i really don't know how i can help my little princess

suitianshi

what happened to my baby:

When my baby was 28 days old, she had a sudden big cry (we didn’t this is due to colic at that time), so we took her to Crumlin children hospital. There she was done a lot of tests, blood, urine and spinal tap, but nothing found. Then she was injected 3 days of antibiotics because the doctor suspected she was infected.

And after the hospital visit, there are a lot of changes:

before: her poo doesn’t have smell, so we have to take her nappy off to check if she posed
after: her poo is smelly (very sour, like that of vinegar)

before: i never saw my baby spit up
after: frequent spit up

before: she could sleep on her own and she fell into sleep in a few seconds
after: she could no longer sleep on her own but in our arms and we had to take 30 mins to make her sleep. We have to cradle here and walk here and there otherwise she will never sleep. in day time, we can’t put her down on the bed she will instantly wake up when we do that.

before: she often smiled during sleep
after: i never see her smile in a sleep

before: she never cried suddenly during a sleep
after: she often had a big cry and then woke up from a sleep

before: she was eager to drink milk when she saw the bottle teat
after: she always turned her head away or screamed during feeding

before: she never sneezed
after : she sneezed a lot every day

what she is like now:
she can only sit there playing toys for 3-5 minutes and then she will start stretching legs and arching back, and crying loudly. we can’t even stop her. She can cry all of a sudden from sleep many times during night . She’s over 6 months but only takes less than 300ml milk a day. She has got eczema and it’s still there after one month (we are giving her emollient all the time).
She can have more than 20 sneezes every day.
She can have hiccup very often every day.
She is on neonate with breastfeeding now.

we have tried a few different formula brand and probiotics but nothing works.

we have taken my baby to hospitals, GPs many times but they always say my baby is growing well, she’s very healthy, but we know there’s something wrong with her and we really don’t know how to help her.



We are in a desperate life every day. Tears running down on my face...

barneyrub

Have you looked into (silent) reflux

suitianshi

barneyrub wrote: »

Have you looked into (silent) reflux

A GP has prescribed us a medicine for reflux, but you know they never listen to us and they do google a lot. I don't know if she is suffering from reflux and not sure if this medicine will do something bad to my girl. she's too small now.

suitianshi

suitianshi wrote: »

A GP has prescribed us a medicine for reflux, but you know they never listen to us and they do google a lot. I don't know if she is suffering from reflux and not sure if this medicine will do something bad to my girl. she's too small now.

Speaking from a pharmacists point of view. If baby is having reflux. She needs to take the medication.

seamus

suitianshi wrote: »

A GP has prescribed us a medicine for reflux, but you know they never listen to us and they do google a lot. I don't know if she is suffering from reflux and not sure if this medicine will do something bad to my girl. she's too small now.

Doctors will not prescribe you medicine that will hurt your child.

It's not going to get better on its own.

Give her the medication.

PirateShampoo

So you went to the doctors for help, he gave you something to help, but Doctors are bad and you didn't give stuff to baby to help. So baby still sad?

troyzer

Scary parenting tactics right there.

SusieBlue

Listen to the doctors, they know best.

To be honest though, some of that behaviour sounds like the sleep regression/growth spurts all babies go through. Even the easiest most content babies go through phases of not sleeping and being extra fussy.
Give the reflux medication a go to rule that out, its the only way you'll know for sure. The doctor wouldn't have prescribed it if he/she didn't think it was necessary.

turbot

For eczema, oatmeal baths are very soothing.

If she is sneezing / coughing a lot, make sure there isn't mold / damp in her direct environment. Does your home smell of damp - that can affect breathing and agitate allergies.

My understanding is, breastfeeding is also a good way for mother to pass on beneficial bacteria etc to baby.

Gently stroking her face from middle of forehead, around cheeks, to chin
Then from shoulders to her elbows
Then on the back of her hands from wrists toward fingers

Are soothing also for her nervous system.

I'm sorry to hear this is happening and hope you find the solution needed.

suitianshi

Deleted User wrote: »

Speaking from a pharmacists point of view. If baby is having reflux. She needs to take the medication.

Yes, but the thing is, they just say take this medicine and then go back. they're not listening , they don't know what we have went through. I don't know if my baby is having a "reflux"

endacl

suitianshi wrote: »

Yes, but the thing is, they just say take this medicine and then go back. they're not listening , they don't know what we have went through. I don't know if my baby is having a "reflux"

Do you know she’s not?

suitianshi

seamus wrote: »

Doctors will not prescribe you medicine that will hurt your child.

It's not going to get better on its own.

Give her the medication.

i though this is true before my baby was given antibiotics. doctors should be serious for any medicine but why she gave my little one that just because nothing is found. They don't even know what colic is. They need to google. I suppose they're professional, but they're not.



I will check the medicine for reflux later and see if it is safe.

suitianshi

SusieBlue wrote: »

Listen to the doctors, they know best.

To be honest though, some of that behaviour sounds like the sleep regression/growth spurts all babies go through. Even the easiest most content babies go through phases of not sleeping and being extra fussy.
Give the reflux medication a go to rule that out, its the only way you'll know for sure. The doctor wouldn't have prescribed it if he/she didn't think it was necessary.

I will try. The doctors said exactly this :give it a shot and see if it helps.

suitianshi

turbot wrote: »

For eczema, oatmeal baths are very soothing.

If she is sneezing / coughing a lot, make sure there isn't mold / damp in her direct environment. Does your home smell of damp - that can affect breathing and agitate allergies.

My understanding is, breastfeeding is also a good way for mother to pass on beneficial bacteria etc to baby.

Gently stroking her face from middle of forehead, around cheeks, to chin
Then from shoulders to her elbows
Then on the back of her hands from wrists toward fingers

Are soothing also for her nervous system.

I'm sorry to hear this is happening and hope you find the solution needed.

Thanks for the good tips, the weather in Ireland is really bad in winter, i will try to warm my room and see if the case can be improved. (the radiator in my house is really useless....)

seamus

The doctor believes your child has reflux, based on the description of the symptoms you have given to him. It doesn't really matter whether you think she has reflux or not.

This is very common, and while it might seem frustrating that the doctor appears to be half-listening (especially when english is not your first language), the doctor is not going to give something to your baby that will harm her. He wouldn't prescribe anything which he doesn't think is necessary.

"Reflux" is basically the baby version of heartburn. Her stomach is uncomfortable, she frequently feels like she needs to vomit, and so she is refusing to take her milk. The medicine will calm her stomach and bring her appetite back.

It's very easy as a new parent to get obsessed about every little change and worry if there's something wrong. Babies change a lot in the early days. Smelly poo, frequent spitting up, poor sleeping, this is all perfectly normal.

It does sound to me like there is a reflux problem. Give her the medication. See how it goes for two weeks. If there's no improvement, go back to the doctor.

bertsmom

suitianshi wrote:

I will check the medicine for reflux later and see if it is safe.

How will you know better than a medically trained doctor? Give the child the medicine and go from there.

suitianshi

seamus wrote: »

The doctor believes your child has reflux, based on the description of the symptoms you have given to him. It doesn't really matter whether you think she has reflux or not.

This is very common, and while it might seem frustrating that the doctor appears to be half-listening (especially when english is not your first language), the doctor is not going to give something to your baby that will harm her. He wouldn't prescribe anything which he doesn't think is necessary.

"Reflux" is basically the baby version of heartburn. Her stomach is uncomfortable, she frequently feels like she needs to vomit, and so she is refusing to take her milk. The medicine will calm her stomach and bring her appetite back.

It's very easy as a new parent to get obsessed about every little change and worry if there's something wrong. Babies change a lot in the early days. Smelly poo, frequent spitting up, poor sleeping, this is all perfectly normal.

It does sound to me like there is a reflux problem. Give her the medication. See how it goes for two weeks. If there's no improvement, go back to the doctor.

Yes， i agree , i will give her the medication for a try.



but what about the doctor giving my 28 days girl 3 days of antibiotics just because they didn't find anything? my girl was even sleeping at that time. Then she said we need to give her antibiotics just in case of infection. There's even no symptom for infection at all. Do you think she's professional?

seamus

suitianshi wrote: »

They don't even know what colic is. They need to google. I suppose they're professional, but they're not.

Think about how many times a day you use google for your job. Do you think that because you have to use google, that means you can't do your own job?
No, it doesn't. And the same is true of doctors. Google is a diagnostic tool for them, just like it is a tool for you.

You're making too much of this. I understand that the situation is distressing, and doubly so because you're in a foreign country.

But the doctor is qualified. He has spent many years gaining a highly-respected qualification in medicine and continually has to prove that he is competent to be a doctor. He will not do anything to hurt your child.

I will check the medicine for reflux later and see if it is safe.

You're not a pharmacist. You are not qualified to check if the medicine for reflux is safe. This area is heavily regulated in Ireland and in the EU. They would not be allowed to sell it if it wasn't safe. Read the label, don't use google.

but what about the doctor giving my 28 days girl 3 days of antibiotics just because they didn't find anything? my girl was even sleeping at that time. Then she said we need to give her antibiotics just in case of infection. There's even no symptom for infection at all. Do you think she's professional?

Yes. If the doctor believed that it was a reasonable precaution to take, then it's a reasonable precaution to take.
Medicating a child without good reason would be one way that doctor could lose her job. She's not going to do it if it's unsafe.

Cash_Q

The changes you describe in your before/after list are things that are highly likely to have happened at a young age anyway. My baby is 11 weeks old, her behaviour in her first 3 weeks was totally different to the next 3 weeks, and the next 3 weeks different again. They are tiny and they make major developments in their first year of life. If the doctor in the hospital gave an antibiotic to be on the safe side, it will have been one suitable for that purpose and could not have harmed your baby. As for the reflux medication, give it to your baby. It would not be prescribed if it were unsafe or if the doctor did not think the baby had reflux. What do you want posters to suggest here? Medical professionals have given treatment to your baby, that is what you should follow.

annoyedgal

So you believe that the antibiotics caused a change on your babys behaviour or harmed her in some way? The doctor would not give antibiotics to a baby that were not suitable and much of the behaviour you describe sounds very typical of a small baby.
My second baby had silent reflux. What calmed her was being held in my arms facing out and i would bend my knees up and down to jostle her. Seemed to soothe her. Also keeping her upright after feeds and spending lots of time winding her.
Babies much prefer being held and sleeping close to a parent so there is nothing unusual there.
If numerous doctors have told you she is thriving then do you best to relax and go with her flow. Everything is a phase with them! This will pass

Moonbeam

I had 4 with reflux,1 allergic to milk and 1 with lactose intolerance.
Reflux medicine is mostly harmless,talk to your GP and PHN it maybe an issue with milk/formula.
Reflux meds were our saviour on the last child.

What did they suspect was wrong with her in the hospital?

jh79

Have you tried Nutramingen formula?

We went through the exact same thing, a&e numerous times, not gaining weight, eczema etc. Was down to 200 ml of milk a day before she was admitted to hospital for monitoring. After staying for the weekend with no improvement or diagnosis a nurse suggested that formula.

It ended up she couldn't digest milk but was not lactose intolerant. Just can't break down milk protein, casein i think. The protein is already broken down in that formula. It's still dairy.

After 6 months of struggle she pretty much improved after the first bottle.

Btw we found Aveeno great for the eczema rash.

Wesser

She is only 28 days old. There are alot things that she is going to do life that she has never done before. I think you need to take some time out, for some relaxation, massage etc

Wesser

If your baby was very irritable, this can be a sign of sepsi s in a baby. Perhaps that's why antibiotics were given
If baby had repair and antibiotics were not given then might be a different story today.

Gimme A Pound

Aw, I'm so sad to read of your upset. Take comfort from the fact that the doctors are pleased with her progress and that babies change a LOT in the first six months. Non stinky poop throughout their nappy-wearing years would be heaven. With most perfectly healthy babies it's fecking woeful!

She must be teething too is she?

Reflux medicine is given to countless very young babies - you gotta give it to her. It's not the same medicine as the antibiotic (which I know you're worried had an adverse effect on her, but you don't know that for sure; maybe research that a little more). Also look into bringing her to an osteopath for baby massage that tackles reflux. That did absolute wonders for my friend's baby boy.

Please don't fall into the trap of thinking doctors are wrong. They're not perfect but they are far more expert than dodgy parenting websites and they do care and want to help. It's what they signed up to do.

Gimme A Pound

Wesser wrote: »

She is only 28 days old. There are alot things that she is going to do life that she has never done before. I think you need to take some time out, for some relaxation, massage etc

She's over six months.

shesty

Reflux mammy here ...Also the mother of two babies who got the three days of antibiotics.

You have been to the doctors and they have given you a prescription.I am not a medical professional, but since the doctors have seen the baby I will say that the symptoms do sound like classic reflux, possibly silent.My first had all of those symptoms.She was 14 months on prescription Zantac for reflux-is that what you got?If sk, it needs to be taken for a couple of weeks before you will see it's effects, as it basically neutralises the stomach acid, but you have to keep taking it in order for it to do it's job.It worked wonders on our child.At about 4 weeks, she started to show the symptoms.Babies tend to be in a little newborn coma the first 10-14 days, and their digestive system really kicks in around 3/4 weeks-or at least that is when they start to become aware od their insides!Ours screamed every evening from 6-10pm for the first 10/11 weeks.She was on Zantac from about 8 weeks.She is now a happy healthy, phenomenally active 4.5 year old, and honestly the Zantac was a lifesaver for us, especially as first time parents.

I can't comment on the skin thing.That may be due to dairy allergies etc.If the child has reflux, feeding is painful for her, so of course she won't take much.

The antibiotics-these were at four weeks??I am saying this now, based on my experience.I was identified as a Group B Strep carrier during my first pregnancy, and I had to get antibiotics during labour.Baby no.1 temp started to go up slightly in the first 24 hours, so they took her, did blood tests and started her on 36 hours of antibiotics.3 days for the blood cultures to develop and show up possible infections-3 days of antibiotics at the same time, in order to kill whatever infection might show up.My third baby also had the same antibiotics, despite not showing signs of anything-I did not get enoughedicine during labour, and my first had tested positive for group B, so they gave him the medication as a precautionary thing.I am not an expert, but my understanding is that Group B strep mothers can pass this to their babies,as it lives in the birth canal. It then can cause a serious infection (eg meningitis) in the baby within 3-4 weeks of birth.However we do not test mothers for group B in Ireland.This MAY have been why the doctors did what they did.

I think give the baby the medication for a few weeks and see does it help.There is no point saying something is wrong but questioning the potential solutions.If you have an idea about what may be the problem then suggest it to the doctor, but if not, try the medicine.At least if it doesn't work you can go back to them and say it doesn't work and they will be able to look at other solutions.

killanena

When my daughter was born she was as continent and quite as could be.

Sleep all night apart from 1 feed around 3am. But every few weeks she had a few tough weeks where she suffered from reflux, growth spurts or teething. It was like a living nightmare for all 3 of us during those periods. We just had to battle through them and follow our gp's advice.

That went on for about a 18 months. Thankfully for us it wasn't constant just periods here and there but its heartbreaking to see then suffer in anyway, especially when you are exhausted so I feel your pain.

Stick to your gp's advice. They are especially careful with what they prescribe infants and I know sometimes it sounds like they are not listening to you but they have probably seen 100's if not 1000's of infants sense they started their career and know the telltale signs.

If all the test came back clear then there is nearly a 100% chance it isn't serious.

The first 18 months will be hard sometimes, being a parent is the hardest job in the world but they will also fly by.

Few tips with what helped us.

-Air purifier with eucalyptus oil when they are stuffy or have a wet cough. Don't leave this on constantly because it can be harsh. Maybe just an hour before bed.

-dehumidifier during the winter. You will be surprised how much water they gather from the air in just a week!

-when she starts teething, sugar free aniseed and glycerine dipped on her soother will work magic with getting her to sleep. Try to limit how often you use it as baby's love it and may look for it every night.

-folic acid in one of her bottles everyday if your not doing it already. Doctors or nurses usually say to do this for the first 6 months from birth.

I wish you the very best, they grow way too fast so enjoy every moment that you can

The Hound Gone Wild

The baby is 28 days old... The doctor probably went white & second guessed themselves. Used Google to reassure themselves of dose etc. Doctors are people and are not walking encyclopedias.

Also

Your baby is 28 days old this information is needed on a prescription so your Pharmacist went white too and would have double checked dose etc.

Source am pharmacist, double check every paediatric prescription I dispense in a formulary book.

(At a guess you were given Gaviscon infant sachets. These neutralize stomach acid and create a lining around the throat/stomach and are perfectly safe within the dose you were given by your Dr/pharmacist)

Gimme A Pound

The poo smell being described as "sour" does point to excess stomach acid.

The sneezing - this has been the dampest weather in ages.
Perhaps it's lactose intolerance too. Have you asked the doctor about this?

margo321

i had psoriasis and the emollients would drive my skin mad. it took me ages to realise this. stupidly i would keep adding more. i figured out the ingredients dodmt agree with me. switched to almond oil and got huge relief. good luck. must be dreadful to see baby so upset.

GaGa21

It sounds to me like your child may be in pain. I had experience of something similar in a child I used to look after. Even though doctor's said she was fine, I knew she was in unnatural pain. Her cries were unbearable, it was heartbreaking.

It turned out to be osteomyelitis in her spine where she had had a previous lumbar puncture for a suspected infection.
As you have said your child had a spinal tap, I would ask for an MRI of the spine to rule this out.
Even though she has had antibiotics, they may have been the wrong type.
Do your research and if it looks like a possibility, query it with your GP and ask for an MRI asap.

I really hope she is ok. It must be very hard for you guys.

sillysocks

When my daughter was almost one she was given antibiotics for three days for an infection.
Afterwards she was being sick all the time after a bottle. So much so that we’d literally stand at the sink after a feed because we knew it was coming. Same for if she had any solid food with dairy. At the time it took a while to realise but it turned out the antibiotics had upset her stomach and caused a temporary lactose intolerance. Switched to lactose free formula and foods, immediate improvement in her sleep, form and no long got sick. The change was immediate and drastic.
Thankfully after around 6 months we were able to gradually wean her back to regular milk and food and she’s fine now.

Might be worth exploring.

shesty

OP-if she is still breastfeeding and on neonate, I presume the mother has also cut out dairy...??

The Hound-your post made me smile.Any interaction I have had with medical people up to about 12 weeks on amy of my three, they do go a bit white around the gills alright :-)

cbyrd

Sounds like allergy symptoms. I've had this with a few of my children. It's usually a food source at this age and if she's on neocate I presume that's the amino acid based one, so failing a dairy allergy it has to be something that you're eating that is bringing on symptoms. Ask the go to prescribe an antihistamine for the allergy symptoms (sneezing eczema gut pain and smelly nappies) if you're not giving it, start with vitamin D and keep giving the probiotic, make sure it's not dairy based though.
I feel your pain, I spent the best part of a year with my now 8 year old trying to get to the bottom of his symptoms. I was told reflux and fussy baby and fussy mother. Turns out he's dairy intolerant (not lactose but casein which doesn't show up in uaual tests.) now he gets everything from earache to dry itchy skin, belly pain, the rolling around the floor kind, the runs. It's horrible.
Don't be fobbed off by reflux. Reflux is caused by something in the diet, it's not a natural ailment and usually the first thing GP's or phns say when they don't know. It's a process of elimination.

pwurple

cbyrd wrote: »

Don't be fobbed off by reflux. Reflux is caused by something in the diet, it's not a natural ailment and usually the first thing GP's or phns say when they don't know. It's a process of elimination.

Em, reflux is not always diet related. It wasn't for my child...

_Brian

suitianshi wrote: »

A GP has prescribed us a medicine for reflux, but you know they never listen to us and they do google a lot. I don't know if she is suffering from reflux and not sure if this medicine will do something bad to my girl. she's too small now.

This attitude is really concerning.
GPS are professionals and not just googling stuff and prescribing in a whim.

Work with your GP, follow their instructions, get a second opinion surely but your complaining about the doctor and yet here you are turning to a group of strangers on the internet looking for help.

Perhaps a case where a social worker needs to get involved.

giggsirish

_Brian wrote: »

This attitude is really concerning.
GPS are professionals and not just googling stuff and prescribing in a whim.

Work with your GP, follow their instructions, get a second opinion surely but your complaining about the doctor and yet here you are turning to a group of strangers on the internet looking for help.

Perhaps a case where a social worker needs to get involved.

Social workers?? Doctors dont always get it right and are quick to dismiss things to reflux/silent reflux very often!

OP. We went through a VERY VERY similar issue. It was down to a few different issues with formula/allergies to mild proteins etc but the saving grace was a formula called nutramigen. Obviously cant give medical advise but please run it past your health care provider if it is something you can try. It worked for us in under 48 hours. A different child once started using this formula.

Gimme A Pound

_Brian wrote: »

Perhaps a case where a social worker needs to get involved.

People are being a bit short with the OP but the above takes the biscuit. No, perhaps not. And pretty insulting to a clearly loving, attentive parent.

They were extremely upset - cut them some slack. Reassurance and advice are what they need - not finger-wagging. They're scared after what they think seems like an adverse reaction to the antibiotic but hopefully enough people have convinced them that these can be normal things for a growing baby, and that the reflux medicine is standard and nothing to fear.

Let us know how you get on at the doctor's, OP.

Neyite

Mod:
Please remember that offering medical advice or diagnosis here is forbidden.



Suggesting that an OP explore a treatment option with their GP or sharing your own experience is fine, telling them that they are dealing with X condition, is not.



As always, if you have medical advice and medications, follow that. If you are unhappy with that medical diagnosis from your GP, seek a second opinion from another qualified doctor, NOT the internet.

Cushie Butterfield

suitianshi wrote:

....but we know there’s something wrong with her and we really don’t know how to help her.

We are in a desperate life every day. Tears running down on my face...

My suggestion is to contact your local Public Health Nurse/Community Health Nurse. You can find yours here: https://www.hse.ie/eng/services/list/2/healthcentres/

It can be extremely daunting for first time mothers (especially if they live in a different country than where their own family live), so don’t feel alone or helpless because there is help out there, & at least if you could hook up with community health services you mightn’t feel as isolated or helpless.

Your maternal instincts have kicked in & the feelings that your experiencing are perfectly natural. Be assured that you’re doing nothing wrong. Your priority is the health of your child, & it certainly looks that you’ve done everything in your power to get to the bottom of the problem. However, I feel that you could benefit from the reassurance of your PHN.

A lot of the time there is no quick or instant fix, & it’s heart breaking for a mother to see her baby in distress with no apparent improvements. Rest assured that child health care professionals work to strict guidelines as set out by the HSE which are regularly updated - this is why they seem to be using Google as a diagnostic tool when in fact it’s more likely that they are checking the HSE website to ensure that they are following the most up to date guidelines.

People on boards mean well, but a lot of the time there is no ‘one size fits all’ solution. Chopping & changing formula etc is all very well, but it needs to be structured & monitored by someone who knows what they’re doing, & in what order. You’ll just drive yourself crazy by trying stuff willy nilly, so try to link in with a community based service, who can liaise with your GP/hospital if needs be.

You also need to look after your own physical & mental health, which is another reason to get community based health nurse involved. If you have to go online just stick to the HSE run website https://www2.hse.ie/babies-and-toddlers/conditions-and-symptoms/ (mychild.ie).

They will get to the bottom of this & you will get through this!

Take care & best of luck.

Babooshka

suitianshi wrote: »

A GP has prescribed us a medicine for reflux, but you know they never listen to us and they do google a lot. I don't know if she is suffering from reflux and not sure if this medicine will do something bad to my girl. she's too small now.

My daughter was born with silent reflux and had to be medicated from her 6 week checkup on after being referred to a paediatrician. I am no doctor but your daughter having eczema could also indicate allergy to milk and she may need a non dairy milk which paediatrician can prescribe. The meds did my child no harm and helped her take her milk intake and be less agitated, I feel for you as it's awful watching the little mites squirm, please get a paediatrician referral.

EDIT: as for health nurses, mine were young and inexperienced and told me I was just a first time mam who was too nervous and didn't notice the reflux in her, only myself and my husband noticed something was up - follow your instincts and I'd say go to a paediatrician, they're used to seeing reflux and allergies in kids, they know what they're doing. Don't mess with the middle man.