Advice needed - two car collision on narrow road

Dubh73

Yesterday while driving into the school a car came against me quite quickly. I stopped because the road is quite narrow and both of us would not fit but the car continued to drive towards me and ploughed into the side to me.

I said to her immediately how could you not see me and she said her foot slipped off the pedal she said this numerous times and my husband was in the front seat of the car to hear it.

we got out to look at the damage and discovered that there wasn’t that much done to hers but I had quite a significant number of scratches on mine.

she was very eager that I would not contact her insurance she’s on her first insurance and her first job as a teacher in the school so she is quite young and offered to pay for it herself.

This morning I had numerous warning lights on the car with regards to the steering as I live very close to the school this did not come on last night. This meant the car had to go into the main dealership. I text The Girl to let her know, she thanked me and a few hours later I got a call from the guards who said please show my insurance and license at the station. He proceeded to tell me that she had made a statement and that as it was only to mirrors that had collided we should sort it out ourselves. As soon as I corrected him and the fact it was not two mirrors he hesitated and said he’d said far too much, it was not a legal issue for him to get involved. Shortly after I had a call from her insurance company asking would I accept that we would all pay for own damage and I said no and then they Said my only choices are that and the 50-50 rule. Does anybody know what the legal standing is in relation to this matter of the private narrow road one car stationery one ploughing in, she claimed liability to us and then backtracked

Samuel T. Cogley

Well worth investing in a dash cam, you'll just have to let the insurance companies hash it out I'm afraid. Just stick to your guns.

amdublin

Merz?
Mars?

I can't really make sense of what you're saying.

Can you edit your post to have sentences and full stops?

Samuel T. Cogley

amdublin wrote: »

Merz?
Mars?

I can't really make sense of what you're saying.

Can you edit your post to have sentences and full stops?

It's more the lack of paragraphs tbh but it's fairly straight forward what happened. They stopped the other car didn't, story changed later by driver at fault.

Rows Grower

Happened to a couple of my friends driving in opposite directions on a narrow road with no white line in the center and they were both advised by the Gardai that called to the scene that because there was no white line on the road there was no point in either of them trying to bring a case against the other.

Samuel T. Cogley

In fairness here on car was stationary, that might go in the OPs favour.

Rows Grower

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

In fairness here on car was stationary, that might go in the OPs favour.

I read what you read Sam, just telling the OP what I know happened.

drunkmonkey

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

In fairness here on car was stationary, that might go in the OPs favour.

Prove it, surley the husband as a witness isn't credible.

Samuel T. Cogley

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Prove it, surley the husband as a witness isn't credible.

It's perfectly possible for one party to be believed over the other.

Dubh73

amdublin wrote: »

Merz?
Mars?

I can't really make sense of what you're saying.

Can you edit your post to have sentences and full stops?

Sorry for any offense. I was putting kids to bed and trying to get this done as well, I didn’t notice the predictive texts etc

Dubh73

Do any of the text messages count??

listermint

Em..

Have you considered your steering fluid level is low and had nothing to do with the scratches on the car ?

Samuel T. Cogley

Dubh73 wrote: »

Do any of the text messages count??

It's going to be a case of being firm with your insurance company and saying you have X and Y evidence. They may very well decide it's not enough to contest it. As has been said before sadly it's a no claims bonus not a no fault bonus so you may just have to pay yourself.

Sucks but you'll need to look at this from a practical standpoint rather than a legal one.

Dubh73

listermint wrote: »

Em..

Have you considered your steering fluid level is low and had nothing to do with the scratches on the car ?

Thank you for your thoughts car serviced last month and wheel damaged where she hit me.

listermint

Then you'll have to leave this with your insurance company to determine.

Unfortunately that's where you at. It's also what premiums are for.

Sleeper12

listermint wrote:

Unfortunately that's where you at. It's also what premiums are for.

Also as the damage is small it might not effect the no claims bonus.

billcullen1

Dubh73 wrote: »

Yesterday while driving into the school a car came against me quite quickly. I stopped because the road is quite narrow and both of us would not fit but the car continued to drive towards me and ploughed into the side to me.

I said to her immediately how could you not see me and she said her foot slipped off the pedal she said this numerous times and my husband was in the front seat of the car to hear it.

we got out to look at the damage and discovered that there wasn’t that much done to hers but I had quite a significant number of scratches on mine.

she was very eager that I would not contact her insurance she’s on her first insurance and her first job as a teacher in the school so she is quite young and offered to pay for it herself.

This morning I had numerous warning lights on the car with regards to the steering as I live very close to the school this did not come on last night. This meant the car had to go into the main dealership. I text The Girl to let her know, she thanked me and a few hours later I got a call from the guards who said please show my insurance and license at the station. He proceeded to tell me that she had made a statement and that as it was only to mirrors that had collided we should sort it out ourselves. As soon as I corrected him and the fact it was not two mirrors he hesitated and said he’d said far too much, it was not a legal issue for him to get involved. Shortly after I had a call from her insurance company asking would I accept that we would all pay for own damage and I said no and then they Said my only choices are that and the 50-50 rule. Does anybody know what the legal standing is in relation to this matter of the private narrow road one car stationery one ploughing in, she claimed liability to us and then backtracked

Are you going to accept 50:50 even though you're not at fault ?

Dubh73

billcullen1 wrote: »

Are you going to accept 50:50 even though you're not at fault ?

It will be the last resort because 50/50 will still be worth something to me. There isn’t much damage to her car at all. I am guessing the 50/50 means both costs are added together and halved?? Is that correct or is it a case of I pay 50% of her costs she lays 50% of mine

Eggs For Dinner

With 2 different versions of events, no independent witnesses and no dashcam, this will be settled 50/50. What other choice is there? 50/50 means you pay half her loss, she pays half your loss.

Duffryman

For what it's worth, almost exactly the same thing happened my wife (while I was a passenger) on a narrow road near us almost two years ago. We were stationary, other car hit us, she admitted at the scene that it was her fault, then changed her story later. We felt exactly the same way as you, but ended up having to settle 50/50. Probably not what you want to hear, but that's our story anyway...

ct5amr2ig1nfhp

Did the accident occur on school grounds? You mention turning into the school and being on a narrow road.

I'd be rightly pissed. A friendly reminder to her that you'll be making a complaint to the principal of the school might make her remember what happened. Inform the principal that one of their new teachers was driving dangerously near the school and caused an accident. Could have been a student on a bicycle... The principal may suggest she settle the issue before the complaint is recorded on her record.
Otherwise the principal will have to be investigate. If you're not happy with the response, you can always direct the complaint to the board of management.

KevinCavan

It’s a very unfortunate accident. Unfortunately nobody wants to accept blame in most accidents. The other driver was clearly in the wrong, but you’ll probably get slapped with the fifty fifty b.s.

Ginger83

Find a witness.

Caranica

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Prove it, surley the husband as a witness isn't credible.

Passengers are not treated as independent witnesses by insurance companies as I learned when I had my car damaged by a third party. Was still glad, for my own safety, that I had passengers though!

The HorsesMouth

OP this exact same thing happened to me earlier this year. Narrow road, no white line..I was entirely faultless as I had actually stopped my car and pulled over while the other car was going too fast and couldn't stop in time. They ploughed into the side of my car and it ended up being a write off. We ended up just settling with our own insurance as they said its extremely rare that anyone will accept liability when the road hasn't enough room for 2 cars and has no white lines. So frustrating and annoying but thats the way it is. I've invested in a dash cam since!

TheChizler

Any chance there was a school CCTV camera around?

Or could the position of the damage on the two cars imply that they drove into you? Did you take pictures at the scene? You mention the wheel was damaged, it's very hard to damage a wheel (beyond scratches maybe) side on by driving into another car. That could help your case that they drove into you? If it is just scratches the pattern of scratches on the wheel could prove you were stopped - straight scratches if you were stopped, curved if the wheel was rotating.

RoamingDoc

Makai Purring Office wrote: »

Otherwise the principal will have to be investigate. If you're not happy with the response, you can always direct the complaint to the board of management.

This goes far beyond the remit of a school principal.
A principal who acts in such a manner would likely be subject to disciplinary action themselves.

You may be thinking of the teaching council? But again, they would be very unlikely to go near such a case.

billcullen1

Dubh73 wrote: »

It will be the last resort because 50/50 will still be worth something to me. There isn’t much damage to her car at all. I am guessing the 50/50 means both costs are added together and halved?? Is that correct or is it a case of I pay 50% of her costs she lays 50% of mine

Are you going to settle it privately yourself ?

Dubh73

Exactly what we were thinking. I mean at the time I thought she was a bit arrogant and put it down to shock. I was anxious something would happen on the drive home and told her it could have been worse it could have been a student (since she was saying her foot slipped) it was well inside the school grounds.

Dubh73

You are correct. My car is worse as she travelled down by me. The fact it’s mostly her mirror and front wheel arch shows she drove at me.

ct5amr2ig1nfhp

No, a principal must investigate any complaint against a teacher.
You must follow school complaints procedure before going to the teaching council. Typically it will be in order, Principal -> board of management -> teaching council.

RoamingDoc wrote: »

This goes far beyond the remit of a school principal.
A principal who acts in such a manner would likely be subject to disciplinary action themselves.

You may be thinking of the teaching council? But again, they would be very unlikely to go near such a case.

Eggs For Dinner

Makai Purring Office wrote: »

I'd be rightly pissed. A friendly reminder to her that you'll be making a complaint to the principal of the school might make her remember what happened. Inform the principal that one of their new teachers was driving dangerously near the school and caused an accident. Could have been a student on a bicycle... The principal may suggest she settle the issue before the complaint is recorded on her record.
Otherwise the principal will have to be investigate. If you're not happy with the response, you can always direct the complaint to the board of management.

That's a fairly serious course of action to take if you are unable to substantiate your allegation. Be very careful

Gerry T

What did the garage say was the steering fault. That photo doesn't show much damage and not sure how it would cause a steering issue.
As someone else said go back and look for cameras pointing in that direction, you might be surprised.
Let your ins co deal with it, but have them robustly say you were stationary long before their client got to you.... ie she had time to stop.
She's some wagon to pull this on you , no integrity, wouldn't like her teaching my kids

ebbsy

Get a solicitor.

A bit of muscle behind the hussle is needed here.

ct5amr2ig1nfhp

A teacher driving dangerously and then lying about her involvement in an accident outside a school is a very serious matter.

One of the key values expected from a teacher is integrity and honesty.

Eggs For Dinner wrote: »

That's a fairly serious course of action to take if you are unable to substantiate your allegation. Be very careful

Eggs For Dinner

Makai Purring Office wrote: »

A teacher driving dangerously and then lying about her involvement in an accident outside a school is a very serious matter.

One of the key values expected from a teacher is integrity and honesty.

I'm not specifically speaking about this thread or this OP, but the amount of times on Boards where posters take an OP's version events as Gospel, when they've only heard one side of the story, is amazing

All I said was that if you are prepared to take a serious course of action as you suggest, you would want to be very careful that you can back it up with evidence

Edward M

Dubh73 wrote: »

Yesterday while driving into the school a car came against me quite quickly. I stopped because the road is quite narrow and both of us would not fit but the car continued to drive towards me and ploughed into the side to me.

I said to her immediately how could you not see me and she said her foot slipped off the pedal she said this numerous times and my husband was in the front seat of the car to hear it.

we got out to look at the damage and discovered that there wasn’t that much done to hers but I had quite a significant number of scratches on mine.

she was very eager that I would not contact her insurance she’s on her first insurance and her first job as a teacher in the school so she is quite young and offered to pay for it herself.

This morning I had numerous warning lights on the car with regards to the steering as I live very close to the school this did not come on last night. This meant the car had to go into the main dealership. I text The Girl to let her know, she thanked me and a few hours later I got a call from the guards who said please show my insurance and license at the station. He proceeded to tell me that she had made a statement and that as it was only to mirrors that had collided we should sort it out ourselves. As soon as I corrected him and the fact it was not two mirrors he hesitated and said he’d said far too much, it was not a legal issue for him to get involved. Shortly after I had a call from her insurance company asking would I accept that we would all pay for own damage and I said no and then they Said my only choices are that and the 50-50 rule. Does anybody know what the legal standing is in relation to this matter of the private narrow road one car stationery one ploughing in, she claimed liability to us and then backtracked

You have a witness, your husband.
Apart from that, the 50/50 rule as far as I know, you claim off her ins and her off yours.
The lesson here is always contact the gardai, she's now a step ahead of you in the legal stakes.
Either that or get a signed admission off of her at the collision.

SteM

Edward M wrote: »

You have a witness, your husband.
Apart from that, the 50/50 rule as far as I know, you claim off her ins and her off yours.
The lesson here is always contact the gardai, she's now a step ahead of you in the legal stakes.
Either that or get a signed admission off of her at the collision.

Sure that will mean nothing, all she'd have to say afterwards is she was in shock at the time and didn't know what she was signing.

Rows Grower

SteM wrote: »

Sure that will mean nothing, all she'd have to say afterwards is she was in shock at the time and didn't know what she was signing.

Oh sweet Lord in Heaven save us.

Edward M

Edward M wrote: »

...she's now a step ahead of you in the legal stakes.

Nonsense.

The first person to report involvement in a minor RTC like this doesn't somehow get bonus points or extra credibility.

Both parties are required by their insurer to report it to the Gardaí.

It might seem unreasonable to some, but this is a matter that should be directed to the Principal and Board of Management.

If a teacher cycling in to work struck you while you were standing on school grounds, injured you and then told you it was your own fault you didn't move, you would address it to the school management as a formal complaint.

Do the same here. Just because your insurers are likely to deal with this 50/50 does not mean that is the end of it. You have effectively been 'injured' by a member of staff on school grounds.

EDIT to add, you shouldn't feel bad about it at all either. The teacher knew it was her fault from what you say and now she's trying to stick you. To hell with that. She had a chance to make it right, then she decided to make it your problem instead. Turn the tables and let her deal with the consequences.

TheChizler

Dubh73 wrote: »

You are correct. My car is worse as she travelled down by me. The fact it’s mostly her mirror and front wheel arch shows she drove at me.

In my totally non-expert opinion the straight radial marks on the alloy show that your wheel wasn't rotating when it was in contact with the other car. I'd be pointing that out to the insurance. They might not believe it but it's some evidence.

antix80

Phone a solicitor. He will write her a letter telling her you're claiming against her. The language will be quite formal and she might decide to pay up.
If you don't want to go the legal route, I wouldn't be above getting the school involved. Maybe you could leave a message with the school asking her to contact you in relation to the collision. A nosy secretary might pry a bit more info out of you

seamus

A signed admission of liability at the scene would be completely worthless, especially once insurance companies get involved.

Reporting it to the Gardai first does not "put her a legal step ahead". There is no legal obligation to report this accident to the Gardai, their involvement is incidental.

The amount of urban myths that people believe about accidents is incredible.

OP, contact your own insurer, give them details of her insurer, dispute liability, provide the facts you have, including the photos, and let the insurance companies fight it out. That's what you pay them for.

Don't complain to the school over a prang in a car park. Don't go paying good money to solicitors over a bloody prang in a car park.

Go to your insurance company who you've been paying a lot of money to for exactly this kind of thing.

seamus

seamus wrote: »

Don't complain to the school over a prang in a car park. Don't go paying good money to solicitors over a bloody prang in a car park.

Go to your insurance company who you've been paying a lot of money to for exactly this kind of thing.

Yes, complain to the school. If it was another parent there's little point, but it was a member of staff, on school grounds.

By all means, put it through insurance, but don't be deterred from taking it further by dismissive 'prang' talk. A teacher was not in control of her car while on school grounds, was unable to stop in time and has damaged your car, then expects to wash her hands of responsibility. That's not okay at all.

Seriously, who in their right mind would think that sort of carry on shouldn't be reported to the principal and BOM? :rolleyes:

antix80

seamus wrote: »

let the insurance companies fight it out. That's what you pay them for.

Don't complain to the school over a prang in a car park. Don't go paying good money to solicitors over a bloody prang in a car park.

Go to your insurance company who you've been paying a lot of money to for exactly this kind of thing.

Eh, naive view Seamus. The insurance companies don't "fight it out" .. they have knock-for-knock agreements. Each insurer will pay for their own client when there's a collision on a country road and no one obviously at fault.

Going to a solicitor will obviously incur a cost and I probably wouldn't bother.

Going to the school is definitely an option. Maybe it's not legal justice but it's a form of justice.

Eggs For Dinner

Rows Grower wrote: »

Oh sweet Lord in Heaven save us.

The poster is correct. Admissions of liability at the scene of an accident have been proven to be inadmissible due to possible intimidation or shock

ct5amr2ig1nfhp

When a poster gives advice on boards, there has to be a presumption that what the OP is telling us the truth. Otherwise any advice would have to come with a disclaimer. "if you're telling the truth, i would suggest... " Give me a break :rolleyes:

The OP would be very foolish to make a false statement, whether to the Gardai or to the schools authorities. I do not believe we have to remind the OP of that.

Let the school authorities investigate whether there is a valid complaint. The threat of the investigation by the Principal or school authorities may be enough for the teacher to see sense and do the right thing.

Eggs For Dinner wrote: »

I'm not specifically speaking about this thread or this OP, but the amount of times on Boards where posters take an OP's version events as Gospel, when they've only heard one side of the story, is amazing

All I said was that if you are prepared to take a serious course of action as you suggest, you would want to be very careful that you can back it up with evidence

Eggs For Dinner

JayZeus wrote: »

Seriously, who in their right mind would think that sort of carry on shouldn't be reported to the principal and BOM? :rolleyes:

If you made an allegation about me to my employer, which has a possible detrimental affect on my job, you better be prepared to prove it or I'm coming after you with the full force of the libel laws

The J Stands for Jay

There was a thread on here recently where something similar happened. The car manufacturer was able to pull telemetry from the car that showed it was stationary when it was hit. Could that be worth looking into?

Rows Grower

OmegaGene wrote: »

Any pssenget in the car is not counted as a witness, it needs to be an independent witness
The Gardaí do not deal with minor collisions like this it’s a civil matter unless a law is broken or someone is injured they don’t want to know and it’s a country road
Admission of guilt or signed confession at the scene means nothing - they were under duress they were in shock they were scared, the list is endless

Dash cam is the beat thing for everyone driving a vehicle and a helmet camera for cyclists and there is no more he said she said it’s just cut and dry.

You're wrong there lad.

Rows Grower

Eggs For Dinner wrote: »

The poster is correct. Admissions of liability at the scene of an accident have been proven to be inadmissible due to possible intimidation or shock

I don't doubt that may have happened but that does not make it a rule of thumb.