think/react rather than what I want/ need/ feel. I'm slowly starting to look inside myself instead of placing all my hopes/ fears/ blame for everything outside - mainly onto John.

Eric Cartman

<SNIP>

Now this is by no means a definite, but

Introversion, dislike of sports yet pro martial arts, describing societal norms as bullsh1t, ignoring you and avoiding conversations which will uktimately result in some sort of personal change.

Theres a lot of hallmarks here of somebody with aspergers or on the autistic spectrum, I got a picture in my head of a sweaty lad in a rock hand t shirt playing world of warcraft all day in my head , then remembered this thread is about a grown man with children.

Im not sure if he’s necissarily intentionally abusive or realises its over and just completely wants to avoid any change in his routine / life. Lots of this behaviour is very explainable once you start thinking along those lines

wiggle16

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Theres a lot of hallmarks here of somebody with aspergers or on the autistic spectrum [...]

Im not sure if he’s necissarily intentionally abusive or realises its over and just completely wants to avoid any change in his routine / life. Lots of this behaviour is very explainable once you start thinking along those lines

There's far, far more hallmarks here of someone who is an abusive, megalomaniacal bully.

I don't believe for a moment that this man has anything other than a horrific personality and a fundamental lack of concern for anyone but himself.

It doesn't sound like Asperger's or autism at all - with respect, you can pick any set of traits in isolation in a person and speculate about ASD. I'm very much a creature of habit and have a practically pathological need to doodle and scribble *constantly*. Anyone could pluck those traits out and say I'm "on the spectrum". But that would be nonsense. No offense, but it's pop-psychology.

I get what you mean but even if it were ASD, it would make no difference to the OP's predicament.

IHeartShoes

igotissues wrote: »

Yeah, I found her quite passive. I had rather she had some suggestions for us..

Hi there - have to say I found your OP really concerning and I feel for you. I don't think you can see the wood for the trees. It must be hard, still being so invested in him but you really do need to put your big girl pants on now and deal with the situation. No matter how nice and conciliatory you are being, he won't change or get any better. Stop worrying about the 20 year investment already made. Don't waste any more time or energy on him. It will not improve. You have received some great advice above and you should act on it. It's difficult to trust yourself in a situation like this when he is so manipulative and abusive so you should trust the objective advice you have received here.

In the main, start behaving as a single parent - that is essentially what you are. Make your own decisions. Do not rely on him for anything. Your instincts concerning your children are correct and you can trust that - you don't need his input anymore especially when it appears to be so flawed.

Anecdotally, Mothers are often left in the family home until the children are no longer dependent (22 if they go to third level). That is probably what you should be fighting for. So fight. It should give you the time you need to prepare financially.

Re the above quote - mediators are facilitators first and foremost. They are not present to negotiate on either behalf. Mediation does not always work and really only does when there is agreement already and little contention. That is not the case here. If it's not working for you, then move on to solicitors. Civil Legal Aid is available if money is an issue at this point. However, I would canvas opinion on solicitors in your area and look for a rothweiler. It is what you will need.

The very best of luck to you and your children. You are more than capable given what you have tolerated already. Be brave and push on.

S

LegacyUser

OP you've written walls of text & ppl have responded in kind. You need to act & stop wasting time rationalizing, planning, weighing permutations & all this nonsense.

You get all your ducks in a row to get out & function independently. You use charities/support bodies if you need to. You leverage every opportunity you have to escape this man.

You accept things will be tumultuous before they settle. There will be fights, anger, upset children, angry family/friends. But there will also be any supports you've lined up & the overwhelming certainty that you are doing the right thing.

This is the right thing to do but it will be hard work & take courage. Cut this man out.

Good luck

igotissues

regarding the ASD point: I often wonder Cartman- although he has none of the other markers. We have close family with ASD (not siblings).
Of course, I would love to convince myself of that so I can make excuses for him.... yet again.....

He used to be big into a certain sport, and then left it, but watched it on TV, gambled on it. When I started showing an interest in it, he said it was bullsh1t and it was a pathetic sport. He still reads the sports section on it and looks up scores but if I bring it up, he more or less rolls his eyes.
He used to have a tonne of friends but he "decided" they were a$$holes for some reason or another and won't speak to them any more. Sometimes this is because they are "a twat" (most people in life are twats, some are nice twats apparently) - or they said something to him and he cut them out of his life bar polite hello, short chat. He can be quite aggressive with people- friends, parent, even strangers. He expects people to behave in a certain way i.e. a way he deems acceptable or have same beliefs/ social mores/ opinions/ reactions as him and when they don't he can't hack it. I clearly "disappoint" him the most!!! On the flip side, he is perfectly able to be charming and nice, when required, small talk, jokes.


In any event, I can't live with him screaming at me, stonewalling me just because.....(insert excuse here- addiction, neurological disorder, mental health issues, mental health disorder (BPD, sociopathy) ) I want to put my kids and my feelings first. He has come first for long enough!

Thank you all for helping me see that "enforcing boundaries" is just another way of trying to make the impossible possible.

cannotlogin

1. What you are trying to do is the equivilant of pushing an elephant up a stairs. The elephant does want to go (i.e.your husband has no interest is doing anything you want, you are exhausted by your efforts, never going to get the result you want and will eventually end up in a worse situation than you started).

He has zero respect for you and any attempt to normalise the relationship is mission impossible? Are you at a stage where you accept this as accurate? If not, why not. Try to understand your feelings.

2. Get a page, list the 5 things that are most important to you right now, for example:-

1. Your children, their safety & happiness
2. You, your satety & happiness
3. A clear head
4, 5 etc

As you do this, it should become clear what's important & how low down the list the house really actually is.

3. What support network do you have?
Can you discuss things with a sister, close friend etc, someone solid who you can lean on temporarily?

If you keep repeating the same actions, you will keep getting the same results. Therefore, you have to change because he won't. What is stopping you? Fear, irrational hope that things will be different etc. Get a page, write these things down & it might help you understand things clearer as at the moment, everything seems unclear your thoughts, your priorities etc.

First understand them, then make plans to address them, then act on them.

When a difficult situation has gone of for so long it's impossible to think or act clearly so the above might be a good starting point.

You deserve better & I hope you find the strength to improve your situation, you know you need to.

ElizaBennett

This is never going to turn into a good relationship so just give up. You have to. For your sanity and for your children. It's possible to move on from this. I was married for 20 years to a very difficult man who was also aggressive and made discussion impossible and it took me a while to realise things would never change. He didn't want to try counselling so there was nothing else for it. I was working full time so got a mortgage to buy him out. In his favour, he did leave easily enough once I said I didn't love him anymore as he's extremely proud. It sounds from what you describe that there is no love coming from your husband.. stop torturing yourself please.

XsApollo

If their are children involved he would have a really hard time making any judge agree to sell the place.
Kids are priority if they are under age and the family home will not be sold if they are living there.
Next time he is screaming at you and stuff call the guards.
More than likely they will ask him to leave or suggests he finds somewhere to stay for the night.

To be honest the ball would be firmly in your court if you wanted it to be.

dellas1979

There is a slightly weird....edge to this post.

Is all the analysing him and examples, is that to learn something from his behaviour?

I dont get it.

And even if you did learn something about this behaviour, what are you doing to do? Because, I'll tell you now, you are not going to change his behaviour.

The only thing you can do (if youre not happy) is to make your own decisions and modify your behaviour. That could mean coming to terms that you have to leave him.

igotissues

@dellas1979
Showing a sample conversation was to give context so people could give advice on what I would do to enforce a boundary in such a situation. I am quite rudderless as to how functional communication works in a relationship due to the current dynamic.

But as p.p.s have pointed out, it is utterly pointless trying to enforce a boundary in such a toxic relationship. Sometimes I waiver in my resolve and go back to that co dependency people placater.

shesty

Yeah OP, having read your sample conversations, you are trying to make it work in a 'normal" way.You are actually giving him all the power through these conversations.If I said to my OH could you do party bags etc, he would either say yeah no problem, or yeah, but will you take the baby while I do that.Generally followed by what time is this thing at anyway.That's fairly "normal".This guy is throwing a temper tantrum in his own peculiar way.One thing I will also say is that (and I am sorry to say this) he comes across as someone who has no respect for you, possibly even enjoys belittling you and the fact that you give in and essentially agree with him so quickly and easily....and may be scornful of you because of that too.I can understand your view to an extent because if you have never known anything else, how can you see the wood from the trees??That being said, you DO know normal....you are trying so hard to have normal conversations about normal things with him and it's not happening-but the problem is all on his side, not yours.

Unfortunately the only way to solve this is to get an exit strategy planned.People have given really good advice here.I would possibly also suggest ringing the likes of women's aid, or a similar organisation, moreso for advice than anything else...they might be able to tell you about the best way to get yourself out of this situation for starters.The thing is though that first of all,you need to accept that he won't change,no matter what you do, so now....what do you do next?

Big Bag of Chips

I don't know, OP. My take on the examples you have given is that he wasn't all that wrong, in these instances. Not excusing all his other behaviour, in any way.

But I know my husband would absolutely hate the thought of being left alone to do party bags and goodbyes. He wouldn't know parents, and hates forced small talk. So I'd never expect him to do that. If I wasn't available for the duration of the party, then it would be moved to a day I was. You knew he'd hate this, and you set it up anyway. And even though he does hate it, has agreed to do it.

Also the example where you were talking to your son about his slipping grades, and he told him he was 'better than that' — I don't see anything wrong with that.

I think though these examples are just showing that you and he are completely at odds. You are both completely on opposite sides and can no longer see any merit in anything the other one says or does. You are in constant conflict with each other and it's unhealthy for everyone involved.

You keep hoping and expecting him to change, but he hasn't and he won't. You need to get your head around that, and make steps to make life easier for yourself and your children.

Ursus Horribilis

I assume his lady friend is still on the scene?

igotissues

I hear you BBOC. It's just the aggressive way he goes about everything with me and kids. First I knew he was pissed off was his slamming stuff in kitchen and saying ****ing forget all this. Sick of all this ****.
I take issue with his severe criticism of our son (**** sake, you lost out on 1/5th marks, it's not ****ing good enough) for e.g.

@UH. Yes. Little less texting but still several times a week. Still Jokes, compliments. And 1.5 hour Skype today with another planned for next week. Less contact is due to her taking time to reply as he replies in much shorter time frames.

Tbh, while it galls me- I'd rather warn her than warn her off as she is quite vulnerable and had poor boundaries (he has a type ;-)
He sees himself as honest- as we're together he will keep it clean but when we break again , I wouldn't be surprised to see a very rapid ramp up again.

Big Bag of Chips

What would you like, OP?

What would make you happy?

igotissues

Big Bag of Chips wrote: »

What would you like, OP?

What would make you happy?

Honestly?
More days now I want peace.
To me that looks like being away from him, having got a reasonable separation agreement. Feeling comfortable to say or do things without the risk of someone going ape**** at me for being myself. I want the chance to be me, not this fake happy/sad puppet. And to feel quiet in myself (some of this will be down to my own work I need to do; I can't blame him for my behaviours)
What I would REALLY like is that some day he would come to me and acknowledge the hurt and damage he caused with his drinking and his abuse. (He's a year dry and won't acknowledge it was anything other than a minor blip, So admitting the latter is about as likely as a lotto win).
And in dreamy dreamy fantasy land? I'd love if he went on a trip to Damascus in sandals/had frontal lobotomy- and came back a changed man. One who is loving and respectful, is emotionally open and hasn't an angry bone in his body.

Lackey

igotissues wrote: »

I hear you BBOC. It's just the aggressive way he goes about everything with me and kids. First I knew he was pissed off was his slamming stuff in kitchen and saying ****ing forget all this. Sick of all this ****.
I take issue with his severe criticism of our son (**** sake, you lost out on 1/5th marks, it's not ****ing good enough) for e.g.

YOU are teaching your kids that is acceptable to do to someone else and it’s acceptable for it to be done to them.
YOU are an adult and have full control over this situation
Your kids don’t have any choice but to live in this sh!tshow and that’s really sad.

YOU either chose to protect your kids from this, and teach them what’s an acceptable way to be treated and treat other people. Or you don’t.
It’s that simple.

Honeydew3456

So sad to read all this but the good news is I think the door is wide open and you are standing there in front of it, ready to walk through it now and find that peace for you and your children.

I happy happy to see that you recognise the emotionally abusive relationship you are in. That is half the battle. You see it now from the outside, you know it is wrong, you know he will never change or embrace the real, beautiful you. So f&ck him. Off with him and off with you to where you want to be.

LolaJJ

Hey OP

My first thought was to respond with "Get out"

This of course is pretty unhelpful to you when clearly these things are complex and as you say there are deep-rooted but I would suggest that you are in a kind of "can't see the wood from the trees" scenario here.

We get so caught up in the detail we fail to see the bigger picture at times. For one, from your communication issues. The best advice I have ever gotten is "Keep doing what you're doing and you'll keep getting what you're getting"

If you constantly want (and need) to discuss certain topics and he knows that his silence frustrates you, then this is where he is getting his power to abuse you. I would try as best as you can to exclude him from decision making, reduce the need for his input, have other people collect the kids or just find ways to reduce the need for his input. Take away his power to abuse you in that way.

Long term though, and I think you're getting there, please do try and figure out an exit strategy, life does not and should not be this difficult. Even take a breath to read how much time you have invested in creating and contributing to this thread. I can only imagine how much of your emotional resources are being exhausted by this and that has to leave less for your kids who can't avoid picking up on all of this.

Whatever you do and however you do it, best of luck x

shesty

From your last post OP, I think you do love him and just want him to be the husband you need him to be - but you are beginning to accept that he probably won't ever be like that, and that you have had enough. I guess that's the first step to the way out.



Best of luck. I hope you manage to find your peace.