Recording cars abusing the bus lane

jungleman12

Hi,
Every morning when I drive from Park West towards my work place in Crumlin on New Nangor road/Killeen road, people use the bus lane to try to pass the queue and then they try to squeeze back into the lane once they pass a good chunk of fools in the right lane. By doing so they are making fools of all the people who are waiting in queue since they are adding up the waiting time for people in a queue.

Since I've never ever seen police on that road in 1 year period, I'm thinking of starting a entertaining project where I would record the cars who are abusing the bus lane and posting them on Youtube after adding some funny post production work on it.

The idea comes from "Stop a Douchebag" project in Russia which became pretty popular with more than 600k subscribers on the Youtube (can't post the link as a new user).

Does anybody know if laws in Ireland are the same as in Russia when it comes to public recording? In Russia it's totally legal to record in public.

Ideally my videos would eventually be seen by police and be used (since they would have clear car regs, faces and time on the video) to fine the wrongdoing drivers, but this depends on law as well.

Your thoughts?

kona

jungleman12 wrote: »

Hi,
Every morning when I drive from Park West towards my work place in Crumlin on New Nangor road/Killeen road, people use the bus lane to try to pass the queue and then they try to squeeze back into the lane once they pass a good chunk of fools in the right lane. By doing so they are making fools of all the people who are waiting in queue since they are adding up the waiting time for people in a queue.

Since I've never ever seen police on that road in 1 year period, I'm thinking of starting a entertaining project where I would record the cars who are abusing the bus lane and posting them on Youtube after adding some funny post production work on it.

The idea comes from "Stop a Douchebag" project in Russia which became pretty popular with more than 600k subscribers on the Youtube (can't post the link as a new user).

Does anybody know if laws in Ireland are the same as in Russia when it comes to public recording? In Russia it's totally legal to record in public.

Ideally my videos would eventually be seen by police and be used (since they would have clear car regs, faces and time on the video) to fine the wrongdoing drivers, but this depends on law as well.

Your thoughts?

Why dont you just use the bus lane too?

As for the videotaping? Get a life.

jungleman12

kona wrote: »

Why dont you just use the bus lane too?

As for the videotaping? Get a life.

So, your advice is to break the law like some do?

Well, videotaping won't really be a waste of my life since this could turn into a project like that Russian.

They are called "Stop a Douchebag", Irish version would be "Stop a c u n t".

amcalester

kona wrote: »

Why dont you just use the bus lane too?

And this folks is why we can't have nice things.

Effects

jungleman12 wrote: »

Does anybody know if laws in Ireland are the same as in Russia when it comes to public recording? In Russia it's totally legal to record in public.

There's a whole thread of dash cam videos over in the motors forum.

randomname2005

kona wrote: »

Why dont you just use the bus lane too?

As for the videotaping? Get a life.

Maybe the op doesn't want to use the bus lane because they respect the rules of the road.

PucaMama

I’d be very surprised to see police there.

TBi

If posting video's online i'd blur out the license plate, just in case.

Also for that stop a douche project then you'll need big stickers.

"I'm a bus lane hogger"

jungleman12

Effects wrote: »

There's a whole thread of dash cam videos over in the motors forum.

Recording won't be done by a dash cam from the car, but rather with high quality normal cam from the sidewalk to get the whole story and details.

TBi

jungleman12 wrote: »

Recording won't be done by a dash cam from the car, but rather with high quality normal cam from the sidewalk to get the whole story and details.

Bring a microphone and interview them; "Why are you being a c**t today?".

Also that dashcam thread has a lot of info on the legalities of posting video's online, dashcam or otherwise.

jungleman12

TBi wrote: »

Bring a microphone and interview them; "Why are you being a c**t today?".

Also that dashcam thread has a lot of info on the legalities of posting video's online, dashcam or otherwise.

Hehe exactly, the problem is this would be filmed in a flow while people drive and there would hardly be any interaction with drivers unlike in Russia where they seek for the contact. Therefore it might not be as interesting as this Russian project where you can see fights, threats and all the drama around it.

I'll check the other threads to see the legal side of recording and posting videos from the public space.

Alanstrainor

If it's a public place then there's nothing stopping you recording and posting it. The gardai wont do anything about it, and it doesn't sound like it would be terribly interesting. Some of the users who post in the dashcam thread have some great compilations (and editing!) of various driving conditions. This seems like it would get boring fast.

Del2005

jungleman12 wrote: »

Hehe exactly, the problem is this would be filmed in a flow while people drive and there would hardly be any interaction with drivers unlike in Russia where they seek for the contact. Therefore it might not be as interesting as this Russian project where you can see fights, threats and all the drama around it.

I'll check the other threads to see the legal side of recording and posting videos from the public space.

Recording in public is legal, you have no right to privacy in public, but once you have recorded something in public you now are a data controller and there are extremely powerful new data control laws coming into force soon. So I'd review the new data protection legislation before posting.

As for the Gardaí acting on the video. If they can't be arsed to stand at the side of the road and have a physical presence to stop the vehicles they aren't going to look at videos and start chasing registered owners.

jungleman12

Alanstrainor wrote: »

If it's a public place then there's nothing stopping you recording and posting it. The gardai wont do anything about it, and it doesn't sound like it would be terribly interesting. Some of the users who post in the dashcam thread have some great compilations (and editing!) of various driving conditions. This seems like it would get boring fast.

Thanks for the info about legal stuff! Yeah, this is exactly my concern, it might become boring really soon. If the gardai would use the videos to send some tickets, that would bring more drama into it on the future encounters with same c u n t s.

jungleman12

Del2005 wrote: »

Recording in public is legal, you have no right to privacy in public, but once you have recorded something in public you now are a data controller and there are extremely powerful new data control laws coming into force soon. So I'd review the new data protection legislation before posting.

As for the Gardaí acting on the video. If they can't be arsed to stand at the side of the road and have a physical presence to stop the vehicles they aren't going to look at videos and start chasing registered owners.

Hmm GDPR, you're right!

This part where Gardai is not interested into filling in the state budget and getting the road clean makes no sense to me They could issue like 10k eur worth of tikets in 1 hours on that road. 1 employee costs far less than that.

Alanstrainor

jungleman12 wrote: »

Thanks for the info about legal stuff! Yeah, this is exactly my concern, it might become boring really soon. If the gardai would use the videos to send some tickets, that would bring more drama into it on the future encounters with same c u n t s.

The only way the gardai will act on this is if you go and make a complaint at the station (or call traffic watch), then you'll have to make a statement against a driver. If the garda thinks it would be worthwhile going to court over, then you'll have to go to court to state what it was you observed. All of this would be against ONE of these eejits, as I can't see them processing them all at once.

kirving

Forget video taping. The only way to stop it is have either automated ANPR, or have the Gards out fining people.

Set the fine at say €500 so that the Gard's don't feel too bad about enforcing it, and put the money directly towards A) Garda Cars / Overtime budget so the Gards see the benefit, and Busses

Effects

TBi wrote: »

If posting video's online i'd blur out the license plate, just in case.

In case of what?

jungleman12

Alanstrainor wrote: »

The only way the gardai will act on this is if you go and make a complaint at the station (or call traffic watch), then you'll have to make a statement against a driver. If the garda thinks it would be worthwhile going to court over, then you'll have to go to court to state what it was you observed. All of this would be against ONE of these eejits, as I can't see them processing them all at once.

If the project would gain traction, maybe Gardai would be asked questions by media (portals/radio stations/papers) since it makes no sense to "lose" this much money every day by not forcing the law on the road.
Then, hopefully the project would force them to get more active.

I can see the same thing happening with the Russian project. In the beginning their police was skeptical about it which you can see from their approach towards activists, but once the project got well known, police man are now really polite and cooperate with activists since they know that each video will get ****load of views and they want to look nice to public.

kona

amcalester wrote: »

And this folks is why we can't have nice things.

A bus lane is a nice thing? For all the talk of pollution and air quality, you have dublin city grid locked while a whole lane sits empty.
A bus lane would work if

1) dublin bus was actually run properly

2) people used the bus

amcalester

kona wrote: »

A bus lane is a nice thing? For all the talk of pollution and air quality, you have dublin city grid locked while a whole lane sits empty.
A bus lane would work if

1) dublin bus was actually run properly

2) people used the bus

Yes they are, and they're not solely for use by Dublin bus.

I don't understand what point you're trying to make re: air pollution. How will increasing capacity for (mostly) single occupancy vehicles going to reduce pollution or congestion?

markpb

jungleman12 wrote: »

If the project would gain traction, maybe Gardai would be asked questions by media

They won't. Irish culture has decided that driving is an imperative and enforcement of minor things like the Road Traffic Acts is a bit mean and a bit childish and the Guardai have better things to do. This is why the guards don't really make much of an effort at fining people for parking on footpaths, driving in bus lanes, rolling through stop signs, etc.

kona wrote: »

A bus lane is a nice thing? For all the talk of pollution and air quality, you have dublin city grid locked while a whole lane sits empty.

Relatively empty bus lanes are perfectly acceptable. If a bus with 140 people rolls past every 10 minutes, the bus lane is probably still carrying more people than the regular lane beside it. It might be annoying for the people stuck in traffic to see the lane appear to be empty but thankfully road space isn't allocated based on peoples perceptions but on actual data or strategy.

kona

amcalester wrote: »

Yes they are, and they're not solely for use by Dublin bus.

I don't understand what point you're trying to make re: air pollution. How will increasing capacity for (mostly) single occupancy vehicles going to reduce pollution or congestion?

Whats not to understand, youve thousands of diesel engines running in the one place for extended periods of time. Of course its going to cause air quality problems.

kona

markpb wrote: »

They won't. Irish culture has decided that driving is an imperative and enforcement of minor things like the Road Traffic Acts is a bit mean and a bit childish and the Guardai have better things to do. This is why the guards don't really make much of an effort at fining people for parking on footpaths, driving in bus lanes, rolling through stop signs, etc.



Relatively empty bus lanes are perfectly acceptable. If a bus with 140 people rolls past every 10 minutes, the bus lane is probably still carrying more people than the regular lane beside it. It might be annoying for the people stuck in traffic to see the lane appear to be empty but thankfully road space isn't allocated based on peoples perceptions but on actual data or strategy.

You think that bus lanes or any sort of public transport is allocated or designed in this country based on actual data?

amcalester

kona wrote: »

Whats not to understand, youve thousands of diesel engines running in the one place for extended periods of time. Of course its going to cause air quality problems.

And if you open up the bus lanes you'll just have 2 x thousands of diesel engines running.

So how will this improve air quality?

Lord Nikon

Weren't the Russians driving on the footpath?

sdanseo

If it really annoys you that much get on to the Gardai in DMR Traffic at Dublin Caslte and complain. If that doesn’t work tweet them continuously and if that still doesn’t work write to the local Superintendent.

If all that doesn’t work some firm pressure on local representatives to step in should do the trick.

These are how things get done in Ireland rightly or wrongly. Standing at the side of the road with a camera and adding to the mountain of YouTube videos posted by busybodies with nothing better to do will make you look like an eejit and nothing more.

Enforcement is for the Guards, if they aren’t doing it then hold them to account rather than resorting to vigilantism.

ED E

sdanseo wrote: »

if that still doesn’t work write to the local Superintendent.

Local TD has been writing local Super who's been ignoring them. The force are a sham.

kona

amcalester wrote: »

And if you open up the bus lanes you'll just have 2 x thousands of diesel engines running.

So how will this improve air quality?

Are you serious. It doesnt work like that. Do you think that all of a sudden twice the amount of cars will just appear because theres no bus lane?

amcalester

kona wrote: »

Are you serious. It doesnt work like that. Do you think that all of a sudden twice the amount of cars will just appear because theres no bus lane?

That's pretty much exactly how it works, it's called induced demand.

DaveyDave

Nothing is being done and nothing will be done. Report them to traffic watch, maybe make a report in person if your free time matches with the Garda's sporadic shift times, maybe one driver gets a warning. That's it. Nothing will change as a whole. It's not worth reporting to traffic watch unless it's a serious incident such as brake testing or swerving at you because of how much effort it is for little results.

Before saying someone "Get a life" you could at least be grateful someone wants to change something. I've nearly crashed because people have tried forcing their way in front a bus lane. You could argue that posting online telling someone to get a life is also a waste of time.

highdef

TBi wrote: »

If posting video's online i'd blur out the license plate, just in case.
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I don't understand why this is often advised. If the car is in a public place, why can't the license plate be shown?

kona

amcalester wrote: »

That's pretty much exactly how it works, it's called induced demand.

So your telling me that by removing the buslane , it could boost car sales by 100% , boost jobs by 100% .

Otherwise where are 100% more cars and people going to come from.

Its not GTA they dont just replicate.

kona

DaveyDave wrote: »

Nothing is being done and nothing will be done. Report them to traffic watch, maybe make a report in person if your free time matches with the Garda's sporadic shift times, maybe one driver gets a warning. That's it. Nothing will change as a whole. It's not worth reporting to traffic watch unless it's a serious incident such as brake testing or swerving at you because of how much effort it is for little results.

Before saying someone "Get a life" you could at least be grateful someone wants to change something. I've nearly crashed because people have tried forcing their way in front a bus lane. You could argue that posting online telling someone to get a life is also a waste of time.

By the same logic i could say that your wasting your time posting that.

markpb

kona wrote: »

So your telling me that by removing the buslane , it could boost car sales by 100% , boost jobs by 100% .

Otherwise where are 100% more cars and people going to come from.

Its not GTA they dont just replicate.

If you remove a bus lane, these things will happen.

Cars will fill up both lanes until they reach the next point in the road where the bus lane previously ended because the road isn't wide enough. Then everyone will sit in the same traffic anyway so opening the bus lane makes no measurable difference over the course of an entire journey.

People on nearby routes will see that the bus lane has gone and decide to take that road instead.

People see that traffic levels have fallen in the area so they decide to make extra trips. They might decide to accept a job slightly further away. They might go to a shop slightly further away instead of a closer one. They might make more leisure trips. Not that these are bad things but they are definitely increased demand.

The opposite is also true. There have been plenty of examples worldwide of roads closing and the levels of traffic in the region falling.

amcalester

kona wrote: »

So your telling me that by removing the buslane , it could boost car sales by 100% , boost jobs by 100% .

Otherwise where are 100% more cars and people going to come from.

Its not GTA they dont just replicate.

I said exactly none of that.

The cars come from people’s driveway as those people who were bus users now drive instead.

Aoife_H89

Depending on the time of the day and day of the week, and the road the bus lane is on, it is perfectly acceptable to use a bus lane.

kona

markpb wrote: »

If you remove a bus lane, these things will happen.

Cars will fill up both lanes until they reach the next point in the road where the bus lane previously ended because the road isn't wide enough. Then everyone will sit in the same traffic anyway so opening the bus lane makes no measurable difference over the course of an entire journey.

People on nearby routes will see that the bus lane has gone and decide to take that road instead.

People see that traffic levels have fallen in the area so they decide to make extra trips. They might decide to accept a job slightly further away. They might go to a shop slightly further away instead of a closer one. They might make more leisure trips. Not that these are bad things but they are definitely increased demand.

The opposite is also true. There have been plenty of examples worldwide of roads closing and the levels of traffic in the region falling.

But will you see x2 the cars? X2 the pollution? At the end of the day the city centre can only accept so many cars, you can double the cars going in but with nowhere to park or put them, people wont bother and still take the bus.
Theres areas of dublin with unbelievable tailbacks with a empty buslane beside the tailback. Open the buslane and you will get more cars flowing through the same junction.

To just say oh there will be x2 the cars because a buslane was removed is rediculous.

kona

amcalester wrote: »

I said exactly none of that.

The cars come from people’s driveway as those people who were bus users now drive instead.

Thats exactley what you said, you said you woild see x2 the pollution and x2 the cars.. Not everybody on the bus has a car. Thats why they are on the bus.

Last time i was on the bus i seemed to be the only one paying on. All OAP and bus passes.

DaveyDave

kona wrote: »

By the same logic i could say that your wasting your time posting that.

You could, but I'm not telling you to get a life. Merely stating that someone else could say your post was a waste of time.

I'm not going to tell someone what to do with their time

Aoife_H89 wrote: »

Depending on the time of the day and day of the week, and the road the bus lane is on, it is perfectly acceptable to use a bus lane.

True but most of them are 7am-7pm and don't apply on Sundays. Some are 7-10, 12-4 or 24 hours. 9-5 rush hour traffic wouldn't have any use of almost all of them.

And what happens when you use bus lanes legally? Last night driving down the quays I had a taxi driver needlessly move over in front of me and proceed to drive slow despite having a completely clear lane.

Other times I've had people drive between two lanes or cut me off and force their way in front of me because they want to turn left. Damned if you do, damned if you don't...

Riva10

Alanstrainor wrote: »

If it's a public place then there's nothing stopping you recording and posting it. The gardai wont do anything about it, and it doesn't sound like it would be terribly interesting. Some of the users who post in the dashcam thread have some great compilations (and editing!) of various driving conditions. This seems like it would get boring fast.

It would be as interesting as "Your pictures of a$$hole parking".

amcalester

kona wrote: »

Thats exactley what you said, you said you woild see x2 the pollution and x2 the cars.. Not everybody on the bus has a car. Thats why they are on the bus.

Last time i was on the bus i seemed to be the only one paying on. All OAP and bus passes.

I said nothing about boosting car sales or jobs.

Nor did I say that everyone getting the bus has a car or will switch to driving but if only 2 or 3 people do the result is less efficient use of the road space.

Anyway it’s widely recognized that increasing road capacity results in a corresponding increase in vehicles and this has nothing to do with the OP so I’ll leave it at that.

kona

DaveyDave wrote: »

True but most of them are 7am-7pm and don't apply on Sundays. Some are 7-10, 12-4 or 24 hours. 9-5 rush hour traffic wouldn't have any use of almost all of them.

And what happens when you use bus lanes legally? Last night driving down the quays I had a taxi driver needlessly move over in front of me and proceed to drive slow despite having a completely clear lane.

Other times I've had people drive between two lanes or cut me off and force their way in front of me because they want to turn left. Damned if you do, damned if you don't...

That would be dangerous driving.. ive noticed a number of drivers seem to think they are traffic corps lately and bizarrely perform such manoeuvres. The only time id consider going to report somebodies driving is when I encounter these self righteous gimps. Id pay good money to see their reaction to a dose of their own medicine.

El Tarangu

Kevin Irving wrote: »

Forget video taping. The only way to stop it is have either automated ANPR...

I don't understand why they don't take this approach; a few of these yokes installed at a select few of the worst places for traffic offences, and they will have paid for themselves within weeks, and have the traffic running smoother ever after for very little running costs.

kona

amcalester wrote: »

I said nothing about boosting car sales or jobs.

Nor did I say that everyone getting the bus has a car or will switch to driving but if only 2 or 3 people do the result is less efficient use of the road space.

Anyway it’s widely recognized that increasing road capacity results in a corresponding increase in vehicles and this has nothing to do with the OP so I’ll leave it at that.

Ok ill try break it down for you.

Since you said there will be x2 the cars on the road and x2 the pollution if buslanes are removed, where do this volume of cars and demand for them come from?

Will dealers give away cars because theres no buslanes? Id love to know.

Or are you the typical boards.ie poster who makes little sarcastic retorts? Well able to be a smartass until your questioned.

ardinn

jungleman12 wrote: »

but rather with high quality normal cam from the sidewalk

De wha?

amcalester

kona wrote: »

Ok ill try break it down for you.

Since you said there will be x2 the cars on the road and x2 the pollution if buslanes are removed, where do this volume of cars and demand for them come from?

Will dealers give away cars because theres no buslanes? Id love to know.

Or are you the typical boards.ie poster who makes little sarcastic retorts? Well able to be a smartass until your questioned.

I’ve answered where the increase comes from.

The cars already exist but people chose to leave them at home, they will no longer do that.

Also I didn’t say pollution would increase twofold, I asked how would increasing the number of Diesel engines improve air quality.

I did say Diesel engines would double and while that may not be exactly the case the number of vehicles will increase massively.

That’s been observed the world over so the general point stands, converting bus lanes to driving lanes will increase congestion and pollution.

As for my sarcastic retort, I stand by that. It’s people like you who use the excuse that I can do x because other people are doing it that ruin things for everyone else.

And while we’re making sarcastic retorts it’s you’re.

kona

amcalester wrote: »

I’ve answered where the increase comes from.

The cars already exist but people chose to leave them at home, they will no longer do that.

Also I didn’t say pollution would increase twofold, I asked how would increasing the number of Diesel engines improve air quality.

I did say Diesel engines would double and while that may not be exactly the case the number of vehicles will increase massively.

That’s been observed the world over so the general point stands, converting bus lanes to driving lanes will increase congestion and pollution.

As for my sarcastic retort, I stand by that. It’s people like you who use the excuse that I can do x because other people are doing it that ruin things for everyone else.

And while we’re making sarcastic retorts it’s you’re.

You have not answered where a increase comes from. Your telling me there will be a massive increase in cars? Who is going to drive them? Where will they come from?
You seem to think everybody who pays for the bus has a car sitting at home. That is not the case. Removing buslanes does not equal removing busses.

El Tarangu

kona wrote: »

You have not answered where a increase comes from. Your telling me there will be a massive increase in cars? Who is going to drive them? Where will they come from?
You seem to think everybody who pays for the bus has a car sitting at home. That is not the case. Removing buslanes does not equal removing busses.

amcalester wrote: »

That's pretty much exactly how it works, it's called induced demand.

Another poster has already helpfully told you the name of the phenomenon; here is a very short explanation.

kona

El Tarangu wrote: »

Another poster has already helpfully told you the name of the phenomenon; here is a very short explanation.

Where does that talk about bus lanes? Also traffic in the states is a different game to traffic here. Cities are planned differently and most U.S cities have far superior public transport.
What i have seen on sundays and from.19.00 to 0700 is the people just stay in the right lane regardless, who is to say that this wouldnt remain if the bus lane period was changed?
Cost of owning a car in the states is considerably less than here too, so while some have cars and take public transport there, over here alot more people rely on public transport as their sole means of transport.

dr.fuzzenstein

kona wrote: »

A bus lane is a nice thing? For all the talk of pollution and air quality, you have dublin city grid locked while a whole lane sits empty.
A bus lane would work if

1) dublin bus was actually run properly

2) people used the bus

Here's the one single thing of substance you wrote in this entire thread.
You also encouraged the OP to use the bus lane himself.
The thing is, if you don't like bus lanes, you can get in touch with your local TD and ask him to do something. Maybe start a partition, get exposure through the press, get the people behind you and use the established democratic processes to achieve change. Maybe even start the "No Bus Lane" party.
You could even convince people on this thread if you posted something that wasn't just drivel or you being petulant and stomping your foot.
The OP is at least trying to find a way to improve a bad situation, he isn't just lurking on the internet dumping on other people.