N.c.t.s still being bought?

KevinCavan

Just wondering if anybody else thinks that n.c.t.s are still being bought. I have to say that judging by some of the cars out there for sale with a full year’s n.c.t., that it can’t be possible that they passed legitimately. I know n.c.t. inspectors have been fired in the past, but is time to look into the ones that are still operating? At the most basic level is it possible that Mickie the n.c.t. inspector, who’s best friend Johnny arrives with a car, is going to fail Johnny his buddy?

Atlantic Dawn

Any examples where you seen a years NCT and think it shouldn't have passed?

Isambard

the areas where a Tester can swing things must be limited. Mostly the computer decides.

Del2005

KevinCavan wrote: »

Just wondering if anybody else thinks that n.c.t.s are still being bought. I have to say that judging by some of the cars out there for sale with a full year’s n.c.t., that it can’t be possible that they passed legitimately. I know n.c.t. inspectors have been fired in the past, but is time to look into the ones that are still operating? At the most basic level is it possible that Mickie the n.c.t. inspector, who’s best friend Johnny arrives with a car, is going to fail Johnny his buddy?

I'd say its more that the NCT is fake rather than bribed. Put the reg into the NCTS site and see if they are legit.

KevinCavan

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Any examples where you seen a years NCT and think it shouldn't have passed?

Went to see a car in Dublin, that a dealer was selling. It was an absolute wreck inside, the airbag light was flashing on and off as I drove it. It had a full year’s n.c.t. on it. It felt like it should have been scrapped, but some how had fresh n.c.t. I since (two weeks ago) bought a second hand car, again with a full year’s n.c.t. and I’m going to have to bring it to a garage, as it makes a strange sound sometimes when I’m reversing, it shouldn’t have a full year’s n.c.t. either. I’m beginning to feel that in a Ireland, car dealers have a cosy relationship with n.c.t. testers.

biko

The way you spell NCT "n.c.t" wrecks my head

There have been many allegations on this forum that something isn't right with the NCT but no-one has been able to prove anything, not is it likely testers would be able to fake measurements taken by machines.

KevinCavan

biko wrote: »

The way you spell NCT "n.c.t" wrecks my head

There have been many allegations on this forum that something isn't right with the NCT but no-one has been able to prove anything, not is it likely testers would be able to fake measurements taken by machines.

Could you potentially put a “good car” through the test and just log it under registration of bad car?

Atlantic Dawn

Can you check any of those cars you spotted on the NCT.ie webpage to see if they show as legit?

mickdw

Nct made some changes in order to be able to spot patterns re car presenters and those doing the test. In addition, the rsa can at any time request that any random car is retested immediately with their staff present or even carrying out the test so it has been tightened up a lot. To say however that it's mostly decided by computer is not correct.
There are plenty of visuals that require the testers opinion and as such there will always be some variation in results.
The nct however is a basic suite of checks and it should in no way be relied upon 're thinking you will have a years hassle free driving.
A perfectly legitimately newly tested car could after only a few miles need a new clutch, discs and pads, tyres, shocks etc. In addition it could need mechanical repair due to random failure of any number of items.
All I would take from nct is that the car is not rotted to unsafe condition, is generally safe to drive down the road and won't need the hassle of nct til next year.

EPAndlee

People should stop assuming that if a car has an nct its mechanical okay

KevinCavan

mickdw wrote: »

Nct made some changes in order to be able to spot patterns re car presenters and those doing the test. In addition, the rsa can at any time request that any random car is retested immediately with their staff present or even carrying out the test so it has been tightened up a lot. To say however that it's mostly decided by computer is not correct.
There are plenty of visuals that require the testers opinion and as such there will always be some variation in results.
The nct however is a basic suite of checks and it should in no way be relied upon 're thinking you will have a years hassle free driving.
A perfectly legitimately newly tested car could after only a few miles need a new clutch, discs and pads, tyres, shocks etc. In addition it could need mechanical repair due to random failure of any number of items.
All I would take from nct is that the car is not rotted to unsafe condition, is generally safe to drive down the road and won't need the hassle of nct til next year.

Okay you made good points, but you did say a number of checks boil down to the tester’s opinion. That surely leaves it open to abuse. Let’s say there is a car dealer in Town A, who knows a tester in Town A. Let’s say the car dealer brings 40 cars per year to be tested. Is there anything to stop the dealer doing a deal with the tester, for say €600? The €600 gets the tester to look the other way, the tester tells him what days at what time would be good to show up, when a snitch won’t be around etc.

Aint Eazy Being Cheezy

KevinCavan wrote: »

Okay you made good points, but you did say a number of checks boil down to the tester’s opinion. That surely leaves it open to abuse. Let’s say there is a car dealer in Town A, who knows a tester in Town A. Let’s say the car dealer brings 40 cars per year to be tested. Is there anything to stop the dealer doing a deal with the tester, for say €600? The €600 gets the tester to look the other way, the tester tells him what days at what time would be good to show up, when a snitch won’t be around etc.

Think you’re starting to get paranoid now, you crazy fecker.

corks finest

Del2005 wrote: »

KevinCavan wrote: »

Just wondering if anybody else thinks that n.c.t.s are still being bought. I have to say that judging by some of the cars out there for sale with a full year’s n.c.t., that it can’t be possible that they passed legitimately. I know n.c.t. inspectors have been fired in the past, but is time to look into the ones that are still operating? At the most basic level is it possible that Mickie the n.c.t. inspector, who’s best friend Johnny arrives with a car, is going to fail Johnny his buddy?

I'd say its more that the NCT is fake rather than bribed. Put the reg into the NCTS site and see if they are legit.

Correct,and some poor mug could buy a second hand with false NCT- bummer

KevinCavan

Aint Eazy Being Cheezy wrote: »

Think you’re starting to get paranoid now, you crazy fecker.

Ha-ha glad you think it’s impossible for there to be corruption in NCT centers, even in small towns where everybody knows each other. NCT inspectors have been fired in the past for corruption, just to let you know. Primetime previously uncovered corruption in NCT tests. But hey I’m crazy, what would I know.

KevinCavan

OSI wrote: »

Of the tens of testers that work any given center at any given shift, how is the dealer supposed to guarantee that the tester he has bribed is going to be on shift and line up all of his other tests perfectly so that the dealers car is next in line when he goes out to get the next job?

Okay so let’s say I’m a dealer, my friend works in centre Y. I ring My friend, what days you working next week. I found out he’s working Monday to Thursday next week. I go online looking for any available spot on those days. I find a spot available Wednesday night at eight. I book that spot and let my friend know I’ll be in at eight on Thursday. He makes sure he tests my car.

EPAndlee

This thread should be in conspiracy theories

Del2005

KevinCavan wrote: »

Okay so let’s say I’m a dealer, my friend works in centre Y. I ring My friend, what days you working next week. I found out he’s working Monday to Thursday next week. I go online looking for any available spot on those days. I find a spot available Wednesday night at eight. I book that spot and let my friend know I’ll be in at eight on Thursday. He makes sure he tests my car.

It's easier for the dealer to just fake the cert themselves than bribe someone. The other thing is that you can clear error codes so that it will pass the NCT but the error isn't fixed so it'll reappear in a few hours or days. Did you check if the cars had legit NCTs from the NCTS site?

Del2005

corks finest wrote: »

Correct,and some poor mug could buy a second hand with false NCT- bummer

Not if you do a history check and verify that it's a legit NCT. If you don't you could have bigger issues.

Atlantic Dawn

It would be a real stupid move to risk your job for a few hundred here and there where it is easily traced back to you, particularly for cars going through a dealer a pattern would develope.

Wishbone Ash

KevinCavan wrote: »

Okay so let’s say I’m a dealer, my friend works in centre Y. I ring My friend, what days you working next week. I found out he’s working Monday to Thursday next week. I go online looking for any available spot on those days. I find a spot available Wednesday night at eight. I book that spot and let my friend know I’ll be in at eight on Thursday. He makes sure he tests my car.

Why do you think friendship means corruption? Most people have moral standards. People have friends working in supermarkets, but don't expect to have their groceries put through without being scanned? And why would anyone risk it for the sake of a few hundred Euro? If a friend of mine asked me to do something illegal, they wouldn't be a friend any longer.

corks finest

Del2005 wrote: »

corks finest wrote: »

Correct,and some poor mug could buy a second hand with false NCT- bummer

Not if you do a history check and verify that it's a legit NCT. If you don't you could have bigger issues.

Be surprised some folk just don't check

punisher5112

I could NCT a car tomorrow and it pass.

I could drive out the gate bounce it off a curb, pot hole or a wall.

Get a quick repair and sell on.....

NCT passes it on that day anything after is exactly that after.


Sensors go, electrical issues could come up after.

The other day my rear wiper failed 1st time I hit it in months by accident.

My rear exhaust made a huge imprint in the road where it imbeded itself as there was a huge dip and now the tip is bent out badly.

So much can happen after.

Del2005

corks finest wrote: »

Be surprised some folk just don't check

Unfortunately I'm not surprised because don't get a mechanic to look over the car before purchasing. And then people wonder why some dealers sell dodgy motors, yet they don't do the basic checks before making the 2nd biggest purchase in their life.

rex-x

OSI wrote: »

Of the tens of testers that work any given center at any given shift, how is the dealer supposed to guarantee that the tester he has bribed is going to be on shift and line up all of his other tests perfectly so that the dealers car is next in line when he goes out to get the next job?

The way it works for many dealers is they drop cars at say 9am and collect them at 5 tested, this was how the dodgy ncts were facilitated a few years ago although they have tightened up on it in recent times.

The money traded hands outside of the test center and generally dodgy passes were for non safety critical items like emissions. I don't know of any who were doing passes for death traps. Dodgy passes were definitely a thing and I'm sure still are but to less of an extent than 3 or 4 years ago.

Polo_Cluvie

Dealers are definitely given the benefit of doubt. I've also come across cars that no way should have passed and have and cars that were failed that were 100%. It's like a game of chance ffs. A mate of mine put his car through with a handbrake that practically hit the ceiling of the car and no way would it hold the car on the smallest of inclines and they passed it! I'm still gob smacked tbh

dr.fuzzenstein

If it wasn't for the NCT, a lot of cars would never be serviced at all.
Most people will grudgingly put it through a service every 2 years (oil change with the cheapest 10w40 available and fcuk the specs) before doing the NCT and complain what a scam it is.
I remember cars in Ireland before the NCT.
Cracked windscreens, broken head or taillights (or filled with water), cars crabbing sideways, only one working head or taillight, lights looking for birds in the trees, rust everywhere, basically on par with Mexico and Morocco.
The NCT had a huge influence on motoring in Ireland.
I bought one car where the crankshaft oils seal started leaking after an oil change. That's because it never had one and the seal had turned into sandpaper and ground down the shaft. The fresh oil was now leaking.
Another had broken springs that were held up with blocks of wood that where wedged into them.
And the famous 4 different tires on a car.
Irish people still don't believe in maintaining their cars, but this way at least they're forced into nto doing the bare minimum.

OldMrBrennan83

EPAndlee wrote: »

This thread should be in conspiracy theories

Have you shares in it or something?

Armadillo

There is probably less chance of a big brand main dealer chancing this but there is potential for a smaller trader operation (maybe in around the bermuda triangle of car traders in certain areas) having friends on the inside.
Quite a lot of the nct test is still a visual examination and a 'fresh' nct cert could mean the difference of a few hundred to a few thousand euro.
Who is checking the new recording system that the nct contract operators (Applus+ over 8 million euro profit in 2016) have in place.
Do they have a computer program to cross reference individuals or dealer\traders against the testers or centers or is it just a spot check by a human or independent body every so often. Maybe the nct needs even more transparency and need to make this data available publicly.
Corruption can be reduced but it can never be totally eliminated due to the human factor.
This 2 jailed in 2017 for the events in 2011.
https://www.thejournal.ie/courts-nct-men-3273984-Mar2017/
It may not always be the €50 in the ashtray but some other personal favour or external pressure to turn a blind eye.

grogi

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

If it wasn't for the NCT, a lot of cars would never be serviced at all.
Most people will grudgingly put it through a service every 2 years (oil change with the cheapest 10w40 available and fcuk the specs) before doing the NCT and complain what a scam it is.
I remember cars in Ireland before the NCT.
Cracked windscreens, broken head or taillights (or filled with water), cars crabbing sideways, only one working head or taillight, lights looking for birds in the trees, rust everywhere, basically on par with Mexico and Morocco.
The NCT had a huge influence on motoring in Ireland.
I bought one car where the crankshaft oils seal started leaking after an oil change. That's because it never had one and the seal had turned into sandpaper and ground down the shaft. The fresh oil was now leaking.
Another had broken springs that were held up with blocks of wood that where wedged into them.
And the famous 4 different tires on a car.
Irish people still don't believe in maintaining their cars, but this way at least they're forced into nto doing the bare minimum.

And that's the real benefit of having the NCT requirement.

Del2005

Armadillo wrote: »

There is probably less chance of a big brand main dealer chancing this but there is potential for a smaller trader operation (maybe in around the bermuda triangle of car traders in certain areas) having friends on the inside.
Quite a lot of the nct test is still a visual examination and a 'fresh' nct cert could mean the difference of a few hundred to a few thousand euro.
Who is checking the new recording system that the nct contract operators (Applus+ over 8 million euro profit in 2016) have in place.
Do they have a computer program to cross reference individuals or dealer\traders against the testers or centers or is it just a spot check by a human or independent body every so often. Maybe the nct needs even more transparency and need to make this data available publicly.
Corruption can be reduced but it can never be totally eliminated due to the human factor.
This 2 jailed in 2017 for the events in 2011.
https://www.thejournal.ie/courts-nct-men-3273984-Mar2017/
It may not always be the €50 in the ashtray but some other personal favour or external pressure to turn a blind eye.

With the amount of people willing to buy cars with no NCT, but with a "guarantee" it'll pass!, from dealers why would they bother to bribe the tester?

The NCT is only a basic safety test that's only really valid till it drives out of the centre, because you can make a car dangerously defective by hitting a pot hole or kerb, yet people seem to think that once you buy from a dealer and it has an fresh NCT the car will be perfect, this and the numerous other NCT threads here show that they aren't.

stefanovich

SHOCK! So the 50 euro in the ashtray no longer works??!!