A question for the diesel drivers out there

NIMAN

The next time you come to change your car, are you thinking of getting away from diesel or sticking with it?

I may be changing soon, and was seriously considering a petrol car next time, as I assumed the Government were going to start hammering the diesel owners.

But they got off in the Budget just passed. The tax of diesel unchanged, no change to road tax etc.

I guess if you do massive miles then diesel is still the answer. I think I do approx 12500+ miles per year/20000km. Most of this is in top gear, straight roads, no stop/start driving. For me the 10c difference per litre combined with the lower MPG off a petrol car would make driving a fair bit more costly.

But my dilemma now is if I change to another diesel and then come to change in 3 or 4 years, how saleable will it be? Perhaps now is the time to ditch the diesel and take the hit?

omri

I sometimes feel as if everyone was forgetting about vast fleets of trucks, busses and other heavy duty machinery thats running on diesel 24/7 more or less. And yet probably due to sheer amount of private cars theyre the one melting north/south poles...

NIMAN

omri wrote: »

I sometimes feel as if everyone was forgetting about vast fleets of trucks, busses and other heavy duty machinery thats running on diesel 24/7 more or less. And yet probably due to sheer amount of private cars theyre the one melting north/south poles...

Appreciate that, but the Gov's of the world will be able to hit diesel cars without hitting those vehicles if they want to.

doolox

I bought a VW Passat estate three yrs ago and I love it. I am fed up with small cars which I had before and I was able to afford a proper car for the first time in my life due to a legacy I received.

I would not contemplate electric cars and I would not go back to petrol as it is too dear and big ones are taxed too heavily.


So diesel it is. Good man Rudolf........

omri

NIMAN wrote: »

Appreciate that, but the Gov's of the world will be able to hit diesel cars without hitting those vehicles if they want to.

I’m sure they can and maybe they will. But how hard do they need to penalize diesel owners to actually make people mass ditch diesels in day a years time?

There was a talk about how in this budget they didn’t save the planet through roughly €5-€10 per tonne? in carbon tax. And it made me thinking how is that supposed to be eco friendly measure if diesel went up 3-4 cents up. We experienced higher increases of fuel prices in last decade and people didn’t stop using cars.

I do feel a bit guilty these days driving the car but without some serious shift in thinking of entire nations and governments and maybe moving to EVs or bicycles there’s not much going to happen when teslas are 100k+ and leafs are still short range and rather expensive.

My only guess is that hitting diesel owners with extra tax might force people who can barely afford their cars right now from owning them.

Kevin Finnerty

It's all about the votes. 2020 is too near to be pissing off the electorate.
Away from politics, I'm seriously gonna consider petrol or electric next time I change, options now are advanced so much on 5 years ago.

colm_mcm

Surely pushing people back to petrol will mess up our co2 targets?

NIMAN

I also own an EV btw, and would like to think that moving to a petrol or petrol/hybrid might be a good idea next time I change, but to do it means that it'll increase my running costs a fair bit.

I guess the fundamental question here is "will my diesel car have any resale value in X number of years".

There is some talk already that dealers are offering lower trade-in figures on diesel cars. Not sure how true it is, maybe they are just using it to screw the customer?

Have to remember of course that the vast majority of Irish cars bought in the last 10-15 years have been diesel, so there will be a lot of them in the market for a long time.

Blazer

colm_mcm wrote: »

Surely pushing people back to petrol will mess up our co2 targets?

I wouldn't worry about it,,,we're already nearly past the point of no return.
It doesn't matter what a country like Ireland does when India,China etc are all heavily polluting in thousands of multiples over us. Add to that when other 3rd world countries get more industrialized and its really just a lesson in futility.
It will require a catastrophic event before governments wake up and realise how bad it really is and then you'll see the **** hit the fan.
Until then its just a token effort.

nice_guy80

bought a diesel yesterday

viva la diesel!

Atlantic Dawn

If they got everyone to just eat meat once a week we could drive whatever we like.

nc6000

Why do people suggest you need to be doing big mileage to need a diesel? I've a three and a bit year old diesel which doesn't even have 60K KMs on it.

uck51js9zml2yt

nice_guy80 wrote: »

bought a diesel yesterday

viva la diesel!

I bet you ... Bought one on Thursday

omri

nc6000 wrote: »

Why do people suggest you need to be doing big mileage to need a diesel? I've a three and a bit year old diesel which doesn't even have 60K KMs on it.

Which is apparently bad thing to have a diesel that's doing little milage. Presumably because of the DPF getting clogged if not enough motorway miles are being done on a regular basis (yet I believe from what I heard big trucks have a passive DPF cleaning technology) and maybe also that not enough driving does not allow the oil to heat up enough to get rid of mainly water to evaporate. Most of my knowledge comes from autoexpert.com.au on youtube though, so don't quote me on that

The J Stands for Jay

colm_mcm wrote: »

Surely pushing people back to petrol will mess up our co2 targets?

It would easily be offset by everyone having one vegan meal a week.

nc6000

omri wrote: »

Which is apparently bad thing to have a diesel that's doing little milage. Presumably because of the DPF getting clogged if not enough motorway miles are being done on a regular basis (yet I believe from what I heard big trucks have a passive DPF cleaning technology) and maybe also that not enough driving does not allow the oil to heat up enough to get rid of mainly water to evaporate. Most of my knowledge comes from autoexpert.com.au on youtube though, so don't quote me on that

I guess a lot of my trips would be short enough but if I'm going anywhere which isn't relatively local then it's at least a 30 min spin on the motorway each way.

Paullimerick

I'd love a EV or a hybrid. But at the moment I got a 9 seater which is needed and don't see them bringing out one that I won't have to have plugged in constantly between drives. Now I may be wrong. But EV works best with a very aerodynamical car. And a 9 seater is far from one of them.

dudara

I’ll be moving away from diesel, mainly because I don’t like the sound of the engine. It’s a great car, plenty of go, but I still think “tractor” whenever I turn on the ignition. I know most people will drop diesel due to tax, mileage or emission concerns. For me, it’s the sound of the engine.

Don’t think I’m ready to go full electric yet, but will probably be looking at a petrol hybrid. I think we'll make the change soon, probably next year, while there is still a good resale value in the car. I am a little concerned that value of diesels will fall badly.

Mooooo

If they do change anything it is likely to be via vrt or road tax on new registrations from a certain date imo. A lot of the narrative 're current cars is overhyped I think

rovertom

nc6000 wrote: »

Why do people suggest you need to be doing big mileage to need a diesel? I've a three and a bit year old diesel which doesn't even have 60K KMs on it.

It's a funny one actually. In times gone by, diesel cars were much more expensive that petrol ones so you really had to do a fair mileage just to make it work cost wise. As petrol became less favourable, the diesel residuals became so much better than anyone could drive a diesel regardless of mileage as you would get your extra outlay back come trade in time. Then in 08, the diesel cars became cheaper than petrol to buy. That made it a no brainer. Cheap to buy, cheap to fuel and good trade in.
The only snag is that the current diesels need regular good long runs to keep them right meaning it brings us back to only getting a diesel if your usage suits it or else it could become troublesome and expensive.

Water John

Have a diesel ATM plus OH has EV. The main problem with the diesel is not the CO2+ gases, its the particle matter. This is about polluting our locality. Just think of all of them dropping the kids to school and idling outside it.

Belfast

omri wrote: »

I sometimes feel as if everyone was forgetting about vast fleets of trucks, busses and other heavy duty machinery thats running on diesel 24/7 more or less. And yet probably due to sheer amount of private cars theyre the one melting north/south poles...

Trucks and Buses can use CNG

Clean Ireland are the first waste management company in the country to introduce CNG powered vehicles in partnership with Gas Networks Ireland. Clean Ireland already have two CNG powered vehicles on the road with more to be introduced
https://www.cleanireland.ie/article/77

“The government has taken the opportunity to promote the transition from an over reliance on diesel in the commercial fleet sector to more environmentally friendly alternative fuels, such as compressed natural gas (CNG). The announcement of a new capital allowance scheme for gas-propelled vehicles and refuelling equipment is welcome, but this needs to be enacted immediately. FTA Ireland has members investing in CNG vehicles but there are no publicly available refuelling sites.
https://www.hgvireland.com/budget-delivers-welcome-news-says-fta/

rovertom

dudara wrote: »

I’ll be moving away from diesel, mainly because I don’t like the sound of the engine. It’s a great car, plenty of go, but I still think “tractor” whenever I turn on the ignition. I know most people will drop diesel due to tax, mileage or emission concerns. For me, it’s the sound of the engine.

Don’t think I’m ready to go full electric yet, but will probably be looking at a petrol hybrid. I think we'll make the change soon, probably next year, while there is still a good resale value in the year. I am a little concerned that value of diesels will fall badly.

I agree that your typical 4 cylinder diesel sounds terrible and really destroys any nice car.
Modern 6 cylinders though are different and I'd go so far as to say sound fantastic .

fennor72

I also have the diesel dilemma I'm driving about 120km a day and once a week I have to do a 250km round trip. I have a 1.4 petrol focus,
yesterday I filled the tank for the week and it cost me 73 euros. I couldn't believe petrol has now gone past the 1.50e a litre mark.
The plan was to change next year to probably a diesel, I think this is my only option with that mileage

omri

fennor72 wrote: »

I also have the diesel dilemma I'm driving about 120km a day and once a week I have to do a 250km round trip. I have a 1.4 petrol focus,
yesterday I filled the tank for the week and it cost me 73 euros. I couldn't believe petrol has now gone past the 1.50e a litre mark.
The plan was to change next year to probably a diesel, I think this is my only option with that mileage

It costs me €90ish to fill up my car. But since I'm enjoying the drive so much, every junction is like Formula 1 Grand Prix start, you gotta defend that pole position

_Brian

Defiantly go diesel again without hesitation.
Currently no alternative out there that suits my needs. I’d consider Outlander phev when the distance on the battery becomes something reasonable and not just a token gesture.

SBPhoto

For me it will be diesel again next time as it only cost me €1.12L after Vat. A very big saving over petrol when your doing 20.000k plus a year, Was in Audi yesterday getting service and they were telling me over 90% of their new sales for 182 on are diesel.As for the noise been tractor like, in don't know hate kind of diesel motors your driving but mine is even quieter than a lot of petrol ones i drove when i was younger.

SBPhoto

For me it will be diesel again next time as it only cost me €1.12L after Vat. A very big saving over petrol when your doing 20.000k plus a year, Was in Audi yesterday getting service and they were telling me over 90% of their new sales for 182 on are diesel.As for the noise been tractor like, in don't know what kind of diesel motors your driving but mine is even quieter than a lot of petrol ones i drove when i was younger.

s7ryf3925pivug

We have two diesels, a c-max and a golf. We'll change the golf first as it's a bit older. We plan to get am electric car to replace it. We'll decide what to replace the c-max with when the time comes - we'll be familiar with the practicaliy of running an electric car and the infrastructure should be better, see what the optoons are for mpvs etc.

Den14

Water John wrote: »

Have a diesel ATM plus OH has EV. The main problem with the diesel is not the CO2+ gases, its the particle matter. This is about polluting our locality. Just think of all of them dropping the kids to school and idling outside it.

That's exactly what is the issue with diesel. This particle matter is much more a health hazard rather than an environmental one. These particles lodge in internal organs such as lungs heart and even brain.

Agricola

I'd be sticking with diesel for the foreseeable anyway. It's just a marked difference in fuel costs compared to a similar size car in petrol. Living out in the sticks and needing something to tow occasionally, it's a no brainer. Plus, at some stage Im hoping to get a remap done on the current diesel for a bit more poke and hopefully a little better consumption too.

no.8

doolox wrote:

I bought a VW Passat estate three yrs ago and I love it. I am fed up with small cars which I had before and I was able to afford a proper car for the first time in my life due to a legacy I received.

Plenty of large petrol estate cars on the road

KevinCavan

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

If they got everyone to just eat meat once a week we could drive whatever we like.

Who would eat all the beef cattle being bred?

no.8

Blazer wrote:

I wouldn't worry about it,,,we're already nearly past the point of no return. It doesn't matter what a country like Ireland does when India,China etc are all heavily polluting in thousands of multiples over us. Add to that when other 3rd world countries get more industrialized and its really just a lesson in futility. It will require a catastrophic event before governments wake up and realise how bad it really is and then you'll see the **** hit the fan. Until then its just a token effort.

Well like not saying you're completely wrong but with that type of attitude we won't get anywhere. In many respects there is influence at play. Funny enough, could be the other way around as they are far ahead of us in some respects. Tbh, we are one of slowest countries to embrace change. We had a fantastic really network (not all viable) but we messed that up as well. Diesels were not the norm for Pvt cars until recently so it's not exactly a tectonic shift if we move away from it.

osheen

If the government/revenue would allow business to claim back VAT on petrol as well as diesel it would make a big difference. Lots of businesses run small vans and car vans that could be replaced with phev versions.

BigCon

I do 45000 KM/year so it's diesel all the way for me. That said I'd love an EV that has a range of 400 KM (i.e. 2 days between charge).

omri

BigCon wrote: »

I do 45000 KM/year so it's diesel all the way for me. That said I'd love an EV that has a range of 400 KM (i.e. 2 days between charge).

you can have tesla at mere €60k and upwards..

rovertom

SBPhoto wrote: »

For me it will be diesel again next time as it only cost me €1.12L after Vat. A very big saving over petrol when your doing 20.000k plus a year, Was in Audi yesterday getting service and they were telling me over 90% of their new sales for 182 on are diesel.As for the noise been tractor like, in don't know hate kind of diesel motors your driving but mine is even quieter than a lot of petrol ones i drove when i was younger.

Take any 4 cylinder diesel you like, and they are harsh.
Drive a nice 6 cylinder current diesel and come back.

Atlantic Dawn

KevinCavan wrote: »

Who would eat all the beef cattle being bred?

Nodoby, then the farmers would breed less of them, then less emissions.

REXER

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

If they got everyone to just eat meat once a week we could drive whatever we like.

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Nodoby, then the farmers would breed less of them, then less emissions.

As much as I like pork and chicken I do love a good beef fillet steak or rib eye steak so hands off the farmers! Go electric or go bicycle but hands off the farmers! :eek:

s7ryf3925pivug

omri wrote: »

you can have tesla at mere €60k and upwards..

The new more affordable model? - not until next year at the earliest.

In California you can get the current ones for less than that I heard, because of the amount that is subsidised as well as cheaper base prices. ...they'd still be better off with half decent public transport though

nice_guy80

Water John wrote: »

Have a diesel ATM plus OH has EV. The main problem with the diesel is not the CO2+ gases, its the particle matter. This is about polluting our locality. Just think of all of them dropping the kids to school and idling outside it.

The issue is why isn't the government providing every school in rural areas with a subsidised bus service to pick up the kids
Less traffic and less pollution

EPAndlee

I'll only buy a petrol again if I can insure atleast a 200bhp + petrol for a reasonable price

omri

nice_guy80 wrote: »

The issue is why isn't the government providing every school in rural areas with a subsidised bus service to pick up the kids
Less traffic and less pollution

Would be interesting to see in % how much private cars pollute, busses and truck, planes and ships and then the industrial/agri + heating/power. I'm sure this would give the picture if not to gvt then at least to the public which sector should be put under pressure to reduce the emissions.

nice_guy80

omri wrote: »

Would be interesting to see in % how much private cars pollute, busses and truck, planes and ships and then the industrial/agri + heating/power. I'm sure this would give the picture if not to gvt then at least to the public which sector should be put under pressure to reduce the emissions.

If 100 cars didn't have to drive to a school and instead 4 buses did the run, I'm sure the roads would be safer, less pollution and there's less need for patents to drive giant buses

ShadowHearth

dudara wrote: »

I’ll be moving away from diesel, mainly because I don’t like the sound of the engine. It’s a great car, plenty of go, but I still think “tractor” whenever I turn on the ignition. I know most people will drop diesel due to tax, mileage or emission concerns. For me, it’s the sound of the engine.

Don’t think I’m ready to go full electric yet, but will probably be looking at a petrol hybrid. I think we'll make the change soon, probably next year, while there is still a good resale value in the car. I am a little concerned that value of diesels will fall badly.

Thats what I did last year.
Bought Alfa GT 1.9 Jtdm in 2016 and I loved the car, but it was completely ruined by that tractor lump inside of it. It was my very first diesel too.
Even if I do about 25k km a year, I went and bought myself new 1.8 turbo petrol. Could not be happier.
If people need diesels and want them, of you go. Have fun. I personally cant stand the thing and it is not because I am hipster and "think of children" crap. Its just not fun.
I am so happy this crap with diesel kicked off, because finally we got ability to buy petrol cars again. Last 10 years were hell for actual PETROLheads.


As for my next car: it could be petrol, hybrid or plug in hybrid. If the hot hatches come with hybrid technology, then I am up for it too.

ofcork

dudara wrote: »

I’ll be moving away from diesel, mainly because I don’t like the sound of the engine. It’s a great car, plenty of go, but I still think “tractor” whenever I turn on the ignition. I know most people will drop diesel due to tax, mileage or emission concerns. For me, it’s the sound of the engine.

Don’t think I’m ready to go full electric yet, but will probably be looking at a petrol hybrid. I think we'll make the change soon, probably next year, while there is still a good resale value in the car. I am a little concerned that value of diesels will fall badly.

I feel the same about the engine sound bought a diesel because I couldn't find a petrol model of the car I wanted nearly paid for so looking at petrol or hybrid.

KevinCavan

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Nodoby, then the farmers would breed less of them, then less emissions.

Most bulls would be killed at birth as they would have no monetary value.

pwurple

nice_guy80 wrote: »

If 100 cars didn't have to drive to a school and instead 4 buses did the run, I'm sure the roads would be safer, less pollution and there's less need for patents to drive giant buses

Indeed, and that's why we walk to school, but I know damn well that those who drive to school, no bus will ever suit, because of spread out after-school activities.... Monday they go straight to GAA, tuesday is swimming, wednesday is tennis, thursday is to a childminder in the next town over and friday a musical instrument.

Plus, the parents are separated, where the mother has them Monday to wednesday, and they head to the fathers house is thursday friday saturday... Plus a childminder to do some afterschool, 20 minutes the other direction.

You get me? School Buses suit this cookie cutter family that has been shrinking away to nothing since the 80's. Mammy sa cistin agus Daddy sa gardin.

Sure, have it as part of a solution, but there needs to be more.

fancy pigeon

Current daily is diesel, next one will be diesel. Diesel for work, petrol cars for the weekends/arsing about

It's the way I work, it works for me. Maybe not for everyone, if petrol works for them belt away

Anti diesel dreamers people need to realise their cars were delivered to forecourts on diesel lorries, along with the petrol to fuel them

awec

I intended to go back to petrol again when I changed car last year, but there is just so much more choice in the diesel world that I ended up buying diesel again.

Looking at sites, you'd see 5 nice cars and 4 of them are diesel. Maybe it has changed since then, but that was my experience.