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Boardband provider's

  • 01-12-2018 12:12am
    #1
    pablo don
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 44 ✭


    Hi all.

    I am just inquiring about people's experience with there isp.I am currently with imagine lte.I can't fault them but with eir having brought fibre connection to my area, I am able to get fibre to the home connection.

    The cost is cheaper with eir Vodafone sky etc.
    I require fibre cable brought to my house.which I thought only eir could do. sky Vodafone etc say the can sort this for me is this true?
    Also I would like to get a tv boardband bundle . obviously sky would be better for tv and it is not through fibre.
    What are people's experience with dealing with there provider of boardband? What is sky boardband like speeds etc .is it fibre?
    Any advice appreciated
    Thanks.


Comments

  • #2
    Poulgorm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 813 ✭✭✭Poulgorm


    From talking to neighbours of mine (most of whom are college educated), I strongly suspect that people like Pablo Don form the vast majority of people in the country. Basically, they haven't a clue about the whole broadband scene - who provides the different infrastructures, who sells on those infrastructures, the difference between internet provided by copper wires, fibre + copper (FTTC), fibre only (FTTH) or wireless.

    Isn't it a shame that out TV networks don't provide a programme that explains it all, in simple terms. I blame RTE more than the others, as our TV licence tax largely funds it.

    The Broadband forum here does its best, but its reach is limited.


  • #3
    Marlow
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,555 ✭✭✭✭Marlow


    A lot of providers can order the FTTH connection to be installed.

    OpenEIR (which is the ones that own the network, not Eir retail) unfortunately have made a mess of the list, so have a read at this thread.

    There is a list of the providers, that do.

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057927096

    Sky are not ready on FTTH. They're only trialing it at the moment, so it's very unlikely to get a connection from them.

    The providers that do are: Airwire, BBnet, Digiweb, eir, Fastcom, Net1, Pure Telecom, Westnet and a few others.

    /M


  • #4
    pablo don
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 44 ✭pablo don


    Marlow wrote: »
    A lot of providers can order the FTTH connection to be installed.

    OpenEIR (which is the ones that own the network, not Eir retail) unfortunately have made a mess of the list, so have a read at this thread.

    There is a list of the providers, that do.

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057927096

    /M

    Cheers it's just confusing as each time u ring eir sky etc the tell u different prices for installation monthly cost for bundles etc.
    Some say you can get ftth some saw u cant.
    Ill give post a read.


  • #5
    Marlow
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,555 ✭✭✭✭Marlow


    pablo don wrote: »
    Cheers it's just confusing as each time u ring eir sky etc the tell u different prices for installation monthly cost for bundles etc.
    Some say you can get ftth some saw u cant.
    Ill give post a read.

    They're trialing it. And sure .. they're also one of the providers that call VDSL fibre .. so how is anyone to know, what you end up with.

    Find a provider, that clearly knows the difference between FTTC, which is a copper based service and really should be called VDSL .. and FTTH, which is fibre all the way in your home.

    Hell, Vodafone now calls all the FTTH products "Gigabit" broadband, even when it's 150 Mbit/s, because they abused the term "fibre" for their VDSL/FTTC products, tainted it and now nobody knows the difference.

    /M


  • #6
    The high horse brigade
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,456 ✭✭✭The high horse brigade


    Sky target customers who are already installed. Sky trialling is just an excuse for waiting until people are on their second contract so they have less trouble shooting and customer support to deal with as they did with VDSL.


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  • #7
    Marlow
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,555 ✭✭✭✭Marlow


    The high horse brigade wrote: »
    Sky target customers who are already installed. Sky trialling is just an excuse for waiting until people are on their second contract so they have less trouble shooting and customer support to deal with as they did with VDSL.

    OpenEIR have already announced their new proposed installation pricing from 1.1.2019 and that's going to screw Sky majorly with that approach.

    Installation will go down .. a little bit .. but it'll now cost the same, no matter if it's an installation, in-situ or provider change.

    /M


  • #8
    Johnboy1951
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,049 ✭✭✭✭Johnboy1951


    Marlow wrote: »
    OpenEIR have already announced their new proposed installation pricing from 1.1.2019 and that's going to screw Sky majorly with that approach.

    Installation will go down .. a little bit .. but it'll now cost the same, no matter if it's an installation, in-situ or provider change.

    /M

    Is that retrospective or only applicable to installs from 1.1.2019?


  • #9
    Marlow
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,555 ✭✭✭✭Marlow


    Johnboy1951 wrote: »
    Is that retrospective or only applicable to installs from 1.1.2019?

    From 1.1.2019 and onwards, if it gets introduced. Right now it's only proposed pricing, but it seems that OpenEIR have set their mind for this one.

    /M


  • #10
    Johnboy1951
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,049 ✭✭✭✭Johnboy1951


    Marlow wrote: »
    From 1.1.2019 and onwards, if it gets introduced. Right now it's only proposed pricing, but it seems that OpenEIR have set their mind for this one.

    /M

    That would seriously affect users' options at end of contract, essentially adding almost €200 to the cost of moving to a new provider.

    That seems to me to be anti-competitive, particularly as the major cost (the physical install) has previously been charged for, to a greater or lesser extent.

    Double charging?


  • #11
    Marlow
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,555 ✭✭✭✭Marlow


    Johnboy1951 wrote: »
    Double charging?

    This is the cost to the provider. It's up to the provider, what they charge the end-customer. But it will certainly not be cheap to change providers all the time anymore.

    It certainly can't be seen as double charging because the actual initial build of the fibre cost a lot more than 200 EUR.

    /M


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  • #12
    Johnboy1951
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,049 ✭✭✭✭Johnboy1951


    Marlow wrote: »
    This is the cost to the provider. It's up to the provider, what they charge the end-customer. But it will certainly not be cheap to change providers all the time anymore.

    It certainly can't be seen as double charging because the actual initial build of the fibre cost a lot more than 200 EUR.

    /M

    Openeir were paid the real cost, so to receive monies again for the same work is double charging.


  • #13
    Marlow
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,555 ✭✭✭✭Marlow


    Johnboy1951 wrote: »
    Openeir were paid the real cost, so to receive monies again for the same work is double charging.

    No. They were not. The build of network and access is multiples of the installation fee. Even the current one. Think in the range of 2k-5k total per premise. Some more, some less.

    /M


  • #14
    Johnboy1951
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,049 ✭✭✭✭Johnboy1951


    Marlow wrote: »
    No. They were not. The build of network and access is multiples of the installation fee. Even the current one. Think in the range of 2k-5k total per premise. Some more, some less.

    /M

    That is the cost of the roll-out per premises I presume.
    In this case it is the cost of installation that is under discussion ..... not how much it cost to arrive at the DP.


  • #15
    Marlow
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,555 ✭✭✭✭Marlow


    Johnboy1951 wrote: »
    That is the cost of the roll-out per premises I presume.
    In this case it is the cost of installation that is under discussion ..... not how much it cost to arrive at the DP.

    No. That's not how things work. OpenEIR owns the network. They have spend that money to build that network. They also have to operate that network.

    So, the cost for build and operation of the network is budgeted for over a time period of 5, 10, 15 maybe 20 years.

    That includes the connection from the DP to your home. Just because your provider pays OpenEIR for connecting a home onto their network doesn't give you any ownership. It's a service, where the payment goes towards the cost of building the network in the first place. It's an access fee.

    And the cost of connecting every premise is total cost of ownership to OpenEIR split by take up over a period and then they'll have to add their margin on top of that.

    That means, the second your house gets connected they have spend X amount to get to you. That's around 2k+. Because without that investment, you wouldn't have a connection in the first place.

    The installation is part of the rollout. You can't just pay for the installation without the network being brought out to you. What would you connect to ? So the cost for your installation is the entire complete cost of ownership as what it has cost to extend the network as far as out to your premise.

    /M


  • #16
    Johnboy1951
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,049 ✭✭✭✭Johnboy1951


    Marlow wrote: »
    No. That's not how things work. OpenEIR owns the network. They have spend that money to build that network. They also have to operate that network.

    So, the cost for build and operation of the network is budgeted for over a time period of 5, 10, 15 maybe 20 years.

    That includes the connection from the DP to your home. Just because your provider pays OpenEIR for connecting a home onto their network doesn't give you any ownership. It's a service, where the payment goes towards the cost of building the network in the first place. It's an access fee.

    And the cost of connecting every premise is total cost of ownership to OpenEIR split by take up over a period and then they'll have to add their margin on top of that.

    That means, the second your house gets connected they have spend X amount to get to you. That's around 2k+. Because without that investment, you wouldn't have a connection in the first place.

    The installation is part of the rollout. You can't just pay for the installation without the network being brought out to you. What would you connect to ? So the cost for your installation is the entire complete cost of ownership as what it has cost to extend the network as far as out to your premise.

    /M

    I was not claiming ownership of anything.

    My house has been connected, so I have made a contribution to the roll-out (connection fee).
    In this proposed (now passed) scheme I will make another contribution any time I change provider, even though it costs openeir very very little to have that recorded.

    There is no way that is equitable to either the end user or the competing ISPs.

    By all means have a yearly 'rent' payable by the ISP for every connection they provide, which can be built in to their monthly charge to the end-user. (Your access fee).
    The more people who connect to the roll out the lower that charge per connection should be to maintain the same rate of return on investment.

    This new scheme is an abomination.


  • #17
    Marlow
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,555 ✭✭✭✭Marlow


    Johnboy1951 wrote: »
    This new scheme is an abomination.

    Of course it is. It only benefits OpenEIR and nobody else.

    But the only one here at fault is Comreg and the Department. For their lack of sorting things.

    /M


  • #18
    Johnboy1951
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,049 ✭✭✭✭Johnboy1951


    Marlow wrote: »
    Of course it is. It only benefits OpenEIR and nobody else.

    But the only one here at fault is Comreg and the Department. For their lack of sorting things.

    /M

    Yes indeed.
    Yet another deliberate mistake by ComReg ....... but honestly I do not believe they are that incompetent, and have come to the view that there is something more sinister at play there.


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