Log Cabin v. Steeltech Shed

MrFinance

Hi all,

Looking for advice if possible. Currently weighing up the possibility of building either a log cabin or a steeltech shed.

1. Steeltech shed. 2.3m in height, 100mm composite panel insulation with wood effect pvc 16m x 6m is costing approx 45k (just for the shell). Builder to do foundation and internal work coming in at 35k.

2. Log Cabin. (using ecologcabins) 10m x 16m. Including;Assembly, Foundation, Roof insulation, Floor instalation, Gutters, Wall insulation, Internal painting, External painting coming it at approx 100k.



Thoughts? Have people used either of the above?

I'm conscious of the width of steeltech as they have specified if I want to add 2m to the width that I will be adding circa 25k to the project. Bringing it to 100k.

Additionally, I am conscious of the timberframe homes in the Irish climate, thus I am leaning toward steeltech. However, I would be open to using another company if anybody has recommendations? (at my wits end currently, researching the past 3 months).



Also, planning re the above. Has anyone built either of the above, and if so, how have you found planning?



Thanks for all answers



MrFinance

listermint

Steeltech shed? log cabin

And planning, you wont get planning for either as a habitable home.

MrFinance

listermint wrote: »

Steeltech shed? (https://www.steeltechsheds.ie/products/garden-chalets/#gallery/a578ee247c267e44fe3772a967925dd7/610) log cabin

And planning, you wont get planning for either as a habitable home.

Heard planning for the cabins is essentially impossible for the cabins. Never heard anything re Steeltech.

Unfortunately, I will need to build one as buying is out of the question. 3 bed semi's fetching 350k + in Cork atm.

listermint

You wont get planning on a steeltech shed to live in.

MrFinance

listermint wrote: »

You wont get planning on a steeltech shed to live in.

Great, now that's out of the way, have you used either company or erected a shed or cabin?

listermint

I would stop looking at sheds you can build on the cheap.

And start chatting with your local planning office.

There have been various threads such as yours started over the years. All leading to nothing.

MrFinance

listermint wrote: »

I would stop looking at sheds you can build on the cheap.

And start chatting with your local planning office.

There have been various threads such as yours started over the years. All leading to nothing.

Again, thanks for your input. However, I am not looking for a lecture.

If building a home in my situation was as easy I would have taken the steps a long time ago!

Building a concrete home is out of the question! Buying one is even further out of the question with the current market. This leaves me with two options;
1. Become homeless next summer
2. Build one of the aforementioned structures.

banie01

I have a Steeltech shed in 8mtr x5mtr with 2.4mtr wall height.
I went with the wood effect steel rather than the PVC as it is much more sturdy.
We have ours split into 2bays, 1 as a shed and utility room with washing machine, dryer and tool storage. Other as a garden Room with 2 windows and French doors also have a toilet in there. Have
Went with Steeltech as price for insulated shed and doors and windows was very competitive compared to block built.
Insulated battened and slabbed it is a great addition to my garden.

Cuddlesworth

MrFinance wrote: »

Again, thanks for your input. However, I am not looking for a lecture.

If building a home in my situation was as easy I would have taken the steps a long time ago!

Building a concrete home is out of the question! Buying one is even further out of the question with the current market. This leaves me with two options;
1. Become homeless next summer
2. Build one of the aforementioned structures.

And then you get a council visit, followed with a fine and interest applied, then with a demolition order. So I'd ask them how much to demo the shed afterwards so you can add that into the budget.

MrFinance

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

And then you get a council visit, followed with a fine and interest applied, then with a demolition order. So I'd ask them how much to demo the shed afterwards so you can add that into the budget.

Will be sure to ask them about demolition order. Thanks :P

alejandro1977

banie01 wrote: »

I have a Steeltech shed in 8mtr x5mtr with 2.4mtr wall height.
I went with the wood effect steel rather than the PVC as it is much more sturdy.
We have ours split into 2bays, 1 as a shed and utility room with washing machine, dryer and tool storage. Other as a garden Room with 2 windows and French doors also have a toilet in there. Have
Went with Steeltech as price for insulated shed and doors and windows was very competitive compared to block built.
Insulated battened and slabbed it is a great addition to my garden.

how warm is the utility room part? Is it damp at all in winter?
More importantly, how much of a pain is it for you (and your spouse) to run out in the rain to put a wash on?
I'm in favour of this as I want to keep damp clothes out of the house but the wife isn't sold...

the other option is a Containex 10' x 10 (like a shipping container) which works out at a similar price

listermint

banie01 wrote: »

I have a Steeltech shed in 8mtr x5mtr with 2.4mtr wall height.
I went with the wood effect steel rather than the PVC as it is much more sturdy.
We have ours split into 2bays, 1 as a shed and utility room with washing machine, dryer and tool storage. Other as a garden Room with 2 windows and French doors also have a toilet in there. Have
Went with Steeltech as price for insulated shed and doors and windows was very competitive compared to block built.
Insulated battened and slabbed it is a great addition to my garden.

Are you living it in, And using it as a permanent home?

Lets not sugar coat this process to the OP.

Because at this point they believe they've suddenly cracked the system.

Or is it just a shed as per its intended construction

enricoh

6m wide before insulation slabbing etc is narrow. Go 8m.
My tuppence worth, go to lads that do sheds for farmers, know windows n door sizes. Call to them, forget emailing.
Steeltech n these cabin crowds are flat out at the minute and charge accordingly.
I built a 20x14ft steel frame log cabin 10 years ago, not for living in, but its still perfect

Edit to say spending 100k on something that the council will get rid of is a bit nuts. At least a mobile home u can flog it on handy. Would u get 10-15k back on the shed? Possibly!

Eric Cartman

if youre going to build an illegal structure to live in just get some of those new porotherm blocks , look up youtube guides and do it all yourself, labour is most of the cost of a building anyway, but since it wont be standing for very long and wont have planning, regulations don't matter so just DIY the whole thing and atleast it will be warmer.

JimmyMW

MrFinance wrote: »

Will be sure to ask them about demolition order. Thanks :P

You seam very determined to ignore the advice here regarding planning and building illegally, that given, you would be best off with a luxury mobile home. When enforcement comes knocking on your door at least you'll be able to sell on the mobile with potentially less of a financial loss

cnocbui

I built a timber cabin as a shed. Parts of it rotted even though Sikkens wood treatments were sold to me as the best available. This isn't the climate for timber anything, IMO.

Sleeper12

OP you'd get less lecturing if you started the thread looking for advice on an office or play room in the garden.

A friend of mine has a log cabin around 10 years now. He has no issues with the wood in Irish climate. At least not yet. It's very easy to heat in the winter and holds the heat. He had an issue with condensation during the summer rather than the winter but putting in extra vents sorted this out.

Anyone who rented from him loved the place. All found in the most comfortable place to stay in.

Eric Cartman

JimmyMW wrote: »

You seam very determined to ignore the advice here regarding planning and building illegally, that given, you would be best off with a luxury mobile home. When enforcement comes knocking on your door at least you'll be able to sell on the mobile with potentially less of a financial loss

actually this is probably the best worst advice, atleast youd still have the mobile when you were forced to move it on.

listermint

Sleeper12 wrote: »

OP you'd get less lecturing if you started the thread looking for advice on an office or play room in the garden.

A friend of mine has a log cabin around 10 years now. He has no issues with the wood in Irish climate. At least not yet. It's very easy to heat in the winter and holds the heat. He had an issue with condensation during the summer rather than the winter but putting in extra vents sorted this out.

Anyone who rented from him loved the place. All found in the most comfortable place to stay in.

Lecturing....


give me a break will ya. and your friend is renting out an illegal dwelling in his back garden. Im sure his neighbours are delighted.

Eric Cartman

listermint wrote: »

Lecturing....


give me a break will ya. and your friend is renting out an illegal dwelling in his back garden. Im sure his neighbours are delighted.

Unfortunately it will take somebodys death as a result of the almost certainly illegal electrical connections most of those cabins have to actually force a change.

In this specific case the OP will likely build in a field, apply for a utility service and when the company goes to update their map / right of ways for it the planning people will figure it out and move the OP on before power is even turned on.

Macy0161

Can't comment on the specific options, but when I was looking for a workshop/ shed, the commercial steel shed options didn't really give a greater life expectancy than (maintained) wood. Any nicks/ damage to steel are basically as susceptible to rust as wood is to rotting in this climate (well that's what my research at the time told me).

banie01

alejandro1977 wrote: »

how warm is the utility room part? Is it damp at all in winter?
More importantly, how much of a pain is it for you (and your spouse) to run out in the rain to put a wash on?
I'm in favour of this as I want to keep damp clothes out of the house but the wife isn't sold...

The shed has Insulation both the Kingspan 50mm panels supplied by Steeltech and a further 125mm of Rockwool between that and the plasterboard.
It is very cosy, the garden room is 5mtr x 5mtr and very adequately heated by a 2kw heater and retains heat very well.
Humidity is currently at 59% in the shed versus 43% in my house.
This is due to the very very new concrete slab. I have a few humidity traps out there but will be running a dehumidifier in there soon for a couple of weeks to bring it down further.
As for the rain, she wanted the machines out of the Kitchen so she got them in the shed been out there a year now and TBH with the bonus quiet in the house, rain isnt an issue.

listermint wrote: »

Are you living it in, And using it as a permanent home?
Lets not sugar coat this process to the OP.
Because at this point they believe they've suddenly cracked the system!
Or is it just a shed as per its intended construction

Oh god no, I'm not living in it and wouldnt.
I have slept out there a couple of times after a night on the beer

Look the OP is letting himself in for a whole world of litigation and enforcement action.
There is no way I know of that either the log cabin option or the Steeltech shed option will meet building regs for a habitable structure.
Its not something I'd recommend or condone.

cnocbui

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Unfortunately it will take somebodys death as a result of the almost certainly illegal electrical connections most of those cabins have to actually force a change.

In this specific case the OP will likely build in a field, apply for a utility service and when the company goes to update their map / right of ways for it the planning people will figure it out and move the OP on before power is even turned on.

What exactly do you believe is the problem with having electricity supplied to a log cabin?

Sleeper12

listermint wrote:

give me a break will ya. and your friend is renting out an illegal dwelling in his back garden. Im sure his neighbours are delighted.

I'm answering the OP's question. Op stated they know that they won't get planning for it as a dwelling but wanted advice on the actual structure itself.

I gave advice on the structure. I could equally have truthfully said that another friend has one with full planning permission as an office. It is genuinely used as an office & only an office but it also has a toilet /shower room and a kitchen. He also finds it very comfortable and easy to heat. He has never commented on condensation so I don't know if he had any issues. His cabin is also 10 years old and supplied by the same company. So far he has no issues with the wood in the Irish climate.

JimmyMW

banie01 wrote: »

The shed has Insulation both the Kingspan 50mm panels supplied by Steeltech and a further 125mm of Rockwool between that and the plasterboard.
It is very cosy, the garden room is 5mtr x 5mtr and very adequately heated by a 2kw heater and retains heat very well.
Humidity is currently at 59% in the shed versus 43% in my house.
This is due to the very very new concrete slab. I have a few humidity traps out there but will be running a dehumidifier in there soon for a couple of weeks to bring it down further.
As for the rain, she wanted the machines out of the Kitchen so she got them in the shed been out there a year now and TBH with the bonus quiet in the house, rain isnt an issue.



Oh god no, I'm not living in it and wouldnt.
I have slept out there a couple of times after a night on the beer

Look the OP is letting himself in for a whole world of litigation and enforcement action.
There is no way I know of that either the log cabin option or the Steeltech shed option will meet building regs for a habitable structure.
Its not something I'd recommend or condone.

Interested in a shed myself maybe next year and would like to insulate the floor, however the steel tech details would have massive thermal bridging. Did you insulate the floor of yours and if so did you get around the thermal bridging?

Sleeper12

Eric Cartman wrote:

Unfortunately it will take somebodys death as a result of the almost certainly illegal electrical connections most of those cabins have to actually force a change.

All of the ones or at least most of the ones I have seen have power brought out from the house the same way you might do with a granny flat. The electrical work would usually be done by a registered electrical contractor.

banie01

JimmyMW wrote: »

Interested in a shed myself maybe next year and would like to insulate the floor, however the steel tech details would have massive thermal bridging. Did you insulate the floor of yours and if so did you get around the thermal bridging?

Thermal bridging in a room for occasional use was not really an issue for me, but as per my PM
reply to you the last time floor insulation was discussed. Yes I did.

listermint

Sleeper12 wrote: »

I'm answering the OP's question. Op stated they know that they won't get planning for it as a dwelling but wanted advice on the actual structure itself.

I gave advice on the structure. I could equally have truthfully said that another friend has one with full planning permission as an office. It is genuinely used as an office & only an office but it also has a toilet /shower room and a kitchen. He also finds it very comfortable and easy to heat. He has never commented on condensation so I don't know if he had any issues. His cabin is also 10 years old and supplied by the same company. So far he has no issues with the wood in the Irish climate.

I see you cut out the lecturing comment i was replying too.

Why? because you said lecturing when people were giving the OP factual information before he spends Thousands upon thousands of his own money on something that would be ripped away from him.


Solid advice,

I could equally truthfully told them it would be grand sure. Do what ya like, its not my money.

Sleeper12

listermint wrote:

I see you cut out the lecturing comment i was replying too.

Well I thought it was obvious that many posters were lecturing op on planning when he wanted advice on the structure.

JimmyMW

banie01 wrote: »

Thermal bridging in a room for occasional use was not really an issue for me, but as per my PM
reply to you the last time floor insulation was discussed. Yes I did.

Sorry I taught my previous discussions via PM were with a different poster.

listermint

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Well I thought it was obvious that many posters were lecturing op on planning when he wanted advice on the structure.

Nah, your happy for the OP to be ill informed.

Its not your money sure why care.

Im afraid i take the opposite view. nothing new there so.

OP, my thinking would be that it's not a terrible idea. I presume you're sticking it in a back garden from a pre-existing (parents?) house? If so, you'll be able to piggyback on their electricity and water setups.


If you insist on taking this gamble, then go for it. Chances are the Council will never notice of their own accord, however, if a neighbour, passerby, etc. complains, you'll be in for a hiding from the Council. If no one complains, the Council will likely turn a blind eye. But if someone gets onto them,you are pretty much guaranteed that you'll have to demolish it.


So my thinking for you would be simply strip your budget down to nothingness. (although, if you've got €100k to spend, I'm sure you can get a mortgage on a house?). But if you insist on going this route, strip your budget down to 10-15k. 20k at most. Like making any gamble, be prepared to lose what you invest into it.

Don't build anything pretentious, tall, or house-like. The more shed-like and 'disguised' it is, the better off you'll be, long-term. You don't want anyone to even know it exists after it's been built.


I built a 4x5meter (well.. an 11x16ft) shed, with PVC window and doors. It cost me about €2,700. I spent about an extra 1,500 on insulating, plastering and wiring it up for electricity. I don't live in it, in fact it's rarely used, but I'd say you could build on the cheap with any old shed company, and then get a small time builder in to insulate and plaster (or DIY it if you fancy it.. insulating seems easy, its the plastering that is a skill). You could build one for a fraction of the cost, and if the CoCo tell you to bin it, at least you won't be as financially invested in it.

Make sure you put your neighbours first. They're the ones who can make or break it for you.

Sleeper12

listermint wrote:

Nah, your happy for the OP to be ill informed.

In the electrical form they warn once that only a registered electrical contractor can carry out work that a poster is planning on doing himself. After the one warning they give out advice to the poster telling them how to to the job.

OP was warned about the planning aspect and they acknowledged the advice. It's then time to answer the question on the construction that they asked about.

Maybe op should have posted in construction instead?

Graham

Mod Note

Thread closed.

1) Topic is more suited to construction and planning
2) Advice on avoiding/ignoring planning permission would be against the forum charter.