Not allowed to leave building during work break at night

AndrewJRenko

seamus wrote: »

Such as where the employee is working the night shift, security (of stock and employees is a concern) and where appropriate facilities have been provided inside the building such that there is no need to leave.

Though emergency egress must still be maintained

Claw Hammer

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

If there are insufficient staff to allow the OP to leave their work area while on a break then the company need to correct the security situation.

the security is adequate provided that shutters are not raised. You are saying that the employer should pay someone to stand at shutters all night so that the employee can wander out to give herself lung cancer?

seamus

runawaybishop wrote: »

I don't think smoking is relevant, though the op mentions it. What's relevant is whether it is reasonable to allow staff to leave the premises for any reason.

Any discretionary reason. Obviously if there is a genuine need to leave the premises which cannot wait until the end of the shift, then it goes without saying that disciplining the employee would be unreasonable.

This is why smoking is relevant, since it's not urgent. It can wait. Therefore is it reasonable to discipline the employee for going out for a smoke? Assuming the company has a genuine reason why they want to minimise ingress/egress to the property, then yes, I think so.

Claw Hammer wrote: »

the security is adequate provided that shutters are not raised. You are saying that the employer should pay someone to stand at shutters all night so that the employee can wander out to give herself lung cancer?

The OP does state that the shutters are opened at night to allow the movement of goods in and out. This complicates things a bit further.

If we assume that

- Employees are ordinarily permitted to leave/enter via the shutters
- The shutters are routinely opened even during the night shift
- There is an appropriate location to smoke which is outside the building but visible from the shutters

Then I think it would be hard for an employer to argue that the employee can't go out for a smoke when the shutters are open anyway. "You can't go out for a smoke because the rules say so", wouldn't be a reasonable position to take. IMO, of course.

byhookorbycrook

Riskymove wrote: »

yes correct, in the same way that you can have a rest period while still in your place of work

my point is that if you are on a rest period then you are on a rest period and not "on call"

what has been suggested is not what is meant by "at your employer's disposal" in this context. An employer is not entitled to shorten your break and call you back to work

In every primary school in the country, this happens every day- even when not on supervision, you can be called to attend to a child, for example. The infant teacher's class contact finishes earlier than other teachers, but they have to stay on the premises until the rest of the school finishes.

Riskymove

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

In every primary school in the country, this happens every day- even when not on supervision, you can be called to attend to a child, for example. The infant teacher's class contact finishes earlier than other teachers, but they have to stay on the premises until the rest of the school finishes.

the hours probably play a part here - would a break occur before 4.5 hours are worked?

the break is probably more for the kids I imagine too

cobhguy28

seamus wrote: »

Rest breaks are still part of the "working day", so the employer can indeed make reasonable declarations about what an employee can and cannot do on those breaks.
.

They are only part of your working day if you are being paid for the break. If not how can the employer dictate where you must go on your break.