Creep feeding weanlings

Muckit

tellmeabit wrote: »

Thought some of the light while ch did ok. 280 kg bit of shape near 800€

That's what l was saying before. Why would lads be obsessed with getting weight on calves (worse still weight from creep) if you had them good quality and could get that money for them?

patsy_mccabe

You'd be doing well to get spring weanlings to eat 2 bags each. That's 15 euro each. It's more than putting condition on them. If they have good breeding, more muscle for example, this will show more with extra feeding. The protein in the meal will drive on their growth too.
I think feeding that small bit of meal costs nothing compared to the overall cost of keeping the cow, which could be close to 700 this year.

Bass Reeves

Muckit wrote: »

That's what l was saying before. Why would lads be obsessed with getting weight on calves (worse still weight from creep) if you had them good quality and could get that money for them?

Bull weanlings are very efficient converters for every 4kg fed of ration you get a kg weight. However you do not want to replace grass in the diet so a kg at the start building to three kgs over 50-60 days. If 50 kgs is a crunch and 50 kgs a good ration or nut it will cost in the region of 27-30 euro. That might take a bull like above to 300 kgs change his shape as well and him near a 900 euro price. TBH 280 kg weanlings is not a great return for a suckler cow.I see dairy bred calves exceeding that

charolais0153

A good bit of meal. 400kg 1070 average for my bull calves this year.
Versus no meal 280kg 800 for what could be one of your best calves.

Meal is a no brainer especially when you have quality.

patsy_mccabe

charolais0153 wrote: »

A good bit of meal. 400kg 1070 average for my bull calves this year.
Versus no meal 280kg 800 for what could be one of your best calves.

Meal is a no brainer especially when you have quality.

How much meal do you feed and for how long?

charolais0153

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

How much meal do you feed and for how long?

Started feeding on 23 jun or so. 250kgs each or thereabouts. Some calves prob ate close to 300 and others 200.

tellmeabit

charolais0153 wrote:

Started feeding on 23 jun or so. 250kgs each or thereabouts. Some calves prob ate close to 300 and others 200.

I've them on a dust of meal the last month. And does make a difference. Wean a few of then this week and bring the meal up. I'd say if i Can at all I'll hold on to what I can for winter. Maybe sell heifers not gone in calf. In stead. Prob keep heifers. Move bulls in spring. Few more trips to mart to get the eye in for the weights before final decision.

Hard Knocks

charolais0153 wrote: »

Started feeding on 23 jun or so. 250kgs each or thereabouts. Some calves prob ate close to 300 and others 200.

Which meal do you find best

charolais0153

Hard Knocks wrote: »

Which meal do you find best

Just an ordinary beef nut is most cost effective id say.

Bass Reeves

Hard Knocks wrote: »

Which meal do you find best

charolais0153 wrote: »

Just an ordinary beef nut is most cost effective id say.

You really only want crunch to start weanling eating ration. when 1-2 start eating the rest will start to come . A good quality nut or ration is always palatable. Cattle always find rations more interesting to eat. Big issue is keeping crows away if feeding in troughs. FIL always used to pour some molasses on top of the ration as it kept crows away. When you get them eating ration they stay eating it.

charolais0153

Bass Reeves wrote: »

You really only want crunch to start weanling eating ration. when 1-2 start eating the rest will start to come . A good quality nut or ration is always palatable. Cattle always find rations more interesting to eat. Big issue is keeping crows away if feeding in troughs. FIL always used to pour some molasses on top of the ration as it kept crows away. When you get them eating ration they stay eating it.

Feed ration as calves in shed. They know the story outside then

Hard Knocks

charolais0153 wrote: »

Feed ration as calves in shed. They know the story outside then

Trying calf grower & not happy with results for price.
Have a few April heifers I’m thinking of keeping
Any recommendations for a good nut / meal

patsy_mccabe

charolais0153 wrote: »

Feed ration as calves in shed. They know the story outside then

I do this as well. You only have to feed a little. They come for it quick then, when you feed them later in the year.

Bass Reeves

Hard Knocks wrote: »

Trying calf grower & not happy with results for price.
Have a few April heifers I’m thinking of keeping
Any recommendations for a good nut / meal

It is a matter of looking at the label on the bag. For weanlings you want a ration/nut that is 16%P at least. You want to see maize and barley as the main energy sources, hulls and beetpulp as the fibre source and soyabean meal or distillers as protein source. Rapeseed meal is grand as a P source if they will eat it but palatibilty is an issue. My own opinion is that buying a good finishing ration/nut is an option and buying soya bean meal to up the P. Adding about 1.5-2kgs of soya bean meal to a 13/14%P bag of finishing ration will up the P to above 16%.

blue5000

Mod Note; pulled a few posts from the mart price thread, as I reckon the subject deserves a thread of it's own.

Muckit

I suppose when l mentioned creeping, l was referring to heifer weanlings or bulls only good enoigh to be squeezed.

Bulls for bull beef are a different kettle of fish as they are going to continue to be pushed once they hit the shed by new owner, that l get and def think there is merit in it.

"Is there any benefit in creating a soft heifer weanling?" l suppose is what l should have said!!

Lady Haywire

Muckit wrote: »

I suppose when l mentioned creeping, l was referring to heifer weanlings or bulls only good enoigh to be squeezed.

Bulls for bull beef are a different kettle of fish as they are going to continue to be pushed once they hit the shed by new owner, that l get and def think there is merit in it.

"Is there any benefit in creating a soft heifer weanling?" l suppose is what l should have said!!

A good few of weanling heifers we sell are bought by the local butchers. Either that or lads who feed to slaughter. Only have one to sell this year as we had a 3/1 bulls/heifers this year. Good job we're not milking
This is our feed, 310 a tonne, though gone up now since we last got a pallet. It's expensive but I've seen a good few of our bulls go on to be finished as bull beef. Prefer to have them eating it anyway as unfed ones don't get looked at much around here.

charolais0153

Lady Haywire wrote: »

A god few of weanling heifers we sell are bought by the local butchers. Either that or lads who feed to slaughter. Only have one to sell this year as we had a 3/1 bulls/heifers this year. Good job we're not milking
This is our feed, 310 a tonne, though gone up now since we last got a pallet.

Looks a good one.

Lady Haywire

charolais0153 wrote: »

Looks a good one.

Stuck with them the last few years as we're happy with it, weanlings love it too. All of them now eating just under a bag a day, with the 4 older ones (including the orphan) prob eating a good chunk of that.

Muckit

Paul & Vincent always had a good name

milligan2

Ran out of grass here at the end of July coz of the drought, so I weaned the strong weanlings and left them in the shed for 5 weeks and fed them an 18% beef nut with soya meal with good hay.
They put on 2 kgs a day and I’ve never seen animals to thrive as well.I think having them in a pen helps a lot as they spend most of the day sleeping instead of dry bulling cows.

grange mac

Bought a few 320kg weanlings and as not set up for bulk went small bag route. Giving them a heifer nut which coming in at 20% protein 355 ton, beef nut was coming at 385 ton small bag. Only difference is nut is twice size but much better value. I only use bout 10t nut over winter so bag suits my circumstances.

Dunedin

grange mac wrote: »

Bought a few 320kg weanlings and as not set up for bulk went small bag route. Giving them a heifer nut which coming in at 20% protein 355 ton, beef nut was coming at 385 ton small bag. Only difference is nut is twice size but much better value. I only use bout 10t nut over winter so bag suits my circumstances.

Who are you getting the 20% nut from

blue5000

Using bull finisher ration here with a small bit of soya added to bring up the protein. Is the P&V ration above printed properly? They have soya as the first ingredient, but it's only 17% protein.

Soya is expensive this year, we're paying €11 a 25 kg bag which works out at €440 a ton.



Bull ration label, sorry about the brown stripe, it really is BS:rolleyes: second ingredient is rolled barley.

Bass Reeves

blue5000 wrote: »

Using bull finisher ration here with a small bit of soya added to bring up the protein. Is the P&V ration above printed properly? They have soya as the first ingredient, but it's only 17% protein.

Soya is expensive this year, we're paying €11 a 25 kg bag which works out at €440 a ton.



Bull ration label, sorry about the brown stripe, it really is BS:rolleyes: second ingredient is rolled barley.

Soya was 11.50-12 euro last year but it is over prices this year I saw bulk prices export of 350/ton so 2.25/bag to transport and bag seems excessive. Yes the P&V label is wrong soyabean can be the latest ingredient as there is other protein sources on the label as well. That is a good ration you are feeding there soya with that would really drive on young cattle

grange mac

Dunedin wrote: »

Who are you getting the 20% nut from

In west cork,Barratt Agri...who in turn get it from Southern Milling in Cork.

charolais0153

Bass Reeves wrote: »

Soya was 11.50-12 euro last year but it is over prices this year I saw bulk prices export of 350/ton so 2.25/bag to transport and bag seems excessive. Yes the P&V label is wrong soyabean can be the latest ingredient as there is other protein sources on the label as well. That is a good ration you are feeding there soya with that would really drive on young cattle

Thered more molasses than soya bean tho

Lady Haywire

blue5000 wrote: »

Using bull finisher ration here with a small bit of soya added to bring up the protein. Is the P&V ration above printed properly? They have soya as the first ingredient, but it's only 17% protein.

It's most likely wrong way round with the barley- they have a strange way of designing labels! Though it it's dehulled & in meal what difference would it make? just that they specifically say dehulled & then hulls further down the list.

Water John

Southern Milling always had good rations too, grange mac. Barrett Agri is owned by Southern Fuels.
Barretts were always easy people to deal with.

Bass Reeves

Lady Haywire wrote: »

It's most likely wrong way round with the barley- they have a strange way of designing labels! Though it it's dehulled & in meal what difference would it make? just that they specifically say dehulled & then hulls further down the list.

It means that it is soya bean meal. The hulls off soya are an excellent fibre source especially at grass.

blue5000

Lady Haywire wrote: »

It's most likely wrong way round with the barley- they have a strange way of designing labels! Though it it's dehulled & in meal what difference would it make? just that they specifically say dehulled & then hulls further down the list.

The ingredients are meant to be in decreasing order by weight, in your ration soya bean de-hulled is the first ingredient listed. As Bass says there is other protein sources (rapeseed and maize gluten) further down the list than soya bean meal.

TooOldBoots

I'm only starting to creep feed now. Planning on Weaning in the next week, I will house the Weanlens from Nov - mid Feb. Thats 3 months+ or roughly 100 days of feeding. Weanlens are an average of 280kg.
I have good silage or Hay but at what rate and what type of Meal to push them over 400kg in the 100 days?

Dunedin

grange mac wrote: »

In west cork,Barratt Agri...who in turn get it from Southern Milling in Cork.

How much a ton is it.

Hard Knocks

blue5000 wrote: »

Using bull finisher ration here with a small bit of soya added to bring up the protein. Is the P&V ration above printed properly? They have soya as the first ingredient, but it's only 17% protein.

Soya is expensive this year, we're paying €11 a 25 kg bag which works out at €440 a ton.



Bull ration label, sorry about the brown stripe, it really is BS:rolleyes: second ingredient is rolled barley.

Think my calves are fed up with their meal.
Can you get P&V bull finisher by the pallet?

Has anyone used Pattons?

Lady Haywire

blue5000 wrote: »

The ingredients are meant to be in decreasing order by weight, in your ration soya bean de-hulled is the first ingredient listed. As Bass says there is other protein sources (rapeseed and maize gluten) further down the list than soya bean meal.

I'll have to ask Sean when he calls for the moolah. He'll know!

Hard Knocks wrote: »

Think my calves are fed up with their meal.
Can you get P&V bull finisher by the pallet?

Has anyone used Pattons?

P & V do everything by the pallet, will even do half pallets if you ask very nicely. No exp with Pattons, used Kiernans nuts for weanlings a few years ago, wasn't as happy with thrive tbh.

bogman_bass

Bass Reeves wrote: »

You really only want crunch to start weanling eating ration. when 1-2 start eating the rest will start to come . A good quality nut or ration is always palatable. Cattle always find rations more interesting to eat. Big issue is keeping crows away if feeding in troughs. FIL always used to pour some molasses on top of the ration as it kept crows away. When you get them eating ration they stay eating it.

I used to think that but then found that calves were always starting on nuts better than ration

hempel

Weaned ours today any1 recommend a mix for pedigree angus bulls and herifers. Or would a 16% beef ration do fine.