Why the word "feminist"?

drillyeye

I only came across the word "equalitarian" recently. It is exactly what you'd imagine it to be.

"I'm an equalitarian, myself"......theres nothing confusing about it, its straight to the point, it makes sense, it seems fair, balanced. Easy!

But when I hear the word "feminist", it is usually attached to some bizarre ideas. It has this negative connotation for many people (I imagine). It isnt very clear in its meaning, it could be construed in a million different ways, are you for women over men, why would a man be interested in being second......etc etc.

So, the point. Why isnt the word Equalitarian used instead of Feminist? Surely one has far better resonance?

For the men in particular, are there any of you that prefer to be called feminists over equalitarian? And why?

Whats up with that!?

Sidenote: Can you imagine women going around proudly declaring themselves as "masculinists"?? Sounds mad

ARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

B.A._Baracus

Every feminist needs a good sorting out with a dick.



















*grabs own popcorn* :pac:

drillyeye

Deleted User wrote: »

ARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

My future congratulations on all the likes.

somefeen

Equalitarian ( or egalitarian?) Is about equality for everyone.
Feminism is ( or was depending who you ask ) about equality for women.

If you are equalitarian then you are also a feminist, because how can you be about equality for everyone with out being for women's equality?

By its definition feminism does exclude other sub groups, but supporting one cause does not mean you must automatically disregard all others.

I'm just thinking out loud here and doing a philosophy student impression, but maybe your right. If I was equally concerned for equality across the whole population than equalitarian would be a better fit. If I was primarily concerned with women's equality then feminist would be a better description.
Good thread OP, pity its gonna be a hate filled mess in about 5 posts.

drillyeye

somefeen wrote: »

Equalitarian ( or egalitarian?) Is about equality for everyone.
Feminism is ( or was depending who you ask ) about equality for women.

If you are equalitarian then you are also a feminist, because how can you be about equality for everyone with out being for women's equality?

By its definition feminism does exclude other sub groups, but supporting one cause does not mean you must automatically disregard all others.

I'm just thinking out loud here and doing a philosophy student impression, but maybe your right. If I was equally concerned for equality across the whole population than equalitarian would be a better fit. If I was primarily concerned with women's equality then feminist would be a better description.
Good thread OP, pity its gonna be a hate filled mess in about 5 posts.

Its one of those things that's so simple, yet......

Here we are!

david75

You’re upset by the word and idea of feminism.

Grow a pair you pussy. You’re a bigger woman than all of them.

johnny_ultimate

As is well-documented in many fine volumes of 19th and 20th century history, the early suffragettes gathered together to coin the phrase with the self-confessed goal of provoking easily provoked internet commentators and angry YouTube men 100+ years into the future.

That it was a handy, effective shorthand for a female-driven fight for equality in a society that was sharply unequal on gender grounds was but a secondary, albeit convenient, concern.

drillyeye

david75 wrote: »

You’re upset by the word and idea of feminism.

Grow a pair you pussy. You’re a bigger woman than all of them.

Not upset in the slightest. More curious than anything else.

Like if a small town referred to cats as "buffalo".

Somehow, that implies to you that I have no testicles, that I can somehow spontaneously "grow" them, have reversed gender, and am larger than any woman. How queer!

drillyeye

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

As is well-documented in many fine volumes of 19th and 20th century history, the early suffragettes gathered together to coin the phrase with the self-confessed goal of provoking easily provoked internet commentators and angry YouTube men 100+ years into the future.

That it was a handy, effective shorthand for a female-driven fight for equality in a society that was sharply unequal on gender grounds was but a secondary, albeit convenient, concern.

Oh so they purposefully use the wrong word to upset men, whereas in fact they are for equality for all people, despite wanting to upset men.

I get you!!

Omackeral

It’s a dirty word now thanks to some absolute “feminist” headers.

somefeen

drillyeye wrote: »

Not upset in the slightest. More curious than anything else.

Like if a small town referred to cats as "buffalo".

Somehow, that implies to you that I have no testicles, that I can somehow spontaneously "grow" them, have reversed gender, and am larger than any woman. How queer![/]

Ah here, stick to one loaded word per thread

Irish Guitarist

Interestingly a lot of the early suffragettes in Britain were rich women who had maids at home doing their housework for them and didn't want those maids taking part in the protests.

Peregrinus

What somefeen said. The word was coined in the mid-nineteenth century, but didn't really take off until later in the century. It refers to advocates of equality who recognised that women were systematically disadvantaged, and who therefore understood that bringing about equality required action to address the systematic disadvantage of women. The British acquired the word from the French, who were a little bit ahead of them on such matters, and the Americans in turn acquired it from the British.

But there has long been confusion about the meaning of the word. As long ago as 1913 Rebecca West observed "I myself have never been able to find out precisely what Feminism is: I only know that people call me a Feminist whenever I express sentiments that differentiate me from a doormat or a prostitute."

764dak

Many people who call themselves feminists actually practice pseudo-feminism. Pseudo-feminists talk about nonsense like manspreading and the thin ideal and many practice misandry (or man hating).

Peregrinus

764dak wrote: »

Many people who call themselves feminists actually practice pseudo-feminism. Pseudo-feminists talk about nonsense like manspreading and the thin ideal and many practice misandry (or man hating).

Are you mansplaining what is authentic feminism, 764dak?

Are Am Eye

Be careful of their equalitiline wiles.

_Dara_

Irish Guitarist wrote: »

Interestingly a lot of the early suffragettes in Britain were rich women who had maids at home doing their housework for them and didn't want those maids taking part in the protests.

Well, one thing at a time, I guess.

The_Valeyard

Are Am Eye wrote: »

Be careful of their equalitiline wiles.

Keep thinking this has something to do with horses

biko

I wonder how many feminists today have read Daughters of Egalia

Maxpfizer

drillyeye wrote: »

So, the point. Why isnt the word Equalitarian used instead of Feminist? Surely one has far better resonance?

Basically for the reasons you described yourself. Connotations.

If a certain kind of person asks me if I am am Feminist and I say "no I am an Equalitarian" then in their eyes I may as well be saying I hate women.

Of a different kind of person asks me if I am a Feminist and I say "yes, I am" then in their eyes I may as well be saying I hate men.

I am strawmanning (or strawpersonning if you prefer) a little bit as I am using extreme examples.

It's probably fair to say that the Internet has somehow managed to destroy all hope for sensible conversations about Feminism.

Do you believe in equality for men and women then you are a Feminist. You're also an Egalitarian too. Both by definition.

If you don't believe in concepts like Rape Culture etc then you may be deemed to be not a REAL Feminist or maybe not a good Feminist. That can be a problem.

It sends a whole variety of different messages to a variety of different people or groups if you refer to yourself as a Feminist or an Egalitarian.

Best to just stay safe and not identify yourself at all. :P

the_pen_turner

the word has changed meaning since it was first coined. first it was a word to discribe a movement that stood up for womens rights and battled for them
now its a word to discribe mostly loonatics that want to spout basless rubbish and belittle men and any rights that we have left. the real femanists were great women with a worthy cause , the ones now are a disgrace to the legacy the first created.

Hector Bellend

Feminism is accurate.

They only care about themselves so why would they be interested in true equality?

voz es

If it is equalist or equalitarian it all feels good to me. Equal society for all, all the same rights and all the same obligations, a cultural awakening of blind expectations of society on both females and males as to their roles in life, a balanced society.

The world is on many fronts tipping in the favor of males this feels wrong to me, at the same time I am well aware of the rights enjoyed by women that are not available to men.

I don't feel the same about feminism, It's sexist form the start, aligning with one of the genders over the other in its name.

Listening to debates, i am often struck by the blatant unchecked sexism of many of its figure heads.

If we are looking at legislation that would tackle sexist practices, I would advocate that tackling of the practice of female only business groupings, and female headed organisations who only promote females in complementary fields to clients when there are often many more efficient options. To my mind this is a step backwards in our society.

pxdf9i5cmoavkz

Maxpfizer wrote: »

Basically for the reasons you described yourself. Connotations.

If a certain kind of person asks me if I am am Feminist and I say "no I am an Equalitarian" then in their eyes I may as well be saying I hate women.

Of a different kind of person asks me if I am a Feminist and I say "yes, I am" then in their eyes I may as well be saying I hate men.

I am strawmanning (or strawpersonning if you prefer) a little bit as I am using extreme examples.

It's probably fair to say that the Internet has somehow managed to destroy all hope for sensible conversations about Feminism.

Do you believe in equality for men and women then you are a Feminist. You're also an Egalitarian too. Both by definition.

If you don't believe in concepts like Rape Culture etc then you may be deemed to be not a REAL Feminist or maybe not a good Feminist. That can be a problem.

It sends a whole variety of different messages to a variety of different people or groups if you refer to yourself as a Feminist or an Egalitarian.

Best to just stay safe and not identify yourself at all. :P

It would be wise to not trust anyone who tries to change people through the use of shaming techniques.

Stonedpilot

Its simple. Feminists couldnt care less about equality.

Just hearing their own voice, masturbating their own huge egos and sense of righteous indignation and talking about the "struggles of being a woman" all the while blaming men for all the wrongs and ills of the world and never taking responsibility for anything.

Do you think repulsive "feminists" like Louise O Neill would help a battered housewife who came to them for help?. What about a school girl whos been bullied?.

Run them the second lay eyes on them.

Yet to meet a feminist who is genuinely concerned with downtrodden poor or battered women. It Doesnt suit them to engage with the Real World

Boom_Bap

I wish that some day people would put effort into solving problems instead of trying to create the perfect label for something.

up for anything

Hector Bellend wrote: »

Feminism is accurate.

They only care about themselves so why would they be interested in true equality?

Ha! That's a very fitting post from a chap with your surname.

The_Valeyard

Boom_Bap wrote: »

I wish that some day people would put effort into solving problems instead of trying to create the perfect label for something.

Everything needs a label these days.

Labelling company making a fortune.

King George VI

The_Valeyard wrote: »

Everything needs a label these days.

Labelling company making a fortune.

Sure if we didn't have labels for things, they'd just be called thing. And even then thing becomes a label itself.

this is getting deep.

The_Valeyard

King George VI wrote: »

Sure if we didn't have labels for things, they'd just be called thing. And even then thing becomes a label itself.

this is getting deep.

But then a thing becomes a yoke?

oneilla

It was a man who came up with the word feminism https://www.stuffmomnevertoldyou.com/blogs/the-man-who-coined-feminism.htm

Mr.H

Great thread OP.

I was a teenage boy in the 90's. I remember playing video games like Tomb Raider and Resident Evil and thinking to myself "why are there not more video games where there is a female hero?". I thought "why do we not have womens football or womens rugby on tv". "Why do we not talk about womens sports and why are there not as many women action stars?". These questions I always thought to myself growing up. I truely believe that women are equal to men and while we do need to even things out, if we just make ourselves aware of the unbalance, it will balance itself out naturally".

These days I have many many arguments with my girlfriends friends who are fashion feminists. This new age buzz word generation who takes on every trend that celebs do. I would never call myself a feminist because I am not one. I am and always have been a Equalist. Im not trying to label myself because all these labels are what people do to justify there new popular show-off stance. I could never be a feminist because it only cares about one gender.

We have women only gyms. Women only companies. Women only businesses who aim specifically at women. Car insurance that aims at women (even though they legally have to accept men). Womens homes. If I a man in his 30s complains that my girlfriend/wife abuses me, I will get laughed at and mocked. Sure she may be smaller than me so I can defend myself but what if I am overweight? What if I am under-educated, have a bad job and we dont have a huge amount of surplus every week? What if I am not physically abused but its verbal? What if I am bullied by my family because they tell me I am not good enough? Who do I go to? The thing is there is nowhere. Men are not cared for because this feminist world we live in doesnt care about men. There is no emergency accom for men who are victims of domestic abuse.

There are hardly any women who are deemed rough sleepers out on the street compared to men. This is because we dont care about men. Women get shorter prison sentences, have longer healthier lives and are better educated even though we pretend they are not because they arent in courses such as engineering. We dont hear anything about trying got push young men into nursing?

If we are to truly have an equal society we need stop all this gender balancing and just focus on individuals. I mean liberals hate people talking about labels yet they are the ones who create all the labels. Why cant we just tell every child whether they are Ann or Barry, that they can be anything they want to be. They can be creative or logical. They can help cure people or help build they world. They can protect people or they can work in the emergency services. Why not help each child to build on their own individual likes and help them to become what they want to be. Why push kids into becoming something just to balance our societies gender quotas?

We will never be equal until people stop wanting to be seen as a Feminist

hightower1

Mr.H wrote: »

Great thread OP.

I was a teenage boy in the 90's. I remember playing video games like Tomb Raider and Resident Evil and thinking to myself "why are there not more video games where there is a female hero?". I thought "why do we not have womens football or womens rugby on tv". "Why do we not talk about womens sports and why are there not as many women action stars?". These questions I always thought to myself growing up. I truely believe that women are equal to men and while we do need to even things out, if we just make ourselves aware of the unbalance, it will balance itself out naturally".

These days I have many many arguments with my girlfriends friends who are fashion feminists. This new age buzz word generation who takes on every trend that celebs do. I would never call myself a feminist because I am not one. I am and always have been a Equalist. Im not trying to label myself because all these labels are what people do to justify there new popular show-off stance. I could never be a feminist because it only cares about one gender.

We have women only gyms. Women only companies. Women only businesses who aim specifically at women. Car insurance that aims at women (even though they legally have to accept men). Womens homes. If I a man in his 30s complains that my girlfriend/wife abuses me, I will get laughed at and mocked. Sure she may be smaller than me so I can defend myself but what if I am overweight? What if I am under-educated, have a bad job and we dont have a huge amount of surplus every week? What if I am not physically abused but its verbal? What if I am bullied by my family because they tell me I am not good enough? Who do I go to? The thing is there is nowhere. Men are not cared for because this feminist world we live in doesnt care about men. There is no emergency accom for men who are victims of domestic abuse.

There are hardly any women who are deemed rough sleepers out on the street compared to men. This is because we dont care about men. Women get shorter prison sentences, have longer healthier lives and are better educated even though we pretend they are not because they arent in courses such as engineering. We dont hear anything about trying got push young men into nursing?

If we are to truly have an equal society we need stop all this gender balancing and just focus on individuals. I mean liberals hate people talking about labels yet they are the ones who create all the labels. Why cant we just tell every child whether they are Ann or Barry, that they can be anything they want to be. They can be creative or logical. They can help cure people or help build they world. They can protect people or they can work in the emergency services. Why not help each child to build on their own individual likes and help them to become what they want to be. Why push kids into becoming something just to balance our societies gender quotas?

We will never be equal until people stop wanting to be seen as a Feminist

Excellent post!

IMO society in general seems to feel it's OK to promote rights for certain segments at the cost of others which previously held the most power. EG Womens rights over mens these days.

The logic feels like "Sure, you men had to good for long enough, now it's our turn at your expense seeing as we had to put up with it for so long"

... my problem with that however is the vast majority of male generations never actually took part in any trampling of womens rights? I'm 33 years old and for as long as I can remember women have been mens equals? It seems totally foreign to me to have it any other way? Yet for some reason I know need to see males somewhat relegated to "shut up and take it" status due to the actions of previous generations?

I dunno, maybe that's just my perspective being skewed?

I'd consider myself and equalist, being anything but seems weird and outdated to me. :-)

Mr.H

hightower1 wrote: »

Excellent post!

IMO society in general seems to feel it's OK to promote rights for certain segments at the cost of others which previously held the most power. EG Womens rights over mens these days.

The logic feels like "Sure, you men had to good for long enough, now it's our turn at your expense seeing as we had to put up with it for so long"

... my problem with that however is the vast majority of male generations never actually took part in any trampling of womens rights? I'm 33 years old and for as long as I can remember women have been mens equals? It seems totally foreign to me to have it any other way? Yet for some reason I know need to see males somewhat relegated to "shut up and take it" status due to the actions of previous generations?

I dunno, maybe that's just my perspective being skewed?

I'd consider myself and equalist, being anything but seems weird and outdated to me. :-)

Im on the exact same boat my friend.

In fact I remember my Aunt about 20 years ago (I would have been about 13) mocking her then boyfriend on front of me and her kids (also his kids who would have been about 4/5 at the time). She called him fat, stupid, retard, loser etc. She would do it in public and it was acceptable and Id go as far as to say if it happened today, nobody would say a word or care about it.

I always thought my mother was the leader of the house to be honest. My dad was strict yes but my mother took charge of most things like bills, dinner, trips etc. My grandmother ran her house and ffs she was born in 1931!

I dont recall any weak women when I was growing up.

professore

hightower1 wrote: »

Excellent post!

IMO society in general seems to feel it's OK to promote rights for certain segments at the cost of others which previously held the most power. EG Womens rights over mens these days.

The logic feels like "Sure, you men had to good for long enough, now it's our turn at your expense seeing as we had to put up with it for so long"

... my problem with that however is the vast majority of male generations never actually took part in any trampling of womens rights? I'm 33 years old and for as long as I can remember women have been mens equals? It seems totally foreign to me to have it any other way? Yet for some reason I know need to see males somewhat relegated to "shut up and take it" status due to the actions of previous generations?

I dunno, maybe that's just my perspective being skewed?

I'd consider myself and equalist, being anything but seems weird and outdated to me. :-)

I'm 46, did a proper STEM degree and there were plenty of women in it who did really well. Apart from one sexist lecturer, they really were not at any disadvantage to the guys. In fact I'd say more "women oriented" fields such as the arts and journalism has far more sexism against women than STEM does - yet that is always the focus lately. Haven't they noticed there is a chronic shortage of STEM workers - if they still can't make it then they are in the wrong field.

It's been the same since. Of course people will step in and say "wage gap" but it's all nonsense. If women choose to have children then it's going to affect their earning potential or their children's welfare. Otherwise there is no wage gap.

Mr.H

professore wrote: »

I'm 46, did a proper STEM degree and there were plenty of women in it who did really well. Apart from one sexist lecturer, they really were not at any disadvantage to the guys. In fact I'd say more "women oriented" fields such as the arts and journalism has far more sexism against women than STEM does - yet that is always the focus lately. Haven't they noticed there is a chronic shortage of STEM workers - if they still can't make it then they are in the wrong field.

It's been the same since. Of course people will step in and say "wage gap" but it's all nonsense. If women choose to have children then it's going to affect their earning potential or their children's welfare. Otherwise there is no wage gap.

There actually is funnily enough. In the opposite way! People dont mention that either. People dont talk about the fact that Women in their early 20s are on more money than their male counterparts.

In fact in the hospitality sector there are very few male store mangers compared to women

Sleepy

In today's world Feminist = Female Supremacist, Egalitarian = sane person.

megaten

Short answer OP is that if you say egalitarian absolutely no one will know what your on about. Word are about communication so if no one knows what you saying its no good.

Mr.H

megaten wrote: »

Short answer OP is that if you say egalitarian absolutely no one will know what your on about. Word are about communication so if no one knows what you saying its no good.

Why do you need to tell people you are anything? Surely the only use in telling people you are a feminist or an egalitarian, is so they think something of you.

Which is the whole point. Being a buzz word is just to pretend you are something.

Airyfairy12

ill just leave this here...

https://victimfocus.wordpress.com/2018/01/03/stop-asking-me-what-about-men/

AllForIt

Feminism is of no concern to me have non-iron shirts, robot vacuum cleaners etc...

Chris_Heilong

I think we have already reached equality in the west as far as a natural position for where both Men and Women are comfortable as we are so different from one another, I am all about equality and feel that the first two movements of feminism were entirely necessary. However in todays equal western world there is little need for a feminist movement unless they want to lobby against the treatment of women in Islam and the middle east, instead what they seem to be doing is going out of their way to find offence in everything, they feel they are victims and they see the world as a sexist patriarchy were men just view women as weak and no better than sex objects which could not be further from the truth.

Maxpfizer

Airyfairy12 wrote: »

ill just leave this here...

https://victimfocus.wordpress.com/2018/01/03/stop-asking-me-what-about-men/

I said to the OP that it's better to not get involved and not label yourself. Just say you care about everyone equally and leave it at that.

Stupid articles like they one you've shared here is exactly why I would steer clear of ever referring to myself as a Feminist in real life and why I'd steer clear of any gender related discussions in real life too.

It's just not worth it. Sure I believe that men and women should be treated equally and should have equal opportunities in our society but if part of being a Feminist means entertaining the idea that male suicide is caused by Patriarchy then, I'm sorry, but I am out.

"We know that the leading cause of death in young men aged 18-35 is suicide. This is the strongest symptom of a patriarchal society where emotionless males struggle to cope with trauma and feelings, can’t open up, don’t feel safe to talk and become completely overwhelmed by emotions they are taught are ‘feminine’, which further induces shame and stigma."

OK then. That's why I'll never identify with this movement. It's full of utter morons with pointless poorly considered agendas.

The idea that there is NO whataboutery when someone talks about mens issues is laughable.

I mean did you actually share this thinking that people would read it and be thinking "oh they are quite right there I am a Feminist now"? If anything it just pushes people further away.

"‘Whataboutery’ comes from a place of misogyny."

Yeah, no thanks. I'd rather not share your "Feminist" label if that's OK.

Airyfairy12

Maxpfizer wrote: »

I said to the OP that it's better to not get involved and not label yourself. Just say you care about everyone equally and leave it at that.

Stupid articles like they one you've shared here is exactly why I would steer clear of ever referring to myself as a Feminist in real life and why I'd steer clear of any gender related discussions in real life too.

It's just not worth it. Sure I believe that men and women should be treated equally and should have equal opportunities in our society but if part of being a Feminist means entertaining the idea that male suicide is caused by Patriarchy then, I'm sorry, but I am out.

"We know that the leading cause of death in young men aged 18-35 is suicide. This is the strongest symptom of a patriarchal society where emotionless males struggle to cope with trauma and feelings, can’t open up, don’t feel safe to talk and become completely overwhelmed by emotions they are taught are ‘feminine’, which further induces shame and stigma."

OK then. That's why I'll never identify with this movement. It's full of utter morons with pointless poorly considered agendas.

The idea that there is NO whataboutery when someone talks about mens issues is laughable.

I mean did you actually share this thinking that people would read it and be thinking "oh they are quite right there I am a Feminist now"? If anything it just pushes people further away.

"‘Whataboutery’ comes from a place of misogyny."

Yeah, no thanks. I'd rather not share your "Feminist" label if that's OK.

Im not attempting to convince anyone to call themself a feminist. Call yourself what ever you like, what im trying to bring to light is that youre denying facts. There has been huge amounts of research into male suicide - men are less likely to seek therapy or talk about their feelings than women. I see it in my own male relatives, they express their emotions through aggression and anger or they go drinking with the lads and they never deal with anything. They feel 'weak' if they express sadness through crying or vulnerability. These are human emotions that no one should be ashamed of having or expressing yet our gendered society has conditioned us to believe that sort of behaviour is only acceptable for children and women - its in our everyday language - grow some balls, youre a pussy - male genitalia=strong, female genitalia=weak. .
Men are more likely to kill themselves. Women are more likely to be raped or killed. Violence and crime towards men is more often perpetuated by men- These are facts, - Denying gender issues only shows your ignorance and privilege and allows these destructive cycles to continue. Its not helping anyone.

The reason why its called feminism is the same reason we have terms like LGBTQ and Black lives matter, Black people suffer more racism than white people, LGBTQ people suffer more descrimination than straight people, Women suffer more discrimination and gender violence than men .. but of course no one questions the integrity of LGBTQ or Black lives matter - only movements which promote the equality of women are dismissed and downgraded.


Equal rights are more than women being granted permission to vote, go to school and get a job.
How many of your male friends have been raped, sexually harassed, followed home, feared for their safety while out at night? suffered relationship violence and abuse? Every one of my female friends and myself included has suffered sexual harassment, relationship abuse and a genuine fear for their safety on more than one occasion. As a woman its a given that you'll go through this at some point. Its not surprising as its so common. If youre against this, why not stand with women instead of telling them to be quiet and to think of men?
Studies on Feminism and gender issues are taught in every University in the country. Sociology, Philosophy, Psychology, teacher training courses but to name a few all cover feminism and white male privilege because facts, studies and statistics show its a global issue. - Your denying of its existence doesn't make it not real.

Are Am Eye

Boom_Bap wrote: »

I wish that some day people would put effort into solving problems instead of trying to create the perfect label for something.

You're right I think and perhaps hopefully this development - problemsolvealisation - will progress afoot.

Hector Bellend

up for anything wrote: »

Ha! That's a very fitting post from a chap with your surname.

Because?

Wibbs

TBH when I read or hear stuff like "gendered society/privilege/patriarchy/rape culture/toxic masculinity/gender issues" I am pretty confident that what will follow is mostly unproven intersectional nonsense cooked up in social "sciences" lecture halls by ideologues justifying their existence. And since parity of equality has creeped ever closer - in some ways exceeded parity - they're forced to twist themselves in ever tighter knots of intersectional nonsense to justify that existence.

Airyfairy12 wrote: »

These are human emotions that no one should be ashamed of having or expressing yet our gendered society has conditioned us to believe that sort of behaviour is only acceptable for children and women

As usual current feminism kicks off from the 70's postmodernist given that humans are blank slates and it's society and culture that are by far the greatest influence. You mention "facts", well I hate to break it to you the actual fact is that the nature/nurture debate is still very much up in the air and many would argue it's nature that has the bigger influence. Never mind the obvious problem with this theory that when western society was actually far more a "patriarchy" male suicide was lower*. Though that's no doubt men's fault again.

How many of your male friends have been raped, sexually harassed, followed home, feared for their safety while out at night? suffered relationship violence and abuse?

Quite the number actually.

Studies on Feminism and gender issues are taught in every University in the country. Sociology, Philosophy, Psychology, teacher training courses but to name a few all cover feminism and white male privilege because facts, studies and statistics show its a global issue. - Your denying of its existence doesn't make it not real.

Again I hate to break it to you but just because this stuff is taught in certain courses in universities does not make it truth, or anything like it. If you want a list of theories we consider total nonsense today that were once taught as universal truths in august universities we'd be here all day. 40 years ago that stuff wasn't taught at all, so where was your "real" then?

If youre against this, why not stand with women instead of telling them to be quiet and to think of men?

Why should I or any other man "stand with women feminists"? As I have noted before your entire sociopolitical feminist worldview can be broken down into just one credo: Women are always victims and it is always men's fault. Even when men are begrudgingly accepted as victims, they're victims of the "patriarchy". It's still their fault.

So while I would have happily confirmed I was a feminist twenty years ago, today I would consider it an insult to my intelligence to be accused of that label. It's the ideology of victimhood and the oppressor. Hell, even that article you linked to is on a site called "Victimfocus". Says it all really.

*outside of the reporting of suicide going up(thankfully) there have been clear increases in male suicide. EG a generation ago one of the least likely demographics to have suicide ideation were middle aged men, now they're among the highest.

RobbingBandit

The wimmins won't be happy till all men are wearing collars, tread softly men.

Ted Simpson

I think the increasing rates of male suicide may be related to the increased feminisation of society. Teaching methods today in schools in western society ahave been designed for the female brain and how it learns, leaving boys at a distinct disadvantage.

What I think men need is more masculinity, to understand that masculinity is good and healthy for society, to embrace their masculinity rather than feeling guilty about it.

Feminists will tell you the cause of male suicide today is related to them not being in touch with their feminine side. If that were the case surely male suicide would have been more prevalent in the past than it was today. I think feminist dogma and the demonising of masculinity has contributed to the increase in male suicide over the last 50 years.

DavyD_83

I've wondered about the etymology of the word before (but never bothered to actually look is up), aren't isms meant to be negative?

And if not already mentioned Joss Whedon made a big speech about the word feminist a while back