Rent Prices/Cost of Living off the wall

Gringo180

Average rent prices in Dublin now stands at 2k a month. I would say the vast majority of people working in the city would be on less than 12 or 13 euro per hour, thats around 1600/1800 euro take home pay per month after tax. How on earth are people suppose to afford any sort of decent lifestyle and have a roof over there head as well? Current min wage in the city is €9.55. Absolutely madness when you take into consideration the cost of living.

What a ****hole of a country or a society we have become.

stimpson

Gringo180 wrote: »

How on earth are people suppose to afford any sort of decent lifestyle and have a roof over there head as well?

Share.

Atoms for Peace

stimpson wrote: »

Share.

Communist!

Ronaldinho

Gringo180 wrote: »

How on earth are people suppose to afford any sort of decent lifestyle and have a roof over there head as well? Current min wage in the city is €9.55. Absolutely madness when you take into consideration the cost if living.

What a ****hole of a country or a society we have become.

Your standards sound too high. You can get a place for 400 pm no bother - you just share.

with 20 other people in a house

Not saying you're wrong but the average is a useful indicator of a city, but irrelevant when it comes to min wage workers.

SEPT 23 1989

I worked two jobs after my first child was born to pay rent and put food on the table it's not easy but that's just life

Grayson

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Not saying you're wrong but the average is a useful indicator of a city, but irrelevant when it comes to min wage workers.

But it is an indicator of what they can afford. A young couple has feck all chance of renting together. And if they did they'd never get a mortgage together.

Past generations could get a deposit together whilst renting. There's feck all chance of that now. Plus the average dubliner spends something like 50-60% on rent. That's really going to reduce their disposable income

Gringo180

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

I worked two jobs after my first child was born to pay rent and put food on the table it's not easy but that's just life

So when did u get to spend time with your family?

jimmycrackcorm

You don't have to spend your whole life working for minimum wage.

Franz Von Peppercorn

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

You don't have to spend your whole life working for minimum wage.

Some people do.

kneemos

We'll need 76,000 extra workers to cure the crisis apparently.
They'll also need somewhere to live along with our projected population increase.

Hardly any improvement anytime soon.

https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/ireland-doesnt-enough-skilled-construction-11272471

Gringo180

kneemos wrote: »

We'll need 76,000 extra workers to cure the crisis apparently.
They'll also need somewhere to live along with our projected population increase.

Hardly any improvement anytime soon.

https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/ireland-doesnt-enough-skilled-construction-11272471

How many men of working age are on the dole? Maybe an increase in minimum wage and an improvement in workers rights would entice them back to work.

kneemos

Gringo180 wrote: »

How many men of working age are on the dole? Maybe an increase in minimum wage and an improvement in workers rights would entice them back to work.

Probably little or none with the required skills or they'd already be working.

doolox

The reality is that married couples with families cannot afford to live in Dublin unless they were lucky enough to own their own house 15 yrs ago, got a big inheritance towards a house, have good jobs ( management level at least) or are willing to share with others.

This is the way for most low paid or min wage jobs in Dublin. They are mostly done by people living at home with parents or who have obtained local authority housing on the basis of being unemployed or on very low hours or money.

Most are living near their work and do not have cars or high fuel bills to contend with as they could not afford them. No job nearby means going on the dole or changing sectors to get a nearby job. Cutting costs is their highest goal.

Anyone without an economic link to Dublin or a need to be living in Dublin would be far better off getting out of it and buying a much cheaper house in the rural parts of Ireland.

I see this happening in my neighbourhood, 40 yrs built and the adult owners are retiring but have adult children still living with them. Many do childminding and keep lodgers to keep costs down. Others have two incomes and others are builders who do up the houses themselves after buying them cheaper than new builds. Other lucky people have built a second house on the big gardens on the end of terrace houses. Most people buying now have to think in terms of more than one job each to afford the high costs.

In the last 10 to 15 yrs the zones around the high cost cities has grown enormously. Dublin can include Offaly, Westmeath and Laois in the commuting belt. Wicklow, Louth and Kildare were always in there as dear places to live.
High cost areas around Galway now stretches to Ballinasloe, Gort and Tuam encompassing most of the county east of Spiddle and Oughterard and Moycullen as well.

The Government will have to look at providing housing for junior staff members in their payroll like years ago when Nurses had halls of residence, Guards were in Barracks and teachers were mostly nuns and brothers in convents and monasteries. A place to live will probably be have to be linked to your job or the won't get many takers of low paid jobs in high cost areas.

Bitches Be Trypsin

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

I worked two jobs after my first child was born to pay rent and put food on the table it's not easy but that's just life

That doesn't make it ok or right.

Gringo180

Bitches Be Trypsin wrote: »

That doesn't make it ok or right.

Exactly. Working two jobs is having absolutely ZERO quality of life.

Pugzilla

Just move out of Dublin. Plenty of small cities/ large towns with superior quality of life in Ireland.

Gringo180

kneemos wrote: »

Probably little or none with the required skills or they'd already be working.

But min wage jobs I am talking about. Raise it and you will entice people off the dole. Not making excuses but I can see why some choose to stay on the dole. Working min wage is about 360 per week after tax. Take into account lunches, transport costs you are lucky to be earning an extra 120 euro for 40 hours than sitting at home scratching the hole off yourself.

Wheeliebin30

There’s plenty on minimum wage or not even working living in town.

The_Brood

Pugzilla wrote: »

Just move out of Dublin. Plenty of small cities/ large towns with superior quality of life in Ireland.

Good luck finding a job with that strategy.

I wonder, is there a country in the Western world with a worse housing shortage and crisis?

It does get highlighted in the media, but the truth is politicians absolutely do not treat it as an urgent problem. People aren't putting enough pressure on them, there's no real major protests over the issue.

It's absolute madness beyond anything conceivable.

Grayson

The_Brood wrote: »

Good luck finding a job with that strategy.

I wonder, is there a country in the Western world with a worse housing shortage and crisis?

It does get highlighted in the media, but the truth is politicians absolutely do not treat it as an urgent problem. People aren't putting enough pressure on them, there's no real major protests over the issue.

It's absolute madness beyond anything conceivable.

Yeah. I'm a tech worker. I'm skilled in incident and problem management. There's next to never jobs away from Dublin. The last one I saw was in Kerry. It would have involved hours driving to see family in Mayo or Friends who mainly live in Dublin. I'd be easier to see my family if I lived in the UK near an airport.

And that was the only job I've seen in the last two years outside Dublin. The same is true for a lot of skilled workers. Especially in anything related to tech, science and engineering. Sure there are some jobs but the majority are in Dublin.

Wheeliebin30

The_Brood wrote: »

Good luck finding a job with that strategy.

I wonder, is there a country in the Western world with a worse housing shortage and crisis?

It does get highlighted in the media, but the truth is politicians absolutely do not treat it as an urgent problem. People aren't putting enough pressure on them, there's no real major protests over the issue.

It's absolute madness beyond anything conceivable.

Most of Europe has a worst crisis.

Graces7

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

Most of Europe has a worst crisis.

Very true. Look up any European country Same pattern

ted1

Gringo180 wrote: »

Average rent prices in Dublin now stands at 2k a month. I would say the vast majority of people working in the city would be on less than 12 or 13 euro per hour, thats around 1600/1800 euro take home pay per month after tax. How on earth are people suppose to afford any sort of decent lifestyle and have a roof over there head as well? Current min wage in the city is €9.55. Absolutely madness when you take into consideration the cost of living.

What a ****hole of a country or a society we have become.

That rent is for a multi unit dwelling so that’s either for a family or for 2-5 people to share.

Also someone earning minimum wage will get rent allowance or HAP. ITs the poor lads working in mid 30k that’ll struggle. The lower end are looked after by the state

ted1

Grayson wrote: »

The_Brood wrote: »

Good luck finding a job with that strategy.

I wonder, is there a country in the Western world with a worse housing shortage and crisis?

It does get highlighted in the media, but the truth is politicians absolutely do not treat it as an urgent problem. People aren't putting enough pressure on them, there's no real major protests over the issue.

It's absolute madness beyond anything conceivable.

Yeah. I'm a tech worker. I'm skilled in incident and problem management. There's next to never jobs away from Dublin. The last one I saw was in Kerry. It would have involved hours driving to see family in Mayo or Friends who mainly live in Dublin. I'd be easier to see my family if I lived in the UK near an airport.

And that was the only job I've seen in the last two years outside Dublin. The same is true for a lot of skilled workers. Especially in anything related to tech, science and engineering. Sure there are some jobs but the majority are in Dublin.

In fairness that’s a random skill you need to reskill

ted1

Gringo180 wrote: »

kneemos wrote: »

We'll need 76,000 extra workers to cure the crisis apparently.
They'll also need somewhere to live along with our projected population increase.

Hardly any improvement anytime soon.

https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/ireland-doesnt-enough-skilled-construction-11272471

How many men of working age are on the dole? Maybe an increase in minimum wage and an improvement in workers rights would entice them back to work.

Workers in Ireland have plenty of rights. They need to cut the incentives for not working.

Samuel T. Cogley

You live further out and commute OP. Now it sucks because our infrastructure is pretty poor but thems the breaks.

Richard Hillman

Now we have things like Sugar Taxes and Minimum Priced Alcohol to deal with. You're basically just working to survive. What's the point anymore?

Vela

The_Brood wrote: »

Good luck finding a job with that strategy.

I wonder, is there a country in the Western world with a worse housing shortage and crisis?

It does get highlighted in the media, but the truth is politicians absolutely do not treat it as an urgent problem. People aren't putting enough pressure on them, there's no real major protests over the issue.

It's absolute madness beyond anything conceivable.

Seattle and Vancouver are both pretty bad at this point. A serious lack of housing and rents are getting higher and higher, not to mention the cost of buying.

Samuel T. Cogley

Richard Hillman wrote: »

Now we have things like Sugar Taxes and Minimum Priced Alcohol to deal with. You're basically just working to survive. What's the point anymore?

Stop eatin' ****e, drinking and smoking and you'll be amazed how much money you have and how much better you feel.

Wanderer78

All hail the market, the market, hail!

super_furry

Gringo180 wrote: »

But min wage jobs I am talking about. Raise it and you will entice people off the dole. Not making excuses but I can see why some choose to stay on the dole. Working min wage is about 360 per week after tax. Take into account lunches, transport costs you are lucky to be earning an extra 120 euro for 40 hours than sitting at home scratching the hole off yourself.

The dole is a bit of a red herring. The unemployment rate is only 5.9% at the moment.

Geuze

Gringo180 wrote: »

Average rent prices in Dublin now stands at 2k a month. I would say the vast majority of people working in the city would be on less than 12 or 13 euro per hour, thats around 1600/1800 euro take home pay per month after tax. How on earth are people suppose to afford any sort of decent lifestyle and have a roof over there head as well? Current min wage in the city is €9.55. Absolutely madness when you take into consideration the cost of living.

What a ****hole of a country or a society we have become.

While I totally agree that property costs are way way too high, the "vast majority" are not on 12 or 13 per hour.

Mean FT earnings incl overtime are 45k approx, or 865 pw

Mean earnings are 20-22 ph.

Median earnings are about 40,000.

Rjd2

Wanderer78 wrote: »

All hail the market, the market, hail!

Yes I don't understand why people keep moaning about people spending there money on ever increasing rents, when they have told constantly the market will sort it out.:pac:

Buford T. Justice XIX

Mod note: I think this would be better suited to the accommodation forum so I'll lock this before transferring. Please note the change of forum and different forum rules.

Buford T. Justice

Graham

Mod Note: Welcome to Accommodation & Property

Thread re-opened.

Samuel T. Cogley

We're going to have to be all sensible now

At the moment rents are going through a transition stage. Many accidental LL's are selling up. Whether the 'professionisation' of the sector will ever lead to a dip in rents is questionable at best.

pwurple

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

We're going to have to be all sensible now

At the moment rents are going through a transition stage. Many accidental LL's are selling up. Whether the 'professionisation' of the sector will ever lead to a dip in rents is questionable at best.

Well, as there is a different tax structure depending on who you are, rather than what you do... it is possible, but unlikely. Last year I had a place up for rent, tenants were offering me cash under the table to up their chances of getting it. Supply is very low. Tenancy law has strengthened to the point where landlords are now so weak, they cannot evict a non paying tenant for a heck of a long time. The risk in becoming a landlord is high, and for some property investors, it makes more sense to leave them empty and growing in value with the market, than renting them out.

As for the cost of living... I don’t think it’s much different to when we bought our first home. House shared with a bunch of other working people in a 4 bedroom place for a few years to save a deposit. House prices were shockingly high. Closed envelope bids etc. Moved into a house, rented out a room to lodgers and overpaid that mortgage with that bit of income. Backpacked or Ryanair and a hostel were holidays. At the moment we still live economically enough, and put what we can into the pension/mortgage. Life happens, we have been hit with setbacks and things, but we are doing ok.

Most of my friends and family would be similar, but some of my peers are still living with their parents, or renting and complaining about rent. Same background, circumstances and education as me. Just a different attitude really?

Some people buy luxuries last, after the basics and providing for the future are sorted.

Heres Johnny

Gringo180 wrote: »

kneemos wrote: »

We'll need 76,000 extra workers to cure the crisis apparently.
They'll also need somewhere to live along with our projected population increase.

Hardly any improvement anytime soon.

https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/ireland-doesnt-enough-skilled-construction-11272471

How many men of working age are on the dole? Maybe an increase in minimum wage and an improvement in workers rights would entice them back to work.

Maybe a reduction in laying about scratching your nuts rights might entice them to work

Cork is pretty bad too. Not as expensive as Dublin but it's getting there. I work in a multinational and there are people moving from abroad as they've got a job here but then find themselves moving back home shortly after as they can't find anywhere to live.

I'm extremely lucky. Myself and my OH live in a 2 bed house in Cork city for 900pm. Been here now about 5 years and never had the rent raised. I thought it was a crazy price when we first moved in but we took a good "risk"! We would be in a position to buy a house but we are happy where we are for now. We can save plenty of money and still go on holidays etc as we are on good enough wages... but we are lucky. Would hate to be looking for somewhere to rent now.

Heres Johnny

Geuze wrote: »

Gringo180 wrote: »

Average rent prices in Dublin now stands at 2k a month. I would say the vast majority of people working in the city would be on less than 12 or 13 euro per hour, thats around 1600/1800 euro take home pay per month after tax. How on earth are people suppose to afford any sort of decent lifestyle and have a roof over there head as well? Current min wage in the city is €9.55. Absolutely madness when you take into consideration the cost of living.

What a ****hole of a country or a society we have become.

While I totally agree that property costs are way way too high, the "vast majority" are not on 12 or 13 per hour.

Mean FT earnings incl overtime are 45k approx, or 865 pw

Mean earnings are 20-22 ph.

Median earnings are about 40,000.

Median earnings are not 40000, not a hope.
I'd say it's about 25000 at a push.

This is from my own observations as a financial advisor carrying out reviews for mortgages, pensions, investments etc....

I came across a small cohort of people in IT and finance earning in excess of 80k but the vast majority of people I dealt with were in the 40-50k bracket. These were your tradesmen and university educated people working in science, public sector etc....good jobs.

I didn't deal with the HUGE numbers of people earning sub 30k as I just knew they hadn't 2 pennies to rub together and just had to work paycheck to paycheck.

Every shop assistant, food sector worker, hospitality, tourism, basic clerical, receptionist, call centre etc....are earning in the 20s.

And there are far more of them than the 80k IT and finance workers out there.

I own a house in Dublin and I'm thankful for it. But a huge majority, if they stay in same jobs, will never afford one.

My brother bought a house in Dublin last year with his girlfriend both aged 27.
315k I think it was. But they have good jobs and excellent prospects.

I don't think it's the government's fault or anyone's fault that a relatively unskilled worker can't buy in a vibrant European capital full of skilled workers.

This isn't Dublin 1970s anymore folks, I don't care that your parents/uncles/grandparents bought a house on a modest income.

Dublin, and Ireland, has changed. You need to change with it. It's a knowledge economy and we are in a free movement of labour area within EU.

Upskill, educate or get left behind. That's not a dig at anyone, but it's my advice. If a young person is reading this, get into IT, Pharma or Finance sectors as that's where the money is. There are other areas too of course. And save regularly and save early. You won't be buying a house in Dublin without doing both of the above, unless you get lucky.

A great advisor I follow online put up an article yesterday saying Irish people are extremely financially illiterate and financial planning is non existent and I have to agree with him.

I had clients that I had to force a financial plan on to get in a position to buy a house.
Checked in on them every couple of months and they hadn't stuck to it in most cases.
I see guys my age mid 30s great jobs never saved a penny, never started a pension, never bought a house.

pwurple

+1 on financial illiteracy. The amount of people with decent jobs but no pension, staggering.

Experience_day

pwurple wrote: »

+1 on financial illiteracy. The amount of people with decent jobs but no pension, staggering.

You can't blame a certain amount of skepticism on pensions...pensions levys, age of retirements rising to be point where you'll probably not be alive etc.

And frankly there are probably a lot of people who would have rather have purchased a couple houses. Personally I work in a relatively lucrative industry (atm!) and pensions come with it so I don't really worry, but I certainly wouldn't be putting much into them myself. (And yes we look at pensions..)

Completely agree with the above. I signed up to my pension a few years ago when I was 25 and had many people at work saying "sure you're far too young for that", "I'm 40 and still think I'm too young to sign up" etc..

Most people I work directly with would be on between 40k and 60k and many of them live paycheck to paycheck. These would be single people without any major commitments but they just like to have the newest gadgets, brand new cars on PCP, new clothes etc..

At the same time it is very expensive to rent. However, many people I know could be a lot better with money of they cut out many of their luxuries.

purifol0

super_furry wrote: »

The dole is a bit of a red herring. The unemployment rate is only 5.9% at the moment.

"Disability Allowance" figures are used to hide the true amount of unemployment which is far higher as almost one in six Irish households is jobless (Feb2018)

Samuel T. Cogley

purifol0 wrote: »

"Disability Allowance" figures are used to hide the true amount of unemployment which is far higher as almost one in six Irish households is jobless (Feb2018)

BTEA Also.

There should be a major crack down on disability allowance, there's a lad at work who is confined to an electric wheel chair and makes it in everyday.

cournioni

The_Brood wrote: »

Good luck finding a job with that strategy.

I wonder, is there a country in the Western world with a worse housing shortage and crisis?

It does get highlighted in the media, but the truth is politicians absolutely do not treat it as an urgent problem. People aren't putting enough pressure on them, there's no real major protests over the issue.

It's absolute madness beyond anything conceivable.

People are making far too much out of the whole, there’s no jobs down the country lark. They are there if you’re willing to take them. You just need to be willing to be somewhat flexible with regard to pay (clearly going to be less) and be open to other fields of work.

Wheeliebin30

purifol0 wrote: »

"Disability Allowance" figures are used to hide the true amount of unemployment which is far higher as almost one in six Irish households is jobless (Feb2018)

Highest disability claimees in Europe.

It’s bonkers for a country our size.

1 in 2 on some sort of welfare, yet we’re told the government don’t care about its citizens.

cournioni

Grayson wrote: »

Yeah. I'm a tech worker. I'm skilled in incident and problem management. There's next to never jobs away from Dublin. The last one I saw was in Kerry. It would have involved hours driving to see family in Mayo or Friends who mainly live in Dublin. I'd be easier to see my family if I lived in the UK near an airport.

And that was the only job I've seen in the last two years outside Dublin. The same is true for a lot of skilled workers. Especially in anything related to tech, science and engineering. Sure there are some jobs but the majority are in Dublin.

You clearly haven’t been looking.

My brother works in tech and he hasn’t had any issues with getting jobs around the country. IT jobs in Dundalk (2), and Galway were offered to him within the past year. Similar pay (and better) to what he got working in Dublin too.

If you’re not willing to be flexible in some way shape or form with regards to “what you’re skilled in” then you’re leaving yourself with very few jobs to choose from, anywhere.

Pugzilla

Medtronic and Boston Scientific are based in Galway, so an option for someone with a biomedical engineering/science background.

Franz Von Peppercorn

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

Most of Europe has a worst crisis.

No it doesn’t.