Teachers Being Paid

Blaizes

I was looking at a teacher social media platform tonight and some teachers have not been paid or been paid the wrong amount today - paid less than they should have been.These teachers primary and secondary are in serious distress as they are wondering how they are going to get through Christmas, pay rent, bills etc. I know dept. are changing over to a new system but it is so wrong that these teachers who have done their work, put in their hours worked themselves to the bone have to go through a dreadful Christmas with not enough money to survive.Why is this happening for teachers who have put in years of study and hard work and can't even be paid? It's shocking and was never like this before.

Huntline

Serious

Blaizes

Yes it is.

sullivlo

Between PAYE, USC and the two pensions, I was taxed more than I earned in December. Ridiculous.

alroley

I was short 9 hours on my latest payslip. Ridiculous!

sullivlo

Oh I’m still disputing a 5 hour discrepancy from October. I have a printout from school saying they put through 29 hours, but I only got paid for 24. They’re a joke. Week 1 tax is a dose, and I was on 8% usc this month, when I didn’t earn that much!!!

sullivlo

sullivlo wrote: »

Between PAYE, USC and the two pensions, I was taxed more than I earned in December. Ridiculous.

Do you consider the pension contribution a tax?

evolving_doors

Augeo wrote: »

Do you consider the pension contribution a tax?

Oh no tax is for the little people, they're talking about the PSPR... "The Public Service Pension Reduction (PSPR) is an income–graduated reduction applied to public service pensions in excess of specified thresholds". https://www.per.gov.ie/en/faq-documents/

So obviously not a tax... just a compulsory contribution to state revenue, levied by the government on workers' income and business profits, or added to the cost of some goods, services, and transactions.
https://www.google.com/search?q=what+is+a+tax%3F&rlz=1C1APWK_enIE768IE768&oq=what+is+a+tax%3F&aqs=chrome..69i57j0l5.6219j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

emilymemily

Hi just wondering, are teachers paid Christmas week? My wages are usually in my account every second Thursday just after 12 am but I checked my account tonight and I haven't been paid. Im a new sub so havnt fully gotten my head around how the pay works etc.
Thanks.

djemba djemba

emilymemily wrote: »

Hi just wondering, are teachers paid Christmas week? My wages are usually in my account every second Thursday just after 12 am but I checked my account tonight and I haven't been paid. Im a new sub so havnt fully gotten my head around how the pay works etc.
Thanks.

Secondary teachers were paid last Thursday (20/12) so not due payment until next Thursday (3/1).

wirelessdude01

emilymemily wrote:

Hi just wondering, are teachers paid Christmas week? My wages are usually in my account every second Thursday just after 12 am but I checked my account tonight and I haven't been paid. Im a new sub so havnt fully gotten my head around how the pay works etc. Thanks.

More than likely sub teachers won't be paid until 10th(Primary) due to the timeframe for inputting information.

lawred2

sullivlo wrote: »

Between PAYE, USC and the two pensions, I was taxed more than I earned in December. Ridiculous.

Pensions aren't tax

emilymemily

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

More than likely sub teachers won't be paid until 10th(Primary) due to the timeframe for inputting information.

Thats ridiculous, I havnt been paid once over the Christmas period, what do they expect people to live on?. Im raging I have to wait until the 10th of January to get paid. lucky for me I dont have children or a family to support, I dont know how anyone in that position would cope this time of year while working as a sub teacher. Ive a good mind to ring them and tell them how I feel.

Tow

To ensure you get paid in 2019, your completed ASC10 forms should be sent in ASAP.

wirelessdude01

emilymemily wrote:

Thats ridiculous, I havnt been paid once over the Christmas period, what do they expect people to live on?. Im raging I have to wait until the 10th of January to get paid. lucky for me I dont have children or a family to support, I dont know how anyone in that position would cope this time of year while working as a sub teacher. Ive a good mind to ring them and tell them how I feel.

Ring who? Sure the phone won't be answered anyway 😠It was well flagged this year that this was going to be the case. Doesn't make it alright though. Teachers need to keep themselves informed.

smallgarden

Secondary pay was up until Wed 5th Dec which is why hours would be short. We should get paid for Thurs and Fri of that week in the next pay check. There was a notice advising of this in our staff room

emilymemily

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Ring who? Sure the phone won't be answered anyway 😠It was well flagged this year that this was going to be the case. Doesn't make it alright though. Teachers need to keep themselves informed.

Payroll, I had to ring them when I started as I hadnt been paid for 8 weeks, they were really helpful, my wages were in the following pay day.
It wasnt well flagged, its the first ive heard there was going to be delays. I wouldnt mind, these things happen but as its a particularly expensive time of year I was relying on my wage, as is everyone else this time of year. This also means ive another 2 weeks of no pay. Not acceptable at all and I dont feel that any other profession would be expected to accept it.

r93kaey5p2izun

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Ring who? Sure the phone won't be answered anyway 😠It was well flagged this year that this was going to be the case. Doesn't make it alright though. Teachers need to keep themselves informed.

Can you advise as to how best to keep informed? My experience is that DES payroll don't answer the phone and don't reply to emails. You say this was "well flagged" - to who? I subbed for two weeks in a school and no information was posted about Christmas pay. The DP said ask the secretary, the secretary said she didn't know and was too busy.

Thankfully I'm not relying on the money but I won't be doing any more subbing for DES schools. Their payroll appears to be incompetent and they just don't seem to give a fiddler's about subs.

wirelessdude01

Follow Voice For Teachers on FB, attend your union meetings are just two places where I came across this information. Also have heard of union reps in schools making people aware of it.

r93kaey5p2izun

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Follow Voice For Teachers on FB, attend your union meetings are just two places where I came across this information. Also have heard of union reps in schools making people aware of it.

I do both already. My union branch is for a particular ETB so no info on Department pay (they did source the info for me after I contacted them for assistance after DES had made a mess of my pay) and the info I saw on VfT was when the pay dates had already passed. Union reps in schools are little use to casual subs. Any official sources of information for casual subs re Department pay dates? A list of cut of dates for entry on OLCS and then pay dates? This should be available several months in advance. The ETB I worked for provided a list of this info for a year in advance.

It's hardly surprising they're so desperate for subs with the attitude they have towards them.

solerina

lawred2 wrote: »

Pensions aren't tax

The pension related deduction is a tax.....it doesn’t go into our pension and is deducted from our wages....what else could it be ? It makes my blood boil

Avatar MIA

solerina wrote: »

The pension related deduction is a tax.....it doesn’t go into our pension and is deducted from our wages....what else could it be ? It makes my blood boil

It's the exact opposite of tax. It reduces the tax you pay on your salary.

It's actually a tax efficient saving.

You'll get a very decent pension because of this when you reach retirement.

This is grown up 101.

solerina

Avatar MIA wrote: »

It's the exact opposite of tax. It reduces the tax you pay on your salary.

It's actually a tax efficient saving.

You'll get a very decent pension because of this when you reach retirement.

This is grown up 101.

It is not part of my pension...I pay that separately, it is a tax pure and simple, there is nothing of benefit what so ever to anyone who pays it.

Avatar MIA

solerina wrote: »

It is not part of my pension...I pay that separately, it is a tax pure and simple, there is nothing of benefit what so ever to anyone who pays it.

What are you talking about? What pension payment that's not a pension contribution?

Are you taking about the spousal element?

kala85

Avatar MIA wrote: »

What are you talking about? What pension payment that's not a pension contribution?

Are you taking about the spousal element?

It's called the pension levy which was a levy in the public sector during the recession brought in by femi legislation.

Although called a levy it doesn't actually go into your pension contributions, it's just a special tax on public sector.

Avatar MIA

kala85 wrote: »

It's called the pension levy which was a levy in the public sector during the recession brought in by femi legislation.

Although called a levy it doesn't actually go into your pension contributions, it's just a special tax on public sector.

I just looked at my wife's pay slip and it's called pension related deduction.

What is actually being complained about here is paying more to your defined benefit pension than heretofore. Even as it stands the public sector defined benefit is still being subsidised by other tax payers.

So, it's an increased pension contribution, but it's still a pension contribution. Sorry, nothing to see here.

kala85

Avatar MIA wrote: »

I just looked at my wife's pay slip and it's called pension related deduction.

What is actually being complained about here is paying more to your defined benefit pension than heretofore. Even as it stands the public sector defined benefit is still being subsidised by other tax payers.

So, it's an increased pension contribution, but it's still a pension contribution. Sorry, nothing to see here.

Its called prd. Pension related deduction which was called the pension levy.

It doesn't actually go into your pension but it is a sizable amount of a deduction each week.

Also newer entrants are subject to career averages pensions and still have to pay it.

Avatar MIA

kala85 wrote: »

Its called prd. Pension related deduction which was called the pension levy.

It doesn't actually go into your pension but it is a sizable amount of a deduction each week.

Also newer entrants are subject to career averages pensions and still have to pay it.

Is what is being paid even with the pension related deduction (per primary teacher pay slip) towards the defined benefit pension enough to fund the actual pension received? No.

It's called a pension deduction... Therefore a pension contribution.

If the government were being clever they could give the public sector the option to opt out of the defined pension scheme and move onto a defined contribution scheme. It would save a fortune if a sizeable proportion moved, considering it makes their blood boil to contribute what they are paying.

But, pretty sure there would be enough advice to tell them to stay as is.

evolving_doors

Avatar MIA wrote: »

Is what is being paid even with the pension related deduction (per primary teacher pay slip) towards the defined benefit pension enough to fund the actual pension received? No.

It's called a pension deduction... Therefore a pension contribution.

If the government were being clever they could give the public sector the option to opt out of the defined pension scheme and move onto a defined contribution scheme. It would save a fortune if a sizeable proportion moved, considering it makes their blood boil to contribute what they are paying.

But, pretty sure there would be enough advice to tell them to stay as is.

Does the PRD go into

A: the pension pot
or
B: general taxation pot?

If it goes directly into the pension pot fair enough. But if it goes into the general exchequer then it's no different to income tax.

So where does it go?

Avatar MIA

evolving_doors wrote: »

Does the PRD go into

A: the pension pot
or
B: general taxation pot?

If it goes directly into the pension pot fair enough. But if it goes into the general exchequer then it's no different to income tax.

So where does it go?

What pension pot? There has been attempts by previous governments to provide for future pension liabilities, but most future pension payments are predicated on the future working population being able to pay pensions of future retirees - hence the pension time bomb. The relatively generous state pension will also be a major drain. But there's not a significant government pension pot, in the same way as a private sector pension pot may be ring fenced.

Avatar MIA

Avatar MIA wrote: »

What pension pot? There has been attempts by previous governments to provide for future pension liabilities, but most future pension payments are predicated on the future working population being able to pay pensions of future retirees - hence the pension time bomb. The relatively generous state pension will also be a major drain. But there's not a significant government pension pot, in the same way as a private sector pension pot may be ring fenced.

in threads relating to public sector pensions do you weigh in on the pensions as

a. self funded

or

b. paid out of curent spending

Avatar MIA

Deleted User wrote: »

in threads relating to public sector pensions do you weigh in on the pensions as

a. self funded

or

b. paid out of curent spending

C. Partially self funded paid out of current spending.

Avatar MIA

Avatar MIA wrote: »

C. Partially self funded paid out of current spending.

gwan out of it and be serious

you want it paid over forty years without any net present value inference

have some pride ffs

Avatar MIA

Deleted User wrote: »

gwan out of it and be serious

you want it paid over forty years without any net present value inference

have some pride ffs

What are you on about?

not a thread to derail but you are trying to have your cake and eat it and you either are very much aware of this or you ought not use big boy language

Avatar MIA

Deleted User wrote: »

not a thread to derail but you are trying to have your cake and eat it and you either are very much aware of this or you ought not use big boy language

I've no clue as to what you're inferring. The best I can think of is that you're having a great Christmas. Kudos.

But, if you'd like to further the conversation you may want to elucidate.

km79

Sure we are lucky to be getting paid for it all aren’t we ?
It’s a vocation
Should be doing it for free

wirelessdude01

km79 wrote:

Should be doing it for free

Along with the CP hours 🀔

Blaizes

Kyng Famous Mail wrote: »

Can you advise as to how best to keep informed? My experience is that DES payroll don't answer the phone and don't reply to emails. You say this was "well flagged" - to who? I subbed for two weeks in a school and no information was posted about Christmas pay. The DP said ask the secretary, the secretary said she didn't know and was too busy.

Thankfully I'm not relying on the money but I won't be doing any more subbing for DES schools. Their payroll appears to be incompetent and they just don't seem to give a fiddler's about subs.

Thank you Kyng Famous Mail, you have said it so well.This is my point the subs are being treated so badly.Luckily I am not dept. so I was ok and got paid but when I read about these dept. paid teachers I was disgusted and v. upset for them.As I have a husband who carries everything ( and lucky I am in this regard ) the sky would not have fallen down had I not been paid as a sub. But for these teachers without a partner or parents in a position to help them out it's a really bad place to be in facing into Christmas with no pay in some cases. It's simply not good enough and some of these teachers were even talking about leaving teaching and who could blame them. There are plenty of other opportunities out there who would bother teaching when being treated like that.

evolving_doors

Avatar MIA wrote: »

What pension pot? There has been attempts by previous governments to provide for future pension liabilities, but most future pension payments are predicated on the future working population being able to pay pensions of future retirees - hence the pension time bomb. The relatively generous state pension will also be a major drain. But there's not a significant government pension pot, in the same way as a private sector pension pot may be ring fenced.

Well if it goes to the general exchequer fund it's a tax then isn't it?

Avatar MIA

evolving_doors wrote: »

Well if it goes to the general exchequer fund it's a tax then isn't it?

Only if pensions never get paid... But I think we'd hear about it if that were the case.

Your pension contribution is tax deductible from your salary.

There's no moral justification for reducing the pension contributions, however that's not how politics works, so if you agitate and are successful I won't complain as I would indirectly benefit, but I don't understand how someone's blood boils when they pay relatively little to garner the pension rights they have.

mtoutlemonde

Blaizes wrote: »

Thank you Arlessienne, you have said it so well.This is my point the subs are being treated so badly.Luckily I am not dept. so I was ok and got paid but when I read about these dept. paid teachers I was disgusted and v. upset for them.As I have a husband who carries everything ( and lucky I am in this regard ) the sky would not have fallen down had I not been paid as a sub. But for these teachers without a partner or parents in a position to help them out it's a really bad place to be in facing into Christmas with no pay in some cases. It's simply not good enough and some of these teachers were even talking about leaving teaching and who could blame them. There are plenty of other opportunities out there who would bother teaching when being treated like that.

Just to be fair... I have worked for the DES for a long time now and have never had a problem with payment. If I need to contact them, they have been very courteous and sent on anything I needed immediately. On the other hand, I worked for an ETB last year for about twelve weeks - a complete nightmare! I was ten weeks without pay and dealt with the most rude HR staff ever. There were many 'think ins' why it was so difficult to get subs ... if they solved the previous two problems, it may help. Back in DES this year and won't be going back to that ETB anytime soon.

evolving_doors

Avatar MIA wrote: »

Only if pensions never get paid... But I think we'd hear about it if that were the case.

Your pension contribution is tax deductible from your salary.

There's no moral justification for reducing the pension contributions, however that's not how politics works, so if you agitate and are successful I won't complain as I would indirectly benefit, but I don't understand how someone's blood boils when they pay relatively little to garner the pension rights they have.

So enlighten me as to how much someone puts in... and gets out.

Blaizes

Really though, none of this should happen be it whichever pay path, because teachers deserve better.We have great teachers in this country I am a primary parent and see how much work is being done with my kids in school and am so grateful to the teachers for the work they do every day and I know when they go into secondary I will say the same if by then teachers won't be so *eed off by everything that that they will have left. I really hope this won't happen.

Avatar MIA

evolving_doors wrote: »

So enlighten me as to how much someone puts in... and gets out.

Your pension is the PS and you don't know?

Here's one article...

Do you think you'll pay 590k into your pension before you retire, even with PRD?

https://www.newstalk.com/-Public-sector-earning-40-more-than-private-says-Davy-

spurious

Away with the teacher bashing folks. Not the forum for it.

No end of other places on boards which will be happy to put up with it.


June
July
August
Loadsamoney
Gold plated pension
Finished at two every day
"I knew a teacher who....."

Avatar MIA

spurious wrote: »

Away with the teacher bashing folks. Not the forum for it.

No end of other places on boards which will be happy to put up with it.


June
July
August
Loadsamoney
Gold plated pension
Finished at two every day
"I knew a teacher who....."

Who is teacher bashing? Are we saying correcting misperceptions is teacher bashing now, seriously?

emilymemily

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Follow Voice For Teachers on FB, attend your union meetings are just two places where I came across this information. Also have heard of union reps in schools making people aware of it.

Why should we have to attend union meetings to get the wages which are owed to us??? Its an absolute disgrace.

TheDriver

Time for a modding: No further talk/trolling regarding pension pots etc on this thread, it is about payment dates and not receiving money owed on time. This is not a thread for discussion about deductions etc

Avatar MIA

TheDriver wrote: »

Time for a modding: No further talk/trolling regarding pension pots etc on this thread, it is about payment dates and not receiving money owed on time. This is not a thread for discussion about deductions etc

Wow. Joke of a forum.

rainbowtrout

emilymemily wrote: »

Why should we have to attend union meetings to get the wages which are owed to us??? Its an absolute disgrace.

You shouldn't. But what is blindingly obvious is that if substitute teachers are not being paid on time in December by the DES and it is an ongoing issue, then if affected teachers turn up in their droves at their union meetings to voice their concern and put it on the agenda at every union meeting, then the unions will make it an issue and will make representations to the DES. If enough pressure is put on the DES by the unions on behalf of their representatives, then the DES might review their payment procedures.

That is the whole point of unions - representing their members. Whinging on VFT or any other forum won't make a blind bit of difference.