Holiday Dilemma

Unreguser

Hi new user here with a slight dilemma.
Been with my partner about 14 years, have an 11 year old, she also has an 19yo from previous.
Myself and her son have never gotten on from day one, dropped outa school, no job, no housework lazes around cheeky etc and other issues.
We`ve had many rows over the years and found the only way to tolerate eachother without breaking- up, is to ignore eachother unless necessary and this for the most part works and we`re both ok with this.
We`ve had family holidays before which for the most part were ok, but we were able to do our own things with himself still mostly sleeping in lazing around etc, and still minimal interaction when together.
I want to bring my own lad on US trip costing in the region of 6k, my partner has said she would too now like to go(no probs there), and now wants the other lad to come too as a `family holiday`.
This is gonna be a pretty much two week 24/7 thing in eachothers company where neither of us get on, and my issue is spending that amount to have tension, awkwardness and possible rows etc.
Obviously I understand her situation where she has to stick by him etc.
It should also be said that more often than not himself and my son don't get on, so quite possibly argueing etc.
Alot more to it but a short summarized (I hope) post to hear with readers would do/advise in this situation or what their views are?

Unreguser

Also needing mentioning is my partner is aware of the situation and her opinion is 'just stay out of eachothers way' which as posted above works for the most part, but obviously won't be doable here.
Id hate for her to miss out on the trip, but at the same time I don't want to go and not enjoy myself.
Happy to elaborate on anything or answer any questions
Thanks

silverharp

first reaction is postpone for a couple of years, no point spending that kind of money to end up not looking forward to it. secondly its rewarding delinquent behaviour, there is no way i would pay for an "adult" to go on holidays if he is being a bum at home, your other half seems to be going to easy on him so maybe you could get her to put her foot down.

the idea is good though, i started taking my son away on a separate holiday a few years back but canoeing and the like

Unreguser

silverharp wrote: »

first reaction is postpone for a couple of years, no point spending that kind of money to end up not looking forward to it. secondly its rewarding delinquent behaviour, there is no way i would pay for an "adult" to go on holidays if he is being a bum at home

Thanks.
not a hope I'd pay either but yeah she probably would if it came down to it and not having the money.
Don't really want to wait tbh feel my own lad is at the right age now to enjoy it and have already discussed it with him :-o

Airyfairy12

I get that you dont get on with him and I understand thats difficult but youve done nothing but critisise him through out your post. I dont think id be making the effort with someone who was constantly belittling me - especially someone whose not even related. He's lazy, dropped out of school, no job, cheeky.. sounds like me at 19 and most other 19 year olds, especially ones that come from broken homes and difficult upbringings like he's had. Besides youre not his dad, his choices are his. The more you nag, criticize and put him down the more likely he is to not do anything. His lack of employment and lack of education are none of your business. Things will work out for him but they'll work out when the times right, not when you say they should.

As for the holiday, you cant go together. you will kill eachother. Youll have to explain that to your partner.

Unreguser

Airyfairy12 wrote: »

youve done nothing but critisise him through out your post. I dont think id be making the effort with someone who was constantly belittling me - especially someone whose not even related.

Besides youre not his dad, his choices are his.

The more you nag, criticize and put him down the more likely he is to not do anything. His lack of employment and lack of education are none of your business.

Very unfair reply imo I think, and I'll explain why ...

Firstly it needed to be explained why this situation is as it is, hence what you assume is constant criticizing.

As posted I actually don't cause him any grief at all, or nagging or belittling, I stay out of whatever is going on as much as possible, and I'm aware his choices are his own, despite all the advice he was given.....and likewise so too are the consequences of his choices. ....hence the situatuon.

And I think his lack of education and lack of employment, although again I stay completely out of it, are very much my business, seen as it has an effect on my day to day living and also my future......I won't be staying Ireland for life so knowing whether this lad can substain himself down the line or if he's happy with a lack of education and lack of employment I think is very much my business or concern for want of a better word...but that's another thread away off yet 😂

evolving_doors

Did you tell the 11yr old the travel details before sorting it with your partner?

Unreguser

Dropped outa school about 12 or 13 I should add, not recently, changed schools refused that too, refused to work with social workers/help, was given a paid course but dropped outa that too. The problems are not just with me but his mother also but obviously and as expected she sticks by him. I do very very little to rock the boat because as pointed out beyond advice which now I don't even do that its not my place.

Getting off topic now, it was posted about the holiday dilemma not who's responsible for it

Unreguser

evolving_doors wrote: »

Did you tell the 11yr old the travel details before sorting it with your partner?

No. Other half doesn't do the long flights, it was discussed with herself first and was ok, after hearing us talking and where were going etc said she would do it too then

Unreguser

evolving_doors wrote: »

Did you tell the 11yr old the travel details before sorting it with your partner?

Before discussing anything definite OH discussed it with the 19yo too, he said didn't want to go, so would have been no issues there and no aggro for anyone.
But now thats changed to 19to will want to go when your booking so come booking theres gonna be an issue for someone so trying to gather views before that.
Basically I don't want to go spend that amount and that time non stop togther and not enjoy it.
To try to be fair I suggested we all go for a normal holiday before this like previous but ''thats a different type of holiday and not the same" 😂

Sorry for how the posts are typed don't usually bother with forums

charlietheminxx

I’ll be honest OP, I don’t have much sympathy for you in this. You’ve been in your stepson’s life since he was 5 and yet you only refer to him as your partner’s son. I’m not excusing his behaviour but dropping out of school at 12 was hardly a decision he should have been allowed to make for himself? He was a child! A difficult one yes but a child nonetheless.

I’m probably biased, I’m from a blended family and I was a bit of a rebellious teenager. I had some issues and probably wasn’t the nicest to them. However my mam and stepdad encouraged and fought me and kept pushing me back on track. I don’t think either of them liked me much at 18 but they still loved me and we have really good relationships now I’m an adult (myself and my partner went off on holiday with them and my sister in September).

You don’t sound like you have any love for your stepson and I think that’s really sad. He is a young man still and sounds like he’s one who needs some support and tough love. Your posts are all about your holiday and your money and your plans but being a parent (or step-parent) means not always putting yourself first. Leave him out of the family holiday since that’s what you want to do, but you should remember it’s not going to help things between you long term.

Sinead Mc1

Ya, he seems troubled. Dropping out so young etc.
Still, i dunno can you put any of this on being from a broken home.
Sure half of us are from broken homes and don't behave this way.
Alot of which have come from way worse situations then described above.
He has a loving and supportive mother. Yes, he doesn't get on with his step father or little brother so they tip toe around him staying out of his way. Seems pretty sweet!
And, tbh, if his issues were this big with ye he wouldn't want to go anyway.
If things were very bad at home he'd get up, get a job, his own place and wouldn't have to tolerate ye. Seems the situation he's in suits him fine.
The way I see it is he knows he can go, all expenses paid, laze about, do nothing, possibly create agro and everyone will just let it off.

There is a much bigger issue at play here then the holiday.
This young man is letting his life slip away. Will he be living at home forever? Does he have any intention of making a living from himself etc.
I think your partner really needs to sit down and address this with him.
Surely she can see that her oldest child's attitude is possibly going to effect a positive experience for her younger child...
It's not much of a holiday expecting people to "stay out of each others way" etc..
This isn't really a solution to the problems ye are having with him.
If she really won't allow the holiday without her son either let her stay or pause it until a future date. It sounds like unfortunately it won't be enjoyable if the older child goes.

Unreguser

Thanks guys and thanks charlietheminx.....I actually agree with you 99% in theory.

Regards been allowed drop out at 12 or whatever it was of course it wasn't a decision he was just allowed to make there was chaos every morning mother in tears etc and although I intervened as was said I'm not his father so could only try so much, after getting away with it he'd spent day on PlayStation and the cycle would start again the next day, it wasn't a case of just letting him.
It's also no secret that my stepson has told pretty much all his side of family doesn't like me no time etc etc and tbh alot of that came from me trying to sort him out or step in and things didn't go wouldn't go his way, granted was years ago but as he got older we did have a talk and decide it's best if we just leave eaxhother to you don't bother me I won't bother you type of thing and we agreed. We are different people I work and do what I have to my stepson spends his day playing PlayStation asking what time his dinner is coming 😂
Getting a little sidetracked trying to remember your post, I don't use the forums, I do agree with you and I'd class myself as fair and easygoing but I think comes a time where you have to decide to put yourself first and not put your future in someone elses hands hence how I am now.

And he's not from a broken home either in the traditional sense, father was absent from very early years and his mother did everything possible for him.

We just simply never got on and it's only ok now because don't bother eachother

LegacyUser

Watch some YouTube clips called "Fatherless Sons", hosted by an American counsellor called Iyanla. They might help.

LegacyUser

Maybe make a compromise - he is more than welcome to come, you'd love nothing more than the opportunity to build bridges with him etc, but that he must contribute towards the cost of the trip. Not his mum - but him. It might incentivise him to get a job if he has something to save for, or give him a small sense of responsibility or purpose. But having dropped out so young, I can't help but wonder what else is going on here. Drugs? Mental health issues? I think the holiday is the least of your worries until you address his issues.

ncmc

I feel sorry for everyone in this situation. I feel sorry for the OP as I can see why he doesn’t want to spend 6k odd to go on holiday with someone he and the younger son don’t get on with.

I feel sorry for the OP’s partner as I can see why she wants to include both her sons in a holiday of a lifetime. And I do feel sorry to an extent for the older son. I’ve seen it with my own nephew that it’s hard coming from a broken home and a half sibling coming along when the older son was a pivotal age.

Still I can’t help but feel that things shouldn’t have been allowed to get to this stage. OP, you have been in this mans life since he was 5, yet you refer to him constantly as ‘her son’ He is also your sons step brother. If you look back, can you honestly say that you’ve made every possible effort with him? Meeting him when he was 5 years old, he was young enough that you should have been like a father figure. Is his father on the scene? Maybe he feels like he’s betraying his father if he gets close to you.

That said, I don’t think I’d be happy with my partner forking our 3k odd to bring a 19 year old man child who can’t/won’t work on a luxury holiday. It seems to me that your partner is compensating for guilt by babying her older son and allowing him to be a layabout.

With regards to the holiday. It’s a tough one. You can either put your foot down about him coming and prepare for the fall out. Or else delay the trip for a year and see if the older son sorts himself out a bit. Or finally (and my preferred option) try, really try to get on with her older son. Can you come together as a united front with your partner and encourage him to get more of a life and get some sort of work. At the moment it’s all ‘her son’ and ‘my son’ I find it odd that you never refer to the younger boy as ‘our son’. It seems clear from what little you’ve posted that there’s a big divide in the house and I think that needs to be addressed if you’ve any hope for a future.

Afroshack

Maybe offer to subsidise the cost of him coming (maybe 50%) if he gets a job and saves for the rest? He most likely won't do it but it stops you looking like the bad guy and giving him reasonable opportunity to join you. Its important to make him feel like he'd be welcome, but as an adult its important he contributes in some way. And that's not a her son/my son divide - that's just being a grown up.

However, I am pretty startled at how quickly you and his mum gave up on him going to school. Was he on drugs? Having mental health problems? Did he qualify for home tuition? Did either of you try homeschooling, Youth reach or FAS? If he was allowed to stay at home playing PlayStation from 13 years old right up until adulthood, he's very unlikely to change his ways and that's partially down to parenting, not him.

duffman13

Tbh you need to have a very serious conversation with your OH. You've gone a long time with the situation your in but your just kicking the can down the road. You need to prioritise parenting and try get this kid motivated. I feel for you and also wouldn't want to pay huge sums for a holiday for someone like that.

Like others have said, make him part pay at least and see if he shows some desire to go. You've probably got 2-3 years to get him up and into the workforce or your going to have him in your house for a long long time.

Unreguser

Thanks lads, I'll do my best to answer your points.

I think I was saying my son her son just to simplify the posts, but fair point I rarely address me him as stepson.

I actually feel sorry for everyone tbh even him and I said that to the missus the other day that this shouldn't even be an issue.

As regards paying for him or giving him the responsibility to cover himself I think consider that and if didnt do it I'd be off the hook so to speak, but we had an issue in the snow last week our son wanted to go out to it but stepson said don't open the door yet, my son said whatever and went to open it and stepson, our soon has mild autism and with that stepson shouted in ma sort out this special needs child.....I was in the room heard this got annoyed but within reason kept very Cool I think, told stepson don't talk to him like like and he said I will if I want, few words back and forth of the same bit heated but same jist sitting on PlayStation answering I will if I want that's what he is. Anyway he left room in a huff and our son thanked me and day went on as normal.....seen a message from stepson to oh advising her to tell me to keep my cool because I've no control over him or anthing he does........so after that I thought about the whole holiday again and decided that's it's not something I could do or would enjoy.

As regards been involved since he was 5 yes and always tried to do the right thing Brought him out parks cinema etc etc. Father is absent no contact. One thing that stuck out and it's going back years but was buying him something and the girl in shop said your dad is very good to you or similar and he replied that's not my dad just some fool I got stuck with....granted could have been 10 years ago but that's how it was constantly

Whispered

God I feel sorry for all of ye. I do understand why you don't want someone on your holiday that you feel will ruin it. I initially thought that your older son was a layabout but then another poster pointed out that he was 5 when you met. 5. Little more than a toddler. Yet you still refer to him as your partners son. The poor lad. It doesn't sound like your family is very blended. More like you have your partner and son and see your other son as a tag-along. You ARE his father, his biological father was never on the scene, you're the closest thing he had. Have ye ever spoken about this, about what exactly your roll in his life was to be, before you decided to blend lives?
Did he grow up being referred to as your partners son? Can you imagine how ostracised he might have felt being the only one not considered, or spoken about, as a full family member?

Anyway, on the holiday, if you two are both aware of how your relationship works, could you have a chat with him about it? See how he thinks it'll work out, see if there is anything you two can do to bond a bit before it. Not as father and son as that ship had sailed, but as two adults who share a common person.

I'd suggest family counselling but I'd imagine there'll be a lot of resistance to that idea.

evolving_doors

The issue isn't really the holiday.
The same conflict will remain whether the holiday happens or not.

Something new needs to happen.
Mother needs to change.
19yr old needs to change.
Step dad needs to change.

I think the issues would fix quicker with a family councillor/therapist session (go alone first OP). Everyone has become fixed in their position.
Maybe it's up to the man of the house to take action and get help from an expert. Same as calling an electrician rather than trying to wire a house yourself.

Whispered

Unreguser wrote: »

As regards been involved since he was 5 yes and always tried to do the right thing Brought him out parks cinema etc etc. Father is absent no contact. One thing that stuck out and it's going back years but was buying him something and the girl in shop said your dad is very good to you or similar and he replied that's not my dad just some fool I got stuck with....granted could have been 10 years ago but that's how it was constantly

That would hurt my feelings. Since having a child I've found it really hard not to take things he does or says personally. And he's only 3. He told me the other evening he wants another mammy who is nice to him. Cheeky pup. But 10 years ago your son was 9, had recently acquired a little brother and was likely lashing out. It wouldn't have been meant personally, any other man in your place would have had the same treatment.

Suppose it's too late to do anything about that now. Do you ever see yourself having a civil relationship with him? Could you use the holiday as leverage for a few changes?

Deub

If the situation is 100% as you described it, I think he shouldn't be allowed to come unless he does something to contribute (find a job). His behavior shouldn't be rewarded.

But the holiday is a small issue. The big issue is how will he be independant long term.
He thinks you can't control him and he can say whathever he wants but you and your wife pay for everything he has (food, clothes,etc).
Your wife will have to have though discussion wirh him to understand that he is not free until he can support himself.

Afroshack

Also, why does he have a PlayStation if he's never gone to school or worked? Why haven't you taken it away from him? He shouldn't be "comfortable" at this age if he's not willing to contribute to it or work for it.

Has he ever had to earn anything before?

Unreguser

No never earned anything just got it eventually or through malinipulation. I used to take the stuff from him and that's where this toxic relationship came from cos probably for the first time in his life was corrected or chastised.

To the girl that said it wasn't personal any man would have got that treatment yes I'm aware of that but it wasn't a one off that was constant for years till we decided it was easier not to bother eachother for the sake of the relationship. Like I'd pick him up from somewhere ask howd you'd get on and he'd say none of your business lol.

Sorta Completely derailed from the OP now ðŸ˜, youthreach was the other course he stopped doing that I posted about earlier someone asked about that.

ncmc

Your stepson sounds like a little pup and your OH sounds like the classic enabler. How did she react when he said that about her younger son on the snow day? He sounds like a sulky 13 year old when in fact he’s a 19 year old man. You and your OH need to show a united front and tell him to either get a job and start contributing to the house or ship out. It’s inexusable that a 19 year old is sitting at home all day playing PlayStation, regardless of the dynamics of the family.

Unreguser

Day to day most times there's no issues between us but that's purely because we just don't bother eachother and some of that is also why his behaviour in general has quietened down, because if he was getting corrected etc there would be alot more issues, I stay out of as much as possible now

Unreguser

ncmc wrote: »

Your stepson sounds like a little pup and your OH sounds like the classic enabler. How did she react when he said that about her younger son on the snow day? He sounds like a sulky 13 year old when in fact he’s a 19 year old man. You and your OH need to show a united front and tell him to either get a job and start contributing to the house or ship out. It’s inexusable that a 19 year old is sitting at home all day playing PlayStation, regardless of the dynamics of the family.

She didn't say anything at the time, a half arsed don't talk like that and stepson started on about he was getting picked on or something, he will argue with her too till he's blue in the face so she let's alot go too just every so often lose the head

Afroshack

If he feels like he is being picked on, he can move out.

Seriously, confiscate his phone and PlayStation and do not return them until he apologises to his brother. Lay down the law!

Unreguser

Afroshack wrote: »

If he feels like he is being picked on, he can move out.

Seriously, confiscate his phone and PlayStation and do not return them until he apologises to his brother. Lay down the law!

Been there done that, personally id f him out if was up to me lol. Unfortunately from my point there's not much I can do with him, even here on this am sure there's alot 'hold me responsible'. I know for a fact if I took his phone there would be war he'd take the OH phone and she would give in and say give it back or something.....gives his one back I mean

Afroshack

Unreguser wrote: »

Been there done that, personally id f him out if was up to me lol. Unfortunately from my point there's not much I can do with him, even here on this am sure there's alot 'hold me responsible'. I know for a fact if I took his phone there would be war he'd take the OH phone and she would give in and say give it back or something.....gives his one back I mean

In that case, I think the biggest issue here is your wife not being consistent and the two of you giving up on discipling him. That said, he is now an adult and should be encouraged to move out and fend for himself.

Take your younger son away, have a great time and don't apologise for not pandering to your stepson. He has a horrible attitude and needs to learn that nice things (holidays) need to be earned.

Unreguser

Afroshack wrote: »

If he feels like he is being picked on, he can move out.

Seriously, confiscate his phone and PlayStation and do not return them until he apologises to his brother. Lay down the law!

Actually the second day of the snow they were out and out son threw threw a snowball at the older one and it got him in the head, nothing hard by any means I think it was even just mostly loose, he made a huge song and dance about getting an apology, younger son said it was an accident but older one insisted 'i dont care you will apologise and learn how things things work when you do wrong', he apologised after back and forth and older one said that's wasn't too hard was it lol.

Turning more into a rant now, he's been with social workers tulsa different places etc to no great avail, it's just one of those things where two people clash and don't get on

ncmc

Afroshack wrote: »

If he feels like he is being picked on, he can move out.

Seriously, confiscate his phone and PlayStation and do not return them until he apologises to his brother. Lay down the law!

Confiscate his phone, PlayStation??? He’s NINETEEN!!! He’s a man! They need to stop pandering to his moods and nonsense and tell him to follow the house rules, contribute to the household or else move out. I know it’s not as simple as that and no one wants to see their child out on the street, but sometimes some tough love and reality check is needed.

Edit: just saw your follow up post Afroshack and agree totally.

ahnow

This is honestly such a sad post, and I think the holiday dilemma is the least of your issues right now. Other posters have said it much better than I could but I really think a spot of family counselling could help you all, and should have been sought out years ago. This man has been shouting for help for years from you all, when he started kicking up a fuss about not wanting to go to school and that’s when help should have been sought. Dont let it go on any longer, you dont all need to have a broken relationship.

Dial Hard

ncmc wrote:

You and your OH need to show a united front and tell him to either get a job and start contributing to the house or ship out. It’s inexusable that a 19 year old is sitting at home all day playing PlayStation, regardless of the dynamics of the family.

I think that ship sailed several years ago, tbh.

Unreguser

ahnow wrote: »

when he started kicking up a fuss about not wanting to go to school and that’s when help should have been sought

That's when help was sought and he was at camhs, social workers involved school involved, he'd go for a day then miss the next four, school.was changed to be few mins walk away and still the same, school let me leave back and books there in case it was too heavy for him to carry they allowed him half days if he wanted just to keep in the system but wouldn't go, social workers threatened that if he didn't go he'd be taken into care and attitude was a snigger and no you won't, this went on back and forth until he was 16 where they dismissed him and said basically it's your choice now if you stay at school or not, homeschooling was not an option as it was decided that was giving into him and he was getting what he wanted, I think he did an ischool for a while as a very last resort. Was put into a youthreach program and stopped going after a few weeks. help was sought and that's the jist of it, and mother is too soft to ever do anything drastic because feels hes had it hard enough

Afroshack

Unreguser wrote: »

That's when help was sought and he was at camhs, social workers involved school involved, he'd go for a day then miss the next four, school.was changed to be few mins walk away and still the same, school let me leave back and books there in case it was too heavy for him to carry they allowed him half days if he wanted just to keep in the system but wouldn't go, social workers threatened that if he didn't go he'd be taken into care and attitude was a snigger and no you won't, this went on back and forth until he was 16 where they dismissed him and said basically it's your choice now if you stay at school or not, homeschooling was not an option as it was decided that was giving into him and he was getting what he wanted, I think he did an ischool for a while as a very last resort. Was put into a youthreach program and stopped going after a few weeks. help was sought and that's the jist of it, and mother is too soft to ever do anything drastic because feels hes had it hard enough

Too soft if anything. His mum is failing him on this I have to say. There's a direct correlation between low educational attainment and ending up in crime/drugs or prison. Is that what she wants for him?

ahnow

I think the not going to school is a symptom of something bigger, and an acting out to try and get both of your attention, have ye ever considered counselling?

fishy_fishy

Go on the holiday without him and bring the wife. If he has no interest in being part of the family then he gets no benefits of being part of the family. Have your wife come or not, but no way would I be spending 6k to be stuck with him for 2 weeks.

I'd worry about leaving him on his own in the house though so personally I'd spend 1000 quid extra and send him and a friend on holidays elsewhere at the same time and consider it insurance against damage to your house.

There may have been reasons for his behaviour when he was a small child or young teenager, but he's old enough now.

I'm not sure family counselling would work with him. More like you and your wife need it to get on the same page about how to eventually get him out of the house.

Unreguser

Afroshack wrote: »

Too soft if anything. His mum is failing him on this I have to say. There's a direct correlation between low educational attainment and ending up in crime/drugs or prison. Is that what she wants for him?

No obviously she wants a good life for him but it's hard to get someone to do something if they refuse and have looked at the options available and none of them worked. He's safe he's not out causing trouble his not on drugs etc supoose that's how she looks at it but yes we've had all these talks about wheres his future going and who's going to fund him when he really comes of age

Unreguser

ahnow wrote: »

I think the not going to school is a symptom of something bigger, and an acting out to try and get both of your attention, have ye ever considered counselling?

Yes theyvr been to quite a few themselves.

I went to a few near the start for a months and it was same thing over and over each time, can't remember the details but after months they had never even met him I got annoyed one day in it told them had not even seen him etc was a bigger problem here that what your trying to address etc and was told that they knew what they were doing and theyd do the meetings without me from.there on in.

Unreguser

fishy_fishy wrote: »

Go on the holiday without him and bring the wife. If he has no interest in being part of the family then he gets no benefits of being part of the family. Have your wife come or not, but no way would I be spending 6k to be stuck with him for 2 weeks..

Well that's the dilemma she might not go without him 😂, so even if that happened it puts a damper on it knowing she won't go even though wants to because she is stuck in a dilemma too

fishy_fishy

Unreguser wrote: »

Well that's the dilemma she might not go without him 😂, so even if that happened it puts a damper on it knowing she won't go even though wants to because she is stuck in a dilemma too

I getchya. She's between a rock and a hard place. She needs to feel she's being loyal to him.

Here's the thing - at his age most teenagers don't go on the family holiday. No interest in hanging around with parents and younger siblings even if they all get along okay.

There was a suggestion earlier that if he pays half you match it and he goes. Maybe your wife could offer him that, and then say "but I know guys your age often have no interest in family holidays doing kid friendly stuff, so the other option is we give you 1000 to book a holiday with a friend"

If he's as lazy as you say he'll jump on the holiday without the family cos he won't have to pay for anything towards it himself.

georgina toadbum

I'm unsure why just handing him 1k to go on a holiday of his own is even being suggested. He sounds like a pain, I wouldn't be handing any money over to him.

fishy_fishy

georgina toadbum wrote: »

I'm unsure why just handing him 1k to go on a holiday of his own is even being suggested. He sounds like a pain, I wouldn't be handing any money over to him.

Because why would you pay an extea 3k to be stuck.with him ruining the holiday you paid 6k for? And he sounds like the type of little sh1t who'd wreck the gaff if left alone for 2 weeks so you can't leave him alone.

And it sounds like the OP would like his wife there but she will feel too guilty to go if she thinks her eldest is missing out.

Make it so that they get their nice holiday and don't have the place destroyed by the time they get home.

Unreguser

I didn't expect this to get so indepth tbh, it really was just about the holiday dilemma 😌

Appreciate the replies, I know most of them are right but at the stage it's a case of people not getting on as happens, wasn't for the lack of trying up to a few years ago but me personally there's only so much trying I do before putting myself first.....that mightnt go down too well here though.

I've nothing against the guy really when comes down to it despite this we just don't get on and 14 bad years etc, even his mother he's constantly correcting her, telling her dinner is wrong type of thing etc lol so nit just me.

Long term plans are were lucky in the sense that I've my own place elsewhere and we have discussed this and willing depending on how he is he'll either say where he is and OH will come with me or if he still the same supoose she'll have to stay and fund him. It's a poxy situation for everyone but we've boiled it down to cant ask her to 'abandon' him, but likewise cant ask me to spend life with someone dont get on with go to work while they sprawl around beating their Highscore 😂 In fairness he's getting a second chance handed to him to sort his life out and if he can't manage by around the 28 29 mark then there's no hope for him
Maybe he cop on in meantime get a job etc so see how it goes.

Big Bag of Chips

Maybe I've missed it, but I don't see anywhere where the 19 year old said he wants to go on the holiday. I see where his mother said it to him and he said he doesn't want to go, so where's the dilemma? I think rather than concentrating on him and giving so much time and attention to managing him you need to sit down, calmly and discuss with his mother how she needs to start making the transition from mother to troubled child, to mother to adult.

I know, I understand, I have children of my own. They are younger and I can't imagine, no matter how troubled they get, ever turning my back on them. But going on a holiday without them, that they don't want to go on anyway, I wouldn't see that as an issue. In fact forcing him, and coaxing him, and urging him is only continuing the mother/child dynamic. As a mother to a child you have, up to an extent, a right to tell them what to do. As a mother to an adult (even a very young adult) you have to accept that they get to make their own choices and you no longer are required in the "mammy" role.

Has your wife ever had counselling? Has she ever had parenting advice? Look, we all know of lazy, good for nothing adults arsing around the place adding nothing of substance to society. Maybe your stepson will end up there, maybe in time he will cop on and turn a corner. But the only way he will do that is if he is allowed make his own decisions. They mightn't be good decisions, but pulling against him on every choice he makes isn't going to really help matters. Even her deciding he should go on the holiday after he said he doesn't want to is a sign of her believing she knows better than him.

She needs to let go. She can always be there and let him know that she is always there, but she has to let go a little. It really is the only chance she has of him growing in himself and maybe turning a corner.

suicide_circus

Do people bring their adult children on family holidays? That stopped in my house when I was 14. At 19 i would rather have died than go on holiday with my folks, i went with my friends.

Colser

The problem imo is that if she goes without him she won't be able to relax or enjoy herself as he doesn't sound capable of looking after himself and there's probably be some drama if she goes away.Even leaving a lot of 19year olds in the house while you go away is chancy unfortunately.

Big Bag of Chips

Well then she needs to make the choice for herself if it's worth going. She can't, and shouldn't bring him along against his will on a very expensive holiday that he is not going to enjoy and as a result will ruin for everyone else.

The decision to go on holiday has been made. The older lad has decided not to go. Das and the younger lad have decided they will go. Now she has to decide. She has to decide between going without him and worrying for the entire time, or staying at home and letting the other two go. Her younger son shouldn't miss out on a holiday just because the older lad doesn't want to go.

Big Bag of Chips

Does the younger child often miss out because of all the time and attention the older lad commands?