Who is getting out or cutting down on sucklers?

Bullocks

Well as the question goes who is getting out? There is a serious amount of talk everywhere about how bad they are paying these days and it seems everyone is changing system to something else but will there be much actual change in numbers calving cows this time next year?
I'm not for now anyhow and may pick up a few cows if they are really cheap between now and Christmas

Sugarbowl

Are we not kinda locked into the suckler system for now with BDGP? Isn't there a penalty if you don't reach your target numbers etc? Because of that, I wouldn't see a mass exodus in farmers leaving the suckies. I'm sticking with them anyway and hoping for the best!

Bullocks

Sugarbowl wrote: »

Are we not kinda locked into the suckler system for now with BDGP? Isn't there a penalty if you don't reach your target numbers etc? Because of that, I wouldn't see a mass exodus in farmers leaving the suckies. I'm sticking with them anyway and hoping for the best!

That's true, I'm not in that scheme but I'm sure a lot are alright

bogman_bass

I think it’s a lot of talk. “I heard that a lad...” kinda stuff

Green&Red

I think it’s something like 40% participation in BDGP and you’d hope that would drive the cost up as lads needs to hit their 20% by the end of this year and 50% by the end of next year

restive

With all the suckler/dairy cows being slaughtered this year will that not mean fewer calves next year? Therefore is it not worth hanging in there for another year?

Muckit

What's the alternative? People don't like change. Bit of work in buying in any number of cattle every year. Some lads couldn't face the thoughts of that.

I think change will only happen (and slowly) as farms are transferred. Everyone will do what's suits their lifestyle best.

Bass Reeves

A farmer a bit over a mile away has reduced from 70 odd cows down to below 30 over the last 2 years. Expects to reduce further. He has started finishing cattle now.

kay 9

Getting rid of all bull weanlings this year, cutting cow numbers by a quarter and going to keep the heifer weanlings instead.
Turning into a right mugs game (not that it wasn't the past 10-15yrs) and getting worse.
Be as well off feeding crocodiles

charolais0153

Keeping roughly sam enumber. 17 ish cows. Might finish a few bull calves in the next few years

_Brian

I deal with a number of older farmers and they have started reducing numbers.
Lame, or older cows not holding to the bull aren’t being replaced. One is cutting from 21 to 12, never buying feed in again.

I know 3 men giving up land they had rented for past years, renting land to run sucklers is out of the question.

I think we need to be killing maybe 400,000 less animals in Ireland to put a floor under beef prices, I can’t see that happening.

patsy_mccabe

Everything that could possibly go wrong happened in the last year. Knock on effect from Brexit, early & late winter, drought, Turkey.....etc etc. If you survive this year, things can only get better. ( that tune in me head)

squinn2912

I feel more negatively when I’m training heavily and Dublin marathon is in less than 4 weeks. Something that gets me is that you get nothing for the time you put in. I come back on a Saturday from a 20 mile run and then it’s a siege all day dosing or something. I’ve often thought that the sucklers are a lot of work but there is something nice about building things up from scratch.
Reading a post there it’s mad not to cull lame or infertile cows but very often they’re let linger here too. I can’t say why.
Anyhow... we’re going up in cows next year!

Parishlad

squinn2912 wrote: »

I feel more negatively when I’m training heavily and Dublin marathon is in less than 4 weeks. Something that gets me is that you get nothing for the time you put in. I come back on a Saturday from a 20 mile run and then it’s a siege all day dosing or something. I’ve often thought that the sucklers are a lot of work but there is something nice about building things up from scratch.
Reading a post there it’s mad not to cull lame or infertile cows but very often they’re let linger here too. I can’t say why.
Anyhow... we’re going up in cows next year!

DCM is only 24 days and 17 hours away....but who's counting.
I know what you mean about the Saturday long runs and then having to tog in to the farming gear and do whatever has to be done. Lets just say that I have a good few jobs put on the long finger over the last few weeks.
Anyway, I am also going to be increasing numbers over the next couple of years. But I am starting from a low baseline. I am also trying to build things up kinda from scratch and it is tough going but when things come together it makes up for a lot of it.

Best of luck in Dublin by the way!!

Reggie.

FIL is getting rid of cows and going back to buying in stores

wrangler

Reggie. wrote: »

FIL is getting rid of cows and going back to buying in stores

Wouldn't like to be trying to buy stores next year, a lot of suckler herds reducing,

farawaygrass

Said after last spring I’d reduce cows and up the sheep numbers. But scanned the cows last week and scanned more than any other year, with all in calf. Honestly wouldn’t have worried about a few empty ones. They seem to be all fairly compact for calving down bar 3. Might sell them, but not if I’m getting nothing for them either, all 4 and 5 stars. Plenty of silage but need to sell some stock as not enough shed space for the winter, and Our Weanlings are mid February born so still light enough, wouldn’t get a great price. Dilemmas dilemmas

Muckit

Reggie. wrote: »

FIL is getting rid of cows and going back to buying in stores

18' cattle trailer would be a good next purchase!!

Reggie.

wrangler wrote: »

Wouldn't like to be trying to buy stores next year, a lot of suckler herds reducing,

Not my call

squinn2912

Parishlad wrote: »

squinn2912 wrote: »

I feel more negatively when I’m training heavily and Dublin marathon is in less than 4 weeks. Something that gets me is that you get nothing for the time you put in. I come back on a Saturday from a 20 mile run and then it’s a siege all day dosing or something. I’ve often thought that the sucklers are a lot of work but there is something nice about building things up from scratch.
Reading a post there it’s mad not to cull lame or infertile cows but very often they’re let linger here too. I can’t say why.
Anyhow... we’re going up in cows next year!

DCM is only 24 days and 17 hours away....but who's counting.
I know what you mean about the Saturday long runs and then having to tog in to the farming gear and do whatever has to be done. Lets just say that I have a good few jobs put on the long finger over the last few weeks.
Anyway, I am also going to be increasing numbers over the next couple of years. But I am starting from a low baseline. I am also trying to build things up kinda from scratch and it is tough going but when things come together it makes up for a lot of it.

Best of luck in Dublin by the way!!

We we’re 60 last year looked like going down to 50 but next thing the oul man was picking out heifers by the dozen😳
You doing Dublin too? Hope it goes well! I complain like a mule but I do like it

Limestone Cowboy

Back 7 for next year. Culled a good few this year. Wasn't really intentional just didn't want to leave any passengers around the place. Should make the winter more manageable anyway. Be better off with 30 right cows than 40 wrong ones.

tractorporn

Cutting back to the BDGP reference number. Have scanned and culled 4 already who are not in calf, have 3 late calvers who might suit an Autumn calver who will be sold with calves at foot and there are 3 old cows not running with the bull that I hope to fatten once weaned.

I suppose the last few years we were tight for shed space and tight for silage each year. This way we won't have to put up a new shed and we should be ok for silage this year with a surplus hopefully next year.

Who2

Intended cutting by twenty but only culled eight and have two more to go. ( the harder ones to flesh) one friend has gone with all his cows and Theres a good few others clearing as calves are weaned. The dry cow trade should be fairly decent next summer. People are well sick of farming this year and it’s pushed a lot of lads that were borderline out of farming.

whelan2

I've been listening to " There'll be no suckler cows here next year" for the last 10 years. I'll believe it when I see it happening

Cattlepen

I cut down from 200 cows to 100 in 2015. Killed 34 of them last week and By the end of November the rest will be slaughtered. Totally sick of it. The job is on its knees. I’m not prepared to lose money and slave anymore. Will keep a few more ewes and get back to buying a few stores. I’ll trick at that till we see what the new CAP brings.

Dickie10

had 16-18 cows the last 6 years, we used to just buy in weanling heifers and kill them. always bought in heifers to match our own out oof sucklers the last few years. but slaughtered the bull last spring and cows are all empty now going to go maybe in spring when prices are a bit better. never liked having to calve cows the last few years delighted to be rid of them madness the amount of work they are for such little profit give me 50 etra sheep to lamb any day. or maybe buy in 100 extra store lambs

kevthegaff

Cattlepen wrote:

I cut down from 200 cows to 100 in 2015. Killed 34 of them last week and By the end of November the rest will be slaughtered. Totally sick of it. The job is on its knees. I’m not prepared to lose money and slave anymore. Will keep a few more ewes and get back to buying a few stores. I’ll trick at that till we see what the new CAP brings.

Fair work in 200 s cows, had u much help?

Muckit

Fair amount of work in 20 cows!!!

Cattlepen

kevthegaff wrote: »

Fair work in 200 s cows, had u much help?

I had one full time guy and also a partime time guy at lambing and calving. I tried students but they weren’t successful with the exception of one great girl.
With the benefit of hindsight it was madness. I had an awful clatter of ewes and all the progeny from the cows as well.
Ambition Can be dangerous , be careful what you wish for

Dunedin

I will stick with it and no immediate intentions to get out. Normally 18-20 cows and finish all.

As someone said to me a few years ago, ‘cows are like the fags, hard to give them up’

Grueller

Have 70-75 of them here and will stay at that. I had an idea of going to 80 but not going to. I think I will stop selling weanlings though in the future (5+ years) refuce cows to 50 and finish my own stock.

squinn2912

Grueller wrote: »

Have 70-75 of them here and will stay at that. I had an idea of going to 80 but not going to. I think I will stop selling weanlings though in the future (5+ years) refuce cows to 50 and finish my own stock.

That’s what I want to do bring the finishing number up and maybe do a bit more angus or Hereford to finish. Last winter everything was just hardship from weather to space etc. calving went well though so small mercies

Parishlad

squinn2912 wrote: »

We we’re 60 last year looked like going down to 50 but next thing the oul man was picking out heifers by the dozen��
You doing Dublin too? Hope it goes well! I complain like a mule but I do like it

Ha, it’s hard to let good heifers go. I only have small numbers here. Calved 17 this year. Am keeping 6 heifers to put in calf next Spring. All cattle kept to store.
Yep will be heading to Dublin in a few weeks. Last long run this weekend, 21.5 miles. Looking forward to it in a sick kind of way. 😀

squinn2912

Ach I know it is surely. More held than usual too. I bought a few sim heifers Off fresians too for next year.
Good work! Coach put down 22 for me with 5 at pace. Dread it!

Danzy

whelan2 wrote: »

I've been listening to " There'll be no suckler cows here next year" for the last 10 years. I'll believe it when I see it happening

There are less every year though.

Suckler breed calf nos tell the tale each year.

390kid

Well stay around the same. Threatened to have a heavy cull every year but we get fond of them at that stage! May try improve quality of them do! 3 lads I work with got out of the cows do replaced them with more sheep forestry and renting it out

Willfarman

Cattlepen wrote: »

I had one full time guy and also a partime time guy at lambing and calving. I tried students but they weren’t successful with the exception of one great girl.
With the benefit of hindsight it was madness. I had an awful clatter of ewes and all the progeny from the cows as well.
Ambition Can be dangerous , be careful what you wish for

Are you not tempted to go milking?

TITANIUM.

Willfarman wrote: »

Are you not tempted to go milking?

Blasphemy

390kid

Cattlepen wrote: »

I cut down from 200 cows to 100 in 2015. Killed 34 of them last week and By the end of November the rest will be slaughtered. Totally sick of it. The job is on its knees. I’m not prepared to lose money and slave anymore. Will keep a few more ewes and get back to buying a few stores. I’ll trick at that till we see what the new CAP brings.

Not being nosy but was your loss figure reduced when you cut down to 100 from 200 cows?

jfh

i think there's a few older lads getting rid of the cows alright but your right, i've been listening to that for the last few years, loads of lads getting out of sucklers . love to see the figures, i'd say suckler cow number are down damn all.

Cattlepen

Willfarman wrote: »

Are you not tempted to go milking?

Frying pan to fire. After heavy investment over the years I don’t have the drive to invest more in dairying. And like I said, not interested in anymore slavery

Danzy

jfh wrote: »

i think there's a few older lads getting rid of the cows alright but your right, i've been listening to that for the last few years, loads of lads getting out of sucklers . love to see the figures, i'd say suckler cow number are down damn all.

Beef cow numbers are down about 3% each year for a few years now.

Cattlepen

390kid wrote: »

Not being nosy but was your loss figure reduced when you cut down to 100 from 200 cows?

Yer not been nosey. I have no problem been truthful bout it. Yes, the loss figure was reduced. But I have still been losing substantial sums of money before sfp so I am more or less throwing in the towel. Flogged a dead horse for long enough.

Angus2018

I'm adding a few extra this year. Trying to get my numbers up a bit but we finish everything at least for now.

I've noticed a gradual drop in cattle, sheep and tillage in my surrounding area. Just not worth it. World hunger here we come.

TITANIUM.

Well I'm going up in numbers. Bulling about 10 extra onto the Autumn calvers and hopefully the same for the spring time girls. Not planning on culling anything bar natural selection.
I haven't noticed numbers reducing around me bar the the lads that are simply to old to keep it up and don't have young lads or young ones behind them to pick up the slack. What I have noticed is a drop in quality. Maybe it's the BDGP or maybe it's that lads just want an easy life so there going very easy calving or a combination of both. But if your looking to get paid for your calfs then quality is an absolute must these days.
A buddy of mine is the local AI tech and a few months ago he was in the yard and I asked him was he busy? Grand during the week he said but the weekends were hectic. He couldn't figure it out. It had never accured to him that lads were simply to busy with work during the week to be properly checking heats and were doing everything they could on the weekend.

Long story short I suppose there's small natural shrinkage in numbers due to the age demographics and a bit of a loss of interest with a large percentage of the guys holding on.

Who2

TITANIUM. wrote: »

Well I'm going up in numbers. Bulling about 10 extra onto the Autumn calvers and hopefully the same for the spring time girls. Not planning on culling anything bar natural selection.
I haven't noticed numbers reducing around me bar the the lads that are simply to old to keep it up and don't have young lads or young ones behind them to pick up the slack. What I have noticed is a drop in quality. Maybe it's the BDGP or maybe it's that lads just want an easy life so there going very easy calving or a combination of both. But if your looking to get paid for your calfs then quality is an absolute must these days.
A buddy of mine is the local AI tech and a few months ago he was in the yard and I asked him was he busy? Grand during the week he said but the weekends were hectic. He couldn't figure it out. It had never accured to him that lads were simply to busy with work during the week to be properly checking heats and were doing everything they could on the weekend.

Long story short I suppose there's small natural shrinkage in numbers due to the age demographics and a bit of a loss of interest with a large percentage of the guys holding on.

Have to agree on the quality of stock alright but there’s definitly a mass exodus from sucklers around here. It’s predominantly dairy with a bit of tillage and the only few lads still around the ring are getting older and far more cautious about buying. I haven’t seen anyone acting the big player lately polling each other. People are definitely sick of the hardship. There’s plenty of options out there work wise and most are no longer satisfied by barely scraping by.

Dickie10

every surrounding me is now leased out. thats 3 farms. one is 340 acres all tillage as it was before. the other is 70acres all tillage, the other is 220 acres in grass and some tillage. all three farmers now just working part time. 2out of 3 are long term leases

Cattlepen

Dickie10 wrote: »

every surrounding me is now leased out. thats 3 farms. one is 340 acres all tillage as it was before. the other is 70acres all tillage, the other is 220 acres in grass and some tillage. all three farmers now just working part time. 2out of 3 are long term leases

That is incredible. But it’s a sign of the times. There’s obviously more money and less hassle by leasing

Dickie10

your probably not far from me being in east midlands. yeah its crazy alright.another three farms with 2 mile of me are also now rented out these would be about 80 acres and 2x 200 acres. in both cases the farmer died a few years back but both families have two and three sons respectively. neither families have anyone with any intrest in farming. I could count on one hand the amount of intensive farmers within 3 miles of me farming there own land and this is some of the best land in Ireland. strangely there are two guys fairly intensive who would have under 20 acres to their name but now rent over 150 acres on these farms. so I suppose theres great opportunities for some people. im actually shocked now that I started to count up the amount of farms let out around me. other parts of the country would always seem a hive of activity with livestock farming whereas around hear the countryside is extremely quiet with just tillage does anyone else find that in tillage areas.?

wrangler

Dickie10 wrote: »

your probably not far from me being in east midlands. yeah its crazy alright.another three farms with 2 mile of me are also now rented out these would be about 80 acres and 2x 200 acres. in both cases the farmer died a few years back but both families have two and three sons respectively. neither families have anyone with any intrest in farming. I could count on one hand the amount of intensive farmers within 3 miles of me farming there own land and this is some of the best land in Ireland. strangely there are two guys fairly intensive who would have under 20 acres to their name but now rent over 150 acres on these farms. so I suppose theres great opportunities for some people. im actually shocked now that I started to count up the amount of farms let out around me. other parts of the country would always seem a hive of activity with livestock farming whereas around hear the countryside is extremely quiet with just tillage does anyone else find that in tillage areas.?

I'm probably not far from you either, a lot of very good land around here
Some extremely good operators around too, we've one in tillage and expanding into dairying hoovering up a lot of land, had no cows in 2015 and looking like 1000 by 2020......extremely hard worker

Reggie.

wrangler wrote: »

I'm probably not far from you either, a lot of very good land around here
Some extremely good operators around too, we've one in tillage and expanding into dairying hoovering up a lot of land, had no cows in 2015 and looking like 1000 by 2020......extremely hard worker

Hes not hoovering up much extra land, just converting his tillage land to grassland. He's pulling back on the contracting too. Will stop completely in a short while I reckon