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Exodus Of Players To Aussie Rules

  • 30-10-2018 3:22pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 2,934 ✭✭✭ dixiefly
    Registered User


    Well Tomás Ó Sé isn't happy and I am beginning to agree with him

    https://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/its-a-farce-toms-s-vents-frustration-as-sixth-irish-youngster-signs-for-an-afl-club-37473965.html


    Red Óg Murphy has become the sixth Irish youngster to be snapped up by an AFL club in the Aussie Rules off-season.
    The Sligo native has joined North Melbourne trialled with the club in August and impressed according to North’s GM of Football Cameron Joyce.

    “Red was invited to Arden Street and we were really happy with his ability and character,” Joyce said.

    “Our recruiters, and in particular our Pro Scout Nick Byrne, have stayed in touch with him and his family over the past few months and we are really happy to have signed him as a Category-B rookie on our list.”

    In particular, Murphy’s running capacity stood out and his testing ranked in the top echelon of players at the club.

    “We did a variety of tests with Red and he was exceptional,” Joyce added.

    “We feel that he has the right foundations to enable him to have a real crack at playing in the AFL and we will give him every chance.”

    James Madden (Brisbane), Mark Keane and Anton Tohill (Collingwood), Stefan Okunbor (Geelong) and Callum Brown (GWS Giants) have already committed to the AFL for the 2019 season.

    There are 14 Irishmen now contracted to clubs in the AFL and Carlow's Jordan Morrissey is expected to become the 15th shortly.

    Kerry legend Tomás Ó Sé took to Twitter to say that he understands why players are choosing to make the move Down Under but he feels for the clubs that have developed them.


    Tomás Ó Sé
    @tomas5ky
    7th player signed on the off season from Ireland. it’s great opportunity for lads and don’t blame them one bit but what a kick in the hole for clubs who’ve brought them through and given them everything.Counties too.Aussies just pick and leave.charge them.http://dlvr.it/QpZCnQ
    8:51 AM - Oct 30, 2018 · Cork, Ireland
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    67 people are talking about this
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    rob hill
    @robhillcork
    · 4h
    Replying to @tomas5ky
    So what you're talking about there is a transfer market? For underage players? Where will the money from that go?

    Tomás Ó Sé
    @tomas5ky
    Straight to club. Transfer markets??? Hardly. They are two different sports. We are amateur for god sake. Under Gaa supervision they should be made pay a contribution yes. God sake amount of clubs struggling financially and these fellas swan in and out poaching. Disgraceful
    9:00 AM - Oct 30, 2018 · Cork, Ireland
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    rob hill
    @robhillcork
    · 4h
    Replying to @tomas5ky
    Well yes, effectively it is a transfer market if you are charging them a fee to sign a player. 7 lads signed so far this year, possibly another few to sign yet - take 32 x U20 panels (minimum of 640 players) - the % is tiny....

    Tomás Ó Sé
    @tomas5ky
    Say that to @DingleGAA who if they had Mark O Connor would probably be celebrating their first county in 70 odd years. Percentages my ass
    9:06 AM - Oct 30, 2018 · Cork, Ireland
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    rob hill
    @robhillcork
    · 4h
    Replying to @tomas5ky @DingleGAA
    So the money would have solved that problem is it? Believe me, I'd love to have seen @DingleGAA win that county. But there are infinitely bigger problems than the aussies in terms of player retention....

    Tomás Ó Sé
    @tomas5ky
    Money does not solve it no. I’ll say it again... it’s wrong that they can come in and take the top players we have and nothing we can do about it. Nothing. It’s a farce
    9:12 AM - Oct 30, 2018 · Cork, Ireland


«1

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 2,618 ✭✭✭ CrabRevolution
    Registered User


    While it is annoying to see talent drained away, there's pretty much nothing you can do about it unless the AFL clubs agree to some sort of goodwill payment. They have no obligation to the GAA and the GAA have no leverage.

    The clubs don't employ the players so haven't a leg to stand on if they demand money off a player's new employer.

    Like if I got a new job in Germany, could my club ask for money off my German employer?

    Could Gortnahoe-Glengoole ask for compensation off Cork City for Shane Long? Can Fighting Cocks ask for money off Leinster for Sean O'Brien?

    Or even more simply, if I transfer to another GAA Club, can my old club ask my new club for money?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,645 ✭✭✭ funnyname
    Registered User


    He's an idiot with his argument, makes no sense to me.

    What next schools/universities to get a kick back from employers when someone gets their first job?


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,308 ✭✭✭✭ Fr Tod Umptious
    Registered User


    Malachy Clerkin was on radio about this a few weeks ago.

    In reality feck all GAA players make it in the AFL.

    The actual number who have actually made it is about 6
    Sean White
    Jim Stynes
    Setanta
    Pierce Hanley
    Tadagh Kennelly
    Zach Touhy.

    The GAA are losing far more players for other reasons than Australia


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 320 ✭✭ WillieMason
    Banned


    funnyname wrote: »
    He's an idiot with his argument, makes no sense to me.

    What next schools/universities to get a kick back from employers when someone gets their first job?

    He is from Kerry backwards as you get. The clown should be focusing on the weekly mass brawls in kerry GAA


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭ LeinsterDub
    Registered User


    He is from Kerry backwards as you get. The clown should be focusing on the weekly mass brawls in kerry GAA

    The GAA will lose more players this week due to the current club v county debacle than they have to the Australians since the 80s


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,428 Powerhouse



    The GAA are losing far more players for other reasons than Australia


    Must say I have limited sympathy for O’Se’s argument, like why do GAA clubs need so much money? Well, it’s for illegal payments to coaches isn’t it?

    At the same time your point is meaningless. O’Se never said there aren’t players being lost to the GAA for other reasons.


  • Registered Users Posts: 16,284 ✭✭✭✭ bucketybuck
    Registered User


    I couldn't blame any young player for getting away from the GAA, whether it be to Aussie rules or to any other sport.

    Forget the money or the sunshine, those young lads might actually get a fixture list and know when games are going to be played! Who could turn that down!

    Stay in Ireland and be ****ed about both on and off the field? These young lads should get out while they can.


  • Registered Users Posts: 16,249 ✭✭✭✭ Utopia Parkway
    Registered User


    While a few young lads have left there are always a few that come back every year too. Galway's Cillian McDaid and Louth's Ciaran Byrne both returned home recently. Most of the lads leaving will be back in a few years time. A select few will stay on longer.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,575 ✭✭✭ BENDYBINN
    Registered User


    Surely this is brilliant for the Gaa, more young lads will be attracted to the sport
    if there’s a chance they could play in Australia
    Lose one gain a hundred...o shea needs to open his eyes!


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,044 ✭✭✭ The_Honeybadger
    Registered User


    Very frustrating when your most promising players are snapped up but what can you do. Those saying the GAA need to do ‘something’ are clutching at straws. As someone said above they have zero leverage unless the game goes semi pro and you tie players in to contracts.

    I can see this issue continuing to escalate with more and more lads going over for trials at the very least. It’s true that not that many have made it to date but were lads travelling in these kinds of numbers? I’m no expert but I doubt it.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,696 ✭✭✭ Always_Running
    Registered User


    The chances of young GAA players making it out there is slim, i'd say let them off and when they return, more than likely within one or 2 years clubs and counties should have a improved player than was exposed to professional training.


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 4,115 Mod ✭✭✭✭ bruschi
    Moderator


    couple of things on this. an exodus is a mass leaving of people. 6 young players, none of whom were on senior squads, is not an exodus. I could probably count up to 15 footballers in Wexford who have left club or county set ups for different reasons. Many players hyped up at minor fail to make the grade later on. For varying reasons. would there be as much an uproar if these lads were leaving for a 2 year WHV like many other Irish lads do?

    As for this increasing, I dont think it will. there is a lot of investment from the AFL clubs point of view in terms of recruiting, travel accommodation and colleges that they dont have on local players. So is the investment going to be worth it for them? Many clubs are not interested in this and others have been burned and not willing to try again.

    At the moment, it is at its highest level. But I reckon at least half of the players there now will be back in Ireland within 3 years. They may be replaced by new recruits, but for the most part, players go over, give it a go, and come back home. Kildare were ones who were crying the most about it in recent years. And now they are all back, Flynn, Cribben, Hurley and Brophy. And bar Hurley, probably all the better for the experience.

    As for players making it out there, you can add Conor McKenna to that list. Has played over 50 games for Essendon and is integral to their side. It'll be interesting to see how Glass and Nash go with Hawthorn, both figured this year with Nash playing finals footy for them. Also you have O Connor in Geelong who has started games. Those 3 are in the make or break category, either push on and play, or end up finishing their time there.


  • Registered Users Posts: 16,284 ✭✭✭✭ bucketybuck
    Registered User


    bruschi wrote: »
    couple of things on this. an exodus is a mass leaving of people. 6 young players, none of whom were on senior squads, is not an exodus.

    Its worth pointing out that the problem isn't really the volume of players going, its the fact that by definition it is the best of the best of the young talents that are going. It is of course a problem for any sport if its very best young talents are all being poached.

    It is a problem. The question is whether the GAA can do anything about it, and considering their treatment of the clubs whether they deserve any sympathy or not.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,217 ✭✭✭ cms88
    Registered User


    He is from Kerry backwards as you get. The clown should be focusing on the weekly mass brawls in kerry GAA

    Weekly mass brawls? :rolleyes:


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 4,115 Mod ✭✭✭✭ bruschi
    Moderator


    Its worth pointing out that the problem isn't really the volume of players going, its the fact that by definition it is the best of the best of the young talents that are going. It is of course a problem for any sport if its very best young talents are all being poached.

    It is a problem. The question is whether the GAA can do anything about it, and considering their treatment of the clubs whether they deserve any sympathy or not.

    but is it really the best of the best? It may be nitpicking, as they are obviously very talented players, but not the absolute best always go. Okunbar has gone from Kerry, but of that U20 group, he is not the best player from that side, O Shea and Clifford clearly miles ahead. And again, its not as if there is a huge drain on every county, one or 2 players from a few counties isnt an epidemic proportion of leaving. If it increases by the same amount next year with no players returning, then I'd review it then. Of course there is the view that the horse will already have bolted by then but I'm not so sure it will get any worse.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,428 Powerhouse


    cms88 wrote: »
    Weekly mass brawls? :rolleyes:


    So there are not brawls at weekly mass in Kerry then?


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,829 ✭✭✭ robbiezero
    Registered User


    I couldn't blame any young player for getting away from the GAA, whether it be to Aussie rules or to any other sport.

    Forget the money or the sunshine, those young lads might actually get a fixture list and know when games are going to be played! Who could turn that down!

    Stay in Ireland and be ****ed about both on and off the field? These young lads should get out while they can.

    Very unlikely that any of those players would be ****ed around. All of those players would have been in and around a county level environment and very likely in the near future to be on the county senior squad.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,829 ✭✭✭ robbiezero
    Registered User


    bruschi wrote: »
    but is it really the best of the best? It may be nitpicking, as they are obviously very talented players, but not the absolute best always go. Okunbar has gone from Kerry, but of that U20 group, he is not the best player from that side, O Shea and Clifford clearly miles ahead. And again, its not as if there is a huge drain on every county, one or 2 players from a few counties isnt an epidemic proportion of leaving. If it increases by the same amount next year with no players returning, then I'd review it then. Of course there is the view that the horse will already have bolted by then but I'm not so sure it will get any worse.

    Kerry are getting a fair dose from the Aussies. In recent years
    Tommy Walsh, a massive player for them, went and never came back the same.
    Mark O'Connor and Okunbar, two massive prospects for them that would be badly needed in a defence that has to be almost entirely rebuilt.
    It must be frustrating for Kerry fans to be trying to get back to the top table and seeing these superb talents heading off. More so, that these are all exactly the type of player that the Kerry team badly needs - powerful, pacey, physical athletes.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,217 ✭✭✭ cms88
    Registered User


    Powerhouse wrote: »
    So there are not brawls at weekly mass in Kerry then?

    Was there any last weekend? Must have missed that one...


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 7,466 ✭✭✭ blinding
    Banned


    Powerhouse wrote: »
    So there are not brawls at weekly mass in Kerry then?
    If there was a mass brawl at mass every week I might go especially if it twas the women at it .


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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 4,115 Mod ✭✭✭✭ bruschi
    Moderator


    robbiezero wrote: »
    Kerry are getting a fair dose from the Aussies. In recent years
    Tommy Walsh, a massive player for them, went and never came back the same.
    Mark O'Connor and Okunbar, two massive prospects for them that would be badly needed in a defence that has to be almost entirely rebuilt.
    It must be frustrating for Kerry fans to be trying to get back to the top table and seeing these superb talents heading off. More so, that these are all exactly the type of player that the Kerry team badly needs - powerful, pacey, physical athletes.


    absolutely they have. Walsh was hitting his peak and despite coming back, was wrecked with injury. A massive loss to them. Similarly with O Connor, was going to be going straight into that side and with Clifford and O Shea too, a great injection of youth into an again side who are needing to challenge at the top. I dont know enough about Okunbar to say he'd be going in just yet, but if he comes back in 2 years, he'll be on the same time scale really as if he just stayed. Thats obviously if he comes back.

    If Clifford ends up going, as was strongly rumoured last year, then it will be a massive blow to them and by far the hardest hitting effect of any players going to AFL.

    Kildare were spoken about similarly as to how many they were losing, but all are now back and mostly playing again.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,829 ✭✭✭ robbiezero
    Registered User


    bruschi wrote: »
    absolutely they have. Walsh was hitting his peak and despite coming back, was wrecked with injury. A massive loss to them. Similarly with O Connor, was going to be going straight into that side and with Clifford and O Shea too, a great injection of youth into an again side who are needing to challenge at the top. I dont know enough about Okunbar to say he'd be going in just yet, but if he comes back in 2 years, he'll be on the same time scale really as if he just stayed. Thats obviously if he comes back.

    If Clifford ends up going, as was strongly rumoured last year, then it will be a massive blow to them and by far the hardest hitting effect of any players going to AFL.

    Kildare were spoken about similarly as to how many they were losing, but all are now back and mostly playing again.

    I'd say Okunbar would have been straight into the panel this year. He was impressive for the u20s all year and Kerry badly need a good full back. Griffin is not their answer.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,044 ✭✭✭ The_Honeybadger
    Registered User


    robbiezero wrote: »
    I'd say Okunbar would have been straight into the panel this year. He was impressive for the u20s all year and Kerry badly need a good full back. Griffin is not their answer.

    Okunbar isn’t really a full back and is not even a good man marker, he would get destroyed there at senior level, he could potentially have made a good half back or midfielder. He may be back some day and we’ll see if he is good enough. Foley will hopefully be the long term full back in kerry once he bulks up a bit as he is still young.

    Mark O’Connor was a devastating loss to kerry, he was an absolute prodigy as a minor and had all the tools to be a big part of that team for many years to come in a problem position at midfield. If Kerry are to get back to Dublin’s level they cannot afford to be losing talent like that. Can’t blame the lad for grabbing the opportunity in front of him though.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 320 ✭✭ WillieMason
    Banned


    Okunbar was never going to make it with kerry and this way he escapes the Violence of the kerry club game.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,829 ✭✭✭ robbiezero
    Registered User


    mickeyk wrote: »
    Okunbar isn’t really a full back and is not even a good man marker, he would get destroyed there at senior level, he could potentially have made a good half back or midfielder. He may be back some day and we’ll see if he is good enough. Foley will hopefully be the long term full back in kerry once he bulks up a bit as he is still young.

    Mark O’Connor was a devastating loss to kerry, he was an absolute prodigy as a minor and had all the tools to be a big part of that team for many years to come in a problem position at midfield. If Kerry are to get back to Dublin’s level they cannot afford to be losing talent like that. Can’t blame the lad for grabbing the opportunity in front of him though.

    Fair enough. I only ever saw him this year in the u20s.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,556 ✭✭✭✭ jmayo
    Registered User


    mickeyk wrote: »
    Very frustrating when your most promising players are snapped up but what can you do. Those saying the GAA need to do ‘something’ are clutching at straws. As someone said above they have zero leverage unless the game goes semi pro and you tie players in to contracts.

    I can see this issue continuing to escalate with more and more lads going over for trials at the very least. It’s true that not that many have made it to date but were lads travelling in these kinds of numbers? I’m no expert but I doubt it.

    I can really see why a young lad would go for it, especially if you are like the lads from Sligo, Derry, etc.

    Even the likes of Kerry can't offer the same enticements as getting paid full time to play sport, and besides the climate is better.
    robbiezero wrote: »
    Kerry are getting a fair dose from the Aussies. In recent years
    Tommy Walsh, a massive player for them, went and never came back the same.
    Mark O'Connor and Okunbar, two massive prospects for them that would be badly needed in a defence that has to be almost entirely rebuilt.
    It must be frustrating for Kerry fans to be trying to get back to the top table and seeing these superb talents heading off. More so, that these are all exactly the type of player that the Kerry team badly needs - powerful, pacey, physical athletes.

    Was O'Se complaining half as much when it was other counties losing possibly some of their best prospects ?


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,074 ✭✭✭ LoughNeagh2017
    Banned


    I think many of these players are over hyped anyway, they have a few good games and somehow they are going to be the next Anthony Tohill, they will likely be back in a few years with their tails between their legs, I don't give them a second thought. Well actually they could be the next Anthony Tohill given that he didn't make it over there either.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,034 ✭✭✭ Amprodude
    Registered User


    to be fair O se is becoming a bit annoying lately with his analysis. Why wouldn't any young lad who is getting paid to play sport not want to go to Australia. You get nothing in gaa and the effort you put in is ridiculous. Unless players are goin to be paid in GAA they shouldn't have any problems going to Australia if that's what they prefer to do. O se is doing alot of talking but what is he doing to help the situation? yeah nothing.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 320 ✭✭ WillieMason
    Banned


    Pat is talking about the Violence of the kerry club game today in the sundayworld dont know why i got a warning for mentioning it on here


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  • Registered Users Posts: 14,681 ✭✭✭✭ P_1
    Registered User


    Can you blame the lads really? Where they are living in Ireland isn't exactly a hotspot of economic or social activity. 3 years in Australia, being paid some decent money and being involved in a professional setup (training, nutrition etc) certainly seems a more attractive prospect than remaining where they are.

    The GAA is a good organisation but fixing the economic and social blight of rural Ireland is likely beyond their skills


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