Couch to 2.17 marathon

Testosterscone

Might be of some interest

https://scullionruns.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/London.pdf

Fenster

I appreciate that it's a great article, but really, they stuck it in a PDF?

average_runner

Fenster wrote: »

I appreciate that it's a great article, but really, they stuck it in a PDF?

Yep because they were issuing it over twitter

Fenster

average_runner wrote: »

Yep because they were issuing it over twitter

Which is predominantly mobile, when a PDF is anything except. Argh! I'll shut up now as I'm detracting from the content.

Singer

Testosterscone wrote: »

Might be of some interest

https://scullionruns.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/London.pdf

His podcast is very good: https://itunes.apple.com/gb/podcast/stephen-scullions-road-to-tokyo-2020/id1447927933?mt=2

I generally thought he was a bit of a jerk from what I'd read from his comments in the media etc., but hearing him talk through his training and comeback (often while running) was very good listening.

healy1835

Singer wrote: »

His podcast is very good: https://itunes.apple.com/gb/podcast/stephen-scullions-road-to-tokyo-2020/id1447927933?mt=2

I generally thought he was a bit of a jerk from what I'd read from his comments in the media etc., but hearing him talk through his training and comeback (often while running) was very good listening.

It's certainly a good listen and he's a very interesting character. Fair play to him for sticking his head above the parapet and taking people with him through the process. He's definitely a more multi faceted character than a couple of his interviews have suggested, but the pod is, by its nature of course, a bit of an echo chamber and some of the things he's come out with would raise the eyebrow a little wouldn't miss one though......

El CabaIIo

He's running the Houston Marathon this day two weeks. Unusual choice but the course is seriously quick and he has a history with the event when he ran a quick half there last year.

Duanington

healy1835 wrote: »

It's certainly a good listen and he's a very interesting character. Fair play to him for sticking his head above the parapet and taking people with him through the process. He's definitely a more multi faceted character than a couple of his interviews have suggested, but the pod is, by its nature of course, a bit of an echo chamber and some of the things he's come out with would raise the eyebrow a little wouldn't miss one though......

I'm not sure what to make of him to be honest, he's certainly not short on confidence....quality runner either way

Lazare

I'm really enjoying his pod, cheers for the heads up about it.

Making me realise these guys are actually human beings. I love his confidence, it's refreshing. It's not come close to crossing the threshold into cockiness (I know nobody has suggested that).

Modesty is nice and all but I'd rather hear honesty on a medium such as this.

healy1835

I've just seen a new podcast pop up on my feed so maybe this post will be obsolete, but once you start talking about the possibility of dropping out in a race, is there not a danger of it becoming something of a self fulfilling prophecy? I know he cited the example of Galen Rupp turning around in Prague last year after a disastrous Boston, but just letting those thoughts seep in during race week doesn't bode wellI would have thought. Now he (over?)analysed a lot of different scenarios in the Podcast to be fair, but it seems a bit of a red flag for me. Hope the weather holds up for him.

OOnegative

Live stream of Houston Marathon on Watch Athletics this Sunday to keep an eye on him.

MrMacPhisto

healy1835 wrote: »

I've just seen a new podcast pop up on my feed so maybe this post will be obsolete, but once you start talking about the possibility of dropping out in a race, is there not a danger of it becoming something of a self fulfilling prophecy? I know he cited the example of Galen Rupp turning around in Prague last year after a disastrous Boston, but just letting those thoughts seep in during race week doesn't bode wellI would have thought. Now he (over?)analysed a lot of different scenarios in the Podcast to be fair, but it seems a bit of a red flag for me. Hope the weather holds up for him.

As I was listening to it I was thinking how refreshing it is to see the Elites also suffer from taper madness.

Forecast looks ok to me.

Lazare

healy1835 wrote: »

I've just seen a new podcast pop up on my feed so maybe this post will be obsolete, but once you start talking about the possibility of dropping out in a race, is there not a danger of it becoming something of a self fulfilling prophecy? I know he cited the example of Galen Rupp turning around in Prague last year after a disastrous Boston, but just letting those thoughts seep in during race week doesn't bode wellI would have thought. Now he (over?)analysed a lot of different scenarios in the Podcast to be fair, but it seems a bit of a red flag for me. Hope the weather holds up for him.

I listened to a few eps back to back on a run yesterday and was worrying to hear him totally flip between seeing it as a real test and definitely taking it on to seriously considering pulling out.

So unlucky with what's forecast. He does make a good point though, the whole point of Houston was to post a time. It does seem to make sense to abandon and tackle Seville instead. That's a month away though, how would he go about making sure he peaks given he's two weeks into a taper?

MrMacPhisto

The forecast is not that horrendous, albeit on the cooler side.

Winds between 15-22kmph, temperature at 7 am of 1 degree, raising to around 5 by finish time.

He has trained and tapered for this race, so go run it. Anything could happen in the 5 or 6 weeks to Seville and there is absolutely no guarantee that it won't be blowing a gale, or unseasonable warm or cold there.

El CabaIIo

MrMacPhisto wrote: »

The forecast is not that horrendous, albeit on the cooler side.

Winds between 15-22kmph, temperature at 7 am of 1 degree, raising to around 5 by finish time.

He has trained and tapered for this race, so go run it. Anything could happen in the 5 or 6 weeks to Seville and there is absolutely no guarantee that it won't be blowing a gale, or unseasonable warm or cold there.

Actual temperates only reflect the air tempreture and the effect on non-living objects.

1°C with a 20kph winds gusting up to 35 is pretty tough marathon conditions as the windchill is forecast for -5°C, that's how your muscles, lungs and brain percieve the temps to be. If anyone remembers what it felt like to run in the "beast from the east" last year, that's how cold the race willl feel to these guys and that's before they have to battle the slowdown effect of the wind.

Saying that, forecasts could change in no time, yesterday they were forecasting a windchill of -8°C and much higher winds so who knows.

As for peaking if he was to go to Seville, if he thinks the weather would cost him more than being a bit off peak, it wouldn't matter imo. I also think race week psychology is overplayed in these sceanarios, I'm sure if the weather is playing ball and he feels good on Sunday, he's going to let rip and won't be thinking about what he thought Wednesday, dropping out only sounds like a plan b if things are going to the dogs which I'm sure there is a pretty clear distinction between. They would be legimate decisions someone has to consider in his situation I would imagine.

AuldManKing

Duanington wrote: »

I'm not sure what to make of him to be honest, he's certainly not short on confidence....quality runner either way

I agree with this one - I enjoyed the 1st few podcasts, then started to become a bit irritated by him. I also subscribed to his emails - by Christ - he's a confident fella.

Maybe he's releasing too many too quickly and its a bit overload

Having said that I took a break from him for a week or so & then enjoyed the chats with Vernon & Butchart (which weren't about him )

MrMacPhisto

El CabaIIo wrote: »

Actual temperates only reflect the air tempreture and the effect on non-living objects.

1°C with a 20kph winds gusting up to 35 is pretty tough marathon conditions as the windchill is forecast for -5°C, that's how your muscles, lungs and brain percieve the temps to be. If anyone remembers what it felt like to run in the "beast from the east" last year, that's how cold the race willl feel to these guys and that's before they have to battle the slowdown effect of the wind.

Saying that, forecasts could change in no time, yesterday they were forecasting a windchill of -8°C and much higher winds so who knows.

As for peaking if he was to go to Seville, if he thinks the weather would cost him more than being a bit off peak, it wouldn't matter imo. I also think race week psychology is overplayed in these sceanarios, I'm sure if the weather is playing ball and he feels good on Sunday, he's going to let rip and won't be thinking about what he thought Wednesday, dropping out only sounds like a plan b if things are going to the dogs which I'm sure there is a pretty clear distinction between. They would be legimate decisions someone has to consider in his situation I would imagine.

Thanks El Caballo,

Hopefully the weather plays ball. Windchill can be nasty but the forecast I looked at had no gust factor and pretty light winds by 8-9am. If the wind calms from a gentle enough breeze of 20-25kmph to 10-15kmph, then 2-5 degrees air temps won't be horrendous, but obviously not ideal. Fingers crossed that it improves a bit.

I hope it works out for him and he has a great race. Enjoying the podcast.

MrMacPhisto

https://abc13.com/live/

live US coverage

Swiper the fox

MrMacPhisto wrote: »

https://abc13.com/live/

live US coverage

Brilliant, thanks for that, I've only started listening a few days ago but I enjoy the podcasts, listened to 5 or 6 on a long run this morning so was interested to see how he goes here, a bit of a pain in the hole but very interesting nonetheless, I'd like to see him go well here

Interesting to see the crowds starting out, my first will be Dublin 19, no idea what it feels like in the first mile of a marathon, must be difficult to stick to the plan

MrMacPhisto

Seems like there is a couple of feeds. There is one showing the marathon, one for the half and then a general coverage one which has "commentary". Doesn't seem to be sound with the other two feeds.

Swiper the fox

MrMacPhisto wrote: »

Seems like there is a couple of feeds. There is one showing the marathon, one for the half and then a general coverage one which has "commentary". Doesn't seem to be sound with the other two feeds.

Indeed, I'm working on the laptop so switching over every few minutes, most focus on the half at the moment but the second hour should be all marathon on the main feed, how's he doing?

MrMacPhisto

http://results.houstonmarathon.com/2019/?pid=leaderboard#

Thats the leaderboard. 31:34 for 10km split. Estimated finish of 2:13:12

El CabaIIo

Must have been a headwind through 15-25k along with that big hill just before halfway as he and everyone slowed back a lot. He absolutely blazed that last 5k to 30k though in 15:29 and on for low 2:14 again. Has 2 to work with now as well as been on his own for the first 20 odd kilometres.

2:13 looks on here, would be great to see

MrMacPhisto

Looking at the route/profile, there are a couple of nasty drags at 23 and 24 mile. The wind should be mainly cross to tail from here to the finish. Lets hope he is feeling strong.

AhhHere

Really enjoying his podcasts and following him today. I think he's in bright orange shorts and a white singlet if you're trying to spot him on the coverage. Hope he does well

Lazare

2:14:32

Superb

healy1835

2:14:34.......

AhhHere

Finished at 2:14:34

Fair play to him!

OOnegative

Time puts him 15th on Irish all times list and fastest marathon by an Irish man since Mark Kenneally in 2011 in Amsterdam.

spc78

Great performance. 15th on the Irish all time list. That should take a lot of pressure of him now for tokyo, he can race with less pressure between now and and tokyo.

jamule

He says on sttrava he went the wrong way. Not sure where or for how long, strava has the distance at 42.5

OOnegative

jamule wrote: »

He says on sttrava he went the wrong way. Not sure where or for how long, strava has the distance at 42.5

The 3 leaders in the half went the wrong way about a mile out for few seconds to, followed a tv truck at a turn off instead of running straight on. Possibly cost Yimer the win in the half to.

Itziger

$hit, not too shabby. I had him down as a small bit of a bluffer! Apologies to the man. 2.14.34. Well done, sir.

El CabaIIo

Itziger wrote: »

$hit, not too shabby. I had him down as a small bit of a bluffer! Apologies to the man. 2.14.34. Well done, sir.

Not having a go but how did you have him as a bluffer?

Last year he ran 13:50 for 5k, 28:36 for 10k. 63:17 for the half
and 2:15:55 in 24°C temps in London. He's got the same kind of wheels as Kenneally had.

TIhis was coming and I think he's got the ability to go faster dare I say even sneak into the 2:12's in a perfect race. He's only 30 right now and has years ahead of him all going well.

I wonder will he run Worlds this year? Conditions will be brutal in Doha but he's got a time set now that's going to be hard to beat by one other Irish guy nevermind 3. The new ranking system could make a balls of this though if it goes ahead as nobody has a clue how it works yet which is a shambles with only with only over a year and a half to go and the window probably open already in that regard.

Itziger

El CabaIIo wrote: »

Not having a go but how did you have him as a bluffer?

Last year he ran 13:50 for 5k, 28:36 for 10k. 63:17 for the half
and 2:15:55 in 24°C temps in London. He's got the same kind of wheels as Kenneally had.

TIhis was coming and I think he's got the ability to go faster dare I say even sneak into the 2:12's in a perfect race. He's only 30 right now and has years ahead of him all going well.

I wonder will he run Worlds this year? Conditions will be brutal in Doha but he's got a time set now that's going to be hard to beat by one other Irish guy nevermind 3. The new ranking system could make a balls of this though if it goes ahead as nobody has a clue how it works yet which is a shambles with only with only over a year and a half to go and the window probably open already in that regard.

Horseman, I was going on very little. I haven't been following the guy in any detail really, certainly not as well up as yourself. I just read an article posted here and picked up on the weight ( I know the guy is naturally heavier than most elites) and then there was the mention of being 'very hungover' on a few occasions. The last bit was how he was talking of pulling the plug on Houston cos of predicted temps or winds or whatever.

Had me thinking he was just an extremely talented bull$hitter who would never really get the times people were talking about. I'm very happy to have been proven wrong and I'd be delighted for the guy if he could take things a step or two further and get into 2.12 territory. It's been too long since we had a real marathon talent.

Lazare

He's fairly confident he can sub 2:10.

A few years yet before he peaks too.

Goose76

Latest podcast has his rebuttal to Jerry Kiernan's criticism of him for running the 10k instead of the marathon at the Euro champs, interesting - worth a listen. Essentially says he did what was best for HIM and his long term marathon training plan, and a successful 10k was part of that larger buildup.

I love the podcasts but have begun to find them a bit disjointed recently, sometimes there's a clear lack of preparation which is annoying. still love listening but think quality over quantity would be better. #AskSkullFriday is brilliant though.

healy1835

I see he's definitely aiming to toe the start line in London. Would be very interesting to see how he & Mick Clohisey stack up against each other there if SS get's an elite entry. No more than Scullion, I think that Clohisey can still find a good bit more as regards his marathon PB. 'Twould be interesting.....

Tipptatlers

I think you may be a few episodes back. He has no plans to do London and has no goal race set as of yet

MY BAD

healy1835 wrote: »

I see he's definitely aiming to toe the start line in London. Would be very interesting to see how he & Mick Clohisey stack up against each other there if SS get's an elite entry. No more than Scullion, I think that Clohisey can still find a good bit more as regards his marathon PB. 'Twould be interesting.....

Is Clohisey full time? Am I right thinking Scullion is a professional runner? I've massive respect for the likes of Hehir, etc who has a 9 to 5 and is at that level.

AuldManKing

healy1835 wrote: »

I see he's definitely aiming to toe the start line in London. Would be very interesting to see how he & Mick Clohisey stack up against each other there if SS get's an elite entry. No more than Scullion, I think that Clohisey can still find a good bit more as regards his marathon PB. 'Twould be interesting.....

I thought he knocked London on the head?

Tipptatlers

Mellow Yellow 26.2 wrote: »

Is Clohisey full time? Am I right thinking Scullion is a professional runner? I've massive respect for the likes of Hehir, etc who has a 9 to 5 and is at that level.

Clohisey is full time. Scullion is a web designer who moved to flagstaf. He is moving professional soon. Gets some funding from Dublin marathon and athletics Northern Ireland but not much. Sponsorship with underarmour is in the pipe line. Hehir is a primary teacher

El CabaIIo

Mellow Yellow 26.2 wrote: »

Is Clohisey full time? Am I right thinking Scullion is a professional runner? I've massive respect for the likes of Hehir, etc who has a 9 to 5 and is at that level.

Some going alright. A bit off topic but some of the best Irish athletes ever had were amateurs for most of their careers. Any sort of state funding was illegal up until the 70's and race prize money didn't exist until the late 70's, early 80's. Any outside sponsorship was strictly forbidden until the 80's.

When Neil Cusack won the Boston Marathon in 1974, he recieved no money but the major marathon crowds were known to shove their own personal money into athletes bags as they passed by and being an Irishman winning Boston, I heard Cusack got a nice bag of green that day. John Treacy won the World XC twice while an amateur. If you look at the national records on the track and road, Many are still held by athletes who were amateur for all of or the majority of their prime running days.

1500- Ray Flynn(3:33)
Mile- Ray Flynn(3:49)
2000- Eamonn Coghlan(4:54)
10k Road- John Treacy(27:46)
Marathon- John Treacy (2:09:15a)(2:11:23)

In the early 70's, a breakaway body from the amateur code sprung up called the International track association and many athletes went pro with them but it disqualified them from running in the Olympics and it quickly went bust as athletes who stayed amateur could still run the Olympics and were actually making more from illegal backhanders than the pros were making. None of them were making much though and most athletes world class or not were working regular jobs and were blue collar hero's of the fans. Even going back to 90's, you had guy's like John Downes working on a building site while knocking out a 13:29 5k, serious going to be able to maintain a regular job and run times like those.

healy1835

Tipptatlers wrote: »

I think you may be a few episodes back. He has no plans to do London and has no goal race set as of yet

AuldManKing wrote: »

I thought he knocked London on the head?

Nope, episode this morning. If he get's an elite entry he's in. The coach/agent is trying to sort it out.

healy1835

Mellow Yellow 26.2 wrote: »

Is Clohisey full time? Am I right thinking Scullion is a professional runner? I've massive respect for the likes of Hehir, etc who has a 9 to 5 and is at that level.

Yeah, also it's worth considering that Sean Hehir took 6 months of a career break and went overseas to train to try and qualify for the last Olympics as far as I'm aware. You gotta respect a guy like that....was hoping it would work out for him.

Flynnboslice

Tipptatlers wrote: »

Clohisey is full time. Scullion is a web designer who moved to flagstaf. He is moving professional soon. Gets some funding from Dublin marathon and athletics Northern Ireland but not much. Sponsorship with underarmour is in the pipe line. Hehir is a primary teacher

Professional - Contracted to run on a set wage/salary

Full Time - Pursues running without a primary source of income

Both in the same boat.

For those who respect the lads who run with a full time job it is worth looking at the other side of the coin. Those who don't have the financial stability often have to make decisions not made by what's best for them but what can support them in pursuing there goal.

Also comparisons between 70s runners and now don't take into account the dramatic increase in cost of living these days those sports grants would barely cover rent nevermind anything else.

El CabaIIo

Flynnboslice wrote: »

Professional - Contracted to run on a set wage/salary

Full Time - Pursues running without a primary source of income

Both in the same boat.

For those who respect the lads who run with a full time job it is worth looking at the other side of the coin. Those who don't have the financial stability often have to make decisions not made by what's best for them but what can support them in pursuing there goal.

Also comparisons between 70s runners and now don't take into account the dramatic increase in cost of living these days those sports grants would barely cover rent nevermind anything else.

I don't think anyone was disrespecting the pro's, that's a big step to make from quitting a job and taking a chance to put yourself in a spot to improve as best you can which is the goal of every runner. If the guys back in the 70's had that choice, they'd have done the same thing of course.

But that doesn't take away my respect and some of stories you hear about the old amateur days. the cost of living is tied to wages which increased dramatically too in inflation. The cost of living today is just as relatively expensive now as was back then. The only difference is the numbers changed as money was harder to come by back then. They didn't have a grant to even cover rent.

It's not an attack on anyone amateur or professional, times change is all and it's good for the sport and athletes that they have, it would be even better if it improved more.

Itziger

El CabaIIo wrote: »

I don't think anyone was disrespecting the pro's, that's a big step to make from quitting a job and taking a chance to put yourself in a spot to improve as best you can which is the goal of every runner. If the guys back in the 70's had that choice, they'd have done the same thing of course.

But that doesn't take away my respect and some of stories you hear about the old amateur days. the cost of living is tied to wages which increased dramatically too in inflation. The cost of living today is just as relatively expensive now as was back then. The only difference is the numbers changed as money was harder to come by back then. They didn't have a grant to even cover rent.

It's not an attack on anyone amateur or professional, times change is all and it's good for the sport and athletes that they have, it would be even better if it improved more.

Or maybe they could become Pro Football players and earn 400 grand a week. Jesus wept. 400 thousand a week. How did this happen?