NBA Regular Season & Playoffs 2018-19 Thread

leggo

leggo wrote: »

I think Golden State win tonight with Klay back. They’re going to step up because they have to and I don’t see Toronto being able to perform with the same intensity as Wednesday when they would’ve went into these road games knowing a split would’ve been a success. I hope we get my “Toronto go 3-1 up then KD comes back” scenario though for entertainment purposes.

3 mins in and already feel great about this prediction with how Toronto are shooting to start!

Carcharodon

Very scrappy opening, game should settle soon, both teams playing loose

Johny Cage

This is Kawhi vs the warriors. His teammates need to start making some shots.

Carcharodon

Warriors should be up by 10, Raptors will be ecstatic with that score line

leggo

Toronto doing to Golden State what was done to them in the 3rd quarter of Game 2! Madness!

Carcharodon

I suppose if we have to lose to any team, I would rather lose to Toronto, they deserve this. Warriors just not clicking, small spurts here and there, they haven’t caught a break and have made poor in game decisions

Legion.

ONE WIN AWAY BABY. THE BOARD MAN GETS PAID

Carcharodon

Durant better man up and get back playing...lol.
Warriors have run out of steam I think, reshuffle for next year and go back at it.
Hopefully Warriors come out like a wounded animal in the next game to make things interesting
Toronto are funny, they have been totally overlooked, even in the East but have gone about their business and took advantage of Warriors injuries.

Hitch2222

It's been phenomenal so far especially given the performance the Warriors gave last night by their stars was not bad at all, the Raptors were simply great.

Not to throw any negative spin on this as such but the game last night above all others thus far must put to bed any narrative that the Warriors are better without KD.

Moreover without being supercritical because he's played well, it once again raises the question of how auspicious Stephs game is in the playoffs.
As I said in the last round, there was no better team for Steph to shine against than the Trailblazers but the Raptors are a completely different animal.
I'm not saying Steph hasn't played well or he's not great but I just don't think he has shown thus far that he can be the most important player when a championship is on the line.

leggo

I agree that the Warriors have their numbers. It’s starting to feel like the Spurs/Heat series that finished off the LeBron Heat where the Warriors just have no answer. They desperately need Durant back or I feel this is over on Monday.

The mad thing is that it’s Durant who can save them but it’s bringing Durant in that perhaps cost them too. Gutting their squad and making it so top heavy robbed them of the overwhelming depth that made them so dominant in the Splash Brother era, whereas now without him they look so threadbare. I wouldn’t be so harsh on Curry and see this as a damning indictment on his position as a game-changer (same way we didn’t hold it against LBJ when the Cavs/Heat fell short). He’s doing his job (although he did have an off-night from 3 last night), he’s just trying to do it against a fully healthy, clicking unit and I think it’s illustrating, yet again, that in today’s NBA just having the best players on the court isn’t enough.

Carcharodon

Hitch2222 wrote: »

It's been phenomenal so far especially given the performance the Warriors gave last night by their stars was not bad at all, the Raptors were simply great.

Not to throw any negative spin on this as such but the game last night above all others thus far must put to bed any narrative that the Warriors are better without KD.

Moreover without being supercritical because he's played well, it once again raises the question of how auspicious Stephs game is in the playoffs.
As I said in the last round, there was no better team for Steph to shine against than the Trailblazers but the Raptors are a completely different animal.
I'm not saying Steph hasn't played well or he's not great but I just don't think he has shown thus far that he can be the most important player when a championship is on the line.

What a load of nonsense, I hate these kind of comments, it’s like a passive aggressive way of having a dig at Curry. The mans game obviously has flaws, every player does but to knit pick a 2 time MVP with multiple championships doesn’t make any sense to me, I’d love to know what you would do ?? Trade him, give me a break, there are very few players better than him out there, the likes of Kawhai are pretty rare, plus Curry is an exceptional team player and ambassador for the Warriors.
I really don’t get your point, sometimes teams and player get beat by a better team or player in that given time, that’s sports, that’s life, there will always be a loser

Being a huge fan of pretty much all sports, when I visited the US when I was younger I wished so badly that I could be living in a city when it wins a championship. Not just winning it but the process of winning it.

Luckily, I get to live in this absolutely fantastic city albeit not in the US (but probably a good thing at this point!) and experience this. I can't put into words the buzz that has enveloped the place really since the 76ers series but it has obviously amped up as it has gone on. I cannot imagine what is going to happen if they win but still work to do! 2016 if we need any reminder of what can happen!

Whatever happens, this has just been 2 of the best months of my life! Love this team and these guys so much

*not forgetting Toronto FC championship in 2017 but it is not a 'big 4' sport. It was great though!

LuckyLloyd

When you have two of your starting five injured during or for a long stretch before the finals it hobbles you. I’ve obviously never been a GS fan, but the injuries are killing them here. Steph is having a good series - the roster was not built for him to carry it. If KD and Cousins leave in the summer they will tailor it differently and maybe in some hypothetical future playoffs you might have a different conversation.

On the other hand, Toronto won’t care about how the title is viewed, nor should they! They did a magnificent job chasing a perceived championship window last summer and have reaped just rewards.

This is why they play the games at the end of the day. The injuries gave Toronto an opening and they’ve stormed through it.

Hitch2222

Carcharodon wrote: »

What a load of nonsense, I hate these kind of comments, it’s like a passive aggressive way of having a dig at Curry. The mans game obviously has flaws, every player does but to knit pick a 2 time MVP with multiple championships doesn’t make any sense to me, I’d love to know what you would do ?? Trade him, give me a break, there are very few players better than him out there, the likes of Kawhai are pretty rare, plus Curry is an exceptional team player and ambassador for the Warriors.
I really don’t get your point, sometimes teams and player get beat by a better team or player in that given time, that’s sports, that’s life, there will always be a loser

It's not passive aggressive and it's not a sly dig by any means, if you take a look back through my previous posts, I'm very consistent in my opinion about Steph, when Butters shared those numbers about GSW being better without KD, I held my hands up and I consistently say he's brilliant because he is but his game is not as effective in the post season as it is in the regular season.
Albeit different in my many facets, its similar for Harden, Steph is a minus defender by BPM this post season.
He's unbelievable offensively but defensively he guards the 3rd-5th option through no fault of his own.

Curry's shortcomings imo are largely insurmountable and confined to the defensive end most glaringly lack of size to defend multiple positions, overall strength, lateral quickness, explosiveness among others, all of which he either can't help or by trying to improve he may hinder the best of his game by slowing down through additional strength for example.

With all due respect, I think you're responding a tad irrationally because they're your team. I'm not remotely suggesting trade Steph or Steph isn't unbelievable because he is as I've always said but his game is not as conducive to success in the post season as it is in regular season.
His defensive frailties are very evident most of all during the playoffs.

It's a far critique and tbf it's one I haven't wavered from so it's not being said now because the Raptors are 3-1 up

leggo

But Steph’s defence also hasn’t been detrimental to Golden State either. He’s a speedy point guard and elite shooter, that’s his game, he’s never been a top defensive option and GSW won three championships with that being the case. So to bring it up now as a criticism to explain why they’re losing in this series is a bit random. It’d be like me slating Draymond for not hitting 3’s on the same level as Steph and Klay...it’s not his job and him not doing so doesn’t swing a single game/series against the Dubs in the slightest! But that doesn’t mean he’s not an elite player.

Hitch2222

leggo wrote: »

But Steph’s defence also hasn’t been detrimental to Golden State either. He’s a speedy point guard and elite shooter, that’s his game, he’s never been a top defensive option and GSW won three championships with that being the case. So to bring it up now as a criticism to explain why they’re losing in this series is a bit random. It’d be like me slating Draymond for not hitting 3’s on the same level as Steph and Klay...it’s not his job and him not doing so doesn’t swing a single game/series against the Dubs in the slightest! But that doesn’t mean he’s not an elite player.

Can you highlight the part where I said GSW are losing because Steph isn't a good defender?
I never said that he wasn't an elite player I've actually said the opposite.
Also, defending is his job like it is every other player, it's not his primary skill but he's a poorer defender than most elite players and that frailty is more evident in the post season, that's my point.

Carcharodon

Hitch2222 wrote: »

It's not passive aggressive and it's not a sly dig by any means, if you take a look back through my previous posts, I'm very consistent in my opinion about Steph, when Butters shared those numbers about GSW being better without KD, I held my hands up and I consistently say he's brilliant because he is but his game is not as effective in the post season as it is in the regular season.
Albeit different in my many facets, its similar for Harden, Steph is a minus defender by BPM this post season.
He's unbelievable offensively but defensively he guards the 3rd-5th option through no fault of his own.

Curry's shortcomings imo are largely insurmountable and confined to the defensive end most glaringly lack of size to defend multiple positions, overall strength, lateral quickness, explosiveness among others, all of which he either can't help or by trying to improve he may hinder the best of his game by slowing down through additional strength for example.

With all due respect, I think you're responding a tad irrationally because they're your team. I'm not remotely suggesting trade Steph or Steph isn't unbelievable because he is as I've always said but his game is not as conducive to success in the post season as it is in regular season.
His defensive frailties are very evident most of all during the playoffs.

It's a far critique and tbf it's one I haven't wavered from so it's not being said now because the Raptors are 3-1 up

Iam definitely a little irrational after losing but I consider myself an extremely rational and logical thinking person in regards to sports.
I find these types of discussions more in line with something you would find on a bad US sports show, just throwing something out there for the sake of it
His game isn’t as effective in post season, ok, let’s say it’s not, what’s the actual point, multiple championships would counter that but a lot of players stats suffer in post season, especially players like steph, he has always been a poor defender, I don’t think he is that terrible but he can be pretty poor at times.
I just don’t see the relevance, we could be here all day and night if we pointed out players weaknesses.
Obviously part of basketball is to analyze pros and cons of players and look at why a team lost but to single out a player like Curry repeatedly for being better in reg season than post is a bit irrelevant, even more so since the whole team is struggling

Hitch2222

Carcharodon wrote: »

Iam definitely a little irrational after losing but I consider myself an extremely rational and logical thinking person in regards to sports.
I find these types of discussions more in line with something you would find on a bad US sports show, just throwing something out there for the sake of it
His game isn’t as effective in post season, ok, let’s say it’s not, what’s the actual point, multiple championships would counter that but a lot of players stats suffer in post season, especially players like steph, he has always been a poor defender, I don’t think he is that terrible but he can be pretty poor at times.
I just don’t see the relevance, we could be here all day and night if we pointed out players weaknesses.
Obviously part of basketball is to analyze pros and cons of players and look at why a team lost but to single out a player like Curry repeatedly for being better in reg season than post is a bit irrelevant, even more so since the whole team is struggling

I think you're pretty rational too but I also think I am too tbh. If you felt my points regarding Curry were irrelevant you could have flagged them earlier as being nonsensical because they're consistent and not made in response to the current situation but rather I'm highlighting them again because I think they're pertinent.

You feel multiple championships exonerates any potential shortcomings Steph has in the post season, I disagree as imo, he's never been the most important player in any championship campaign. He may have been their best player but not the most important in crunch time.
The difference between Steph/Harden/Lillard and LBJ/Durant/Kawhi/PG13 is that when the game is on the line one group have the ability to win it on both ends while another does not.

IMO the other superstars mentioned above that are better 2 way players are closer to Steph from an offensive perspective than Steph is to them from a defensive perspective.
Some of that is not his fault but it's still a difference, a difference that becomes more important during the playoffs.

Imo highlighting that Steph doesn't have the defensive chops of many of his fellow superstar contemporaries is a fair critique.

Just rewatching the game. I don't know the stats and could be wrong but it felt like the refs kept their whistles in their pocket a lot which is great! Game 3 was unwatchable at times I felt with the refs constantly getting involved. When basketball flows it is just a treat to watch

Carcharodon

Hitch2222 wrote: »

I think you're pretty rational too but I also think I am too tbh. If you felt my points regarding Curry were irrelevant you could have flagged them earlier as being nonsensical because they're consistent and not made in response to the current situation but rather I'm highlighting them again because I think they're pertinent.

You feel multiple championships exonerates any potential shortcomings Steph has in the post season, I disagree as imo, he's never been the most important player in any championship campaign. He may have been their best player but not the most important in crunch time.
The difference between Steph/Harden/Lillard and LBJ/Durant/Kawhi/PG13 is that when the game is on the line one group have the ability to win it on both ends while another does not.

IMO the other superstars mentioned above that are better 2 way players are closer to Steph from an offensive perspective than Steph is to them from a defensive perspective.
Some of that is not his fault but it's still a difference, a difference that becomes more important during the playoffs.

Imo highlighting that Steph doesn't have the defensive chops of many of his fellow superstar contemporaries is a fair critique.

Yea, totally get your points but I would disagree in some regards, we are probably closer in our views that it may seem.
We probably just come at things from a different angle.
Iam not a huge stat guy, I find people get too bogged down in them at times and don’t see the things you can’t measure.
For me, Curry set down a benchmark of excellence both on and off the court, this may not be as prevalent in the post season in your opinion but it still sets a tone for this team to carry into playoffs.
It’s fine that you think he has not been the most important player in any of his multiple championship campaigns, and that’s probably fine with him too, that may be the quality you fail to see and can’t measure on a stat sheet.

Oh, Paul George....honestly don’t see him in that league of players, I like him but not yet for me.

ButtersSuki

Haven’t posted this week as I’m travelling and struggling for free time. Sad to see the series being affected so much as it is by injury but fair play to the Raptors, I didn’t see them up 3-1 by any means. Think it’s 4-1 now tbh, regardless of whether KD comes back or not. Toronto just gave too much length for GS, esp. defensively. Reminds me of the OKC team that should have beaten GS in 2016 tbh.

Sad also to see the Steph dissing continuing, the PG in particular going too far. “Playoff P” has had some incredible performances in the last 2 play offs....incredibly bad ones. 5 points in an elimination game, his D on Lillard spring to mind. Too tired to post more, will revisit later this week.

Hitch2222

Carcharodon wrote: »

Yea, totally get your points but I would disagree in some regards, we are probably closer in our views that it may seem.
We probably just come at things from a different angle.
Iam not a huge stat guy, I find people get too bogged down in them at times and don’t see the things you can’t measure.
For me, Curry set down a benchmark of excellence both on and off the court, this may not be as prevalent in the post season in your opinion but it still sets a tone for this team to carry into playoffs.
It’s fine that you think he has not been the most important player in any of his multiple championship campaigns, and that’s probably fine with him too, that may be the quality you fail to see and can’t measure on a stat sheet.

Oh, Paul George....honestly don’t see him in that league of players, I like him but not yet for me.

I was quite literally going to say the same thing last night, we're pretty close in opinion, as you said, its angles.
TBH I think if you look at my posts and the frequency of positive to critical of Steph, you might conclude I'm too critical but I don't mean to be.

I was just highlighting that BPM as an example, I haven't looked closely but I feel the same about lots of stellar offensive players over the past few years, Lillard & IT are two that spring to mind.

I feel Steph has done more with his natural physical abilities than most players. He represents everything that GSW is and wants to be from the perspective of attitude and playing style.
He's arguably their most important player most of the time, their best player a large proportion of the time too but I just think the amount of players who win Finals MVP without being close to the best defender on their team is few and far between.

Just mentioned PG13 because he was pretty much Top 3 or so in both MVP & defensive POY this year.

We'll leave it there, as I said not my intention to slate Steph at all, its just how I've viewed him (& many other offensive centric guards) for years now.

Carcharodon

Kevin Durant questionable for tomorrow’s game, I think it should be...Kevin Durant questionable for Warriors next season.

I saw a funny post about Leonard on Twitter, something like, Leonard’s family doesn’t even know he plays in the NBA, just comes home like it was a normal day at work, it’s funny because you can totally see that, I’ve never seen a player like him

simongurnick

Carcharodon wrote: »

Kevin Durant questionable for tomorrow’s game, I think it should be...Kevin Durant questionable for Warriors next season.

I saw a funny post about Leonard on Twitter, something like, Leonard’s family doesn’t even know he plays in the NBA, just comes home like it was a normal day at work, it’s funny because you can totally see that, I’ve never seen a player like him

Yeah. I saw one the other day that said " after the game kawhi threw on his sweats and popped back home to unpause that episode of everybody loves raymond he had been watching.

Angliru

He's one of a kind. Rachel Nichols continues to be the biggest idiot with a voice in the sport, that interview could have been so great if she wasn't trying to dig for juicy clickbait and things the meme kids will like. Between that and the draft disaster she's really dropped whatever standards she had for broadcasting.

I do enjoy whenever this meme is reposted though

ButtersSuki

Angliru wrote: »

He's one of a kind. Rachel Nichols continues to be the biggest idiot with a voice in the sport, that interview could have been so great if she wasn't trying to dig for juicy clickbait and things the meme kids will like. Between that and the draft disaster she's really dropped whatever standards she had for broadcasting.

The Jump and any time I've ever seen her on TV are truly painful viewing. That said, she's been on The Lowe Post and the Windhorst Pod a few times and in fairness she's been an awful lot better on both. Maybe she should just do radio/pods instead of TV? I know this isn't the most PC thing to say but I doubt she'd have the gig she has if she was a man...........


Took Toronto -11.5 tonight, I just can't see them losing tbh.

Angliru

Bah God that's Kevin Durant's music!

It'll be interesting to see if he actually gets some minutes.

ButtersSuki

Oh and Tony Parker retired.

Hitch2222

Ah stop Butters, no need for that jazz. I genuinely quite like her. I love seeing her, Candace Parker and others voicing their opinion.

Taking the position of "wouldn't have the job if she was a man" is similar to those critiquing running the WNBA at a loss when the WNBA is asking for higher salaries.

Creating a situation of equal outcome in the short term is a worthwhile endeavor in order to put commentators and the sport in general on an equal footing with men. It's a long term investment.

Its worked incredibly well in tennis for example and I genuinely like hearing their opinion.

Blinky Plebum

Hitch2222 wrote: »

Ah stop Butters, no need for that jazz. I genuinely quite like her. I love seeing her, Candace Parker and others voicing their opinion.

Taking the position of "wouldn't have the job if she was a man" is similar to those critiquing running the WNBA at a loss when the WNBA is asking for higher salaries.

Creating a situation of equal outcome in the short term is a worthwhile endeavor in order to put commentators and the sport in general on an equal footing with men. It's a long term investment.

Its worked incredibly well in tennis for example and I genuinely like hearing their opinion.

Womens tennis was much bigger in the 1990's when they didn't earn as much as the men, the equal pay for the 4 grand slams hasn't really increased the popularity of women's tennis it just helps the female players earn more money.

What other business in the world would employers ask for higher salaries when your business is making a loss and why should people invest in a business that is loss making, if the NBA wants to take money out of the players proportion of the NBA revenue to prop up the WNBA then fair enough but if I was an investor there is no way I'd be happy having my money being used to prop up a loss making enterprise.

Athletes in numerous other sports have to accept not being paid any big money because there sport doesn't generate huge revenues why is there an expectation that because the male equivalent sport makes money they must prop up the paying of salaries in the female equivalent professional sport.It might be a nice thing to do but it shouldn't be expected and I can understand why investors would be opposed to their money being used for an unprofitable venture.

It may not be fair on women that they don't have the same earning capacity as men when it comes to the vast majority of sports however male models don't earn the same as their female equivalent and nobody cares about that, almost all of the top luxury fashion brands are for women and nobody complains about that either.