Solar panels

dmessiah

Hi how much is it to get solar panels now for a 3 bed .for eletricity.is it worth it? How long do the panels last?can you sell back to the grid?and how much grant is there.
Thanks

2011

dmessiah wrote: »

Hi how much is it to get solar panels now for a 3 bed

Depends on lots of things, like how many panels? Do you want to store the power generated, sell to the grid or use immediately? Do you want your home to run in island mode independent of the grid?

for eletricity.is it worth it?

If you want to save the planet, yes if you want to save money probably not.

How long do the panels last?

A long time. Very little discernible performance reduction after 20 years.

can you sell back to the grid?and how much grant is there.

It’s possible but generally not worth it.

Sleeper12

It does not seem possible to sell back to the grid any more in Ireland. You can give your excess to the grid.

I looked at storing the energy but the battery is mad money. Over 10k for a battery if me serves.

Like solar thermal it's a long way off before it pays for itself. 10 years or so. The cost of equipment is slowly coming down and electricity is get more expensive. This will make it better value in a few years.

It is value for money now if someone is in the house all day. You can heat a full tank of water, run washing machine and dishwasher. All these appliances would need to run one at a time to make the most of your free electricity. If no one is in the house all day you'll have a tank of hot water.

dmessiah

10 years is a long time .so what would it be about half of your electrics for a month mine averages 80 a month.

No thanks to storing it if its over 10k

Typical ireland that you cant sell it back unlike other countries .we get nothing from the greedy little men that have ruled us for so many years once their pockets are full.

So would it be around 5k for normal 3 bed semi detached house .

Sleeper12

dmessiah wrote:

So would it be around 5k for normal 3 bed semi detached house .

I think that would be about right with a dedicated solar company but I'd hazard a guess that your local electrician would be cheaper & do as good a job.

I think I read about grants for pv solar due to come into effect in the next month or two. Might be worth having a look at that. I'd imagine all the details would be on the SEI website

2011

2011 wrote: »

If you want to save the planet, yes if you want to save money probably not.

We are only trying to save the humans, the planet is more resilient.


10k a battery
(worth an extra €6k if you can hang it on a wall)

I hope that salesman bought you dinner first...;)


Solar is the most affordable way to power an installation without utility facilities.

bleary

Announcement today of new grants for solar and batteries and increase in insulation grants might be of interest

https://merrionstreet.ie/en/News-Room/Releases/Minister_Denis_Naughten_launches_pilot_Micro_Generation_scheme_targeting_domestic_customers_and_self-consumption.html

2011

I’m not a fan of batteries for grid connected systems for obvious reasons. I would rather use excess energy to heat water.

2011

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

We are only trying to save the humans, the planet is more resilient.

I think that most people in the ROI that install PV solar panels in a domestic install are doing it because they care about the environment. The return on investment is so long in most cases that I can’t see why else they would do it. There are of course a few exceptions, but not many.

10k a battery
(worth an extra €6k if you can hang it on a wall)

Not sure what you mean. Are you referring to Tesla’s offering?

Solar is the most affordable way to power an installation without utility facilities.

I don’t think it is as black and white as that.
There are many variables.

MoodeRator

So how much does a battery and 2 kwp cost to install?

The maximum grant support levels are as follows:
Solar PV Systems €700/kWp
Battery Storage €1,000

ted1

You have to buy a battery when going bigger than 2Kw what a joke.

chewed

hijacking this thread!

If you were to use solar power to charge an Electric car (e.g. in the evening/overnight), would you require a battery (to store the solar electricity)?

2011

chewed wrote: »

If you were to use solar power to charge an Electric car

You would require an acre of solar panels (slight exaggeration, but not much).

Sleeper12

chewed wrote:

If you were to use solar power to charge an Electric car (e.g. in the evening/overnight), would you require a battery (to store the solar electricity)?

No sunlight at night so you can store the power in a battery during the day and then use the battery to help charge the car

I'm not convinced, even with the grant, that a battery is value for money

The car has a battery.

I don't see any merit in the current grant unless I can get a few €1000 off my solar array by installing a 6Ah USB power bank to qualify.

Feed in tariffs would be far greener and beneficial to the network. Too much li-ion Kool Aid uptake these days.

2011

2011 wrote: »

You would require an acre of solar panels (slight exaggeration, but not much).

20kWp would charge most fully depleted car batts on the market ona good day.

200m² ± array.

2011 wrote: »

Not sure what you mean. Are you referring to Tesla’s offering?

That and the rest of the bandwagon.



^ 45kWh battery, delivered from Poland complete with recombinant gas and minimal upkeep, auto levelling, low maintenance watering system & automated anti-stratification device.

ted1

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

20kWp would charge most fully depleted car batts on the market ona good day.

200m² ± array.



That and the rest of the bandwagon.



^ 45kWh battery, delivered from Poland complete with recombinant gas and minimal upkeep, auto levelling, low maintenance watering system & automated anti-stratification device.

Are you sure it’s 48Kwh? Quote just says 48v


Does the 630 mean 630w so 4.4 kWh

Yes I am sure. I build batteries.
kWh figure calculated at C80 discharge.

Clicky

ted1

Can you show the calcs?

I’m intreseted in seen how they come up with 45 kWh with only 24 cells

2011

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

20kWp would charge most fully depleted car batts on the market ona good day.

200m² ± array.

A 200m² array?
This would be an issue for many houses. I don’t have enough roof area facing south.

ted1

ted1 wrote: »

Can you show the calcs?

I’m intreseted in seen how they come up with 45 kWh with only 24 cells

875Ah (battery Capacity @ C80) x 2.1V x 24Cells = 44.1kWh±

2011 wrote: »

A 200m² array?
This would be an issue for many houses. I don’t have enough roof area facing south.

It's a lot smaller than an acre!

Use a hybrid system if you haven't the real estate. East, South, West and Horizontal are all good options.
Realistically few people will use more than 30% of an 80kWh battery in their daily commute. ....I'd be highly confident car manufacturers have inflated the battery capacity figures anyway let's say moot point compensating for efficiency looses.

ted1

ted1 wrote: »

only 24 cells

Each cell is 45kg.

2011

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

It's a lot smaller than an acre!

Agreed, this is why I said "slight exaggeration, but not much".
200m² may as well be an acre for most people.

I don't see charging electric vehicles with solar panels in domestic installations catching on in this part of the world. Apart from the cost benefit analysis unlikely to work out few would have the roof space and then there would also be planning required for something this size I would imagine.

A 2000% overspec is a large amount in my book but maybe I'm splitting hairs...

You get between 3 and 6 times the rated power in energy from solar that is well sited, most of the year, is all I have to say, the rest is application dependant.

IIRC you need planning permission for >6 modules.

2011

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

A 2000% overspec is a large amount in my book but maybe I'm splitting hairs...

Not splitting hairs, just labouring the point.
Once again, the acre reference was an exaggeration.

I am still of the opinion that installing solar panels on houses to charge electric vehicles just won't catch on, which is my main point.

Of course.

They are better suited to demand offsetting. They do this very well. Car, toaster all the same to an electron.

unkel

2011 wrote: »

You would require an acre of solar panels (slight exaggeration, but not much).

No you wouldn't need an acre of solar panels!

The average Irish car does 17k km per year. That's 46km per day. My car has a range of 240km, and a usable battery of 28kWh

The daily 46km in my car uses just over 5kWh

With a modest enough 10 panel solar PV setup, you can produce this in less than 2 hours on a bright day in summer. I'd say this setup would be able to fully charge the car on over 250 days of the year, but obviously not on a dark rainy day in winter. This system produces about 3,000kWh per year. Or just shy of the average Irish household consumption of 3,500kWh per year

2011

unkel wrote: »

No you wouldn't need an acre of solar panels!

Agreed.
Read back through the thread, this “exaggeration” has been covered to death.

Although I agree that electric vehicles are the future chargeing then from solar panels mounted of the owner’s home has not caught on and won’t in the near future.

Have you done this in your home?
If not why not?

unkel

2011 wrote: »

Although I agree that electric vehicles are the future chargeing then from solar panels mounted of the owner’s home has not caught on and won’t in the near future.

Agreed that it hasn't caught on. The whole EV business hasn't caught on here, with only 0.1% of current Irish private cars being EVs (one of the lowest percentages in Europe)

And most EV owners charger their cars up at night at a very cheap and very green (lot of it from wind) 7c/kWh

2011 wrote: »

Have you done this in your home?
If not why not?

I have installed 2 arrays of solar PV in my home since I got my EV. These are used for my high background electricity use at the moment (and not for charging my car). I do plan to install more PV in the very near future (before next summer) and hope to either charge my car with it, or sell it back to the grid, or both

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unkel wrote: »

Agreed that it hasn't caught on. The whole EV business hasn't caught on here, with only 0.1% of current Irish private cars being EVs (one of the lowest percentages in Europe)

And most EV owners charger their cars up at night at a very cheap and very green (lot of it from wind) 7c/kWh



I have installed 2 arrays of solar PV in my home since I got my EV. These are used for my high background electricity use at the moment (and not for charging my car). I do plan to install more PV in the very near future (before next summer) and hope to either charge my car with it, or sell it back to the grid, or both

Any chance you could post up exactly what you have?

2011

unkel wrote: »

Agreed that it hasn't caught on. The whole EV business hasn't caught on here, with only 0.1% of current Irish private cars being EVs (one of the lowest percentages in Europe)

Even within that small group that have EV's charging from solar panels has not caught on no matter what way you look at it.

I think that the cost benefit analysis would demonstrate that there are quicker ways to get a return on your investment.

I have installed 2 arrays of solar PV in my home since I got my EV. These are used for my high background electricity use at the moment (and not for charging my car).

Fair enough.

Do you know anyone in a domestic installation that has installed enough solar panels to charge a car? I certainly don't and I believe that this is due to the cost and size of the array required, which is my central point. Do you agree with me on that?

I know that an acre sized solar array is not required to charge the average EV. This is why I consistently described this as an exaggeration, so lets take that as read. However, it will require a larger array than anyone is prepared to install in a domestic installation to date in Ireland with perhaps only one or two exceptions (if even that). So we can argue back and forth about the size of the array required, but my point still remains.