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How to Fix RTE?

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  • Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 28,475 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cabaal


    Liamario wrote: »
    The only way to fix RTE is to get rid of it. If they insist on keeping the fee, it should be used as a fund for those who wish to make Irish programming and put on a channel totally free of advertisement.

    Totally free of adverts?
    So you want an increased license fee then?

    I know we all would like RTE to be like the BBC but we don't have the massive population to fund it from the license fee, lets be realistic.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,911 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    Cabaal wrote: »
    Totally free of adverts?
    So you want an increased license fee then?

    I know we all would like RTE to be like the BBC but we don't have the massive population to fund it from the license fee, lets be realistic.


    Why do we need to increase the license fee? There is no need to keep rte running in any way close to its current format, it should be used for funding and showing homegrown programming only which would massively reduce the costs of it having to purchase syndication for the other garbage it shows.


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,417 ✭✭✭✭kneemos


    VinLieger wrote: »
    Why do we need to increase the license fee? There is no need to keep rte running in any way close to its current format, it should be used for funding and showing homegrown programming only which would massively reduce the costs of it having to purchase syndication for the other garbage it shows.


    Homemade programming is extremely expensive. Which is probably why they buy in foreign made programmes.


  • Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 28,475 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cabaal


    VinLieger wrote: »
    Why do we need to increase the license fee? There is no need to keep rte running in any way close to its current format, it should be used for funding and showing homegrown programming only which would massively reduce the costs of it having to purchase syndication for the other garbage it shows.

    You think 300million odd will run all of RTE..this includes radio stations, RTE1, 2, TG4, online services and create homegrown content as well as improve all these services?
    :rolleyes:

    Remember, the person above that I responded to wants no adverts too so the only revenue stream would be the license fee.

    If you think 300million odd will do everything then you don't live in the real world.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,667 ✭✭✭Hector Bellend


    A good start would be to stop Ryan Tubridy reading movie reviews from the Irish Times on his radio show.

    Second step would be to deliver a very hard kick in the bollix for him.

    Third step would be to tear up his contract and stuff it into his mouth.

    Final step would be to grab him by the scruff of the neck, throw him out on to the street and tell him that his broadcasting career with RTE is over and that he will have to survive in the commercial radio sector on his merits as a broadcaster.

    Lets see how he survives.

    Lets put some tax payers money to better use.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 12,504 ✭✭✭✭machiavellianme


    1. Cut at least one, if not both orchestras.
    As important as supporting the arts, they are still a frivolous luxury to maintain.
    2. Cap all pay at 100k. They aren't doing anything mentally or physically challenging or working unsociable hours. There's no need for rigorous training or university doctorates. Literally anyone who can speak can do it.
    3. Ban all new hires who are related to any past or current employees in any way. The same applies for anyone related to any political person or party.


  • Registered Users Posts: 495 ✭✭the-island-man


    vicwatson wrote: »
    Stop paying those “top 10” exhorbitant amounts of our cash for starters. Rte think they are the national broadcaster of america ffs

    They get four time the pay, times the pay, of the United States President.
    Times the pay!
    This woman here - times the pay!
    Who is a minister. Times the pay!
    And anything she does - times the pay!
    Who is elected - times the pay!
    Well she'll be removed from office. Times the pay!
    You've lived your high life. You have had your day, Pat!

    'Kay. Thank you very much - you're RTE.
    'Kay. Thank you very much - not ABC...
    'Kay. Thank you very much - you're RTE.
    'Kay. Thank you very much - not ABC...
    Always cracks me up....




  • Registered Users Posts: 20,417 ✭✭✭✭kneemos


    1. Cut at least one, if not both orchestras.
    As important as supporting the arts, they are still a frivolous luxury to maintain.
    2. Cap all pay at 100k. They aren't doing anything mentally or physically challenging or working unsociable hours. There's no need for rigorous training or university doctorates. Literally anyone who can speak can do it.
    3. Ban all new hires who are related to any past or current employees in any way. The same applies for anyone related to any political person or party.


    Why are RTE lumbered with the orchestras anyway?
    The Arts Council or some such could surely be responsible.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,905 ✭✭✭✭Bob24


    1. Cut at least one, if not both orchestras.
    As important as supporting the arts, they are still a frivolous luxury to maintain.
    2. Cap all pay at 100k. They aren't doing anything mentally or physically challenging or working unsociable hours. There's no need for rigorous training or university doctorates. Literally anyone who can speak can do it.
    3. Ban all new hires who are related to any past or current employees in any way. The same applies for anyone related to any political person or party.

    Agree with points 2 and 3, even though 3 would probably be hard to enforce.

    I can’t agree with banning *both* orchestras though. Yes they cost money but IMO it’s money better spent than pretty much anything else RTÉ is doing as it’s promoting arts and culture and is not really a political/ideological enterprise. I wouldn’t have any issue if they were taken away from RTÉ and managed by another public entity though, but not scrapped altogether.


  • Registered Users Posts: 43,028 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    kneemos wrote: »
    Why are RTE lumbered with the orchestras anyway?
    The Arts Council or some such could surely be responsible.

    How are family members with musical talent meant to survive in the real world without them?


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  • Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 28,475 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cabaal


    For those claiming both orchestras should be shut down,
    Complete disregard for good music and culture, shame on you.

    Its not just about some music, its support arts, they entertain and engage children and adults, wanting to scrap them altogether shows a high level of ignorance


  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 80,174 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sephiroth_dude


    Samsgirl wrote: »
    Make it a subscription service only.

    All the "talented" gowls would have to take a pay cut then though, they wouldn't happy with that.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,378 ✭✭✭CeilingFly


    vicwatson wrote: »
    Stop paying those “top 10” exhorbitant amounts of our cash for starters. Rte think they are the national broadcaster of america ffs

    But their top ten are top ten for a very good reason - they bring in the revenue and each and every one of the top ten contribute handsomely to RTE profits.

    Where the big costs are, is in outside broadcast of sports especially GAA and Horse Racing, children's programming, news, other minority programming and orchestras.

    But as usual its easy to whine off at the "top ten"


    Look at the indo - they got rid of many of their better journalists to "save money". Its now absolute and utter rubbish and they have seen a huge drop in readership, well above the market decline and there's little chance of people paying for the rubbish they spout online.

    New management have now realised this but its probably too late.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,467 ✭✭✭valoren


    Keep the Late Late but stop producing the Saturday Night Ray D'Arcy show.
    It's just butter spread over too much bread.

    When you see D'Arcy making a skype call to a family and having them run around the house looking for items in order to win €300 to fill air time, then you can see why RTE is a loss maker.

    The over time being paid for this show must be ridiculous, redressing the same set to boot. (Weekend + unsocial hours etc).

    Saturday night should show a film premiere to occupy that same slot.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,504 ✭✭✭✭machiavellianme


    Cabaal wrote: »
    For those claiming both orchestras should be shut down,
    Complete disregard for good music and culture, shame on you.

    Its not just about some music, its support arts, they entertain and engage children and adults, wanting to scrap them altogether shows a high level of ignorance

    Where's the national industrial metal band or the national synthpop band? Plenty of artists in those genres engage children and adults.
    If orchestral music can't stand on its own two feet the same way as any other genre, then it clearly isn't thriving. Bar a handful of workings by Handel and a few others on these shores, we haven't exactly set the world alight in composition.
    Dispensation might be made for one orchestra, but two?


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,905 ✭✭✭✭Bob24


    CeilingFly wrote: »
    But their top ten are top ten for a very good reason - they bring in the revenue and each and every one of the top ten contribute handsomely to RTE profits.

    Don’t forget RTÉ is a public entity though. And if the goal was to bring as much revenue as possible from high audience time slots, there would be better ways of doing it than hiring these people.

    In the context of delivering a public service, saying their higher salaries are justified because they bring in more revenue than other types of broadcasts - and weaker time slots! - is like saying it would be justified to pay civil servants working for the revenue commissioner more that those working for the HSE because the first group brings in revenue and the second costs money.

    So either RTÉ sees itself as a public entity with a public service mission and pays employees in a way which allows it to deliver the best public service (it currently isn’t but what is good public service in this context should be defined clearly and imposed upon RTÉ’s management - and while expensive and not very financially rewarding, running an orchestra is definitly more of a public service to me than hosting an entertainment talk show), or it sees itself more as a for profit entity but then it should stop relying on public funds.

    Don’t get me wrong, I don’t think RTÉ shouldn’t care about its cash flow and audience levels. But while applying a purely commercial logic to justify high salaries is perfectly fine (and makes sense) in the context of a privately funded organisation, doing the same for publicly funded one would sound pretty hypocritical to me as it would be a way to set yourself as a direct competitor and equivalent of private broadcasters, while knowing you have an unfair advantage compared to them gifted by the public and none of what you are doing would exist without these public funds.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,504 ✭✭✭✭machiavellianme


    CeilingFly wrote: »
    But their top ten are top ten for a very good reason - they bring in the revenue and each and every one of the top ten contribute handsomely to RTE profits.

    Where the big costs are, is in outside broadcast of sports especially GAA and Horse Racing, children's programming, news, other minority programming and orchestras.

    But as usual its easy to whine off at the "top ten"


    Look at the indo - they got rid of many of their better journalists to "save money". Its now absolute and utter rubbish and they have seen a huge drop in readership, well above the market decline and there's little chance of people paying for the rubbish they spout online.

    New management have now realised this but its probably too late.

    Nonsense. The top 10 have prime time slots. Advertisers pay for this regardless of whether it's Miriam, Marty or Marian. The people who watch and listen to these programmes are often victims of circumstance, trapped in waiting rooms, hospital wards, nursing homes or just watch the "late late" because they've always done. Sure, there's a handful of people who might like Ryan Tubridy and /or Ray D'Arcy but I've yet to meet one, however, I've met hundreds who complain about them. These RTE cronies offer neither insight nor entertainment in their textbook interviews. If you put any presenter in those slots you'd see the same level of revenue and possibly even more because the public might be interested to see how a new face might succeed as surely the newcomer couldn't be as poor as the incumbents.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,366 ✭✭✭Star Bingo


    There’s a lack of adventure in RTE where’s the irish bear grylls. Ireland’s Most Dangerous Roads? Dual Survivor in the comeragh mountains.... why was it down to the BBC to pack Ed n Dara off to Mandalay


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,500 ✭✭✭BrokenArrows


    Top RTE presenters are earning 500k+ which is about 0.18% of the total license income.

    Top BBC presenters are earning 1.5million which is about 0.0085% of the total license income.

    RTE presenters are paid far too much money for what they produce.

    RTE shows generally are not re-sellable. The Late Late doesnt get shown in any other country. BBC talk shows shows generally are always re-sellable and shown around the world.

    RTE need to shift focus to creating re-sellable content and moving away from relying on the TV license to support the garbage they create.

    If you try and find a list of the top Irish TV Shows most of anything you will find was created by the BBC or other UK channels. Even our beloved Fr. Ted wasnt an Irish created show.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,758 ✭✭✭Laois_Man


    Top RTE presenters are earning 500k+ which is about 0.18% of the total license income.

    Top BBC presenters are earning 1.5million which is about 0.0085% of the total license income.

    RTE presenters are paid far too much money for what they produce.

    RTE shows generally are not re-sellable. The Late Late doesnt get shown in any other country. BBC talk shows shows generally are always re-sellable and shown around the world.

    RTE need to shift focus to creating re-sellable content and moving away from relying on the TV license to support the garbage they create.

    If you try and find a list of the top Irish TV Shows most of anything you will find was created by the BBC or other UK channels. Even our beloved Fr. Ted wasnt an Irish created show.

    BBC shows such as Graham Norton are resealable because they get the A-listers. There's almost always at least one heavy hitter on the couch for the duration of the show. Committing A-listers to appear is easy with a potential audience so huge - they're probably turning some away. RTE are lucky to get a current A-lister any more often than once every 4 or 5 months. They're not very interested in the Irish market. It has nothing to do with RTE's focus!


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  • Registered Users Posts: 17,797 ✭✭✭✭hatrickpatrick



    Ah, but I was quoting the rap remix sir ;)



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,911 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    Cabaal wrote: »
    You think 300million odd will run all of RTE..this includes radio stations, RTE1, 2, TG4, online services and create homegrown content as well as improve all these services?
    :rolleyes:

    Remember, the person above that I responded to wants no adverts too so the only revenue stream would be the license fee.

    If you think 300million odd will do everything then you don't live in the real world.

    300 million would be enough to do exactly as needed and have basic news and some homegrown programming. Homegrown programming is in part so expensive due to how mismanaged RTE is and its production staff are never held to account for any of the gross overspending that occurs due to their ridiculous work practices.



    Cut RTE in half so it can do news, sports and a bit for homegrown, why would we need anything else sure don't we all have basically 300+ channels for the rest or as any sensible person should be doing simply cut the cable and go full streaming/online.


  • Registered Users Posts: 29,037 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    Funding for most media outlets are voluntary. RTE and BBC are involuntary, this is why state broadcasters should be impartial..

    it's the tv licence that is involuntary. it so happens that both in ireland and the uk the money goes to the state broadcasters. but even if the state broadcasters no longer existed,, it's likely that we would still need a licence to own a tv.
    i find that both rte and the bbc are impartial. however as i said before, some on one side of a particular argument will always think both broadcasters aren't impartial because they may not report in a manner that suits that particular person's side of an argument or agenda.
    I've also yet to hear of anyone describe RTE and BBC as far-left, unless the real motive of TV licenses is to redistribute the wealth to people like Gary Lineker and Chris Evans, in which case they have it arse backwards because they're both loaded.

    i have over the years, seen people across the internet describe the bbc as both far left and far right. granted i don't really see this sort of commentary these days.

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,037 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    Where's the national industrial metal band or the national synthpop band? Plenty of artists in those genres engage children and adults.
    If orchestral music can't stand on its own two feet the same way as any other genre, then it clearly isn't thriving. Bar a handful of workings by Handel and a few others on these shores, we haven't exactly set the world alight in composition.
    Dispensation might be made for one orchestra, but two?

    orchestral music is a non-issue in terms of funding to rte . it wouldn't be standing on it's own 2 feet whether the orchestras remain with rte or went elsewhere. they would highly likely remain publically funded.
    Bob24 wrote: »
    Don’t forget RTÉ is a public entity though. And if the goal was to bring as much revenue as possible from high audience time slots, there would be better ways of doing it than hiring these people.

    In the context of delivering a public service, saying their higher salaries are justified because they bring in more revenue than other types of broadcasts - and weaker time slots! - is like saying it would be justified to pay civil servants working for the revenue commissioner more that those working for the HSE because the first group brings in revenue and the second costs money.

    So either RTÉ sees itself as a public entity with a public service mission and pays employees in a way which allows it to deliver the best public service (it currently isn’t but what is good public service in this context should be defined clearly and imposed upon RTɒs management - and while expensive and not very financially rewarding, running an orchestra is definitly more of a public service to me than hosting an entertainment talk show), or it sees itself more as a for profit entity but then it should stop relying on public funds.

    Don’t get me wrong, I don’t think RTÉ shouldn’t care about its cash flow and audience levels. But while applying a purely commercial logic to justify high salaries is perfectly fine (and makes sense) in the context of a privately funded organisation, doing the same for publicly funded one would sound pretty hypocritical to me as it would be a way to set yourself as a direct competitor and equivalent of private broadcasters, while knowing you have an unfair advantage compared to them gifted by the public and none of what you are doing would exist without these public funds.

    we are all assuming here that rte is making the choice in terms of behaving in part like a commercial entity. i have a feeling that may not be so, that possibly successive governments have decreed that this is how rte should run. it explains why a couple of our public services part operate in the manner of a commercial/private entity.
    as for paying people who bring in the most money a high wage, that is how the broadcast industry tends to work and in theory at least, if we want good quality broadcasters on a public service then that has to be paid for. of course good quality is subjective and there are some on rte who aren't good at all, but clearly they are doing something right as people obviously watch them for better or worse.
    VinLieger wrote: »
    300 million would be enough to do exactly as needed and have basic news and some homegrown programming. Homegrown programming is in part so expensive due to how mismanaged RTE is and its production staff are never held to account for any of the gross overspending that occurs due to their ridiculous work practices.

    some questions based on this as i haven't heard about any of this.
    1. in what way are rte's production staff not held to account?
    2. what have they over-spent on?
    3. what are their ridiculous work practices?
    VinLieger wrote: »
    Cut RTE in half so it can do news, sports and a bit for homegrown, why would we need anything else sure don't we all have basically 300+ channels for the rest or as any sensible person should be doing simply cut the cable and go full streaming/online.

    a lot of us have 300+ channels, but realistically, on the majority of them there is f all. as for online streaming, that may not be viable for everyone as not everyone will have strong enough internet. hopefully they will in the near future though.

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,555 ✭✭✭Roger Hassenforder


    Decimation.

    And then more decimation.


  • Registered Users Posts: 494 ✭✭Irish Kings


    Jimmy. wrote: »
    Stop putting Miriam on the RTÉ guide every week anyway.

    agreed the pics are all a bit saggy at this stage


  • Registered Users Posts: 494 ✭✭Irish Kings


    Jimmy. wrote: »
    Stop putting Miriam on the RTÉ guide every week anyway.

    agreed her pics are saggy at this stage


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,555 ✭✭✭Roger Hassenforder


    Probably still would though


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,440 ✭✭✭The Rape of Lucretia


    Where's the national industrial metal band or the national synthpop band? Plenty of artists in those genres engage children and adults.
    If orchestral music can't stand on its own two feet the same way as any other genre, then it clearly isn't thriving. Bar a handful of workings by Handel and a few others on these shores, we haven't exactly set the world alight in composition.
    Dispensation might be made for one orchestra, but two?

    'We' composed for Handel ?

    We do need the two orchestra all right though. Ireland if musically very weak. Embarrassingly so really, and taxing the wider population to raise their level of appreciation of good music is beyond argument, a good policy. Whether it is channelled through RTE or otherwise is just an administrative detail though.

    (John Field by the way, is Ireland only worthwhile contribution to the musical landscape of the world. And not bad at all he were).


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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,838 ✭✭✭10000maniacs


    Cabaal wrote: »
    For those claiming both orchestras should be shut down,
    Complete disregard for good music and culture, shame on you.

    Its not just about some music, its support arts, they entertain and engage children and adults, wanting to scrap them altogether shows a high level of ignorance

    I don't think anybody was saying shut them down. But they are too much of a shoulder of burden for RTE. Privatize them and let them market themselves. Have an Irish version of The Proms and market the recordings.


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