Does my employer has the right to search my Car?

APMagic

Hey,
Another saga of my part time work place, farm shop/garden centre. I completely understand the right to search your bag with you present and lockers too. But now apparently they are going to make it a mandatory thing to search your car.... Its not a company car, its private and just because its parked in the staff car park they have the right to search it?? Its a grey area, and I have nothing to hide. Just makes me feel like i am subjected to mistrust. 
One of HR pushed their luck by searching a bag without anyone being there. But that was brushed aside and forgotten. I am tempted to stick a Halloween fake cut off arm in the boot of my car to freak them out. 
Any thoughts welcome. Not sure where I stand on this issue.

Donutz

Unless you are using you car to preform some of your work duties, I would say no they are not entitled to search your car.

Your car is your own personal property and I would say they have as much right to search that as they do your house or apartment.

irelandrover

Out of curiousity, why do you accept their right to search your bag, but think they can't search your car. You are bringing both onto their property. Whats the difference?

Dardania

Legally, I don't know. Morally, if they suspect you of theft, they should call the Gardai and have them search your car.

TheValeyard

If its your personal car and not a work car, id have thought no. I thought only Gardai or Customs could search. Ill wait for the legal eagles to venture an option.

fishy_fishy

Not if it isn't in your contract.

Get a new job, sounds like a horrid place to work.

mickmmc

I have walked passed the Guinness entrance & exit near Heuston Station - Victoria Quay. The beer kegs are stored at that location.

The vehicle stops at the barrier and in the case of a car the boot is opened. The security guard comes out of the security hut and checks the boot and the car. The security guard then goes back to the hut and the barrier is only then lifted to let the vehicle out.

fishy_fishy

mickmmc wrote: »

I have walked passed the Guinness entrance & exit near Heuston Station - Victoria Quay. The beer kegs are stored at that location.

The vehicle stops at the barrier and in the case of a car the boot is opened. The security guard comes out of the security hut and checks the boot and the car. The security guard then goes back to the hut and the barrier is only then lifted to let the vehicle out.

And I bet it's in their contracts that the car will be searched.

OP says their management want to introduce it. Without it being in their contracts, they can't.

As to the reality of it, it's complete abuse of power. Have a look at the OP's post history. We're at full employment. I'd look for another job.

subpar

Once you bring your car onto company premises your employer is entitled to check you vehicle as you exit the site.

Dardania

subpar wrote: »

Once you bring your car onto company premises your employer is entitled to check you vehicle as you exit the site.

Source?

seamus

subpar wrote: »

Once you bring your car onto company premises your employer is entitled to check you vehicle as you exit the site.

Rubbish.
There is no such blanket entitlement afforded to employers to use as they wish.

An employer may have a policy like this protect their goods, but:

- Employees must agree to it
This means that they must be aware of it and it cannot be foisted upon them. So if, for example, the employee is guaranteed a parking space as part of their contract, then the employer cannot make searching a condition later on. They must either provide an off-site space or get the employee to explicitly agree to the search. The employee can refuse and continue to use the space on-site, without punishment.

- Any search must be limited to what is reasonably necessary for stock/income protection
This means that the car cannot be forensically searched, have everything removed from it, to look for "something". The person doing the searching must have an idea of what he is looking for, and the nature of the search limited to that.
Guiness is a good example; they're looking for stolen kegs. So going through the whole car and pulling everything out would be way over the top. Open the boot, quick look in, that's as far as they can go.

- Only specified persons may carry out searches.
This means management can't decide on a whim to go through your car/bag. Certain personnel are given this role and only they may search.

- The decisions to carry out searches should be accompanied with a policy.
That is, if your searches are "random" you have to be able to prove that they are and you're not deliberately targeting anyone. The safest policy is to search everyone or search no-one. A policy to search based on "suspicion" or "tip-offs" will land you in hot water.

- Searches cannot be carried out without the property owner present.

- Searches should be "hands-off" as much as possible.
So if the person doing the searching needs to see under something, they should ask the property owner to move it. Getting physically involved themselves leaves them open to claims of tampering or damage.

- There must be defined disciplinary processes for both "refused" searches and "failed" searches. You cannot physically force someone to allow their property to be searched, and you cannot seize their property if you find they've been stealing. If someone is fired on the spot for a failed search or refusing a search, then you're going to end up being sued for unfair dismissal.

Searching private property has ramifications for the employer across employment law, privacy law, defamation, criminal law, and a host of others. It is not something any company should be doing on a whim and without an entire textbook-sized process and training manual for.

AAAAAAAAA

APMagic wrote: »

Its not a company car, its private and just because its parked in the staff car park they have the right to search it?? Its a grey area, and I have nothing to hide

It's not a grey area, it's a black area. The company cannot use "it's parked in the company car park" as an excuse to search your car, and you should tell them to absolutely get ****ed

_Brian

Honestly I’d buy a bag of compost and some pots in a rival store and keep the receipt.
Let them check the car and kick off their witch hunt, when they’re suitably wound up remember you have the receipt in your wallet.

iPhone.

How can you work under those circumstances? It sounds like a very bad atmosphere to be working under.

What's next, latex gloves?

Danzy

I can understand the company being frustrated if there are pot plants walking out the door and it is hitting the bottom line but If someone asked me if they could search my car I wouldn't let them under any circumstances.

If you like the work place and work is hard to come by then, maybe but I'd take it bad, even suggested, not only for the gross invasion of privacy that it represents.

As pointed out, it is not just the wrong way to go about solving there problem but they have no legal right to do so.

CruelCoin

This is another example i think of people being precious with their privacy.

What are you carrying in your car that you'd have an issue with them seeing?

Most of us have cd's bits of receipts, some coins and maybe some pens strewn around the place....

Why would you jeopardise your relationship there over what's really a non-issue?

AAAAAAAAA

CruelCoin wrote: »

This is another example i think of people being precious with their privacy.

What are you carrying in your car that you'd have an issue with them seeing?

Most of us have cd's bits of receipts, some coins and maybe some pens strewn around the place....

Why would you jeopardise your relationship there over what's really a non-issue?

Because it's none of their business what's in the employee's car. All the employee has to do is show up and work. If the employer owned the car, fair enough. If the employee was being paid to drive somewhere, possibly entering a grey area. When the car has absolutely nothing to do with the job, it's none of the employer's business.

CruelCoin

AAAAAAAAA wrote: »

Because it's none of their business what's in the employee's car. All the employee has to do is show up and work. If the employer owned the car, fair enough. If the employee was being paid to drive somewhere, possibly entering a grey area. When the car has absolutely nothing to do with the job, it's none of the employer's business.

Maybe not, but is the employee so secure in their job that this is worth fighting about?

Picking your battles, etc?

Spook_ie

If they are introducing a policy like many builders providers where they check your (customer) boot against an invoice would they not be allowed to check the vehicle?

1hnr79jr65

CruelCoin wrote: »

Maybe not, but is the employee so secure in their job that this is worth fighting about?

Picking your battles, etc?

Who is to say that the person(s) searching your car who may have a personal grudge "find" something that they could potentially drop into the vechicle to incriminate an innocent party.

Private vechicles are off limits unless other wise stated in contract and regulated. In a production factory i used to work in, security waved the wand and asked you to empty bag onto desk, they had no right to put their hand in your pockets, bags or anything else.

If you feel threatened you can repsond that you do not consent to accepting this as normal practice as it is not part of your contract.

If the wish to discuss this futher then ask them to convene an official meeting with appropriate representatives and if they dont accept this you can advise them you will seek outside support on the matter.

jimmycrackcorm

I'd be filing up my car boot with a load of merchandise purchased in a competitor store.

Then when the investigation starts I'd pull out the receipts and talk to my solicitor.

the_pen_turner

Spook_ie wrote: »

If they are introducing a policy like many builders providers where they check your (customer) boot against an invoice would they not be allowed to check the vehicle?

What builders providers do this. If never seen it in any I have been.

I can't see any one risking acusing someone in the wrong.

If they opened my vanat any time there could be all kinds of materials from their store or others. How could the prove that it wasn't in there when I drove in.

1hnr79jr65

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

I'd be filing up my car boot with a load of merchandise purchased in a competitor store.

Then when the investigation starts I'd pull out the receipts and talk to my solicitor.

Don't do this as you could be seen to bait a negative situation which could look unfavorable for you if you then magically produce receipt. Its very easy to try setup a defamation however if this new security issue is aware of and then you play such games it could go against you.

Best bet is just to challenge them and seek legal advice if they try force an issue, try force a contract change without prior consent or in the worst case try to dismiss you for not wanting to accept unreasonable change of terms to your contract.

You could argue the point that a refusal to take part in such a practice without consent does NOT provide an admission of liability or guilt.

allthedoyles

It's in my contract , so employer can search the car

odyssey06

Would it not make more sense to put cctv in the staff car park?
This doesnt seem proportionate.

the whole year inn

allthedoyles wrote: »

It's in my contract , so employer can search the car

Are you sure thats legal even if its in the contract.
I always thought no body can check you bag or person/car unless its a guard.
I wouldnt mind poping the boot but going though the car I would nt let it happen .
It really puts a negative vibe to the staff.
Has anyone been caught stealing?

GarIT

Keep a ridiculously large dildo on the boot if they insist on having a loot.

AndrewJRenko

CruelCoin wrote: »

This is another example i think of people being precious with their privacy.

What are you carrying in your car that you'd have an issue with them seeing?

Most of us have cd's bits of receipts, some coins and maybe some pens strewn around the place....

Why would you jeopardise your relationship there over what's really a non-issue?

Maybe you have your set of clothes for your other gender? Or your very large, overflowing bag of sex toys? Or maybe you have the tools and equipment for your other job which has nothing to do with this job?


Who cares - it's not the employer's business either way.

allthedoyles

the whole year inn wrote: »

Are you sure thats legal even if its in the contract.
I always thought no body can check you bag or person/car unless its a guard.
I wouldnt mind poping the boot but going though the car I would nt let it happen .
It really puts a negative vibe to the staff.
Has anyone been caught stealing?

not aware of it ever been activated against an employee

Jim2007

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

I'd be filing up my car boot with a load of merchandise purchased in a competitor store.

Then when the investigation starts I'd pull out the receipts and talk to my solicitor.

Sure you would, because you don’t need the job right?

GarIT

Jim2007 wrote: »

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

I'd be filing up my car boot with a load of merchandise purchased in a competitor store.

Then when the investigation starts I'd pull out the receipts and talk to my solicitor.

Sure you would, because you don’t need the job right?

Nobody does right now. We're at as close to 100% employment as we can get, shops are crying out for staff and will take anyone that applies.

Sleeper12

the_pen_turner wrote:

What builders providers do this. If never seen it in any I have been.

Davis in Harmonstown. Chadwicks. Heaton Buckley & many more. Pretty much anyway they have a security on the gate are supposed to be doing this. If the security isn't checking he's not doing his job.

Dardania

Sleeper12 wrote: »

the_pen_turner wrote:

What builders providers do this. If never seen it in any I have been.

Davis in Harmonstown. Chadwicks. Heaton Buckley & many more. Pretty much anyway they have a security on the gate are supposed to be doing this. If the security isn't checking he's not doing his job.

Can confirm, my car was inspected any time leaving Heiton Buckleys in Bray, as a customer. Although it depends if you drive out from the customer parking, or the yard at the back - the yard at the back seems more intensely scrutinised.

the_pen_turner

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Davis in Harmonstown. Chadwicks. Heaton Buckley & many more. Pretty much anyway they have a security on the gate are supposed to be doing this. If the security isn't checking he's not doing his job.

it must be a big city thing. its years since iv seen security down the country. .


what happens if you refuse. they cant stop you leaving. and you havnt stolen anything until you have left.

they would need proof that you put the item into your vehicle. having it in there wouldnt be enough.

Sleeper12

the_pen_turner wrote:

what happens if you refuse. they cant stop you leaving. and you havnt stolen anything until you have left.

Last time I was in chadwicks coolock there was a barrier that wasn't lifted till van was searched.

I doubt they can legally stop you leaving without a search

aroundthehouse

your vehicle is private property, they have no right to search it unless its used for work purposes or is brought on to the work property, if its left in the staff car park i'm sure they have a sign that reads the management accepts no responsibility for any damage done to your vehicle etc... this means you are responsible for your own vehicle and this works both ways which means they have no right to search it unless they get a warrant on reasonable grounds to believe you have stolen from them...

To be honest if i were you I would seriously consider getting a new job, i thinks is appalling that an employer would see fit to search an employees vehicle

Riskymove

I think an issue here is the word "search"

In the scenarios of Guinness and Chadwicks etc given, the guard can look in the booth or van to ensure that any goods tally with the docket

in neither situation can the guards search your car (e.g. look in glove box or go through personal belongings)

the_pen_turner

An employee situation is a lot trickier you have to think about your job.

I wouldn't let a shop look in my van purely on principle. They are accusing you of stealing.

Unless the y have evidence then any search is a waste if time. A lot of serial number s wouldn't be unique enough to say that was next in line on the pallet.

I have often bought stuff in one shop then went to another 10 min later and bought more if the hadn't enough.

C3PO

Searching employees' cars is not that unusual - I've seen it happening in a number of places over the years! Usually a look into the boot as the car exits the security barrier as somebody described earlier. I wouldn't have a problem as long as everybody's car was getting the same treatment! You're not obliged to arrive in a car or to park it on the employers premises!

mikemac2

APMagic wrote: »

One of HR pushed their luck by searching a bag without anyone being there.

Ask this person in HR will their car be searched also? Yeah they work in an office but they can easily stroll to storerooms too

Sleeper12

I'd imagine prison officers would be subject to random searches to ensure that they are not bringing in contraband

KevinCavan

Have a ski mask, an imitation firearm and some cable ties in your boot?

Mrs OBumble

OP, just catch the bus or park elsewhere. Your type of workplace is high-risk for employee theft, and employers who want to stay in business put in place controls to discourage and detect it. If they didn't, then you'd likely be out of a job.