How not to cycle past a horse

wexandproud

Lumen wrote: »

Oh and nee, I still think you're being unreasonable with your request to ask permission to pass.

That's not what it says in the law, and it's not what happens in practice. I live on a horsey road and in the hundreds of passes I've done there is no permission asked nor given, just a smile and a wave from either or both parties at some point in the manoeuvre which is nothing like asking or giving permission.

to be fair i dont think it was meant literally as asking for permission , more a case of will the horse be spooked if i pass or am i ok to get by.
There are a couple of roads down here where we meet horses regularly and if we meet them we slow down a bit and the lead jockey knowing the horse has spotted us will say your grand lads , thanks , and we move on . If we come up behind them the first rider lets the last jockey know were there and he shouts to the other jockeys , we keep right and the jockeys seem to turn the horses slightly right so the nags can see us , ''are we ok '' ? '' sure your grand lads go ahead , thanks
not really asking permission just a bit if courtesy

rushfan

Wishbone Ash wrote:

Last year a woman on horseback said that my Lycra was frightening her horse. The horse didn't seem agitated and was simply standing at the edge of the roadway. We met on a very steep incline and I was going very slowly and quietly on probably an 18-20% gradient (near the bottom of the first part of 'The Wall').

Sounds like it might have been a chat up line.

Lusk_Doyle

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

Last year a woman on horseback said that my Lycra was frightening her horse. The horse didn't seem agitated and was simply standing at the edge of the roadway. We met on a very steep incline and I was going very slowly and quietly on probably an 18-20% gradient (near the bottom of the first part of 'The Wall').

I'm not sure what she expected me to do.

I have trouble believing this. One does not "quietly" go up an 18 - 20% incline!

07Lapierre

Lusk_Doyle wrote: »

I have trouble believing this. One does not "quietly" go up an 18 - 20% incline!

+1 If it was me you'd hear my crying!

AxleAddict

My thighs would be squeaking like two balloons being rubbed together - not good - for anyone within earshot!

tigerboon

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

Last year a woman on horseback said that my Lycra was frightening her horse.

But not her....

Ave Sodalis

ConnyMcDavid wrote:

Why should something that gets intimidated by motor noise and speed be allowed on a road that is built for things with motor noise and speed? Just because horses used to have sole use of roads back in the day doesn't give them a right today. They have trailors nowadays.

Horses, as actually demonstrated in the video posted earlier, can become accustomed to loud noises and motor noises. Most of them, with the proper experiences, get used to it quite quickly. Some even just need to have a minute to figure something new out and then they're happy. The problem with bikes is often their silence coming up behind. A horse who is used to bikes will have no issues with approaching a bike. The main issue with any other road user is the lack of acknowledgement that the horse a)may be young and not yet used to other road users or b) a horse can be spooked by something in a hedge and can move in any direction rapidly therefore it's safer for all involved to give them room and slow down.

It's not just cyclists. I've had motorists rev their engines beside me, I've had ones overtake me when their was barely enough room, and I've had ones drive so close behind me their bumper touched the hocks of the horse I was on. I've had pedestrians refuse to put down their hoods (it wasn't raining at the time) which was causing the horse to worry but they still walked towards the horse. I've had tractors barrel past me without slowing.

PS horses not only do have a right to be on the road, they have right of way.

LennoxR

I had one encounter with a horse once that was unpleasant. Basically I passed quickly on a descent and the horse got a bit spooked and kind of jumped on all fours. So anyway the rider, a woman, started cursing at me. Being a little hot tempered myself I actually cycled back the hill to enquire what the problem was. The woman apologised for cursing and explained that horses get spooked sometimes if things creep up on them quietly from behind.

So anyway, since then, that was about four years ago, when I'm approaching a horse from behind on a bike, I slow down and announce my presence. And the riders usually acknowledge my presence and move to one side. No more issues. So I think that's the way to go.

guanciale

My post is not about the triathletes in this incident but about some if the advice here.
Much advice suggests that a rider approaching from the rear should alert the horse rider in a manner that wont alarm the horse (how I am supposed to know what is acceptable?).

The difficulty is that a local stable owner has told me in the past that I should never interact with the jockey and horse, to stay well back and overtake wide when safe. His view was that there is no difference to the overtake whether you are a car or a bike.

Why would he say this and should I now change?

Ave Sodalis

guanciale wrote: »

My post is not about the triathletes in this incident but about some if the advice here.
Much advice suggests that a rider approaching from the rear should alert the horse rider in a manner that wont alarm the horse (how I am supposed to know what is acceptable?).

The difficulty is that a local stable owner has told me in the past that I should never interact with the jockey and horse, to stay well back and overtake wide when safe. His view was that there is no difference to the overtake whether you are a car or a bike.

Why would he say this and should I now change?

Perhaps it suits his horses best, but I think it's poor enough advice in general. Suddenly having a bike behind a horse may or may not go well. I think a simple "excuse me" when you're in ear shot and asking how best to proceed is the easiest way forward. Most of the time, a rider will have no problems with you passing once they and the horse are aware of you. However, it might be a narrow bit of road, it might be that the horse is getting to a spooky bit of road that has nothing to do with the cyclist, there might be a pull in further up, or it might be that they're on a young/nervous horse, so sometimes passing at that time isn't particularly safe for anyone.



If the yard owner is happy enough for you to over take in that way, then I'd keep going that way. However, you may not always meet horse riders from his yard so maybe just keep an eye out too. I'm not sure why he said you should never interact with them though.

Lusk_Doyle

I've always done it with "coming up on your right" and have never had an issue as I pass far to the right and slowly with the jockey having seen me, acknowledged me and prepared the horse/themselves.

eeeee

Generally, if I'm approaching from behind, I slow right down, I hang about two lengths back to the right of horse and rider (horses have blind spots directly in front and behind them), so the horse has a chance to see me, I cough, or say hi, or make eye contact, and either go when they wave me on or acknowledge me in a positive way if you know what I mean. Then pass right over the other side of the road when it's safe to do so, out of the hoof zone!
If they're coming towards me, I slow right down, stay left on my side of the road, make eye contact with the riders (or say hi depending on the situation), they nod or wave or say hi and when it's safe to continue I do.

Riding, horses are aware of what's around them before you are, and take their confidence from the rider when faced with something unfamiliar (or not and begin prance/cartheeling procedures :pac: ), so engaging the rider is important so that as you get closer the rider knows that if they suddenly start going sideways, up or suddenly forwards they're prepared and know what to ride into.

Glass fused light

guanciale wrote: »

My post is not about the triathletes in this incident but about some if the advice here.
Much advice suggests that a rider approaching from the rear should alert the horse rider in a manner that wont alarm the horse (how I am supposed to know what is acceptable?).

The difficulty is that a local stable owner has told me in the past that I should never interact with the jockey and horse, to stay well back and overtake wide when safe. His view was that there is no difference to the overtake whether you are a car or a bike.

Why would he say this and should I now change?

A horse has better hearing that humans, you may note in the clip the horses ears were moving tracking the sound while it remained looking forward.

It's the exact same as if you are walking along a narrow country road without looking back. What sounds would cause you to worry that your safety was at risk from the actions of someone comming up from behind you, what sounds would you miss and be startled by when you realised something was right behind you or passing you without warning.

Once the animal can hear you coming it can try assess the danger your present, some of this will be relying on the reaction that the rider has too.

Slow and steady sound is not going to be a major issue so a slow car, peoples voices are fine same with a bell ringing at an interval a long way out.
Sudden sounds matched with a speedy arrival is the equivalent of a friend jumping out from a wall and shouting boo at you.

Most people will jump from the unexpected, but sometimes not

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3sB9p8mh6Y

youtube.com/watch?v=b3sB9p8mh6Y

Just make sure that the rider is aware of you because what you think is safe and what the horse thinks can be 2 different things, in a car the bodywork takes the damage on a bike it's your body at risk (and the rider&horse) Most riders will indicate when it's safe to pass or not if given time. The body language of the horse will too the position of its ears and head and a relaxed body.

Balanadan

Arcade_Tryer wrote: »

Five or six cyclists at the end of the video went by fine. Not saying I know better than you or others who hang around large animals. I'm saying I know better than you when you say that all of the cyclists in the video behaved dangerously. They simply didn't. And it's unfair to say they all did.

They simply didn't go by fine. The one or two that actually left reasonable space were still going far too quickly. I take it you weren't fortunate enough to attend the College of Common Sense?

eeeee

Balanadan wrote: »

They simply didn't go by fine. The one or two that actually left reasonable space were still going far too quickly. I take it you weren't fortunate enough to attend the College of Common Sense?

Don't start it again!

On a more serious note, Mod Note: no personal abuse please. Any questions pm me do not respond in thread.

Arcade_Tryer

Balanadan wrote: »

They simply didn't go by fine. The one or two that actually left reasonable space were still going far too quickly. I take it you weren't fortunate enough to attend the College of Common Sense?

Hay, at least I attended college.

gctest50

Arcade_Tryer wrote: »

Hay, at least I attended college.

And if you startle the wrong horse, you will discover time-travel !

when you wake up it'll be 2019, with a face like a kebab

Lusk_Doyle

nee wrote: »

Don't start it again!

On a more serious note, Mod Note: no personal abuse please. Any questions pm me do not respond in thread.

Not posted in bold font so no deal.

Wailin

LennoxR wrote: »

I had one encounter with a horse once that was unpleasant. Basically I passed quickly on a descent and the horse got a bit spooked and kind of jumped on all fours. So anyway the rider, a woman, started cursing at me. Being a little hot tempered myself I actually cycled back the hill to enquire what the problem was. The woman apologised for cursing and explained that horses get spooked sometimes if things creep up on them quietly from behind.

So anyway, since then, that was about four years ago, when I'm approaching a horse from behind on a bike, I slow down and announce my presence. And the riders usually acknowledge my presence and move to one side. No more issues. So I think that's the way to go.

Would expect nothing less from some cyclists to react the way you did, like an entitled indignant child. You did exactly what those muppets did in the video and you'd the gall to get contrary with the rider who'd nearly had a serious incident. She was right to **** you out of it.

Fighting Tao

Wailin wrote: »

Would expect nothing less from some cyclists to react the way you did, like an entitled indignant child. You did exactly what those muppets did in the video and you'd the gall to get contrary with the rider who'd nearly had a serious incident. She was right to **** you out of it.

Over react much? He/She didn't know and learned from it. Would you prefer that he/she didn't learn and did it again?

secman

I generally do a quick calc of the length of the horses legs, in particular his hind legs and pass a safe distance accordingly .

AndrewJRenko

Ave Sodalis wrote: »

It's not just cyclists. I've had motorists rev their engines beside me, I've had ones overtake me when their was barely enough room, and I've had ones drive so close behind me their bumper touched the hocks of the horse I was on. I've had pedestrians refuse to put down their hoods (it wasn't raining at the time) which was causing the horse to worry but they still walked towards the horse. I've had tractors barrel past me without slowing.

PS horses not only do have a right to be on the road, they have right of way.

I've learnt a lot from this thread, and didn't know that I should check with a rider before passing, but are hoods really an issue?

Honestly, if a person wearing a hood is going to be a problem, I'd be thinking that the horse shouldn't be out on a public road.

Ave Sodalis

AndrewJRenko wrote:

I've learnt a lot from this thread, and didn't know that I should check with a rider before passing, but are hoods really an issue?

Not usually but it was one of those massive ones with the fur around it that completely hid her face so she no longer looked "human". The horse quite obviously having a freak out at it and she still walked towards him.

AndrewJRenko wrote:

Honestly, if a person wearing a hood is going to be a problem, I'd be thinking that the horse shouldn't be out on a public road.

The horse is actually almost completely bombproof and was completely fine when the girl finally lowered the hood. It was an underage girl smoking, which is why she was hiding her face. I didn't care what she was doing though, I just didn't want anyone hurt.

Glass fused light

secman wrote: »

I generally do a quick calc of the length of the horses legs, in particular his hind legs and pass a safe distance accordingly .

Don't forget to factor in its ability to run forward at an angle and kick out at the same time.

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

I've learnt a lot from this thread, and didn't know that I should check with a rider before passing, but are hoods really an issue?

Honestly, if a person wearing a hood is going to be a problem, I'd be thinking that the horse shouldn't be out on a public road.

Any animal has the ability to read body language and the face and eyes are important in this. The horse is risk assessing just like you would if you were approached by a shifty looking lad on a street corner with his hood pulled up. Or the horse may have had a bad experience or fright from someone in a hood.

secman

How do horses feel about shades ?

eeeee

secman wrote: »

How do horses feel about shades ?

Depends on the horse. Larger frames suit the Thoroughbreds, fine lines, long faces, Jackie O style, buttier types like cobs or Connemara's are better with a more flamboyant, winged and funkier style. :P

AndrewJRenko

Ave Sodalis wrote: »

Not usually but it was one of those massive ones with the fur around it that completely hid her face so she no longer looked "human". The horse quite obviously having a freak out at it and she still walked towards him.


The horse is actually almost completely bombproof and was completely fine when the girl finally lowered the hood. It was an underage girl smoking, which is why she was hiding her face. I didn't care what she was doing though, I just didn't want anyone hurt.

Glass fused light wrote: »

Any animal has the ability to read body language and the face and eyes are important in this. The horse is risk assessing just like you would if you were approached by a shifty looking lad on a street corner with his hood pulled up. Or the horse may have had a bad experience or fright from someone in a hood.

I'm not blaming the horse or criticising the horse. If he reacts badly to people with hoods, then so be it - I just think the rider can't be taking it out on on a public road where there is a fair chance they will meet people with hoods.

Glass fused light

Ave Sodalis wrote: »

Not usually but it was one of those massive ones with the fur around it that completely hid her face so she no longer looked "human". The horse quite obviously having a freak out at it and she still walked towards him.

You've got to remember to draw the curtains and stop showing werewolf films to the horses, bad enough that they have to watch the sports and cycling but you got to draw a line somewhere

Ave Sodalis

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

I'm not blaming the horse or criticising the horse. If he reacts badly to people with hoods, then so be it - I just think the rider can't be taking it out on on a public road where there is a fair chance they will meet people with hoods.

He doesn't usually spook at hoods. This hood just happened to be very large and completely covered the girl's face. Not your common, run of the mill hood. Normal hoods the horse is well used to, considering I and others at the yard have to work regardless of weather. He's even used to balaclavas since I wear one in winter.



My point wasn't that the girl had her hood up, it was that she made the situation far more dangerous by refusing to stop and lower the hood. If she had pulled it down the first time I asked, nobody would have been in any danger. I'm saying it's not just cyclists that can cause issues on the road for horse riders.

Rechuchote

If you offend a horse you're likely to graduate rapidly from the School of Hard Knocks.