Cut to child benifit for people earning over 100k to help fund childcare

Idbatterim

Idbatterim wrote: »

I read this earlier, costing a billion a year, it should be scrapped!

https://m.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/donohoe-sparks-fears-of-cuts-to-generous-pension-tax-relief-37016481.html

No it certainly should not, again trying to gouge more from people who are trying to plan for their future. Disgusting. There should be tax cuts and more pension relief for those paying tax at the higher rate not talk of reducing it to further support the welfare classes, baby producing machines and other useless layabouts.

Blaas4life

If all children are equal....surly the level of child support should be equal irregardless of parents income?

steddyeddy

Lily Melodic Squeegee wrote: »

No it certainly should not, again trying to gouge more from people who are trying to plan for their future. Disgusting. There should be tax cuts and more pension relief for those paying tax at the higher rate not talk of reducing it to further support the welfare classes, baby producing machines and other useless layabouts.

Earlier in the thread you claimed your mother did indeed wash your clothes for you. Please stop taking a moral high ground regarding work ethic. It's insulting to people like me who does work hard.

steddyeddy

steddyeddy wrote: »

Earlier in the thread you claimed your mother did indeed wash your clothes for you. Please stop taking a moral high ground regarding work ethic. It's insulting to people like me who does work hard.

Would you ever give it a rest, bowing your own trumpet. Someone washing your clothes for you some of the time has nothing to do with work ethic or how hard a person works (it's just normal family behaviour). If you think it does you are sadly mistaken.

steddyeddy

Blaas4life wrote: »

If all children are equal....surly the level of child support should be equal irregardless of parents income?

But countless studies show that they're not. The quality of education the child receives as well as socio-economic group dictates their future. So maybe the level of support should match the need.

salonfire

Lily Melodic Squeegee wrote: »

No it certainly should not, again trying to gouge more from people who are trying to plan for their future. Disgusting. There should be tax cuts and more pension relief for those paying tax at the higher rate not talk of reducing it to further support the welfare classes, baby producing machines and other useless layabouts.

You would be in favour then of cutting the old age pension?

Because that is probably the most significant spend on Welfare and increasing all the time due to aging population.

salonfire

salonfire wrote: »

You would be in favour then of cutting the old age pension?

Because that is probably the most significant spend on Welfare and increasing all the time due to aging population.

No, the old age pension is for those who have worked hard and they deserve every cent of it.

Its the people who never worked we need to tackle and put out on their ear not though who worked all their life. Coupe this with bringing the people into the tax net and ask them to contribute a very small amount, as this is a lot of people the extra income would be significant and allow cuts to though who deserve it, paying massive tax on very normal wages and subsidising large amounts of people who pay little or nothing or have the hand out for dole, housing etc.

steddyeddy

Lily Melodic Squeegee wrote: »

Would you ever give it a rest, bowing your own trumpet. Someone washing your clothes for you some of the time has nothing to do with work ethic or how hard a person works (it's just normal family behaviour). If you think it does you are sadly mistaken.

I find those with the right wing attitudes towards work are often the most sensitive to their own handouts.

salonfire

Lily Melodic Squeegee wrote: »

No, the old age pension is for those who have worked hard and they deserve every cent of it.

Its the people who never worked we need to tackle and put out on their ear not though who worked all their life. Coupe this with bringing the people into the tax net and ask them to contribute a very small amount, as this is a lot of people the extra income would be significant and allow cuts to though who deserve it, paying massive tax on very normal wages and subsidising large amounts of people who pay little or nothing or have the hand out for dole, housing etc.

Oh OK, so you don't actually give a sh*t about the spending amounts or balancing budgets or whatever, as long as the recipients are those you approve of.

Should the Finance Minister run it by you first if you approve those benefitting from the Welfare budget?

salonfire

steddyeddy wrote: »

I find those with the right wing attitudes towards work are often the most sensitive to their own handouts.

Nox wants those who he considers as 'deserving' to pay less tax while at the same getting all the benefits they 'deserve'.

He doesn't give a damn about anything else and thinks the unemployed are out to rob him of his money. Odd, considering the number of people unemployed has tumbled in recent years.

Idbatterim

Lily Melodic Squeegee wrote: »

No, the old age pension is for those who have worked hard and they deserve every cent of it.

Its the people who never worked we need to tackle and put out on their ear not though who worked all their life. Coupe this with bringing the people into the tax net and ask them to contribute a very small amount, as this is a lot of people the extra income would be significant and allow cuts to though who deserve it, paying massive tax on very normal wages and subsidising large amounts of people who pay little or nothing or have the hand out for dole, housing etc.

oh I totally agree. I think the billion saved should go towards usc abolition. Ideally reducing only the marginal rate, but that will never happen here ...

steddyeddy

salonfire wrote: »

Nox wants those who he considers as 'deserving' to pay less tax while at the same getting all the benefits they 'deserve'.

He doesn't give a damn about anything else and thinks the unemployed are out to rob him of his money. Odd, considering the number of people unemployed has tumbled in recent years.

That's it. It's nothing to do with fairness in this case. It's to do with whatever benefits one specific group at the expense of the others.

Nermal

Idbatterim wrote: »

I read this earlier, costing a billion a year, it should be scrapped!

https://m.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/donohoe-sparks-fears-of-cuts-to-generous-pension-tax-relief-37016481.html

It takes a truly warped viewpoint to construe not applying tax as a 'cost'.

Idbatterim

Nermal wrote: »

It takes a truly warped viewpoint to construe not applying tax as a 'cost'.

You’re right to a point. I just don’t agree with taxing at an insane rate, the billion euro should go to reducing it. Young and Middle Age are screwed here, I’m not worried about surviving when retired, I’m worried about now!

Cyrus

steddyeddy wrote: »

That's it. It's nothing to do with fairness in this case. It's to do with whatever benefits one specific group at the expense of the others.

The more is only one specific group he is targeting

steddyeddy

steddyeddy wrote: »

I find those with the right wing attitudes towards work are often the most sensitive to their own handouts.

Yeah because having your clothes washed is a handout :rolleyes:, especially considering it is usually being done while I am working hard on the farm during my weekends or other time
Off from work.

Idbatterim wrote: »

oh I totally agree. I think the billion saved should go towards usc abolition. Ideally reducing only the marginal rate, but that will never happen here ...

As has been pointed out the problem with getting rid of USC is that it should the only tax that many lower earners pay so if you get rid of it you narrow the tax net and out even more reliance on those already being robbed with the higher rate of tax.

salonfire

Lily Melodic Squeegee wrote: »

Yeah because having your clothes washed is a handout :rolleyes:, especially considering it is usually being done while I am working hard on the farm during my weekends or other time
Off from work.

Your farm is fully self-sufficient I take it and are not in receipt of any grants?

After all, we can't have farmers 'scrounging' off our hard earned taxes, especially yours since you are feeling you are getting robbed, particularly when it comes to things like third level grants.

salonfire

salonfire wrote: »

Your farm is fully self-sufficient I take it and are not in receipt of any grants?

After all, we can't have farmers 'scrounging' off our hard earned taxes, especially yours since you are feeling you are getting robbed, particularly when it comes to things like third level grants.

Like all farms it gets a fairly small amount of eu subsidies, the main reason being to have cheap food on the shelf for consumers. Get rid of grants and the cost of food would increase significantly so in reality it's a grant for consumers.

Also farm subsidies are from Europe not from our income tax or otherwise paid in Ireland and income tax is paid on farm subsidies so it's irrelevant to really to a conversation about taxation in Ireland.

salonfire

Lily Melodic Squeegee wrote: »

Like all farms it gets a fairly small amount of eu subsidies, the main reason being to have cheap food on the shelf for consumers. Get rid of grants and the cost of food would increase significantly so in reality it's a grant for consumers.

Also farm subsidies are from Europe not from our income tax or otherwise paid in Ireland and income tax is paid on farm subsidies so it's irrelevant to really to a conversation about taxation in Ireland.

OK, I'm trying to keep up here.

So welfare to farmers... Good
Welfare to pensioners... Good
Welfare to the unemployed... Bad

I think the Minister should just consult with you before spending your 'hard earned' money that was robbed from you.

Blaas4life

Lily Melodic Squeegee wrote: »

Like all farms it gets a fairly small amount of eu subsidies, the main reason being to have cheap food on the shelf for consumers. Get rid of grants and the cost of food would increase significantly so in reality it's a grant for consumers.

Also farm subsidies are from Europe not from our income tax or otherwise paid in Ireland and income tax is paid on farm subsidies so it's irrelevant to really to a conversation about taxation in Ireland.

If the grant is small....how come the cost of food would rise significantly??


Do you think ireland pays no tax to the EU?

salonfire

salonfire wrote: »

OK, I'm trying to keep up here.

So welfare to farmers... Good
Welfare to pensioners... Good
Welfare to the unemployed... Bad

I think the Minister should just consult with you before spending your 'hard earned' money that was robbed from you.

Farmers to not get welfare they work exceptionally hard and provide food for your table in turn they are paid a small farm payment for this.

It's not really welfare to pensioners - they have paid tax all their life so have covered the cost

Welfare to gunuine - short term unemployed = Good
Welfare to long term unemployed and many other types who never worked, expect free houses or free/very low rent, produce babies just to make more money from the system etc = Bad

Blaas4life wrote: »

If the grant is small....how come the cost of food would rise significantly??


Do you think ireland pays no tax to the EU?

Small individually and small for small farms. Spread it across all farms, especially very big farms then it would result in large rises. Its not a grant either its a farm payment. Its the only thing enabling some farms to make a small profit and the only think that enable many small and part-time farms to break even. All the profit is for the retailers but if the subside was taken then prices would rise a lot or else we end up losing lots of small farmers and thus ruin rural Ireland and what its all about.

J.pilkington

Idbatterim wrote: »

I read this earlier, costing a billion a year, it should be scrapped!

https://m.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/donohoe-sparks-fears-of-cuts-to-generous-pension-tax-relief-37016481.html

Please have a think about how the whole cycle works rather than just believing the headline of a thrash newspaper. It’s not the tax giveaway you think it is, it’s more of a postponement of tax plus plenty of other benefits to economy along the way;
- invest in pension and get a tax break, if anything this cools the economy as it pushes out spend to later years,
- jobs supported in pension fund industry,
- pension funds invest in items such as property
shares further stimulating economy,
- and key (that you seem to miss) is that when pension fund is cashed in tax is payable (although there are some tax free thresholds)
- people who draws a pension are a very important part of the economy (senior citizens spending help balance an economy such as spending off peak, new cars, helping kids) so then having less money impacts economy in a big way.
- even simple things like pensioners being able to pay private health insurance eases the burden on the state

If it needs to be tackled then lower the tax free encashment threshold not the tax break on investment

Blaas4life

Lily Melodic Squeegee wrote: »

Small individually and small for small farms. Spread it across all farms, especially very big farms then it would result in large rises. Its not a grant either its a farm payment. Its the only thing enabling some farms to make a small profit and the only think that enable many small and part-time farms to break even.

I agree...but I don't see what's the difference to tax payer wheter it's paid to a farmer or someone on the dole tbh and is paid out irregardless wheter someone works the farm or not

Hardly taxpayers problem wheter farmers make money or not??,we get it here and take it...it's money for jam like??...but most my income is off farm so I can see both sides of arguements here

salonfire

Lily Melodic Squeegee wrote: »

Welfare to long term unemployed and many other types who never worked, expect free houses or free/very low rent, produce babies just to make more money from the system etc = Bad

You have such a chip on your shoulder about these people .. in the context of Government spending, it is absolutely tiny.

Even if payments made to these cohort of people was stopped in the morning, you would barely see the saving in your Income Tax. €200 million was just handed over to consultants in the HSE this week. I don't see you object to that. Think that does not cost you anything?

As proven by the decline in employment, the vast majority of people are willing to work.

And as we know, this is a country full of shi**y low paid jobs (lower than you'd get on the scratcher); speaks volume of the willingness of people to work.

animaal

Idbatterim wrote: »

You’re right to a point. I just don’t agree with taxing at an insane rate, the billion euro should go to reducing it. Young and Middle Age are screwed here, I’m not worried about surviving when retired, I’m worried about now!

So as long as you're not worried about the future we should make it more difficult for others to consider their futures?

Would you have tax people on the contributions they save towards their pensions, and then tax it again when they draw it down? Because today it's taxed when it's drawn down.

Wheeliebin30

salonfire wrote: »

You have such a chip on your shoulder about these people .. in the context of Government spending, it is absolutely tiny.

Even if payments made to these cohort of people was stopped in the morning, you would barely see the saving in your Income Tax. €200 million was just handed over to consultants in the HSE this week. I don't see you object to that. Think that does not cost you anything?

As proven by the decline in employment, the vast majority of people are willing to work.

And as we know, this is a country full of shi**y low paid jobs (lower than you'd get on the scratcher); speaks volume of the willingness of people to work.

Which jobs are lower than 198 a week?