Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Hi there,
There is an issue with role permissions that is being worked on at the moment.
If you are having trouble with access or permissions on regional forums please post here to get access: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058365403/you-do-not-have-permission-for-that#latest

Should a third gender option be included in the census?

  • 24-01-2019 3:21pm
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,765 ✭✭✭


    An important progressive step of statistical importance or a precedent that will lead to more and more classifications that will lead to the opposite?


«134

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,103 ✭✭✭✭neris


    no


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,571 ✭✭✭tigger123


    sxt wrote: »
    An important progressive step of statistical importance or a precedent that will lead to more and more classifications that will lead to the opposite?

    Are you suggesting this? Or did you see this somewhere else?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 113 ✭✭Prince William


    Yes a third gender opinion should be on census 2021


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,908 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    There should be 2 options, leading as follows
    What is your sex:
    - Penis, I am male.
    - Vagina, I am female.


  • Site Banned Posts: 512 ✭✭✭Dakotabigone


    What does one have to have to qualify for this new gender?


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,190 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    No.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,765 ✭✭✭sxt


    tigger123 wrote: »
    Are you suggesting this? Or did you see this somewhere else?

    Canada and Australia are officially doing so in their next census


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,190 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    What does one have to have to qualify for this new gender?

    Just a notion that you want to be it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,235 ✭✭✭✭Cee-Jay-Cee


    You’re either male or female when you are born. New born babies have no awareness of their sexuality and so their gender is determine by their physical attributes. End of story.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,775 ✭✭✭✭Gbear


    The census isn't a determination of the laws of physics. It's an information gathering exercise.

    If there are significant numbers of people who would put something else on the gender question, and knowing that would aid in the provision of services or formulation of policy, then it should be there.

    It's not a moral question. It's about government planning.

    I don't know why people get so exercised about something so trivial as transgenderism.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,461 ✭✭✭Bob Harris


    What does one have to have to qualify for this new gender?

    A willy and/or a fanny. Then you identify yourself as whatever you want.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,173 ✭✭✭✭How Soon Is Now


    Uhhhhhhhhhh!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,732 ✭✭✭BarryD2


    neris wrote: »
    no

    No, no, no. The census like the constitution is no place for such confusion.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,044 ✭✭✭Theboinkmaster


    sxt wrote: »
    An important progressive step of statistical importance or a precedent that will lead to more and more classifications that will lead to the opposite?

    Nonsense - there are only 2 genders.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,959 ✭✭✭Deebles McBeebles


    If we have 3 options it should be;
    A. Male
    B. Female
    C. None of the above

    I predict about 1 million people will choose C purely to take the p*ss.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,571 ✭✭✭tigger123


    Why all the hostility towards this idea? If you choose male or female, what business is it of yours what someone else chooses?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,508 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    69e7d2775263b17e4f0c484f62ae9de5.jpg


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,143 ✭✭✭Auguste Comte


    I'm Jedi by religion and gender.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 498 ✭✭Muckka


    I identify as a tulip.

    There's only two gender's, no matter what your brain tells you.

    Inside you're either biologically a man or a woman.

    As for the tulip, I wasn't born a bulb.

    I'm all for the people's choice, have a refferendum on it if ye like.
    Majority rules.
    I'm all for democracy.

    But there's only two gender's.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,261 ✭✭✭✭TheValeyard


    I'm Jedi by religion and gender.

    Prefer Sith myself. More fun.

    All eyes on Kursk. Slava Ukraini.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 571 ✭✭✭tmh106


    You’re either male or female when you are born. New born babies have no awareness of their sexuality and so their gender is determine by their physical attributes. End of story.

    Not true. Intersex babies share characteristics of male and female.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 498 ✭✭Muckka


    Prefer Sith myself. More fun.

    I'd prefer to be a grey Jedi, but I like your style lol


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,033 ✭✭✭✭Richard Hillman


    sxt wrote: »
    Canada and Australia are officially doing so in their next census
    And in 100 years when people look back, they will be saying "what the hell were they thinking?".


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,140 ✭✭✭✭TheDoc


    Gbear wrote: »
    The census isn't a determination of the laws of physics. It's an information gathering exercise.

    If there are significant numbers of people who would put something else on the gender question, and knowing that would aid in the provision of services or formulation of policy, then it should be there.

    It's not a moral question. It's about government planning.

    I don't know why people get so exercised about something so trivial as transgenderism.

    The proposed change of genders and pronouns in language is a pretty significant matter. That is where the debate or issues arise. Along with the whole non-binary thing also.

    Totally cool with Transgenderism, not cool with being told how the use of century old pronouns and descriptors are not all of a sudden "offensive". That part of it along with non-binary stuff is a totally fine movement and thing to have or do, but don't expect to not be challenged when it comes to language an what constitutes offense etc.

    It's also just another hotbed for aggressive/excitable people who can't engage in any debate, and if the view is contradictory then you are just labelled as being "anti-trans" or whatever


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,872 ✭✭✭Sittingpretty


    tmh106 wrote: »
    Not true. Intersex babies share characteristics of male and female.

    Intersex is a TINY proportion of births, certainly no where near enough to consider a third gender classification on a census form.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Will Siri ,Alexa and cortuna be included don't want them ladies to be left out


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,974 ✭✭✭Chris_Heilong


    You should do a poll, they are always fun...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,140 ✭✭✭✭TheDoc


    tigger123 wrote: »
    Why all the hostility towards this idea? If you choose male or female, what business is it of yours what someone else chooses?

    If there is to be any socially acceptable change surrounding centuries of language, I'd argue its pretty much all our business?

    Male or Female is a universally accepted choice for gender, because there are only two.

    If there is to be a universally accepted new structure, method or setup, that is something that will go through plenty of discussions, debate and factoring.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,226 ✭✭✭✭Pherekydes


    There is no question regarding gender on the census.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,571 ✭✭✭tigger123


    TheDoc wrote: »
    If there is to be any socially acceptable change surrounding centuries of language, I'd argue its pretty much all our business?

    Male or Female is a universally accepted choice for gender, because there are only two.

    If there is to be a universally accepted new structure, method or setup, that is something that will go through plenty of discussions, debate and factoring.

    We don't use the same language we did centuries ago. Language is evolving on a continuing basis, and is never static. Words, their context, and meaning are continually updated.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,669 ✭✭✭Tin Foil Hat


    The census form doesn't ask about gender ay all. It asks about sex.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,140 ✭✭✭✭TheDoc


    tigger123 wrote: »
    We don't use the same language we did centuries ago. Language is evolving on a continuing basis, and is never static. Words, their context, and meaning are continually updated.

    Absolutely, but done so through social acceptance and adoption. And while words may change and evolve as you say, fundamentals of the language don't always.

    Pronouns have been a fundamental of language since it's invention, and really hasn't changed. It has evolved every so slightly over time, but has generally remained the same for centuries.

    Like what would the third option even be? Something like "do not with to define" or is there someone or some group putting forward a new gender type?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,474 ✭✭✭Obvious Desperate Breakfasts


    You’re either male or female when you are born. New born babies have no awareness of their sexuality and so their gender is determine by their physical attributes. End of story.

    Well no, you can be born intersex, having biological characteristics of both genders. It’s a tricky thing to know how to treat.
    Intersex is a TINY proportion of births, certainly no where near enough to consider a third gender classification on a census form.

    But still, they exist.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,710 ✭✭✭D3V!L


    The census form doesn't ask about gender ay all. It asks about sex.

    You do know its the same thing , don't you ?

    :rolleyes:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,717 ✭✭✭Apiarist


    D3V!L wrote: »
    You do know its the same thing , don't you ?

    :rolleyes:

    Nope, gender and sex are not the same thing generally. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_and_gender_distinction


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,710 ✭✭✭D3V!L


    victor8600 wrote: »
    Nope, gender and sex are not the same thing generally. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_and_gender_distinction

    Nope,

    I'm sticking with my original comment.

    :rolleyes:

    You can cut things off, put things inside out etc but you cannot change your gender / sex.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    Male
    Female
    Attack Helicopter


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,669 ✭✭✭Tin Foil Hat


    D3V!L wrote: »
    You do know its the same thing , don't you ?

    :rolleyes:

    Oh I know that. Plenty people pretend not to though, by spinning the line that sex and gender are different, and then going on to argue that people should be allowed to self identify as their 'gender' even when specifically asked for their sex.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,160 ✭✭✭Huntergonzo


    Sure why not, as of this very moment I identify as a pencil. I demand you acknowledge and respect my delusion and if you don't then you're a backwards bigot!

    People are great aren't they :-)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,995 ✭✭✭Ipso


    Just three, get woke!


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 296 ✭✭Noodles81


    What will/ could the 3rd one be?

    Transitioning? Hermaphrodite?

    So I'm either male or female ( born or transitioned).

    Or, I can be male and say I'm female and vice versa.

    I can't be anything else, or can I? Like a pencil, that's just delusional.

    Please explain in plain English.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,397 ✭✭✭Pauliedragon


    sxt wrote: »
    Canada and Australia are officially doing so in their next census
    Australia made a complete balls up of the last census. They are the last country we should be looking for census advice. A demented donkey couldn't have made more of a dogs breakfast of their last census attempt.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,122 ✭✭✭c montgomery


    Male/female/head the ball


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 691 ✭✭✭Terrlock


    No....there are 2 genders Male and Female.....the more we give in to nonsense the greater the nonsense will be.

    We are transitioning out of the control of religious groups...we should try and attain some sensibility...not just submit to an even greater level of nonsense that is appearing out of the cracks.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,667 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    tigger123 wrote: »
    We don't use the same language we did centuries ago. Language is evolving on a continuing basis, and is never static. Words, their context, and meaning are continually updated.

    Plus this sort of information is great from a statistical point of view.

    The only problem I can see with a question like What gender do you identify as. Or what gender are you. 1) Female, 2) Male, 3) other, is that there will be some people who have no idea what that means.

    nevertheless, these are statistics we should be collecting.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,667 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    Terrlock wrote: »
    No....there are 2 genders Male and Female.....the more we give in to nonsense the greater the nonsense will be.

    We are transitioning out of the control of religious groups...we should try and attain some sensibility...not just submit to an even greater level of nonsense that is appearing out of the cracks.

    Yet we have questions asking what sky fairy people believe in. And to be fair, that's an important bit of information. The same can be said for sexuality or what gender people identify as. And that's what the census is for.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,559 ✭✭✭ceadaoin.


    They should ask sex and also gender identity if different from biological sex. Job done


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,160 ✭✭✭Huntergonzo


    As a matter of interest, can I decide I'm a women and start using the ladies changing rooms in the gym? if so I may start to get behind this very important 'fight for equality'!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,070 ✭✭✭Franz Von Peppercorn


    Gbear wrote: »
    The census isn't a determination of the laws of physics. It's an information gathering exercise.

    If there are significant numbers of people who would put something else on the gender question, and knowing that would aid in the provision of services or formulation of policy, then it should be there.

    It's not a moral question. It's about government planning.

    I don't know why people get so exercised about something so trivial as transgenderism.

    transgenderism has plenty of societal impact.

    Anyway surely it’s two or four genders. Ignoring the fluidity stuff.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,819 ✭✭✭Rezident


    No. How can you ignore Biology? Biology is a good system, that's why we use it. Having 31 genders like they have in New York (it may have gone up since then) or the 50 plus genders they have on facebook, are not good systems, they are ridiculously confusing, that's why we don't use them.

    Also, going with what people say, as supposed to a verifiable system is open to abuse, people could just start making up their own genders, how can it be verified?

    Feelings may change, biology is insuperably more reliable.

    Biology > feelings


  • Advertisement
Advertisement