Charging at work

Dev1234

Hi,

I'm not sure if this has been covered previously as I am new to electric vehicles.

What would be the typical charging set up that a company provide? Are they standard granny cable charging facilities or would they have the fast chargers (CHAdeMO)? Or a mix?

I ask as I am thinking of getting an Outlander PHEV and based on my commute (26 miles - half motorway / half N roads) I'm thinking I would need to be able to charge in work to gain the benefits of an EV and not be relying on the petrol engine for my trip home.

Also, how do companies typically manage charging at work? Do you book a time slot? Is it first come first served and you are relying on people coming out to move their cars during the day to free up the charge point?

Where I work are in the process of installing them so there are no instructions as of yet as to how it will all work but I'd be interested to hear what others experience on a day-to-day basis.

I know I will get home in a PHEV without a charge but for it to make sense financially I would want to be fairly sure that I would get access to the charge point at some stage during the day.

Thanks

Calahonda52

I get the sense that you expect to freeload the charging at work for it to make sense financially.
You also expect to get charge time at work, even if it means discommoding a BEV.
What a wonderful world you live in.

ELM327

I'm liaising with the site team to get access to our work chargers removed for non BEV vehicles. Daily there's a queue and it's so annoying to see a phev charging at 3kW when you know someone in a BEV has to stop on the way home to charge. Just for the phev owner to save €1 in electricity.

rivegauche

In our work multi-storey parkhouse the BEVs charge on the ground floor and PHEVs charge on the floors above.

listermint

i envisage this getting so complex that workplaces will decide its too much hastle tbh.

Especially if there is arguments about how electric your car is over mine. etc.


(not arguing that its not valid concern) but i can see workplaces just saying 'nope too much hastle' charge it at home. -

ted1

Calahonda52 wrote: »

I get the sense that you expect to freeload the charging at work for it to make sense financially.
You also expect to get charge time at work, even if it means discommoding a BEV.
What a wonderful world you live in.

I wouldn’t call it freeloading I’d say it’s a perk of a job and the company improves its CSR by promoting EV usage.

Silent Running

Dev1234 wrote: »

Hi,

I'm not sure if this has been covered previously as I am new to electric vehicles.

What would be the typical charging set up that a company provide? Are they standard granny cable charging facilities or would they have the fast chargers (CHAdeMO)? Or a mix?

I ask as I am thinking of getting an Outlander PHEV and based on my commute (26 miles - half motorway / half N roads) I'm thinking I would need to be able to charge in work to gain the benefits of an EV and not be relying on the petrol engine for my trip home.

Also, how do companies typically manage charging at work? Do you book a time slot? Is it first come first served and you are relying on people coming out to move their cars during the day to free up the charge point?

Where I work are in the process of installing them so there are no instructions as of yet as to how it will all work but I'd be interested to hear what others experience on a day-to-day basis.

I know I will get home in a PHEV without a charge but for it to make sense financially I would want to be fairly sure that I would get access to the charge point at some stage during the day.

Thanks

You seem to have a fairly small commute. Any reason not to full BEV?

Dev1234

Calahonda52 wrote: »

I get the sense that you expect to freeload the charging at work for it to make sense financially.
You also expect to get charge time at work, even if it means discommoding a BEV.
What a wonderful world you live in.

Doesn't everyone freeload at work? It needs to be financially viable to drive an EV or a PHEV and I'm sure many on here have bought EVs based on the fact that they can "freeload" at work. As mentioned in my OP, I can get home on the ICE but if there was a fast charger in work I don't think I be discommoding anyone for 20 minutes.

ELM327 wrote: »

I'm liaising with the site team to get access to our work chargers removed for non BEV vehicles. Daily there's a queue and it's so annoying to see a phev charging at 3kW when you know someone in a BEV has to stop on the way home to charge. Just for the phev owner to save €1 in electricity.

If the PHEV has a daily commute of 20 miles each way what makes a BEV more of a priority? The PHEV user wants the same benefits as a the BEV owners (environmental, financial etc.) - why should a BEV get priority?

rivegauche wrote: »

In our work multi-storey parkhouse the BEVs charge on the ground floor and PHEVs charge on the floors above.

Thanks rivegauch

listermint wrote: »

i envisage this getting so complex that workplaces will decide its too much hastle tbh.

Especially if there is arguments about how electric your car is over mine. etc.


(not arguing that its not valid concern) but i can see workplaces just saying 'nope too much hastle' charge it at home. -

Looking at the reaction to my opening post I can see what you mean!!!

Dev1234

Silent Running wrote: »

You seem to have a fairly small commute. Any reason not to full BEV?

The family is growing. Throw in the dog as well and I am not sure if there is a BEV out there size wise within my budget (20k or so).

ELM327

Dev1234 wrote: »

If the PHEV has a daily commute of 20 miles each way what makes a BEV more of a priority? The PHEV user wants the same benefits as a the BEV owners (environmental, financial etc.) - why should a BEV get priority?

PHEV is not stuck at work they can drive on, BEV is stuck until they get a charge.

eddhorse

Interesting topic, currently only two Electric Ireland charging points near our office block,
Keeping an eye on it and always seems to be the same cars parked there.

ELM327

ELM327 wrote: »

I'm liaising with the site team to get access to our work chargers removed for non BEV vehicles. Daily there's a queue and it's so annoying to see a phev charging at 3kW when you know someone in a BEV has to stop on the way home to charge. Just for the phev owner to save €1 in electricity.

ELM327 wrote: »

PHEV is not stuck at work they can drive on, BEV is stuck until they get a charge.

You'd want to be totally daft to rely on work charging in a BEV, when buying a BEV one should factor in reliance on the public network if your return commute can't be done on your home charging.

Alkers

IMO phevs have just as much right to use destination chargers (such as at your workplace) as full bevs.
I get the argument about not making it home for rapid chargers (which I don't think phevs should use if anyone is waiting) but it's not the phev owners fault you purchased a vehicle unsuitable to your needs.

ELM327

Augeo wrote: »

You'd want to be totally daft to rely on work charging in a BEV, when buying a BEV one should factor in reliance on the public network if your return commute can't be done on your home charging.

What EV do you drive?

ELM327

ELM327 wrote: »

PHEV is not stuck at work they can drive on, BEV is stuck until they get a charge.

I've no skin in the game....I don't have an EV of any description. But if somebody started giving me grief over the fact that I could pay for fuel to get home instead of charging it for free I'd laugh in their face. Whether or not you can get home without charging means SFA to me. Just saying.

rivegauche

Simona1986 wrote: »

IMO phevs have just as much right to use destination chargers (such as at your workplace) as full bevs.
I get the argument about not making it home for rapid chargers (which I don't think phevs should use if anyone is waiting) but it's not the phev owners fault you purchased a vehicle unsuitable to your needs.

PHEV parked at a charging point for 8 hours by a German "towel on the deckchair" type. That's what the rules in our place prevent.

Silent Running

Dev1234 wrote: »

Doesn't everyone freeload at work? It needs to be financially viable to drive an EV or a PHEV and I'm sure many on here have bought EVs based on the fact that they can "freeload" at work. As mentioned in my OP, I can get home on the ICE but if there was a fast charger in work I don't think I be discommoding anyone for 20 minutes.


If the PHEV has a daily commute of 20 miles each way what makes a BEV more of a priority? The PHEV user wants the same benefits as a the BEV owners (environmental, financial etc.) - why should a BEV get priority?


Thanks rivegauch


Looking at the reaction to my opening post I can see what you mean!!!

I wouldn't be worried about being called a freeloader. I was slated recently because I do most of my charging on the public network. This is because I use destination chargers for their intended purpose, and most of my driving is done a very long distance away from my home charger, very regularly in another country.

While I've no problem with PHEVs using work chargers, (it's up to the employers/employees how they handle their local etiquette) I get a bit irked when I come to a public charger occupied by a PHEV. The public network is inadequate to provide for those without an engine, never mind cars that can use their engine to get home.

If/when the public network can handle all forms of car charging, it'll be a different story.

ELM327

Deleted User wrote: »

I've no skin in the game....I don't have an EV of any description. But if somebody started giving me grief over the fact that I could pay for fuel to get home instead of charging it for free I'd laugh in their face. Whether or not you can get home without charging means SFA to me. Just saying.

So no EV yet you think you know what works best? Gotcha.

ELM327

ELM327 wrote: »

What EV do you drive?

If I drove an EV I'd be reliant on the public network ........... I consider that daft too so I don't drive an EV.
I also have other requirments and preferences that EV can't meet

All that aside, driving an EV or not one can still point out the FACT that you'd want to be totally daft to rely on work charging in a BEV, totally and utterly daft.

listermint

Augeo wrote: »

You'd want to be totally daft to rely on work charging in a BEV, when buying a BEV one should factor in reliance on the public network if your return commute can't be done on your home charging.

ELM327 wrote: »

What EV do you drive?

He has a point though..

Silent Running

Deleted User wrote: »

I've no skin in the game....I don't have an EV of any description. But if somebody started giving me grief over the fact that I could pay for fuel to get home instead of charging it for free I'd laugh in their face. Whether or not you can get home without charging means SFA to me. Just saying.

Here's hoping you never get one.

ELM327

ELM327 wrote: »

So no EV yet you think you know what works best? Gotcha.

You don't need an EV to realise that owning an EV does not ensure work can or will facilitate your charging requirements

listermint

Augeo wrote: »

You don't need an EV to realise that owning an EV does not ensure work can or will facilitate your charging requirements

Id be intrigued to what ELM will expect his work place to do if lets say, every single employee had a BEV

listermint

listermint wrote: »

Id be intrigued to what ELM will expect his work place to do if lets say, every single employee had a BEV

I imagine he'd draw up a list of their commuting distances......... the longest commute that can't be done without a work charge would be assigned (hopefully) some priority after he liaised with the various work teams.

You'd have to factor in use of air con and other luxuries too I suppose.

It'd be really fun and positive for all concerned.

rivegauche

Augeo wrote: »

If I drove an EV I'd be reliant on the public network ........... I consider that daft too so I don't drive an EV.

How about if you've got 165 charge points available to you in work?

ELM327

Augeo wrote: »

You don't need an EV to realise that owning an EV does not ensure work can or will facilitate your charging requirements

listermint wrote: »

Id be intrigued to what ELM will expect his work place to do if lets say, every single employee had a BEV

The current line we've been given is that chargers will be installed as growth demands. And true to their word there have been ~8 chargers installed at multiple sites, gradually in stages as growth grew. Currently there is not even 1% of the staff driving EV/PHEV.



I think once we get to a serious number (say 10-20% penetration) each spot will have a 10a CEE plug (or similar) like they do in Canada or colder US states for block heaters.

ELM327

Augeo wrote: »

I imagine he'd draw up a list of their commuting distances......... the longest commute that can't be done without a work charge would be assigned (hopefully) some priority after he liaised with the various work teams.

You'd have to factor in use of air con and other luxuries too I suppose.

It'd be really fun and positive for all concerned.

Your sarcasm is duly noted.
Serious response to genuine questions above. Borderline posts like yours will get the reply they merit.

rev2.0

Have been following a few of these threads on here recently as considering the purchase of a PHEV...

One thing I’ve noticed; The sense of entitlement from some BEV owners regarding public chargers is astonishing!

Dev1234

Thanks for the replies folks.

For those that do charge at work is it only slow charging that is typically provided?

Silent Running

Dev1234 wrote: »

Thanks for the replies folks.

For those that do charge at work is it only slow charging that is typically provided?

The terminology is important. Slow would generally mean granny cable speed, or level 1. Fast would sometimes be home charger or destination charger, or level 2. Rapid would be the machines that can charge a 30kWh car in about 30 minutes.

Employers would generally install level 2, some only level 1.

ELM327

Dev1234 wrote: »

Thanks for the replies folks.

For those that do charge at work is it only slow charging that is typically provided?

Generally it is AC/Standard/Slow charging.
We have a mix of 7kW and 22kW units. But (unless you have a Zoe) they are all slow chargers. No DC units, these would be too expensive.

Dev1234

Silent Running wrote: »

The terminology is important. Slow would generally mean granny cable speed, or level 1. Fast would sometimes be home charger or destination charger, or level 2. Rapid would be the machines that can charge a 30kWh car in about 30 minutes.

Employers would generally install level 2, some only level 1.

Thanks for clarifying SR.

Silent Running

rev2.0 wrote: »

Have been following a few of these threads on here recently as considering the purchase of a PHEV...

One thing I’ve noticed; The sense of entitlement from some BEV owners regarding public chargers is astonishing!

There would be no sense of anything if everyone was considerate and thought about other drivers before their own sense of entitlement and greed. You only need to look up a few posts to see the type of inconsiderate dicks there are around.

As for me? If I had a PHEV and was on a public charger, I would give way to a BEV, no question. But only yesterday I gave way to another BEV, because I had taken enough to get me on my way. It's called sharing a scarce resource in a fair way.

listermint

Silent Running wrote: »

There would be no sense of anything if everyone was considerate and thought about other drivers before their own sense of entitlement and greed. You only need to look up a few posts to see the type of inconsiderate dicks there are around.

As for me? If I had a PHEV and was on a public charger, I would give way to a BEV, no question. But only yesterday I gave way to another BEV, because I had taken enough to get me on my way. It's called sharing a scarce resource in a fair way.

Back in the real world though, Charging for use would solve this debate straight away and do away with any entitlement.

Of which you have to agree there is.

unkel

Dev1234 wrote: »

Doesn't everyone freeload at work? It needs to be financially viable to drive an EV or a PHEV and I'm sure many on here have bought EVs based on the fact that they can "freeload" at work.

Even if you charged up your PHEV at work from 0% to 100% every single working day, your savings would be in the order of €100 per year (200 days times 50c).

With respect, but you haven't done your sums right if that made a difference in the car (from €13k or so to buy second hand for an Outlander PHEV) being financially viable or not...

listermint

unkel wrote: »

Even if you charged up your PHEV at work from 0% to 100% every single working day, your savings would be in the order of €100 per year (200 days times 50c).

With respect, but you haven't done your sums right if that made a difference in the car (from €13k or so to buy second hand for an Outlander PHEV) being financially viable or not...

I dont understand that, Lets say you charged a Phev everyday at work and never filled it with Petrol.

How would the savings be 100 Euro ?

Dev1234

unkel wrote: »

Even if you charged up your PHEV at work from 0% to 100% every single working day, your savings would be in the order of €100 per year (200 days times 50c).

With respect, but you haven't done your sums right if that made a difference in the car (from €13k or so to buy second hand for an Outlander PHEV) being financially viable or not...

Thanks unkel.

From a financial stand point its not the electricity I'm trying to save on. Its the fact that the 30 mile or so range of the outlander on EV would mean that I would be using the ICE to get me home at 40mpg or less.

Charging at home and at work is where the saving kicks in for the PHEV on my commute versus the diesel Passat I have which is giving me 50 per so mpg.

Silent Running

listermint wrote: »

Back in the real world though, Charging for use would solve this debate straight away and do away with any entitlement.

Of which you have to agree there is.

I suppose I live in my own bubble where I'm happy to give way to people, and would expect to get it back in turn. Obviously, this doesn't always happen, but it often does.

Agreed though, when public charging means there's fee to pay, things will change big time. I'm fairly used to paying for public charging and know what it costs. It will definitely change some peoples charging habits.

unkel

listermint wrote: »

I dont understand that, Lets say you charged a Phev everyday at work and never filled it with Petrol.

How would the savings be 100 Euro ?

The OPs commute is 26 miles (about 40km). I'm not quite sure of the real life range of the Outlander PHEV, but let's say it is about that. Then the OP has a choice:

- charge it at home on his free EV charger (well subsidy €600, so it can be installed for free), using night rate electricity. Costs 14kWh*8c = about €1
- charge it at work. Costs €0

So a saving of €1 a day (not the 50c I mentioned, the battery is a bit bigger than I thought), thus a saving of €200-€250 per year if charging at work every single day.

Now if the OPs commute was double that, charging at work (and at home) would avoid him having to fill it up with petrol. The savings would be much bigger then, say something like 8l/100km, so more like €5 per day if he charged both at home and at work compared with only charged at home and not at work

unkel

Dev1234 wrote: »

Thanks unkel.

From a financial stand point its not the electricity I'm trying to save on. Its the fact that the 30 mile or so range of the outlander on EV would mean that I would be using the ICE to get me home at 40mpg or less.

Charging at home and at work is where the saving kicks in for the PHEV on my commute versus the diesel Passat I have which is giving me 50 per so mpg.

Ha crossed posts! I guess it depends on how far you can drive the car on electric. If your car can do your return trip of 26 miles on electric, then your savings would be minimal as per my last post. If you can only make it to work and the car is empty (like some small batteried PHEV) then work and home charging would make a more significant difference

Dev1234

unkel wrote: »

Ha crossed posts! I guess it depends on how far you can drive the car on electric. If your car can do your return trip of 26 miles on electric, then your savings would be minimal as per my last post. If you can only make it to work and the car is empty (like some small batteried PHEV) then work and home charging would make a more significant difference

My commute is 26 miles each way so the outlander battery will be pretty much used up on the way in.The drive home will be on the ICE, if i can't charge at work

unkel

Thanks for clarifying. Then yes, charging both at home and at work will make a significant difference. You won't be the first Outlander owner who drives 90% of their mileage on electricity by plugging it in everywhere

You sure about how much space you need though? We're a family of 5 with growing up kids + dog and the size of an Ioniq / Leaf is fine for us (plus of course all the
other benefits of a full BEV). We don't have any buggies or bikes to carry though or any other big loads while all of us are on board.

listermint

unkel wrote: »

Thanks for clarifying. Then yes, charging both at home and at work will make a significant difference. You won't be the first Outlander owner who drives 90% of their mileage on electricity by plugging it in everywhere

You sure about how much space you need though? We're a family of 5 with growing up kids + dog and the size of an Ioniq / Leaf is fine for us (plus of course all the
other benefits of a full BEV). We don't have any buggies or bikes to carry though or any other big loads while all of us are on board.

Ya but you put the dog and the Kids on the roof though

Dev1234

unkel wrote: »

Thanks for clarifying. Then yes, charging both at home and at work will make a significant difference. You won't be the first Outlander owner who drives 90% of their mileage on electricity by plugging it in everywhere

You sure about how much space you need though? We're a family of 5 with growing up kids + dog and the size of an Ioniq / Leaf is fine for us (plus of course all the
other benefits of a full BEV). We don't have any buggies or bikes to carry though or any other big loads while all of us are on board.

Its things like the buggy, space for the dog, room to grow if there is another addition to the family that are pointing me towards the outlander.

We have gotten used to the room of an estate and we are finding it hard to downsize but it is worth thinking about. Thanks

DeepBlue

I seem to recall a time when charging your mobile at work was frowned upon.
Times have changed :pac:.

ELM327

ELM327 wrote: »

Your sarcasm is duly noted.
Serious response to genuine questions above. Borderline posts like yours will get the reply they merit.

Yeah, you've been nothing but wonderfully helpful and polite in this topic so far......which I duly noted.
I wasn't being sarcastic by the way, I reckon what you'd do is what I detailed

ELM327 wrote: »

What EV do you drive?

ELM327 wrote: »

So no EV yet you think you know what works best? Gotcha.

unkel

listermint wrote: »

Ya but you put the dog and the Kids on the roof though

Just the wife and the kids. Dog is sitting beside me in the passenger seat :pac:

Gazzmonkey

eddhorse wrote: »

Interesting topic, currently only two Electric Ireland charging points near our office block,
Keeping an eye on it and always seems to be the same cars parked there.

Yeah we have them fitted in the underground carpark at work but seems no one wants to use them. Both chargers are vacant all day every day.

creedp

Gazzmonkey wrote: »

Yeah we have them fitted in the underground carpark at work but seems no one wants to use them. Both chargers are vacant all day every day.

We have 3 new charge points but 2 of them are out of order for nearly 2 months now and one is used full time by a Porche Panamera Hybrid!

creedp

rev2.0 wrote: »

Have been following a few of these threads on here recently as considering the purchase of a PHEV...

One thing I’ve noticed; The sense of entitlement from some BEV owners regarding public chargers is astonishing!

I'd also swing it around and say because I have a BEV I understand how important access to public charging is and would never hog a public / on-street charging point for an entire day if I wasn't charging. Each to their own ... btw Id feel the same way if a bunch of inconsiderate ICE drivers abandoned their cars at a row of petrol pumps and shagged off for a burger cos like they felt like it

irishgrover

rev2.0 wrote:

One thing I’ve noticed; The sense of entitlement from some BEV owners regarding public chargers is astonishing!

In fairness I think it's more frustrating than entitlement..... And it's not just frustration with PHEVS. It's frustration with locals using fast chargers to save some money versus home charging.
It's a real pain in the arse if you need a charge to get home and you arrive at a fast charger to find a Phev plugged in that will happily sit there for an hour, using the fast charger to charge at a rate of 10% of what your car would, knowing that it would cost them €2 and 90 seconds to get the same amount of fuel at the nearby pump, and you have to sit there and wait for 30 - 60 minutes because they would rather spend €10 on a latte and pastry rather than €2 on petrol. Or worse, go for an hour long lunch.
All EV owners are longing for charging to be introduced as this should curtail this kind of behaviour.
Note: most Phev drivers are much more accommodating, but plenty are not